hi all, thanks alot for all the comments. its very helpful, and i welcome it all. i'll download the podcasts on blind cool tech today and go from there. and Niel your idea of quicknav is definitely what i'm going to try.
i suppose i have the similar problem, i got a loan macbook pro sitting on my table and find the transmition period is rather frustrating, as i'm not exactly familiar with the voiceover concept. so far, i manage to set up my mail accounts, itunes, and yeah, thats about it really. is rather frustrating, as i can call myself a nerd, but got frustrated with learning the mac. i suppose, not so much of the mac itself, is learning the interface of the os and voiceover. i hope i can get myself train, before order my own mac. if not, i know the same thing will happen, it will sit there, and like Niel said, returning it in x days. :) so, thanks very much for all the encouragement, and please do post more. cheers Joanne On 09/06/2011, Esther <mori...@mac.com> wrote: > Hi Neil, > > You can also interact with the Trackpad Commander, if you have it enabled, > by using a two finger swipe to the right, and you can stop interacting by > using a two finger swipe to the left. I think you'll find this more > convenient to use if you're navigating your home iTunes library and have > just flicked right or left to the "sources" list or the "songs" list, and > want to interact. Desktop Mac users (or anyone using a full-size keyboard) > who have Numpad Commander activated, and are using the default definitions, > can press the "9" key of the numeric keypad to start interacting and the "7" > key of the keypad to stop interacting. > > I know that Geoff also said that he found using Trackpad Commander a lot > more intuitive way to navigate when he made the transition to the Mac, > especially coming from the iPhone background. There are some posts that > I've written near the beginning of the year where I actually outline how to > navigate both ways: with Trackpad Commander and with keyboard shortcuts. > The reason that most list post answers tell people how to navigate with the > standard VoiceOver keyboard shortcuts if a specific context is not requested > is that these answers work for everybody. Trackpad Commander only works for > people who are both running Snow Leopard and have late enough model laptops > that support it, or else have bought a Magic TrackPad (if they are Desktop > Mac users or have earlier model Mac laptops). Even with older Mac laptops > and a Magic TrackPad, the use and gestures are not as intuitive as when you > have a new model laptop that innately supports it. We have some people on > list who get started with older Macs, and who also may not be running Snow > Leopard, so we try to make the replies useful for them, too. I used to try > to remember to state what worked for Leopard only for Tiger users, and what > had changed for Snow Leopard for Leopard users. This is like trying to > mention what combinations are specific to English language input keyboards. > > Another useful VoiceOver command is VO-Shift-C, which copies the last phrase > to the clipboard, and lets you paste it in with Command+V. > > HTH. Cheers, > > Esther > > On Jun 8, 2011, at 09:26, Neil Barnfather - TalkNav wrote: > >> interacting is another Voice Over qwerk, it initially irritated the hell >> out of me, but now it saves me time, a lot of time, and makes things >> easier to understand. >> >> two ways of interacting, the documented way, control, options, shift, down >> arrow, and the reverse to stop interacting, control, options, shift, up >> arrow. >> >> or if you're using quicknav, simply using one hand, which is the supreme >> benefit of quicknav, press the right and down arrow together to interact, >> and left and down to stop. >> >> >> Regards, >> >> Neil Barnfather >> >> Talks List Administrator >> Twitter @neilbarnfather >> >> TalkNav is a Nuance, Code Factory and Sendero dealer, for all your >> accessible phone, PDA and GPS related enquiries visit www.talknav.com >> >> URL: - www.talknav.com >> e-mail: - serv...@talknav.com >> Phone: - +44 844 999 4199 >> >> >> >> On 8 Jun 2011, at 20:18, Shannon Dyer wrote: >> >> I fought the signature battle yesterday. Finally, I won. >> >> So, open mail. Then, go to the menu bar and find preferences. You'll see a >> series of buttons, one of which is labeled signatures. Enable that one. >> >> Here's where it got tricky for me. You'll see a table. You have to control >> option shift down-arrow to interact with it. When I did this, I saw >> something that said GMail, and, since that's what I use, I left the table >> alone, now that it was highlighted. Then, I tabbed over to a box that said >> signature 1. At first, I thought that was where the signature went, but >> no. That seems to just be the name of the signature. I tabbed again, and >> was in an edit box. I wrote the signature. The next part, I couldn't get >> voiceover to do, so a friend clicked on the plus sign for me. Apparently, >> this says that this is the signature I wanted to use. Then, I checked the >> box that said "include signature above quoted text". After that, I was >> done. >> >> Hopefully, this helps a bit. >> >> Shannon >> Are you a fan of women's music? If so, join me each Thursday from noon >> until three for the Eclectic Collection: a Celebration of Women In Music. >> Point your media player to: >> http://mojoradio.us/listen >> or >> www.mintfm.net >> >> On Jun 8, 2011, at 2:25 PM, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: >> >>> Okay, I have a few questions that I haven't seen in the last few months. >>> How do you put things on your desc top? And how do you move a folder >>> from one place to the next? Like what command is like the applications >>> key in windows, or alt key, these keys gave us the options to copy move >>> or send things to certain areas. Lastly, what's the tricks to creating a >>> signature in apple mail? Thanks from a new user. On Jun 8, 2011, at >>> 12:50 PM, Kimberly wrote: >>> >>>> This is truly an incredibly helpful post. >>>> >>>> I've had my Mac for several months but haven't made the switch from Jaws >>>> and >>>> the pc because I find the command structure and especially web >>>> navigation >>>> totally not intuitive. But these two suggestions have made me want to >>>> give >>>> it another try. >>>> >>>> Kim >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com]On Behalf Of Shannon Dyer >>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2011 1:16 PM >>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>> Subject: Re: transition from pc to mac >>>> >>>> >>>> This was a marvelously helpful message. I read nothing about either of >>>> these >>>> features in the voiceover quickstart, and no one has suggested them. >>>> Thank >>>> you so, so much for making me aware of them. I think this will make the >>>> Mac >>>> and I better friends in a much more timely manner. (Smile) >>>> >>>> Shannon >>>> Are you a fan of women's music? If so, join me each Thursday from noon >>>> until >>>> three for the Eclectic Collection: a Celebration of Women In Music. >>>> Point >>>> your media player to: >>>> http://mojoradio.us/listen >>>> or >>>> www.mintfm.net >>>> >>>> On Jun 8, 2011, at 10:11 AM, Neil Barnfather - TalkNav wrote: >>>> >>>>> Joanne, >>>>> >>>>> for me the podcasts etc do help, but by far the biggest thing that very >>>> few people seem to throw up as the most obviously easy way into Mac >>>> usage is >>>> to use QuickNav. >>>>> >>>>> let me explain, there are a number of ways to use a Mac, unlike with a >>>>> PC, >>>> where you can really only use the qwerty keyboard. >>>>> >>>>> A Mac has different commanders as they are referred to, these are ways >>>>> of >>>> inputting commands or actions to Voice Over to make a desired thing >>>> happen, >>>> be it navigation or more. >>>>> >>>>> you can use your keyboard, with the Voice Over keys, control and >>>>> options, >>>> with a range of additional keys to activate various commands. You can >>>> use >>>> the number pad if your keyboard has one to also do the same, if you have >>>> a >>>> track pad you can use that to gesture like you can on an iPHone, iPod >>>> Touch >>>> or iPad. >>>>> >>>>> but the big one for me that is often overlooked is Quick Nav, quick nav >>>> uses the four arrow keys to enable you to quickly navigate around >>>> everything >>>> from finder Windows, to apps, to text edit areas to the internet etc. >>>>> >>>>> firstly you need to know that in certain cases you have to turn quick >>>>> nav >>>> off and indeed back on again. you enable / disable quick nav using the >>>> left >>>> and right arrow keys pressed once at the same time. quite literally left >>>> and >>>> right arrow keys press once together. >>>>> >>>>> you'll hear Voice Over say, Quick Nav on or off. >>>>> >>>>> once its on, you can use individual presses of the right / left arrow >>>>> to >>>> move the Voice Over cursor from item to item on the screen... >>>>> >>>>> inserted little note here, you need to also understand that whilst PC's >>>> screen readers use up and down arrows to move you about, the Mac uses >>>> left / >>>> right, and thinking about this, it does make sense, as this is how >>>> sighted >>>> folk read. >>>>> >>>>> so the left / right keys will move item by item, be it a chunk of text >>>>> on >>>> the internet, or icons on a desktop etc. >>>>> >>>>> the up / down arrow keys again individually pressed will cycle through >>>>> the >>>> elements of the item that you are interacting with based on the rotor >>>> setting, the rotor is a dial or rotory styled switch which adjusts the >>>> method of moving through elements in a given thing. >>>>> >>>>> let me explain, a web-site is made up of headings, links, visited >>>>> links, >>>> fields, form fields, tables etc. so when you're in Safari the rotor may >>>> have, and you can customise this, headings, tables, links, words and >>>> characters within the rotor. if you want to quickly move between the >>>> headings on a web page you should make sure that the rotor is set to >>>> headings, you cchange the roter setting by pressing together the up and >>>> left >>>> arrow keys, or the up and right arrow keys. >>>>> >>>>> once you're on heading, use the up / down arrow key indivually to jump >>>> between headings since this is what your roter is now set to. >>>>> >>>>> say you find the heading you are looking for, you can now right arrow >>>> through the content, imagine though you find a word that Voice Over >>>> doesn't >>>> quite read right, and you think, what did it say? change the roter to >>>> word, >>>> using the up and right or up and left arrows together, now down press >>>> until >>>> yu are one word ahead of the word you wish to have spelt, now change the >>>> roter to charicter, press down arrow and the cursor will move charicter >>>> by >>>> charicter. >>>>> >>>>> once done simply change the roter bakc to heading or whatever you wish. >>>>> >>>>> this is just one example of how the roter works. >>>>> >>>>> another amazing thing which gets little press is the Item Chooser, >>>>> which >>>> by pressing control, options, I, will bring up a list of every single >>>> item >>>> on any page you are on, be it a finder window or safari window etc. >>>>> >>>>> this has to be one of my favourite features of Voice Over. >>>>> >>>>> with this snazy feature you now have a list of every componant on the >>>> screen, say you are on Amazon, and you've got an item up in front of >>>> you, >>>> you want to find the add to basket button, but can't. >>>>> >>>>> press control, options, I, and then type basket, or b, a, s and leave >>>>> it >>>> at that... the list of items reduces based on the available options with >>>> your letter combination. this is fantastic for finding things you are >>>> having >>>> trouble with, or where for example you don't quite know if the item is, >>>> add >>>> to basket, put in basket, add to cart, etc.... as you can try a few >>>> words >>>> until you find what you want. you don't need to do it in any given >>>> order, so >>>> even if the link reads add this dam item to my cart, you could type dam, >>>> and >>>> the list will reduce to any option with dam in it. >>>>> >>>>> Quick Nav and the Item Chooser have to be my two main features of Voice >>>> Over and this is how I have successfully last October made the switch to >>>> Mac >>>> from being a JAWS PC user for 12 years before that. >>>>> >>>>> hope that this has helped. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Neil Barnfather >>>>> >>>>> Talks List Administrator >>>>> Twitter @neilbarnfather >>>>> >>>>> TalkNav is a Nuance, Code Factory and Sendero dealer, for all your >>>>> accessible phone, PDA and GPS related enquiries visit www.talknav.com >>>>> >>>>> URL: - www.talknav.com >>>>> e-mail: - serv...@talknav.com >>>>> Phone: - +44 844 999 4199 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 8 Jun 2011, at 13:58, Joanne Chua wrote: >>>>> >>>>> hi there, >>>>> >>>>> i'm Joanne, from Australia whom currently on total transit from PC to >>>>> Mac. however, i found that the commands and learning the back takes me >>>>> too long, and i'm not really sure where to start. >>>>> it sounds stupid i know but, may i ask, is there any tips or ways for >>>>> me to fast track my learning curves with using voice over? >>>>> >>>>> any suggestion is deeply appreciated. >>>>> >>>>> many thanks >>>>> >>>>> Joanne :) > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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