On 02/27/2015 02:53 PM, Scott Helms wrote:
"My point is that the option should be there, at the consumer level."
Why? What's magical about symmetry? Is a customer better served by
having a 5mbps/5mbps over a 25mbps/5mbps?
Why not 25/25?
50MB/s might be tough to fill, but even at home I can get good use out
of the odd 25MB/s upstream burst for a few minutes.
"There are so many use cases for this, everything from personal game
servers to on-line backups, that the lack of such offerings is an
indication of an unhealthy market."
Until we get NAT out of the way, this is actually much harder to
leverage than you might think. I don't think there is anything
special about symmetrical bandwidth, I do think upstream bandwidth
usage is going up and will continue to go up, but I don't see any
evidence in actual performance stats or customers sentiment to show
that it's going up as fast as downstream demand.
Scott Helms
Vice President of Technology
ZCorum
(678) 507-5000
--------------------------------
http://twitter.com/kscotthelms
--------------------------------
On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 3:36 PM, Daniel Taylor <dtay...@vocalabs.com
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>> wrote:
My point is that the option should be there, at the consumer level.
If not for fully symmetrical service (I admit that 50MB/s upstream
is a tough pipe to fill), at least for significantly higher
upstream service than is currently available in most neighborhoods.
There are so many use cases for this, everything from personal
game servers to on-line backups, that the lack of such offerings
is an indication of an unhealthy market.
On 02/27/2015 02:25 PM, Scott Helms wrote:
Daniel,
We'd have to come to some standard definition of, "But even if
1% of users would reasonably be using a fully symmetric link
to its potential..."
As I said, I have visibility into a large number of symmetric
connections and without exception they'd fit well into a plan
that offered upstreams with that had a fractional speed of the
downstream. Now, keep in mind I'm not talking about 1/10 as a
ratio here, but 1/5 would accommodate ~99.2% and 1/4 would fit
~99.9%. It's also important to note that all of these
accounts are in the >25mbps down territory so their upstreams
are >5mbps.
What I see when I look at customer satisfaction ratings is a
very strong correlation with low uplink speeds and a high
satisfaction rate when we look at uplink speeds greater than
4mbps. What I don't see is an increase in customer
satisfaction as upload speeds go past ~6mbps. Conversely,
increases in customer satisfaction with correlate with
increases in download speeds past ~30mbps before the
correlation starts weakening.
Scott Helms
Vice President of Technology
ZCorum
(678) 507-5000 <tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
--------------------------------
http://twitter.com/kscotthelms
--------------------------------
On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 2:57 PM, Daniel Taylor
<dtay...@vocalabs.com <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>>>
wrote:
The statistics certainly *should* be used when provisioning
aggregate resources.
But even if 1% of users would reasonably be using a fully
symmetric link to its potential, that's a good reason to
at least
have such circuits available in the standard consumer mix,
which
they aren't today.
On 02/27/2015 01:30 PM, Scott Helms wrote:
Daniel,
Well, I wouldn't call using the mean a "myth", after all
understanding most customer behavior is what we all
have to
build our business cases around. If we throw out what
customers use today and simply take a build it and
they will
come approach then I suspect there would fewer of us
in this
business.
Even when we look at anomalous users we don't see
symmetrical
usage, ie top 10% of uploaders. We also see less
contended
seconds on their upstream than we do on the
downstream. These
observations are based on ~500k residential and business
subscribers across North America using FTTH (mostly GPON),
DOCSIS cable modems, and various flavors of DSL.
Scott Helms
Vice President of Technology
ZCorum
(678) 507-5000 <tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
<tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
--------------------------------
http://twitter.com/kscotthelms
--------------------------------
On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 2:21 PM, Daniel Taylor
<dtay...@vocalabs.com <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>>
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com> <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com
<mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>>>>
wrote:
But by this you are buying into the myth of the mean.
It isn't that most, or even many, people would take
advantage of
equal upstream bandwidth, but that the few who
would need
to take
extra measures unrelated to the generation of that
content
to be
able to do so.
Given symmetrical provisioning, no extra measures
need to
be taken
when that 10 year old down the street turns out to
be a master
musician.
On 02/27/2015 11:59 AM, Scott Helms wrote:
This is true in our measurements today, even when
subscribers
are given
symmetrical connections. It might change at some
point in the
future,
especially when widespread IPv6 lets us get
rid of NAT
as a de
facto
deployment reality.
Scott Helms
Vice President of Technology
ZCorum
(678) 507-5000 <tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
<tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
<tel:%28678%29%20507-5000>
--------------------------------
http://twitter.com/kscotthelms
--------------------------------
On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 12:48 PM, Naslund, Steve
--
Daniel Taylor VP Operations Vocal
Laboratories, Inc.
dtay...@vocalabs.com <mailto:dtay...@vocalabs.com>
http://www.vocalabs.com/ (612)235-5711 <tel:%28612%29235-5711>
--
Daniel Taylor VP Operations Vocal Laboratories, Inc.
dtay...@vocalabs.com http://www.vocalabs.com/ (612)235-5711
