I'm not talking about global, public use, only private use.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Beecher" <beec...@beecher.cc>
To: "Mike Hammett" <na...@ics-il.net>
Cc: "Ryan Hamel" <r...@rkhtech.org>, "Abraham Y. Chen" <ayc...@alum.mit.edu>,
nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2024 2:06:32 PM
Subject: Re: Stealthy Overlay Network Re: 202401100645.AYC Re: IPv4 address
block
You don't need everything in the world to support it, just the things "you"
use.
You run an ISP, let me posit something.
Stipulate your entire network infra, services, and applications support 240/4,
and that it's approved for global , public use tomorrow. Some company gets a
block in there, stands up some website. Here are some absolutely plausible
scenarios that you might have to deal with.
- Some of your customers are running operating systems / network gear that
doesn't support 240/4.
- Some of your customers may be using 3rd party DNS resolvers that don't
support 240/4.
- Some network in between you and the dest missed a few bogon ACLs , dropping
your customer's traffic.
All of this becomes support issues you have to deal with.
On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 2:21 PM Mike Hammett < na...@ics-il.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
I wouldn't say it's unknowable, just that no one with a sufficient enough
interest in the cause has been loud enough with the research they've done,
assuming some research has been done..
You don't need everything in the world to support it, just the things "you"
use.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
From: "Tom Beecher" < beec...@beecher.cc >
To: "Mike Hammett" < na...@ics-il.net >
Cc: "Ryan Hamel" < r...@rkhtech.org >, "Abraham Y. Chen" < ayc...@alum.mit.edu
>, nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2024 1:16:53 PM
Subject: Re: Stealthy Overlay Network Re: 202401100645.AYC Re: IPv4 address
block
<blockquote>
How far are we from that, in reality? I don't have any intention on using the
space, but I would like to put some definition to this boogey man.
</blockquote>
It's unknowable really.
Lots of network software works just fine today with it. Some don't. To my
knowledge some NOS vendors have outright refused to support 240/4 unless it's
reclassified. Beyond network equipment, there is an unknowable number of
software packages , drivers, etc out in the world which 240/4 is still
hardcoded not to work. It's been unfortunate to see this fact handwaved away in
many discussions on the subject.
The Mirai worm surfaced in 2016. The software vulnerabilities used in its
attack vectors are still unpatched and present in massive numbers across the
internet; there are countless variants that still use the same methods, 8 years
later. Other vulnerabilities still exist after multiple decades. But we somehow
think devices will be patched to support 240/4 quickly?
It's just unrealistic.
On Fri, Jan 12, 2024 at 1:03 PM Mike Hammett < na...@ics-il.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
" every networking vendor, hardware vendor, and OS vendor"
How far are we from that, in reality? I don't have any intention on using the
space, but I would like to put some definition to this boogey man.
-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
Midwest Internet Exchange
The Brothers WISP
From: "Ryan Hamel" < r...@rkhtech.org >
To: "Abraham Y. Chen" < ayc...@avinta.com >, "Vasilenko Eduard" <
vasilenko.edu...@huawei.com >
Cc: "Abraham Y. Chen" < ayc...@alum.mit.edu >, nanog@nanog.org
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2024 11:04:31 PM
Subject: Re: Stealthy Overlay Network Re: 202401100645.AYC Re: IPv4 address
block
Abraham,
You may not need permission from the IETF, but you effectively need it from
every networking vendor, hardware vendor, and OS vendor. If you do not have buy
in from key stakeholders, it's dead-on arrival.
Ryan
From: NANOG <nanog-bounces+ryan= rkhtech....@nanog.org > on behalf of Abraham
Y. Chen < ayc...@avinta.com >
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2024 6:38:52 PM
To: Vasilenko Eduard < vasilenko.edu...@huawei.com >
Cc: Chen, Abraham Y. < ayc...@alum.mit.edu >; nanog@nanog.org < nanog@nanog.org
>
Subject: Stealthy Overlay Network Re: 202401100645.AYC Re: IPv4 address block
Caution: This is an external email and may be malicious. Please take care when
clicking links or opening attachments.
Hi, Vasilenko:
1) ... These “ multi-national conglo ” has enough influence on the IETF to not
permit it. ":
As classified by Vint Cerf, 240/4 enabled EzIP is an overlay network that may
be deployed stealthily (just like the events reported by the RIPE-LAB). So,
EzIP deployment does not need permission from the IETF.
Regards,
Abe (2024-01-11 21:38 EST)
On 2024-01-11 01:17, Vasilenko Eduard wrote:
<blockquote>
> It has been known that multi-national conglomerates have been using it
> without announcement.
This is an assurance that 240/4 would never be permitted for Public Internet.
These “ multi-national conglo ” has enough influence on the IETF to not permit
it.
Ed/
From: NANOG [ mailto:nanog-bounces+vasilenko.eduard=huawei....@nanog.org ] On
Behalf Of Abraham Y. Chen
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2024 3:35 PM
To: KARIM MEKKAOUI <amekka...@mektel.ca>
Cc: nanog@nanog.org ; Chen, Abraham Y. <ayc...@alum.mit.edu>
Subject: 202401100645.AYC Re: IPv4 address block
Importance: High
Hi, Karim:
1) If you have control of your own equipment (I presume that your business
includes IAP - Internet Access Provider, since you are asking to buy IPv4
blocks.), you can get a large block of reserved IPv4 address for free by
disabling the program codes in your current facility that has been disabling
the use of 240/4 netblock. Please have a look at the below whitepaper. Utilized
according to the outlined disciplines, this is a practically unlimited
resources. It has been known that multi-national conglomerates have been using
it without announcement. So, you can do so stealthily according to the proposed
mechanism which establishes uniform practices, just as well.
https://www.avinta.com/phoenix-1/home/RevampTheInternet.pdf
2) Being an unorthodox solution, if not controversial, please follow up with me
offline. Unless, other NANOGers express their interests.
Regards,
Abe (2024-01-10 07:34 EST)
On 2024-01-07 22:46, KARIM MEKKAOUI wrote:
<blockquote>
Hi Nanog Community
Any idea please on the best way to buy IPv4 blocs and what is the price?
Thank you
KARIM
</blockquote>
Virus-free. www.avast.com
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
