Re: [dev] wmpus - a new cross platform wm

2011-10-03 Thread Yue Wu 
On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 07:23:25AM +, Andy Spencer wrote:
> Hello there, 
> 
> I would like to point out a project I've started on for *yet another*
> new window manager, called `wmpus' [1]. It's not actually a suckless
> project, but I thought some folks here might be interested nonetheless.
> 
> The biggest feature is that it should be portable and work well with
> different windowing systems. Besides that, it should support a variety
> of window management modes, be easy to hack, and lay golden eggs.
> 
> Until now, I've been focusing on getting it to actually manage windows,
> so many features are completely missing: There's currently no support
> for settings or configuration files, no statusbar, very minimal window
> decorations, lots of memory leaks, no `make install' rule, etc.
> 
> That being said, here's what does work:
> 
>  - Runs natively on X11 and MS Windows
>  
>  - Tiling window management similar to acme or wmii. That is, rows,
>columns, split/stack/max modes, multi-monitor support, limited
>support for tags
> 
>  - Support for some external statusbars such as dzen [2]
> 
> Any feedback will be appreciated. It should be easy enough to build for
> X11 and there's a windows binary linked from the wiki for anyone brave
> enough to try it out.
> 

No any doc about how to use it...

And I feel some slow down when moving the window on windows 2000.

-- 
Regards,
Yue Wu

Key Laboratory of Modern Chinese Medicines
Department of Traditional Chinese Medicine
China Pharmaceutical University(中國藥科大學)
No.24, Tongjia Xiang Street, Nanjing 210009, China

Re: [dev] wmpus - a new cross platform wm

2011-10-03 Thread Andy Spencer 
On 2011-10-03 15:01, Yue Wu wrote:
> No any doc about how to use it...

There is now a simple man page in the source repository, and a copy of
it on the wiki, hope that helps.


> And I feel some slow down when moving the window on windows 2000.

I have not tested it with windows 2000. I did notice some significant
slow downs on windows xp though, but those have hopefully been fixed.
You might try a couple different versions of the exe to see if it is an
issue with all of them.


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Re: [dev] wmpus - a new cross platform wm

2011-10-03 Thread Andy Spencer 
On 2011-10-03 06:13, Al Gest wrote:
> > The GPL is generally my preferred license, but lets not get into that
> > argument now. However, I could probably be convinced to switch to a
> > permissive license for this particular program. Would the ISC license
> > work for you?
> 
> Revised BSD, ISC, and MIT licenses are all suckless in my book, or as
> suckless as they can be without being public domain. So to answer your
> question, yes.

For the record, it's been changed to the ISC license.


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[dev] Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Pierre Chapuis 

I am wondering what the simplest multi-language VM is.

Obviously the CLR and JVM are not candidates. Parrot is
interesting but is bloated too. The Lua VM is simple
but too tied to the language.

I have found about the Dis VM [1]. It looks interesting,
does anybody here still use it?

Otherwise, GoLigtly [2] was promising but it looks like
it never took off...

[1] http://www.vitanuova.com/inferno/papers/dis.html
[2] https://github.com/feyeleanor/GoLightly

Re: [dev] Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Kurt H Maier 
next question:   most suckless optimizing XML <-> asn.1 translator

Re: [dev] Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread pancake 
There are some languages that compile to luavm. I would prefer lua than java, 
parrot or dotnet.

Dalvik is not an option as long as its src sucks and there's only a single lang 
to compile for it atm... Go will be another option soon probably.

Jamvm is probably the best option for running java.. And well from the vm point 
of view. Java asm sucks less than the dalvik or dotnet ones.. Lua is not 
compatible between versions of the vm.

On 03/10/2011, at 17:11, Pierre Chapuis  wrote:

> I am wondering what the simplest multi-language VM is.
> 
> Obviously the CLR and JVM are not candidates. Parrot is
> interesting but is bloated too. The Lua VM is simple
> but too tied to the language.
> 
> I have found about the Dis VM [1]. It looks interesting,
> does anybody here still use it?
> 
> Otherwise, GoLigtly [2] was promising but it looks like
> it never took off...
> 
> [1] http://www.vitanuova.com/inferno/papers/dis.html
> [2] https://github.com/feyeleanor/GoLightly
>

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Bjartur Thorlacius 
On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis  wrote:
> On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your text so wide,
> please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and anything
> wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is unpleasant to
> read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people wrapping their
> emails too wide.
>
fmt(1)

Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Dieter Plaetinck 
On Mon, 3 Oct 2011 15:37:15 +
Bjartur Thorlacius  wrote:

> On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis
>  wrote:
> > On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your text so
> > wide, please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and
> > anything wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is
> > unpleasant to read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people
> > wrapping their emails too wide.
> >
> fmt(1)
> 
> Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
> format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
> Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
> necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.
> 

+1

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Petr Sabata 
On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 03:37:15PM +, Bjartur Thorlacius wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis  
> wrote:
> > On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your text so wide,
> > please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and anything
> > wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is unpleasant to
> > read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people wrapping their
> > emails too wide.
> >
> fmt(1)
> 
> Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
> format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
> Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
> necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.
> 

+1

-- 
# Petr Sabata


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Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Jakub Lach 
+1
 
Dnia 3 października 2011 18:03 Petr Sabata  napisał(a):
> On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 03:37:15PM +, Bjartur Thorlacius wrote:
> > On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis 
 wrote:
> > > On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your text 
so wide,
> > > please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and 
anything
> > > wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is 
unpleasant to
> > > read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people wrapping 
their
> > > emails too wide.
> > >
> > fmt(1)
> > 
> > Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
> > format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
> > Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
> > necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.
> > 
> 
> +1
 

[dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Christian Neukirchen 
Pierre Chapuis  writes:

> I am wondering what the simplest multi-language VM is.

MIPS.

-- 
Christian Neukirchenhttp://chneukirchen.org

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Nick 
On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 06:11:44PM +0200, Jakub Lach wrote:
> +1
>  
> Dnia 3 października 2011 18:03 Petr Sabata  
> napisał(a):
> > On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 03:37:15PM +, Bjartur Thorlacius wrote:
> > > On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis 
>  wrote:
> > > > On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your text 
> so wide,
> > > > please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and 
> anything
> > > > wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is 
> unpleasant to
> > > > read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people wrapping 
> their
> > > > emails too wide.
> > > >
> > > fmt(1)
> > > 
> > > Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
> > > format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
> > > Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
> > > necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.
> > > 
> > 
> > +1
>  

Bam, Jakub is excluded from the debate.

Incidentally, while we're trying to be fascist about email
style, I hate 'contributions' of +1.

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Jakub Lach 
> Bam, Jakub is excluded from the debate.


Don't tell me you don't like comic sans?

I would use http://llamafont.com/ to
cheer you up, but don't know how to use 
it in emails.

Man, those computer things are hard.

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Kurt H Maier 
+1



Sent from my Palm Pre on the Now Network from Sprint
On Oct 3, 2011 12:15 PM, Nick  wrote: 

On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 06:11:44PM +0200, Jakub Lach wrote:

> +1

>  

> Dnia 3 października 2011 18:03 Petr Sabata 
<con...@redhat.com> napisał(a):

> > On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 03:37:15PM +, Bjartur Thorlacius 
wrote:

> > > On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis 
<eeke...@fastmail.fm> wrote:

> > > > On another note entirely, would you mind not 
wraping your text so wide,

> > > > please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger 
text, and anything

> > > > wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps 
which is unpleasant to

> > > > read. It's not just you, there's quite a few 
people wrapping their

> > > > emails too wide.

> > > >

> > > fmt(1)

> > > 

> > > Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a 
message

> > > format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?

> > > Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than 
strictly

> > > necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.

> > > 

> > 

> > +1

>  



Bam, Jakub is excluded from the debate.



Incidentally, while we're trying to be fascist about email

style, I hate 'contributions' of +1.

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread pancake 
Mips is not a vm.. But talking about simple architectures...

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_instruction_set_computer

On 03/10/2011, at 18:14, Christian Neukirchen  wrote:

> Pierre Chapuis  writes:
> 
>> I am wondering what the simplest multi-language VM is.
> 
> MIPS.
> 
> -- 
> Christian Neukirchenhttp://chneukirchen.org
> 
>

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread Christoph Lohmann 
Greetings,

touch your own nose.


Sincerely,

Christoph Lohmann


Sent while having a nice shit.
Kurt H Maier wrote:
> +1
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Palm Pre on the Now Network from Sprint
> 
> -
> On Oct 3, 2011 12:15 PM, Nick  wrote:
> 
> On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 06:11:44PM +0200, Jakub Lach wrote:
>> +1
>>  
>> Dnia 3 października 2011 18:03 Petr Sabata 
> napisał(a):
>> > On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 03:37:15PM +, Bjartur Thorlacius wrote:
>> > > On Sun, Oct 2, 2011 at 9:52 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis
>  wrote:
>> > > > On another note entirely, would you mind not wraping your
> text so wide,
>> > > > please? My eyes aren't too good so I use larger text, and
> anything
>> > > > wrapped over about 75-80 columns double-wraps which is
> unpleasant to
>> > > > read. It's not just you, there's quite a few people wrapping
> their
>> > > > emails too wide.
>> > > >
>> > > fmt(1)
>> > >
>> > > Can we unify our evangelist forces and standardize on a message
>> > > format? What about RFC 2646: text/plain; format=flowed?
>> > > Embedding any more formatting characters in emails than strictly
>> > > necessary sucks, and autogenerated HTML sucks hard.
>> > >
>> >
>> > +1
>>  
> 
> Bam, Jakub is excluded from the debate.
> 
> Incidentally, while we're trying to be fascist about email
> style, I hate 'contributions' of +1.
>

[dev] [svkbd] TODO

2011-10-03 Thread Christoph Lohmann 
Greetings,

on #suckless there was a discussion how to improve svkbd to be
more useful in a suckless tablet environment. Here is the TODO
list.

# svkbd
## TODO
* move svkbd repository to suckless.org for hackers@ listing
* fix button down passthrough bug (button up instead of down should be
  handled)
* add way to specify return code in layout
* add multiple layouts per instance, instead of assuming user to be able to
  copy with modes
* add empty field support
* add floating (as default)
* -d (dock)
* -t (toolbar)
* add maximum width/height of layout, so it's not stretched, when used with
  docking support in dwm
* scaling may be useful
* add X geometry parsing instead of -wX (XParseGeometry(3))


I'm lacking some time, so people interested may take over.


Mainly this is a reminder for wart_ and secondly to have some
publicity for the suckless tablet efforts.


Sincerely,

Christoph Lohmann

[dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Christian Neukirchen 
pancake  writes:

> Mips is not a vm.

Why not? :P

-- 
Christian Neukirchenhttp://chneukirchen.org

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Bjartur Thorlacius 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 5:38 PM, pancake  wrote:
Emulating is virtually executing...

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread pancake 
Because there's nothing virtual in a real architecture. And emulating it is 
just an emulation. Virtualization is not supported by mips. So..

On 03/10/2011, at 19:25, Christian Neukirchen  wrote:

> pancake  writes:
> 
>> Mips is not a vm.
> 
> Why not? :P
> 
> -- 
> Christian Neukirchenhttp://chneukirchen.org
> 
>

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread pancake 
Nope. Virtualization != emulation != simulation != interpretation.

Nevertheless when ppl talk about virtual machines they usually refer to pieces 
of software that implement machines that cannot be implemented by hardware 
because they provide high level opcodes and primitives.

If you use gxemul or qemu you end up having the same problems than running your 
software natively as audio/video/io/network is not abstracted and require a 
system running on top of your app to handle it.

Virtual machines are also refered to code emulation on top of real architecture 
or software in advanced binary packers.

On 03/10/2011, at 19:44, Bjartur Thorlacius  wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 5:38 PM, pancake  wrote:
> Emulating is virtually executing...
>

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Connor Lane Smith 
Hey,

On 3 October 2011 18:38, pancake  wrote:
> Because there's nothing virtual in a real architecture. And emulating it is 
> just an emulation. Virtualization is not supported by mips. So..

You're right, MIPS isn't a VM, it's an ISA. But the Dis virtual
machine is based upon the Dis ISA (a CISC-like bytecode); likewise the
JVM, CLR, etc. So MIPS isn't a VM, but a VM may implement MIPS.

On 3 October 2011 19:08, pancake  wrote:
> Nope. Virtualization != emulation != simulation != interpretation.

The difference between an emulator and a VM is that an emulator
simulates a specific device / processor, rather than executing the ISA
itself. If we were to emulate the N64, it would be an emulator; if we
were to virtualise MIPS, it would be a VM.

> Nevertheless when ppl talk about virtual machines they usually refer to 
> pieces of software that implement machines that cannot be implemented by 
> hardware because they provide high level opcodes and primitives.

Anything that can be implemented in software can be implemented in
hardware; it's simply not cost-effective to do so.

So yeah, MIPS may well be the best ISA for a 'multi-language' VM.

(Holy acronyms, Batman.)

cls

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Pierre Chapuis 

On Mon, 3 Oct 2011 18:44:23 +0200, pancake wrote:


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_instruction_set_computer


Nice, I didn't know that.

As for what I was looking for I guess I will evaluate the
possibilities to implement something else on top of some
version of the Lua VM for now.

Re: [dev] Formatting emails

2011-10-03 Thread stanio 

(top posted)
+1 

* Nick  [2011-10-03 18:16]:
> On Mon, Oct 03, 2011 at 06:11:44PM +0200, Jakub Lach wrote:
> > +1
> > > +1
> >  
> 
> Bam, Jakub is excluded from the debate.
> 
> Incidentally, while we're trying to be fascist about email
> style, I hate 'contributions' of +1.
-- 
 stanio_

Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Suraj N. Kurapati 
On Mon 03 Oct 2011 08:05:26 AM PDT, Patrick Haller wrote:
> update_config() { [ `mtime $cfg` -gt `mtime $history` ] && . $cfg
> ; }
> export PS1='`update_config`> '

Never heard of mtime(1).  Is that POSIX sh?  This is:

update_config() { [ $cfg -nt $history ] && . $cfg ; }

-- 
Waste not fresh tears over old griefs.
-- Euripides


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Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Connor Lane Smith 
Hey,

On 3 October 2011 19:42, Suraj N. Kurapati  wrote:
> Never heard of mtime(1).  Is that POSIX sh?  This is:
>
> update_config() { [ $cfg -nt $history ] && . $cfg ; }

No it isn't, the '-nt' flag is a non-POSIX test(1) extension.

cls

Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Suraj N. Kurapati 
On Mon 03 Oct 2011 07:49:04 PM PDT, Connor Lane Smith wrote:
> On 3 October 2011 19:42, Suraj N. Kurapati wrote:
> > Never heard of mtime(1).  Is that POSIX sh?  This is:
> >
> > update_config() { [ $cfg -nt $history ] && . $cfg ; }
>
> No it isn't, the '-nt' flag is a non-POSIX test(1) extension.

I stand corrected.  Thank you.

-- 
I just forgot my whole philosophy of life!!!


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Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Connor Lane Smith 
On 3 October 2011 20:01, Suraj N. Kurapati  wrote:
> I stand corrected.  Thank you.

Strangely, this is actually a difficult problem to solve elegantly
whilst remaining POSIX-compliant. dmenu_run uses a hack involving 'ls
-t'. It's gross.

cls

Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Kurt H Maier 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 3:04 PM, Connor Lane Smith  wrote:
> Strangely, this is actually a difficult problem to solve elegantly
> whilst remaining POSIX-compliant. dmenu_run uses a hack involving 'ls
> -t'. It's gross.

I'd like to see sbase include a version of stat(1) that wasn't written
by mouthbreathing farmers.

-- 
# Kurt H Maier

Re: [dev] Make dmenu sensitive to user aliases ("Hello world")

2011-10-03 Thread Andrew Hills 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 3:18 PM, Kurt H Maier  wrote:
> mouthbreathing farmers.

I can't tell whether or not this is an insult.

--Andrew Hills

Re: [dev] Re: Most suckless multi-language VM

2011-10-03 Thread Bjartur Thorlacius 
I recommend porting Dis to jslinux.