RE: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
When I worked on the UK Universities X.25 networking software we used Series/1s for interfacing the x.25 to VM/370 as IBM had X.25 and Channel hardware for the s/1. Dave > -Original Message- > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Guy > Sotomayor Jr > Sent: 22 November 2016 07:31 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > Subject: Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US. > > The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There were > originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later. I always knew > them by their code names — different varieties of peaches…so named > because they were developed by IBM’s GSD division which was > headquartered in Atlanta, GA (even though all of the development was done > in Boca Raton, FL). > > TTFN - Guy > > > On Nov 21, 2016, at 10:11 PM, couryho...@aol.com wrote: > > > > what is it? looks too new for me, do not remember this one > > Ed# > > > > > > In a message dated 11/21/2016 9:30:06 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, > > drlegen...@gmail.com writes: > > > > The vintage computing world is in your debt, Steven.. ;-) > > > > On Mon, Nov 21, 2016 at 10:18 PM, Steven Maresca > > > > wrote: > > > >> On Mon, Nov 21, 2016 at 10:50 PM, Ian Finder > > wrote: > >> > >>> Someone go rescue this: > >>> http://nwct.craigslist.org/zip/5886266424.html > >>> > >>> Or palletize it and send it to me. > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Ian Finder > >>> (206) 395-MIPS > >>> ian.fin...@gmail.com > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Ian Finder > >>> (206) 395-MIPS > >>> ian.fin...@gmail.com > >>> > >> I'm in CT close enough to make a rescue..I've reached out to the poster. > >> > >> Regards, > >> Steve > >> > >
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> From: Josh Dersch > There appears to be no continuity between CA1/CB1 of slot 9 and CA1/CB1 > of the SPC/MUD slots in the rest of the system. Is that the only issue? If so, that should be 'not too hard' to track down. It's possible that they didn't bother wiring NPG to that slot, but sent it directly to the NPG pin on the 'UNIBUS out' connector; when the -11/40 was done, there were no single-board DMA devices. > It's very puzzling. BTDT! :-) > I have an RK11 and an RK05 Ah, you're good then - Unix V6 will run fine with a single RK. (Ah, memories: my first experience as a sys-admin was on an 11/40 with a single RK...) The standard V6 distro include systems that will run on an RK. (The V7 distro does not, but it's possible to build RK-based systems. You'd need to bring it up on an emulator to do so.) > (with the option of a 2nd RK05 if I ever get some mounting rails for > it.) I know the RK05s are tight storage-wise. Well, you can't put all the source and documentation online with a single RK (or even two), but that shouldn't be an issue. If you were actually trying to do _real work_ on the system, a single RK might be something of a PITA. > I also have an RL02 but I need to repair an RL11 first. Put that online, and you'll have plenty of room. Also, with two controllers, you'll get higher performance (not that you care :-); you could put e.g. swapping on the RK, and most files on the RL. > I should be able to wrangle bits onto media either using what I have, > or by using stuff at the LCM, but the VTServer option sounds nice too. OK, I'll probably get back to work on it 'soon'. > The RL bootstrap and driver would be very useful to have, thanks! They're available on my "Bringing up V6 Unix on the Ersatz-11 PDP-11 Emulator" page, here: http://mercury.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/tech/V6Unix.html#RL That page (and it's partner, "Improving V6 Unix") probably contains some other useful stuff, if you're serious about running V6. One off the top of my head: the C on the 'vanilla' V6 distro is fairly primitive. There are no longs or unsigneds, casts don't work, etc, etc. There is a later version (which I think might be the so-called 'phototypsetter C'), available from the 'Shoppa disks', you might want to get that. Noel
Re: Rogue: Mctesq was here
> > There's a Rogue for the Alpha Micro. I don't have source for it either, > > but it runs very well. > > What is an Alpha Micro? http://ampm.floodgap.com/ It's hosted on one! -- personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ -- Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com -- Everyone is different. No two people are not on fire. -- Strong Bad #84
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> It's possible that they didn't bother wiring NPG to that slot, but sent
> it directly to the NPG pin on the 'UNIBUS out' connector
Sho'nuff; the 11/40 prints indicate (pg. 86) that "BUS NPG" goes directly from
C07P2 ("Source" - you can see the generation on print K4-5, pg. 62, lower
right side), to A09U1 (NPG on the UNIBUS Out connector), do not pass through
SPC slot 9, do not collect a grant.
I dunno about any other oddities you're seeing, but I think this one is
solved. :-)
Noel
Re: Reverse-engineering WD1000, WD1001 hard disk controllers
On 20.11.2016 01:30, Al Kossow wrote: On 11/19/16 4:25 PM, dwight wrote: It is actually a controller for a TRS-80 but it was a WD1000 in disguise. what format board (5" or 8")? 8X300 or 305? I dumped and took pictures of a couple different styles which are up on bitsavers under westernDigital Interesting The MFM disk controller for later version Lilith's is clearly based on a WD1001-05. But uses a 8x305 iso 8x300. Pic of PCB and dump of proms are onftp://ftp.dreesen.ch/WD1001/ The disk used is an imi-5018 15MB. Jos
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There were originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later. I always knew them by their code names — different varieties of peaches…so named because they were developed by IBM’s GSD division which was headquartered in Atlanta, GA (even though all of the development was done in Boca Raton, FL). We'd get it for the VCFed museum, but we already have one and time/bandwidth are spread thin right now.
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 7:48 AM, Noel Chiappa
wrote:
> > It's possible that they didn't bother wiring NPG to that slot, but
> sent
> > it directly to the NPG pin on the 'UNIBUS out' connector
>
> Sho'nuff; the 11/40 prints indicate (pg. 86) that "BUS NPG" goes directly
> from
> C07P2 ("Source" - you can see the generation on print K4-5, pg. 62, lower
> right side), to A09U1 (NPG on the UNIBUS Out connector), do not pass
> through
> SPC slot 9, do not collect a grant.
>
> I dunno about any other oddities you're seeing, but I think this one is
> solved. :-)
>
> Noel
>
Interesting. I'll have to look tonight and see if the same is true for
other bus grants -- I can run the system with no grant continuity card at
all in slot 9 and everything works. Which seems strange to me.
I went through and cleaned the edge connectors on all of the boards,
grants, and UNIBUS jumpers, and I went through the CPU set to make sure all
jumpers (etc.) are in the right place for running without an MMU, EIS, LTC,
Stack Limit, etc. I now have the system booting XXDP (from a SCSI2SD via
the SCSI controller) and things are mostly sane. Occasionally the
diagnostics start trapping to 10 (reserved instruction trap) so something's
amiss but I didn't have time last night to dig into things.
I did find out why there was that wire missing on the backplane; the KW11-L
requires a wire (carrying one of the bus grant signals) be removed from
slot 3. My machine is a bit of a mongrel -- the CPU set that it came with
was not original to the machine, so nothing matches up... but things seem
to be rectified now. Just need to solve the slot 9 mystery and work on
getting diagnostics to pass more reliably.
Thanks,
Josh
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 2:31 AM, Guy Sotomayor Jr wrote: > The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There were > originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later... ISTR having to mod our 3780 COMBOARD code to talk to a Series/1 in about 1992 or so because someone in WI bought our VAXBI COMBOARD to send EDI purchase reqs to a vendor network run by IBM and the device on the other end of our customer's modem was a Series/1 that didn't quite exactly implement 3780 like all the IBM products before it. -ethan
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> From: Josh Dersch derschjo at gmail.com > see if the same is true for other bus grants -- I can run the system > with no grant continuity card at all in slot 9 and everything works. Well, the BG4-BG7 grants definitely _are_ run through the SPC slot 9 (see below) - at least, on a stock system. It's _possible_ that the software you're loading doesn't use interrupts. (I have this vague memory that, unlike the -11/34, the /40 doesn't complain if there's a non-continuous grant line.) Or perhaps someone wired them across on that slot, to avoid knuckle-mashing trying to put a G727 down there. Anyway, the wire list in the drawings show all four lines (although they are listed in two places, under "BGx" and "BUS BGx"). E.g. BG4 is shown on pg. 79 as going from D07E2 (Source - K4-6, pg. 63, top right) to D09S2 (which is the correct BG4 'in' pin for SPC), and as BUS BG4 on pg. 84 as going from D09T2 (SPC BG4 'out' pin) to B09E2 (correct BG4 UNIBUS 'out' pin). > I now have the system booting XXDP Yahh!! > I did find out why there was that wire missing on the backplane; the > KW11-L requires a wire (carrying one of the bus grant signals) be > removed from slot 3. Right, BG6 is wired through that KW11-L slot because the clock needs interrupts - the wire list shows that on pg. 79, where the BG6 entry is longer than the other BGn entries, because of that. If I'm reading the notations correctly, it shows the jumper installed by default - I guess it was removed by hand on systems sold with a KW11-L? There must also be some way to indicate that the jumper should be wired on top at both ends (so the F03V2 to D09M2 wire wouldn't have to be removed to pull the F03R2 to F03V2 jumper) - although maybe they just did _all_ multi-pin runs as alternating low on both ends, high on both ends, repeat to make removal/replacement easier. Speaking of notation, dunno if you knew this (I didn't), but the wire list for the 11/40 includes etch also; you can tell etch entries from an 'H' in the "Q" column and 'P' in the "Remark" column. Don't confuse them with the 'H' in the "A/P" column, which also also has some 'L' entries; not sure what that is about, unless it tells whether the signal is asserted high or low. Noel
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 12:11 PM, Ethan Dicks wrote: > On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 2:31 AM, Guy Sotomayor Jr > wrote: > > The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There > were > > originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later... > > ISTR having to mod our 3780 COMBOARD code to talk to a Series/1 in > about 1992 or so because someone in WI bought our VAXBI COMBOARD to > send EDI purchase reqs to a vendor network run by IBM and the device > on the other end of our customer's modem was a Series/1 that didn't > quite exactly implement 3780 like all the IBM products before it. > > -ethan > Whomever gets this, I donated my Series/1 to the VCFed Museum in Wall NJ, and if you want to check it out for comparison purposes, I would be happy to help set up an appointment to inspect it. Also, I have some notes about the system I had, which is very similar to the Series/1 on craigslist. I was able to IPL it, but did not do much else. http://www.vintagecomputer.net/browse_thread.cfm?id=12 http://www.vintagecomputer.net/ibm/Series1/ http://www.vintagecomputer.net/browse_thread.cfm?id=206 Bill
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
On 11/22/2016 10:09 AM, william degnan wrote: On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 2:31 AM, Guy Sotomayor Jr >wrote: > >The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There >were > >originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later... Ultimate's Pick implementation for the IBM mainframe had a channel attached Series One with serial channels available for communications to IBM 3151 ASCII terminals. if you ran the usual pile that IBM had, there was a program that ran in the Series one that put up a screen similar to a 3270 on each 3151 terminal, and acted much like a 3270 terminal, but with Ascii terminals and using cursor control and the like to do the screens. A standalone controller, the 7171 also did that as well. On the 9121 mainframes there was a 68000 equipped board and subsystem called the Hyfas that did the same directly from boards in the 9121 chassis. IBM disclosed Ultimate on a method to bypass the 3270 software and do direct I/O for byte I/O to use the terminals on all three of these subsystems like direct attached Ascii terminals. Also there was a Pick Series one implementation by Pick Blue in Seattle. I also know that some number of Sears Roebuck stores had Series One systems for their POS control in each store up to the end of life of pretty much a real Sears chain, and the product. There was a large flood of systems at the time that the IBM POS systems were converted to some other backend system (I didn't track what the replacement configuration was). I've not set foot in a Sears store in 30 years due to them screwing me in 1976, so don't know much about any of their gear since, but I am pretty sure on the Series One from some people who acquired systems at that time, in the early 90s.
Re: Rogue: Mctesq was here
On 20/11/16 05:39, Richard Loken wrote: On Sun, 20 Nov 2016, Antonio Carlini wrote: There is a rogue that runs on VAX/VMS as I definitely played it a little back in the day. I don't think I had the sources, just a .EXE, so that may not work so well for Alpha. Now THAT is interesting! I wonder where it went to? I do have some backup TK50 cartridges that *may* cover that era. First I need to dig out a system with a TK50/TK70 drive on it and see if it still works. Then I'll need to go through the cartridges I do have and archive them. Whether the old games made it out of university with me or not is another matter. Ping me again in a month or so to see how far I've got ! Antonio arcarl...@iee.org
Re: Fwd: NCD16 images. Was: NCD19 / Xncd19
Hi Al & list, Sorry for the delay, but the files should be readable now. On 18-11-16 19:00, Al Kossow wrote: Fred, could you make these files readable, please Apparently Filezilla in the new configuration needs more configuration. The URL again: http://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/comp/divcomp/NCD/ Greetings, Fred Jan
Re: HP Draftmaster RX pen plotter needs love
I appreciate the guidance so far, thanks very much.
I found another power supply/motor driver board ("analog board") of the
same part number, hooked it up to the plotter and tested it. The -12v test
point on the new board read zero, and the other voltages were present just
like the original board.
I don't suppose that proves anything, but at least now I have 2 power
supplies.
I don't have an electronics background other than hobby-level tinkering. I
don't know how likely it is I'll be able to diagnose and fix this solely on
remote guidance, and in any case that seems like too much for me to ask.
If there is someone within driving distance of Seattle who could get this
thing working I will pay them what their time and effort is worth (I'm
trying to avoid shipping this monster or buying anyone plane tickets).
thanks
M.
On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:17 PM, Michael Newton
wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 17, 2016 at 12:10 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote:
>
>> On 2016-Nov-16, at 11:34 PM, Michael Newton wrote:
>>
>> > That's right, there is a -5v test point that reads zero.
>>
>> From the previous discussion, presumably you mean -12V.
>
>
> Yes -12v, sorry
>
>
>> > Any guidance? Like if I need to pull parts off and test them, which ones
>> > might I go for? I'm a caveman with electronics.
>>
>> Looking at:
>> 7595-7596_HardwareSupportManual_07595-90025_168pages_Feb90.pdf
>> from hpmuseum.net via the link you supplied, the document seems to be
>> truncated.
>> The document simply ends part way through the schematics pages, and of
>> course the power supply schematic is missing.
>> (Aside, where did you find that document link? I didn't find it ref'd on
>> the hpmuseum pages.)
>>
>>
> It's linked from http://www.hpmuseum.net/collection_document.php - search
> the page for "DraftMaster"
>
> The document does appear to be missing the full schematic of the analog
> board. I haven't been able to find them anywhere.
>
>
>
>> There is a minimal diagram for the power supply on page 5-4 (pdf.30),
>> which shows the -12V supply as an independent (not part of the control
>> loop) secondary out of the switching supply. That's good as it limits the
>> likely problem region. There will be more components involved than shown
>> there, but the diode seen there on the -12V supply will lead to a filter
>> cap and possibly a 3-terminal linear regulator such as a 7912 or LM320-12,
>> or even a zener
>> regulator. There may be current limiting or overvoltage circuitry between
>> there and the actual -12 output of the supply.
>>
>> - identify the -12V componentry in the power supply.
>> - if there is a 3-terminal -12V regulator check for input to the
>> reg vs output.
>> - confirm that it's not the load side of the -12 causing the
>> problem.
>> - pic(s) of the power supply board might help us identify the
>> area or get a better idea of what we're dealing with.
>>
>>
>
> I took photos: https://goo.gl/photos/tRWV3ATTqx2R3eDz6
>
>
>
>
Re: DNIX and ABCenix install media disk images.
actually, it appears the machine is emulated in MAME On 11/22/16 11:12 AM, Anders Sandahl wrote: > Not that I'm aware of. I can do it, but I don't have daily access to the > machine so it will take a couple of months. >> >> has the firmware been dumped from this? >> >> On 11/21/16 6:54 AM, Anders Sandahl wrote: >>> On 11/18/16 12:02 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote: > This is great! Thanks Mattis, Jonas and Al. > > Somewhere I have an early DNIX system image from a development machine. > I don't know if that is interesting to put on bitsavers as well? > yes, I think so >>> >>> And I have documentation and software to the Luxor ABC1600 as well. >>> >>> Temporary link: http://blue.abc80.net/archive/luxor/ABC1600/ >>> >>> Most of it is in Swedish though. >>> >>> /Anders >> >
Re: Re: DNIX and ABCenix install media disk images.
Not that I'm aware of. I can do it, but I don't have daily access to the machine so it will take a couple of months. has the firmware been dumped from this? On 11/21/16 6:54 AM, Anders Sandahl wrote: On 11/18/16 12:02 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote: This is great! Thanks Mattis, Jonas and Al. Somewhere I have an early DNIX system image from a development machine. I don't know if that is interesting to put on bitsavers as well? yes, I think so And I have documentation and software to the Luxor ABC1600 as well. Temporary link: http://blue.abc80.net/archive/luxor/ABC1600/ Most of it is in Swedish though. /Anders
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
On 2016-11-22 3:31 PM, jim stephens wrote: On 11/22/2016 10:09 AM, william degnan wrote: On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 2:31 AM, Guy Sotomayor Jr >wrote: > >The IBM Series/1 was introduced in 1976 and withdrawn in 1988. There >were > >originally 2 models and another 2 models were added later... Ultimate's Pick implementation for the IBM mainframe had a channel attached Series One with serial channels available for communications to IBM 3151 ASCII terminals. if you ran the usual pile that IBM had, there was a program that ran in the Series one that put up a screen similar to a 3270 on each 3151 terminal, and acted much like a 3270 terminal, but with Ascii terminals and using cursor control and the like to do the screens. A standalone controller, the 7171 also did that as well. On the 9121 mainframes there was a 68000 equipped board and subsystem called the Hyfas that did the same directly from boards in the 9121 chassis. IBM disclosed Ultimate on a method to bypass the 3270 software and do direct I/O for byte I/O to use the terminals on all three of these subsystems like direct attached Ascii terminals. Also there was a Pick Series one implementation by Pick Blue in Seattle. I also know that some number of Sears Roebuck stores had Series One systems for their POS control in each store up to the end of life of pretty much a real Sears chain, and the product. There was a large flood of systems at the time that the IBM POS systems were converted to some other backend system (I didn't track what the replacement configuration was). I've not set foot in a Sears store in 30 years due to them screwing me in 1976, so don't know much about any of their gear since, but I am pretty sure on the Series One from some people who acquired systems at that time, in the early 90s. I understand that the Sears stores in the US replaced their Series/1 machines with a 9371, Sears Canada replaced theirs with a small AIX system as did the late Eatons Dept store. State Farm Insurance agents used to have Series/1 machines in their offices, they too replaced them with 9271s. The machines in the Sears stores stores did not have the operator panel, nor did they have a diskette drive so if you wanted to run diagnostics on them you had to haul these items packaged as a CE tool to the site with you. The biggest problem with servicing Series/1 was they where so reliable that unless you where maintaining a lot of them you never got good at them. The channel adapter on the Series/1 had a rather large flaw, if you did not disable the interface before shutting down the Series/1 it would upset the channel it was attached to causing a flurry of channel checks that could bring the host system to its knees. When I worked in the IBM Toronto Lab we had two channel attached Series/1 machines with 72MD diskette units that we used to create diskettes from images sent to us and also to send diskette images. These Series/1s pretended to be a 3270 control unit so that the MVS host system knew how to talk to them. Paul.
Re: Free IBM system/1(?) in eastern US.
On 11/22/2016 2:56 PM, Paul Berger wrote: The channel adapter on the Series/1 had a rather large flaw, if you did not disable the interface before shutting down the Series/1 it would upset the channel it was attached to causing a flurry of channel checks that could bring the host system to its knees. When I worked in the IBM Toronto Lab we had two channel attached Series/1 machines with 72MD diskette units that we used to create diskettes from images sent to us and also to send diskette images. These Series/1s pretended to be a 3270 control unit so that the MVS host system knew how to talk to them. the Ultimate system was the only Non IBM written supervisor / system that ran on mainframes at the time. The supervisor or in Pick terms, Monitor handled such things with code specific to Pick. I don't know that it would have caused the system to stop, but I'd doubt it, as we had a complete setup to test it with, and running with parts turned off after system boot would have been tested. All of the channels, 7171, Series 1, and Hyfas channels were all run in a different mode than most anywhere in IBM, though I understand the mode was supported w/o firmware mods on all systems. I'd have loved to have heard the L2 and L3 calls if anyone called with complaints though. Our support contract with IBM essentially made us L3 for everything we had, but we had access to all PMR's as well as PMR's filed against systems with our software. I say to all PMR's as the access has vastly narrowed, but we had access for supporting our own VM/SP, so we could search for problems and get APARs. All of our systems were hooked up via a channel switch to three systems, a 4381, 9121, and a 9370. All had some dedicated DASD, but unique items such as a couple of tape drives, the 7171, and the Series one were all on the switch to be moved to each system to see what happened. We also conned IBM into a CHIM as well as set of hardware and software to enable Microchannel machines to be either a channel, or to run channel attached hardware. Also, note that Mike Ross has a CHIM, which I am not sure he knows is a CHIM. http://www.corestore.org/360tester-1.jpg At least the box we had matched this. We were hoping that IBM would forget it when we started to get where our facility would shut down, as we were the only account left in Orange County with 370 or 360 channels, but the found it. Also had a custom instruction trace firmware for the 4381 for being able to trace some performances with deposits into lower memory. thanks Jim
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
On 11/22/16 9:27 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote: > From: Josh Dersch derschjo at gmail.com > see if the same is true for other bus grants -- I can run the system > with no grant continuity card at all in slot 9 and everything works. Well, the BG4-BG7 grants definitely _are_ run through the SPC slot 9 (see below) - at least, on a stock system. It's _possible_ that the software you're loading doesn't use interrupts. (I have this vague memory that, unlike the -11/34, the /40 doesn't complain if there's a non-continuous grant line.) Or perhaps someone wired them across on that slot, to avoid knuckle-mashing trying to put a G727 down there. Yes, I'd expect them to be run through the slot (though I expected the NPG, too :)). And there does seem to be continuity between the BG pins on the CPU backplane and those on the DD11. If I remove the grant continuity card from slot 9, I can still boot XXDP. If I remove a grant continuity card from the DD11 (with NPG still intact), I can't -- it hangs as I'd expect with a hole in the grant chain. No one's done anything cute like hard-wiring the grants in and there's no evidence of any modifications. All expected voltages are present on the backplane pins in the right places. I put a little contact cleaner in the slot too, just in case. I still can't get an SLU to function in that slot, though the CSR addresses seem to respond and the console/diagnostic PROM chugs along happily when I power the machine up (though nothing appears on the serial line). Tonight I may try running the SLU on an extender board and verifying that all the proper voltages are actually making it to the board. The fact that the board appears to be responding but I'm getting nothing over the serial line makes me think that maybe the -15V isn't present for some reason... Anyway, the wire list in the drawings show all four lines (although they are listed in two places, under "BGx" and "BUS BGx"). E.g. BG4 is shown on pg. 79 as going from D07E2 (Source - K4-6, pg. 63, top right) to D09S2 (which is the correct BG4 'in' pin for SPC), and as BUS BG4 on pg. 84 as going from D09T2 (SPC BG4 'out' pin) to B09E2 (correct BG4 UNIBUS 'out' pin). > I now have the system booting XXDP Yahh!! > I did find out why there was that wire missing on the backplane; the > KW11-L requires a wire (carrying one of the bus grant signals) be > removed from slot 3. Right, BG6 is wired through that KW11-L slot because the clock needs interrupts - the wire list shows that on pg. 79, where the BG6 entry is longer than the other BGn entries, because of that. If I'm reading the notations correctly, it shows the jumper installed by default - I guess it was removed by hand on systems sold with a KW11-L? The KW11-L manual suggests that this is the case, the installation instructions specifically call out removing that wire. Apparently my 40's backplane had been reconfigured in such a manner at some point. There must also be some way to indicate that the jumper should be wired on top at both ends (so the F03V2 to D09M2 wire wouldn't have to be removed to pull the F03R2 to F03V2 jumper) - although maybe they just did _all_ multi-pin runs as alternating low on both ends, high on both ends, repeat to make removal/replacement easier. Speaking of notation, dunno if you knew this (I didn't), but the wire list for the 11/40 includes etch also; you can tell etch entries from an 'H' in the "Q" column and 'P' in the "Remark" column. Don't confuse them with the 'H' in the "A/P" column, which also also has some 'L' entries; not sure what that is about, unless it tells whether the signal is asserted high or low. That's useful information to have, thanks! - Josh Noel
Re: Reverse-engineering WD1000, WD1001 hard disk controllers
On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 9:14 AM, jos wrote: > The MFM disk controller for later version Lilith's is clearly based on a > WD1001-05. > But uses a 8x305 iso 8x300. > All of the WD1001 controllers I've seen use 8X305. Some later WD1000 use 8X305 also. I've disassembled the firmware of one WD1001-05 so far, and it does not use any of the added features of the 8X305. I suspect WD and their licensees switched to the 8X305 due to price or availability, rather than due to the extra features. Pic of PCB and dump of proms are onftp://ftp.dreesen.ch/WD1001/ > Thanks! The PROM contents match those of the WD1001-05 which Al dumped and put online: http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/westernDigital/WD100x/WD1001-05/ Al and I also each dumped the controller PROMs from Fortune 32:16 WD1001-CLB disk controller, which were the same, and appear to be an older firmware version. http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/fortuneSystems/firmware/WD1001-CLB_Fortune/ I've made a fair bit of progress reverse-engineering the WD1001 firmware (newer, not -CLB), and I've just pushed it to the github repo, though it's not yet as thoroughly commented as the two WD1000 versions (and even those aren't 100% done).
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
On 11/22/16 4:00 PM, Josh Dersch wrote: On 11/22/16 9:27 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote: > From: Josh Dersch derschjo at gmail.com > see if the same is true for other bus grants -- I can run the system > with no grant continuity card at all in slot 9 and everything works. Well, the BG4-BG7 grants definitely _are_ run through the SPC slot 9 (see below) - at least, on a stock system. It's _possible_ that the software you're loading doesn't use interrupts. (I have this vague memory that, unlike the -11/34, the /40 doesn't complain if there's a non-continuous grant line.) Or perhaps someone wired them across on that slot, to avoid knuckle-mashing trying to put a G727 down there. Yes, I'd expect them to be run through the slot (though I expected the NPG, too :)). And there does seem to be continuity between the BG pins on the CPU backplane and those on the DD11. If I remove the grant continuity card from slot 9, I can still boot XXDP. If I remove a grant continuity card from the DD11 (with NPG still intact), I can't -- it hangs as I'd expect with a hole in the grant chain. No one's done anything cute like hard-wiring the grants in and there's no evidence of any modifications. All expected voltages are present on the backplane pins in the right places. I put a little contact cleaner in the slot too, just in case. I still can't get an SLU to function in that slot, though the CSR addresses seem to respond and the console/diagnostic PROM chugs along happily when I power the machine up (though nothing appears on the serial line). Tonight I may try running the SLU on an extender board and verifying that all the proper voltages are actually making it to the board. The fact that the board appears to be responding but I'm getting nothing over the serial line makes me think that maybe the -15V isn't present for some reason... Ad: mystery solved (?). I had borrowed the SLU I was using in the 11/40 from my 11/34. This was an M7856 (DL11-W). Thought I'd grab another SLU from my UNIBUS drawer and configure it up so I could put the 7856 back in the 11/34, but all I had left were the older, more annoying to configure M7800s (DL11-D). So I jumpered it up (max of 2400 baud with the crystal that's currently installed, blah) and installed it. Works fine in the DD11 backplane. Moved it to slot 9 of the CPU backplane. Still works. So... maybe I just completely missed the memo on this, and maybe there's still something wrong with my backplane... is it possible that slot 9 of the 11/40's CPU backplane is wired *specifically* for an M7800? I guess I need to spend some time tonight seeing what the differences are... but now I need to go attend to a cranky 2yo who just woke up from a nap... - Josh
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> On Nov 22, 2016, at 4:40 PM, Josh Dersch wrote: > > > So... maybe I just completely missed the memo on this, and maybe there's > still something wrong with my backplane... is it possible that slot 9 of the > 11/40's CPU backplane is wired *specifically* for an M7800? I guess I need > to spend some time tonight seeing what the differences are... but now I need > to go attend to a cranky 2yo who just woke up from a nap… > I seem to recall something similar with one of the 11/40’s I was working on. I believe that because the 11/40 CPU backplane is wired for an M787 that things don’t work quite right if you try and install an M7856 into the SPC slot in the backplane and try and use it and not the M787. There is a way to jumper the CPU backplane so you can use na M7856 and not the M787. I haven’t really investigated it in detail (and it’s been a long time since I messed around with the 11/40 at that level). TTFN - Guy
Re: Looking for 8085a CPU
Hi Adrian , I'm certain I have a couple 8085s you can have for the shipping . Let me go through my storage unit this week end and find them . I'm in San Diego , CA USA , there has to be some slick way to ship to the UK to avoid all the unpleasantness Do you have PayPal or ? We can figure something out . You do know the 8085 has a MINIMUM frequency of 500 KHz due to internal dynamic logic ? It gets real pissy if you go below that . CDP1802s you can clock down to 0 Hz . Let me know if this will work for you . Happy Turkey Day ! Best regards, Steven C KJ6STF On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 3:32 PM, Adrian Graham wrote: > Hi folks, > > Still working on this STC Executel and it looks like the CPU isn't too good > given how hot it gets within a minute or so. The display is the same > whether > there's a CPU physically present or not. I built this circuit to test it: > > http://saundby.com/electronics/8085/freerun.shtml > > Using a 4mhz crystal the address lines are all over the place - I'm using a > logic analyser rather than LEDs. > > Has anyone got a spare they'd like to sell me? I'm struggling to think of > something I've got that may have a socketed 8085... > > -- > Adrian/Witchy > Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator > Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer > collection? > > >
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Guy Sotomayor Jr wrote: > > > On Nov 22, 2016, at 4:40 PM, Josh Dersch wrote: > > > > > > So... maybe I just completely missed the memo on this, and maybe there's > still something wrong with my backplane... is it possible that slot 9 of > the 11/40's CPU backplane is wired *specifically* for an M7800? I guess I > need to spend some time tonight seeing what the differences are... but now > I need to go attend to a cranky 2yo who just woke up from a nap… > > > > I seem to recall something similar with one of the 11/40’s I was working > on. I believe that because the 11/40 CPU backplane is wired for an M787 > that things don’t work quite right if you try and install an M7856 into the > SPC slot in the backplane and try and use it and not the M787. There is a > way to jumper the CPU backplane so you can use na M7856 and not the M787. > I haven’t really investigated it in detail (and it’s been a long time since > I messed around with the 11/40 at that level). > > TTFN - Guy > > I have my 11/40 fired up right now too. I can load BASIC and I have a M9312 with a M7800 that returns serial signals/monitor running. I have the CPU backplane, two core planes (empty), a DD11B and an DD11C. I can operate without a grant card in slot, but I can't boot up using RL02 either way, still trying to track down if I have a UNIBUS issue. If there is something I can measure for you, for comparison purposes, let me know. I will be around tomorrow too during the day. I live near Phila, it's 845PM Tuesday at the moment here. BIll
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> > > I have my 11/40 fired up right now too. I can load BASIC and I have a > M9312 with a M7800 that returns serial signals/monitor running. I have the > CPU backplane, two core planes (empty), a DD11B and an DD11C. I can > operate without a grant card in slot, but I can't boot up using RL02 either > way, still trying to track down if I have a UNIBUS issue. > > If there is something I can measure for you, for comparison purposes, let > me know. I will be around tomorrow too during the day. I live near Phila, > it's 845PM Tuesday at the moment here. > > BIll > ...slot 9 that is, system does not seem to notice. I have only a M737, no M787 installed but my CPU is not expecting a M787
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
> On Nov 22, 2016, at 5:43 PM, william degnan wrote: > > On Tue, Nov 22, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Guy Sotomayor Jr wrote: > >> >>> On Nov 22, 2016, at 4:40 PM, Josh Dersch wrote: >>> >>> >>> So... maybe I just completely missed the memo on this, and maybe there's >> still something wrong with my backplane... is it possible that slot 9 of >> the 11/40's CPU backplane is wired *specifically* for an M7800? I guess I >> need to spend some time tonight seeing what the differences are... but now >> I need to go attend to a cranky 2yo who just woke up from a nap… >>> >> >> I seem to recall something similar with one of the 11/40’s I was working >> on. I believe that because the 11/40 CPU backplane is wired for an M787 >> that things don’t work quite right if you try and install an M7856 into the >> SPC slot in the backplane and try and use it and not the M787. There is a >> way to jumper the CPU backplane so you can use na M7856 and not the M787. >> I haven’t really investigated it in detail (and it’s been a long time since >> I messed around with the 11/40 at that level). >> >> TTFN - Guy >> >> > I have my 11/40 fired up right now too. I can load BASIC and I have a > M9312 with a M7800 that returns serial signals/monitor running. I have the > CPU backplane, two core planes (empty), a DD11B and an DD11C. I can > operate without a grant card in slot, but I can't boot up using RL02 either > way, still trying to track down if I have a UNIBUS issue. > > If there is something I can measure for you, for comparison purposes, let > me know. I will be around tomorrow too during the day. I live near Phila, > it's 845PM Tuesday at the moment here. > Hmm. I just realized that folks are having trouble booting an 11/40 from an RL02. My 11/40 (which is a *big* configuration) has an RL11 in addition to the RK11D and in the past I’ve booted it from an RL02 with no problems. So I suspect it’s some sort of Unibus configuration issue. I haven’t fired up the system since I moved it a few years ago so it would likely take a bit to check things out. TTFN - Guy
Re: ISO: PDP-11/40 LTC and Stack Limit options
On 11/22/16 5:13 PM, Guy Sotomayor Jr wrote: On Nov 22, 2016, at 4:40 PM, Josh Dersch wrote: So... maybe I just completely missed the memo on this, and maybe there's still something wrong with my backplane... is it possible that slot 9 of the 11/40's CPU backplane is wired *specifically* for an M7800? I guess I need to spend some time tonight seeing what the differences are... but now I need to go attend to a cranky 2yo who just woke up from a nap… I seem to recall something similar with one of the 11/40’s I was working on. I believe that because the 11/40 CPU backplane is wired for an M787 that things don’t work quite right if you try and install an M7856 into the SPC slot in the backplane and try and use it and not the M787. There is a way to jumper the CPU backplane so you can use na M7856 and not the M787. I haven’t really investigated it in detail (and it’s been a long time since I messed around with the 11/40 at that level). TTFN - Guy Interesting. I suppose the LTC on the M7856 could also be disabled... I'll have to try that and see if it works. The DL11-W manual doesn't seem to cover any special installation procedures for the 11/40, and the 11/40 System Manual describes Slot 9 as a "SMALL PERIPHERAL CONTROLLER (USUALLY DL11)" slot without mentioning the lack of NPG and the LTC oddity. Weird. I now have the CPU passing diagnostics with flying colors (there was a problem with the IR Decode logic causing incorrect reserved instruction traps), and I can boot RT-11 from the SCSI controller, yay. Now to track down the EIS and Stack Limit options... - Josh
