>
> JF Martinez <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > > find alternate routes to introduce people to Project Independence,
> > > since I won't recommend a distribution that I can't use myself.
>
> > Can you read? Then reread my previous posts and you will see how much
> > I hate having vital software available only for X because I think in
> > what happens when X doesn't work.
>
> Yes. But my point is that I use a distribution because it's a whole
> lot easier than collecting and compiling all the programs I use. If a
> distribution stopped shipping lots of stuff that I use, I would switch
> to something that had the applications I need. And I'd stop
> recommending my ex-distribution to people because I'd no longer be
> using it and would no longer have enough information about the
> distribution to support it.
>
In the heat of discussion I have been a bit excessive: RedHat has ever
been a reasonable compromise between distributions with too little
stuff and encyclopedical distributions where excess of software does
far more harm than good.
I still remember first time I tried Debian: it had 6, yes, six web
servers and by the middle of installation I was feeling dizzy and
failing to install what I wanted while trying to filter the things I
was uninterested. An economist would talk you about decreasing
marginal utility with the first glass of water being more valuable
than diamonds for a man on the verge of dying from thirst while the
thirtieth glass will in fact harm him (negative utility). Same thing
about software.
A distribution who fails to ship software who has a significant user
base will cause inconvenience to those users but a distribution
designer has also the duty to help the users in selecting what is
really good without them losing time trying lemons. In addition there
is software who, for the good of Linux, should better be dead so
better avoid putting it under the spotlights and giving it an
opportunity to gain more users. And there IS inferior software: about
everyone agrees about TWM having no redeeming features, ED being
obsolete or Apache being superior to the NCSA server.
> > But I don't accept having a thousand defenseless beginners getting a
> > headache after seeing three dozens of mail clients (bot console and
> > X) and two hundred editors jsut because a couple hardcore Unixers
> > complained loudly about the lack a program they are the only users
> > and could have downloaded in seconds.
>
> I have trouble with the notion that new users will be caused
> irreparable harm by including programs on the CD they won't
> immediately use. If they are that fragile, they should stop using the
> internet, because there are billions of pages that they'll never
> care about.
>
> If you don't want people to be confused, perhaps you should lobby from
> their inclusion in the default workstation install. (Again,
> neglecting the minor fact that there are users for whom that change
> would make the workstation install useless.) But taking them off the
> CD is is a bad idea, because it's a sure way to upset the people
> your most important userbase: the people who use your distribution,
> upgrade with your distribution, and recommend your distribution to
> others.
>
Again the point is that I don't propose making space by removing
software used by a significant number of people. Only that RedHat
skims what is shippped and removes software nobody is interested about
_and_ clearly inferior to equivalents.
--
Jean Francois Martinez
Project Independence: Linux for the Masses
http://www.independence.seul.org
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