I started my current Mac experience by borrowing a Mac Mini from a vendor who sold assistive technology for Windows. I wanted to prove that what they said about the mac was wrong, that they couldn't use it effectively as blind folks. I dumped my old pc and started use the Mac full time from the beginning and i haven't looked back since. True i have a virtual machine but that's mostly for playing audio games that are not available on the Mac yet. I do not miss the single key keystrokes much and i'm so glad i got rid of that virtual buffer and all the other ways windows screen reading software spoon feeds us. /Krister 12 feb 2010 kl. 09.13 skrev Nicolai Svendsen:
> Hi, > > I use VoiceOver the most, and I'm way more efficient using VoiceOver now. I > found that, if you were loading absolutely massive webpages, JAWS/Window Eyes > first had to load all the contents into their virtual buffer before you could > do as much as navigate. I personally see that as a huge drawback to > efficiency. The only reason JAWS or Window-Eyes, not to mention NVDA among > others take advantage of one-letter navigation keys in HTML environments is > probably because they have that drawback. VoiceOVer might be able to, but the > issue would be that, if you're in a form field, you'd need Forms mode which > I'm so glad to get rid of. With a Windows-based screenreader, you have to > exit forms mode, then use H to go to the next heading, whereas with VoiceOver > you can simply do it within the field itself due to separate commands. > That'll still slow you down, no matter how fast you are. It's still an extra > keystroke, regardless of Auto-forms mode. You still have to exit it one way > or the other. > > Just as a note, I can actually hit VO-H with one hand without much effort. I > can't hit VO-Shift-H, but if I have to use that keystroke I'll just use the > right shift key. > > You knew what you were getting into, though. You knew the functionality > existed, but it's bound to be different as it's an entirely different > operating system. I can't stress that enough. > > Suggestion: Dump your Windows computer in the trash and spend all time on the > Mac. You always have virtual machines if you need to do something you know > you can only do on Windows, but the way you'll really get efficient in > navigation with VoiceOver is to get rid of all Window-sbased solutions and > just suck it up when something is a bit different. I say that because that > worked for me, and it's the best thing I ever did. It's not an insult to any > new switchers, just something to consider. I yet have to understand why > people buy Macbook Pros if they might not even like the operating system or > the screenreader. Just something I've been wondering, since it's mostly > people who have never used Macs who seem to buy them. Or, at least, people > who hardly have used Macs or even people who aren't open to the idea of using > a Mac. > > Regards, > Nic > Skype: Kvalme > MSN Messenger: nico...@home3.gvdnet.dk > AIM: cincinster > yahoo Messenger: cin368 > Facebook Profile > My Twitter > > On Feb 12, 2010, at 1:38 AM, Scott Howell wrote: > >> Mary, >> >> What I was pointing out is that jumping from heading to heading may not be >> as simple as just pressing h, but the functionality still exists, even if >> you have to hold some additional keys down. In the end you use what works >> best for you. YOu say browsing using IE on windows is more efficient for you >> and that is great, but for me I have found ways of becoming very efficient >> using VO and Safari. In fact I prefer in nearly all cases now, using VO and >> Safari. There was a time I may have agreed with you, but as I really became >> comfortable with VO and the entire Mac experience, I really have no use for >> windows or windows-based screen readers. Well the only reason I use windows >> personally is for some courses I am taking that use news groups and so far >> outlook express is the only choice I have found thus far and since most the >> materials have to be produced using Word, I have to drag that out. >> Otherwise, I honestly do find the Mac works well for me. Again, you use what >> works for you because being efficient and productive is most important. >> On Feb 11, 2010, at 7:23 PM, Mary Otten wrote: >> >>> Hi Scott, >>> I'm not Linda, but I had to respond to your note to her re the differences >>> between moving around on a page among elements with Window Eyes or Jaws and >>> Voice Over. You said that you didn't see much difference between pressing h >>> by itself or pressing 3 additional keys in addition to h to move among >>> headers. And you say this is easily done with one hand? You must have >>> amazing hands. I can no way do that. I've been touch typing for decades. It >>> gets even more interesting when you add the shift into the mix to go up the >>> page in reverse order. Doable? yes? As easy as pressing one key? Not by a >>> long shot. Are there other benefits, such as not having to go in and out of >>> forms mode? for sure. The added functionality for VO on the web in Snow >>> Leopard is one of the main reasons I decided to try a Mac. I really >>> appreciate the numpad commander, although learning it was not as intuitive >>> as learning mnemonics on the regular keyboard. In no way is the rotor as >>> efficient for me as having that array of single letter keystrokes that let >>> me move among various web elements at will. Another thing I hope can be >>> implemented in the future is a means of letting focus return to where it >>> was when you return back to a previously visited page. That's a big time >>> saver with the Windows screen readers, although it doesn't always work. >>> Its nonexistent with vo. I like the fact that pages seem to load faster >>> with Safari than they do with IE and a screen reader. Over all, for me, the >>> Windows experience is still more efficient. But there are pluses with the >>> Mac, and I'm hoping it will keep improving. Group mode is something I have >>> tried and dropped. I just never found a page where it seemed to offer any >>> advantage, since I don't really care how the page is laid out. I want info >>> and where it is on the page just doesn't seem very important to me, so long >>> as I can get to it efficiently. Maybe I don't go to the right sites where >>> group mode's benefits are displayed to best advantage. >>> >>> Mary >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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