Dear List, dear Andreas,
Andreas, before you close this thread, a final general comment: since 7
years I am teaching my students at the University in Freiburg that Open
Source is more than an IT project, it is a movement, that will change
the world, including values like transparency, participation, shared
information and first of all freedom and peace. And the QGIS project and
its vital and global community is a lighthouse project representing all
these values.
Many commited QGIS users share these values with the rest of the world,
and therefore show deep solidarity with the Ukraine.
So, here is another - more passive - proposal, how we could address the
raid on Ukraine adequately: let´s name the next QGIS release "Ukraine"
or "Kiev" to express the solidarity with the people in Ukraine and their
fight for freedom.
What do you think?
Best regards,
Markus
Am 25.02.2022 um 11:48 schrieb Andreas Neumann:
Hi all,
May I suggest that we stop this thread here - and try to fight the
Russian aggression in different ways / different channels? This is not
the right channel to make a meaningful difference in this horrible war.
As an example, we can try to influence / put some pressure on our
local governments. Both the German and the Swiss governments are
blocking more effective sanctions on Russia. By not buying Russian
energy and raw materials and by freezing bank accounts of Russian
oligarchs who support this war - this is where we can make a
difference. So the pressure needs to be put on our European
governments - and not in the QGIS user community.
As an example: in Berne / Switzerland there will be a demonstration
tomorrow at noon to put pressure on our Swiss government to freeze
Russian bank accounts and to prohibit raw material trading (a lot of
Russian raw materials are traded in Switzerland). I believe this is
where we can make a difference.
Wish you all the best,
Andreas
On Fri, 25 Feb 2022 at 10:50, landcons...@freenet.de
<landcons...@freenet.de> wrote:
Dear Andreas, dear list,
Andreas, you wrote "/If we start excluding countries and
organizations on such assumptions/" I wished you could understand
that Putin´s aggression is not stopping in Ukraina (starting in
Afghanistan, Chechnya, Georgia, Syria, Ukraina, ...whats next).
The only non-atomic power that can stop this is the Russian people.
And yes, I know, Russia is not a democracy, and maybe some
Russians are "suffering from Putin´s politics" (if it were the
"majority" like you say, I had no need to write this letter and
Putin never dared to invade the Ukraine).
I can also imagine, that many of the Russian QGIS users really
appreciate the freedom they feel when they co-operate with the
QGIS community. But I am sure the invasion of their army into
Ukraine is not a reason for them to start thinking about the
legality to kill civilians in independant neighbouring countries.
It´s not a reason unless we (the free, democratic and peaceful
QGIS community) give them such a reason, which is the boycott of
Russian members as long as their troops are in the Ukraine.
And, Andreas, when you are asking where to draw a "/red line/",
you are not seriously comparing the bombing of Kiev with the "oil
exploration" ???? This is cynical.
We must not be passive and hoping "/that this situation can soon
be deescalated/" is not enough. The time is now to make it
absolutely clear that military force against democratic countries
will have consequences for the agressors.
And finally to all Russian QGIS users: I like your country and
your culture and really appreciate all Russian colleagues I met in
the scope of my professional work, this includes all the great
QGIS Plugins and Tools that came from you.
Please help us to stop this war and make your contribution to
secure freedom and peace in Europe and wordlwide!
Best regards,
Markus
Am 24.02.2022 um 13:29 schrieb Andreas Neumann:
Dear Markus,
This is a really difficult topic that you raise here. While I
agree that the aggression from the Putin regime should be
condemned, I am against excluding Russian QGIS contributors and
sustaining members. If we start excluding countries and
organizations on such assumptions - where do we draw the line?
The majority of today's world population unfortunately has to
live in problematic conditions, when it concerns democracy and
dictators. Also - where should be draw the line on what is
ethical use of QGIS and what not? Is oil exploration utilizing
QGIS software allowed, as an example?
As the current QGIS.ORG <http://QGIS.ORG> treasurer I can say
that we had a sustaining member from Russia last year - there is
no indication that this company is collaborating with the Putin
government - though it is of course a bit hard to judge - of
course - for outsiders.
The vast majority of the Russian population is probably suffering
from Putin's politics - my guess is that the majority of the
Russian population would like to live in peace and prosperity and
not be involved in such war and aggression. But do they have a
real choice? Fair elections? I doubt it ... In that sense I am
against excluding Russian QGIS users and contributors based on
these events.
We also have QGIS contributors from Ukraine who are now affected
by this aggression - let's be supportive when there could be
Ukrainian refugees in the coming months - and let's hope that
this situation can soon be deescalated.
Greetings,
Andreas
On Thu, 24 Feb 2022 at 10:09, landcons...@freenet.de
<landcons...@freenet.de> wrote:
Dear List,
like all free people in the world I totally condemn the
Russian invasion in Ukraine this morning. This is an attack
on the free world and especially on Europe and on all values
of freedom which we all represent in a global, peaceful open
source community.
- So, what can each individual do to defend this freedom?
- What can the QGIS community do?
- How can we be sure, that the know-how we develop will not
be used for Russian military purposes against the Ukraine?
The invasion was confirmed by the Duma, the Russian
parliament which is the representative body of the Russian
people. Consequently the Russian population bears
responsibility for the invasion and we should led them know,
that military force against an independent, free and
democratic European country goes against all the values we
stand for in the open source community.
The least we can do is starting to think about a boycott of
Russian products and Russian co-operations to express our
opinion to all Russian companies and partners we know.
Finally its up to the ordinary Russian man to change this
unbearable situation which is becoming a permanent threat to
free Europe.
With this respect the QGIS developer community should also
think about excluding Russian partners and sponsors from all
QGIS activities as long as Russian troops are in the Ukraine.
I think, the values of freedom we stand for, is the highest
good we must defend!
How do you think about it?
Very concerned greeting.
Markus Weidenbach
landConsult.de
Bühl/Germany
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Andreas Neumann
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