The LT moderator let me know that my previous message, to which Lisa is replying, was not posted.
Here is what Lisa was responding to: "Lisa, articulate reframe/proposed alternative event description. I would support an event with that description. You’ve raised an excellent point: IF THE HOSTAGES WERE RETURNED, the war Hamas started could end. It would have ended long ago. Why have very few of the ceasefire crowd been using their voices to ask for the hostages to be returned? Would that have been a more productive message all of this time? Will the hostages’ abduction and treatment be mentioned at this talk? Curious who here in town would surrender if their children were taken from Lincoln and held hostage, today? For those who do not know, there are still babies, children, and Americans being held hostage in Gaza at this moment. I hope they are on the agenda as well." > On Dec 5, 2024, at 8:51 AM, Lisa Hodes Rosen <lhode...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Forest, > > Anyone in the ceasefire crowd that ignores the hostages is not actually > interested in a ceasefire or peace. > > A few months ago I encountered someone from "Lincoln for Palestine." I asked > her why she didn't talk about the hostages. She pointedly told me LFP wasn't > concerned with the hostages. That should tell you all you need to know about > LFP and its ilk. They are using this moment to say the quiet part out loud: > Israel and the Jews should be wiped off the map. > > When someone tells you who they are, you should believe them. > > Lisa > > > > On Thu, Dec 5, 2024 at 7:59 AM Forest Brown <forestbrow...@gmail.com > <mailto:forestbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> Lisa, articulate reframe/proposed alternative event description. I would >> support an event with that description. >> >> You’ve raised an excellent point: IF THE HOSTAGES WERE RETURNED, the war >> Hamas started could end. It would have ended long ago. Why have very few of >> the ceasefire crowd been using their voices to ask for the hostages to be >> returned? Would that have been a more productive message all of this time? >> Will the hostages’ abduction and treatment be mentioned at this talk? >> Curious who here in town would surrender if their children were taken from >> Lincoln and held hostage, today? For those who do not know, there are still >> babies, children, and Americans being held hostage in Gaza at this moment. I >> hope they are on the agenda as well. >> >>> On Dec 4, 2024, at 8:24 PM, Lisa Rosen <lhode...@gmail.com >>> <mailto:lhode...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>>> Sara, >>>>> >>>>> You asked, "How can anyone say this presentation will foster antisemitism >>>>> without actually attending and listing why and how?” >>>>> >>>>> I can list why and how. >>>>> If someone has the phrase "From the river to the sea" in their bio or >>>>> organization's description, then they are not interested in peace. It's >>>>> equivalent to putting a swastika in your organization's logo. This phrase >>>>> has been used by Hamas and other Islamist terrorist groups for years to >>>>> mean a total eradication of the Jews from Israel. They showed us on >>>>> October 7 how they intend to do that. >>>>> Other indicators of anti-semitic propaganda include calling Israelis >>>>> "colonizers" (the history dispels that notion) or - my personal favorite >>>>> - "Zionists!" If you want to read a history of the word "Zionist" and how >>>>> it has inexplicably evolved as some kind of insult or slur, please read >>>>> Noa Tishby's "Israel: A Simple Guide To The Most Misunderstood History On >>>>> Earth." It's fact-based and well-written. >>>>> The reason why folks are upset about this event is because the >>>>> description is so wildly offensive. The only thing missing from the >>>>> actual event is Mohammed Sinwar's invitation to be keynote speaker. >>>>> A more balanced event description might look something like this: >>>>> “Over one year ago, Hamas slaughtered over 1200 men, women, and children >>>>> and took 254 hostages. Today, 105 hostages still remain in captivity. >>>>> Since Hamas effectively declared war against Israel over a year ago, Iran >>>>> and other Iranian-backed militias have attacked Israel, expanding the >>>>> conflict from Gaza to Lebanon, the West Bank, and Iran proper. Thousands >>>>> of Palestinians have lost their lives, and there are many who criticize >>>>> Netanyahu’s motives in unnecessarily prolonging the war to avoid facing >>>>> criminal charges. >>>>> >>>>> In the face of rising anti-semitism in the US, an incoming Trump >>>>> administration appears ready to confirm Israel’s right to defend itself >>>>> though the incoming administration hasn’t outlined any policies aimed at >>>>> ending the conflict. To that end, we are hosting an event titled “The >>>>> Hamas/Netanyahu Problem” that will bring together experts in the field to >>>>> discuss strategies for ending the conflict, bringing the hostages home, >>>>> and how the two sides might move towards peace.” >>>>> Finally, you said, "Maybe some Isreal (sic) hate translates into Jew >>>>> hate, but I would argue not all." >>>>> What kind of statement is this? Do you have evidence to support your >>>>> "argument"? >>>>> The logical conclusion of your statement is that it's just “some” Jew >>>>> hate that results from hating Israel. Why is any level of hating Jews >>>>> acceptable? >>>>> Can you imagine this same discussion but replacing Jews with people of >>>>> color or LGBTQ+? Because I can't. >>>>> >>>>> Lisa Rosen >>>>> Bedford Rd. >>>>> >>>>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>>>> From: Sara Mattes <samat...@gmail.com <mailto:samat...@gmail.com>> >>>>> Date: Wed, Dec 4, 2024 at 6:39 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [LincolnTalk] Exploring the Holy Land Problem: Friday, Dec 6 >>>>> and Saturday, Dec 7 >>>>> To: Margo Fisher-Martin <margo.fisher.mar...@gmail.com >>>>> <mailto:margo.fisher.mar...@gmail.com>> >>>>> CC: Lincoln Talk <lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>> <mailto:lincoln@lincolntalk.org>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The only way to know if the accusations about the speakers are correct is >>>>> to listen to them. >>>>> Maybe some Isreal hate translate into Jew hate, but I would argue not all. >>>>> Let's just not make blanket statements, and statements that as >>>>> inflammatory or more so than those the speakers are accused of making. >>>>> >>>>> How can anyone say this presentation will foster antisemitism without >>>>> actually attending and listing why and how? >>>>> >>>>> There is a lot of anxiety being expressed on these threads. >>>>> Much of it justified, and there exists much anxiety about much, in >>>>> addition to the increase in antisemitism. >>>>> >>>>> Let’s not increase anxiety further. >>>>> >>>>> We are a sophisticated audience that can listen and discern between some >>>>> actual realities/facts and propaganda. >>>>> >>>>> We can do this! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On Dec 4, 2024, at 11:35 AM, Margo Fisher-Martin >>>>>> <margo.fisher.mar...@gmail.com <mailto:margo.fisher.mar...@gmail.com>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Sara and Lt, >>>>>> >>>>>> I think that although you might be able to, many people CANNOT “walk and >>>>>> chew gum” at the same time - to use your analogy. >>>>>> I agree with Seth that Israel hate and Jew hate are very much connected, >>>>>> and this type of presentation will only foster antisemitism, no matter >>>>>> how well-meaning attendees are. >>>>>> >>>>>> Margo >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Dec 4, 2024 at 10:26 AM Dianeclimo--- via Lincoln >>>>>> <lincoln@lincolntalk.org <mailto:lincoln@lincolntalk.org>> wrote: >>>>>>> Two comments : >>>>>>> The bombing of Gaza and Lebanon is directed at two terrorist >>>>>>> organizations that lead their citizens to hate the Jewish people not >>>>>>> only in Israel, and with the desire to wipe all of the Jewish people >>>>>>> off the face of the earth.This war is not for political purposes; it is >>>>>>> for survival. >>>>>>> 2. Furthermore, please don’t tell me that the Palestinians have a >>>>>>> better claim to the land of Israel when the Jewish people have sought >>>>>>> to return “home” for thousands of years since the Romans destroyed the >>>>>>> Temple in Jerusalem and the diaspora began. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> How many Lincoln women, gays, transgenders, bi-sexuals would like to >>>>>>> live in Gaza, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Turkey, Egypt and Saudi Arabia? >>>>>>> Israel is the ONLY place in the middle east that upholds the values for >>>>>>> which we fought for in 1775. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 12/04/2024 9:42 AM EST Sara Mattes <samat...@gmail.com >>>>>>>> <mailto:samat...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> All, >>>>>>>> I believe that we here in Lincoln can walk and chew gum at the same >>>>>>>> time. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We can love a country and its people and despise its leadership and >>>>>>>> the actions of leadership, especially when it comes to war. >>>>>>>> We can hold sympathies/empathy for a civilian population being >>>>>>>> devastated by bombs, and want to seek ways to assist them/defend them, >>>>>>>> while we despise that use them for political purposes. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We can hold special concern for oppressed populations who have >>>>>>>> suffered under despotic colonial rule for centuries. >>>>>>>> This country itself sought to free itself from what has become such >>>>>>>> rule, and we took up arms to that on April19,1775. >>>>>>>> We “settled” this land by pushing out, removing, going to war with >>>>>>>> those who had lived here before. >>>>>>>> We built this country on the backs of forced labor that we brought >>>>>>>> here against their will, then bought, sold traded that labor. >>>>>>>> Our wealth was built on the backs of that forced labor, all while we >>>>>>>> debated how best to govern ourselves. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This country, while having a ideal of tolerance, has, in practice has >>>>>>>> had racism (and all sorts of other “isms”, antisemitism included) in >>>>>>>> its DNA. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> History is messy and there is enough hate to go around. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Let’s take a deep breath and recognize that perhaps it might be a good >>>>>>>> thing to hear from those advocating for the rights of another >>>>>>>> peoples-the Palestinians-not Hamas or Hezbollah-the Palestinians and >>>>>>>> their long history of struggling to secure a homeland. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> We can do it. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message: >>>>>>>>> From: Jennifer Saffran <jennifer.saff...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>> <mailto:jennifer.saff...@gmail.com>> >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [LincolnTalk] Exploring the Holy Land Problem: Friday, >>>>>>>>> Dec 6 and Saturday, Dec 7 >>>>>>>>> Date: December 3, 2024 at 7:43:52 PM EST >>>>>>>>> To: Seth Rosen <rosen...@gmail.com <mailto:rosen...@gmail.com>> >>>>>>>>> Cc: Forest Brown <forestbrow...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>> <mailto:forestbrow...@gmail.com>>, Lincoln Talk >>>>>>>>> <lincoln@lincolntalk.org <mailto:lincoln@lincolntalk.org>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Also, many Jews go back and forth between Israel and other countries, >>>>>>>>> or have close relatives in both places. IDK any American or Canadian >>>>>>>>> Jewish person that I can think of who does not have a relative in >>>>>>>>> Israel. Having said that, IDK a single Jewish person who supports >>>>>>>>> Netanyahu. (There may be someone in the US or Canada , but I don’t >>>>>>>>> know them.) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Dec 3, 2024, at 5:01 PM, Seth Rosen <rosen...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>> <mailto:rosen...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Paul - there are many Jews who take issue with Israel’s government >>>>>>>>>> (American and Israeli), and many others who take issue with her >>>>>>>>>> approach. I see no issue with that dialogue, and I know for a fact >>>>>>>>>> that it occurs in many and possibly every Jewish household including >>>>>>>>>> my own. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> That doesn’t change the fact that Israel hate and Jew hate are >>>>>>>>>> mostly the same thing. It’s a fairly straightforward connection, and >>>>>>>>>> it can appear a little disingenuous when folks don’t acknowledge it. >>>>>>>>>> People who have anger toward Israel also have anger toward the Jews. >>>>>>>>>> Her enemies don’t simply wish to eliminate Israel the State… they >>>>>>>>>> seek to eliminate every Jew that lives within her borders. The >>>>>>>>>> so-called colonizers and zionists to which the event description >>>>>>>>>> refers. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Israel is the national homeland of the Jewish people. It’s a >>>>>>>>>> majority Jewish country. It’s the only country explicitly >>>>>>>>>> established to provide safety and security for Jews after literally >>>>>>>>>> millennia of persecution. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The type of vitriolic propaganda (from the river to the sea, and the >>>>>>>>>> like) contained in this talk is the same type that calls for the >>>>>>>>>> elimination of the state of Israel and all the Jews in it. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> It seems like what you’re arguing is that American Jews are just >>>>>>>>>> very different than the Israeli Jews, and you’re just talking about >>>>>>>>>> “the Israeli ones.” It’s dangerous. We are the same people. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The Jews over in Israel are the same people who fled persecution >>>>>>>>>> less than 100 years ago. After the war, the very few that survived >>>>>>>>>> (including a fortunate few in my own family) made their way there >>>>>>>>>> and oversaw the formation, defense, and construction of the State. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The Jews here in the US (the second largest population of Jews >>>>>>>>>> outside of Israel) are also a relatively new phenomenon. It wasn’t >>>>>>>>>> until 1880 that Jews came here in any significant number, fleeing >>>>>>>>>> persecution in Europe, Russia and elsewhere. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> So to put a finer point on it — people historically haven’t liked us >>>>>>>>>> very much. And they’ve been trying to kill us for a long time. As a >>>>>>>>>> result, we haven’t been able to get settled down in any one place >>>>>>>>>> for too long because of that fact. We don’t get too comfortable, >>>>>>>>>> because history suggests we shouldn’t. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> So we’re a little sensitive to hate mongering because we’ve seen how >>>>>>>>>> it ends up, and we know history tends to repeat itself. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Seth Rosen >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Dec 3, 2024, at 10:26 AM, Paul Shorb <paul.sh...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:paul.sh...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Yes the speakers may intend to generate anger at Israel. Or at >>>>>>>>>>> least recognize that will be a foreseeable reaction. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> However, you lose me when you then add “and by extension the Jewish >>>>>>>>>>> community”. What is your basis for inferring that intent? And what >>>>>>>>>>> do you mean by “the Jewish community”? I note that many Jews >>>>>>>>>>> condemn Israel’s treatment of Gaza. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 3, 2024 at 11:55 AM Rosa Elena >>>>>>>>>>> <rvillalobos3...@gmail.com <mailto:rvillalobos3...@gmail.com>> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> While I agree that we should not censor good faith discussions on >>>>>>>>>>> difficult topics, can we really say that that the intent of this >>>>>>>>>>> specific meeting is in “good faith”? Let’s take a look at the >>>>>>>>>>> invitation (please look at the pdf with the actual description of >>>>>>>>>>> the event). It says things like the following: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> “… confirm Israel as a Jewish supremacist/apartheid state, and to >>>>>>>>>>> further subjugate or eliminate non-Jews living in a Greater Israel.” >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> “Zionism today (…) has emerged as an expression of neocolonialism, >>>>>>>>>>> Christian nationalism, and fascism.” >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Using words and phrases like supremacist, Apartheid, elimination of >>>>>>>>>>> non-Jews, fascism - is that “good-faith criticism” or hyperbolic >>>>>>>>>>> language meant to incense and generate anger/fear of Israel and by >>>>>>>>>>> extension the Jewish community? I am all for a fact-based >>>>>>>>>>> discussion with multiple perspectives, but that does not seem to be >>>>>>>>>>> the goal of this talk. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I don’t think the “real-life risk” of hate crimes due to this type >>>>>>>>>>> of language is as low as some might like to think it is. To me, the >>>>>>>>>>> fact that these “experts” chose to use this type of tired rethoric >>>>>>>>>>> instead of fact-based and rational arguments diminishes their >>>>>>>>>>> respectability, and yes, I find it dangerous. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> - Rosa >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 2, 2024 at 6:07 PM Joan Kimball <selene...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:selene...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Thank you Paul. A very thoughtful, clear response that, for me, >>>>>>>>>>> puts these very difficult issues in perspective. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Joan >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 2, 2024, 12:46 PM Paul Shorb <paul.sh...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:paul.sh...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Rosa - >>>>>>>>>>> One can't deny the fact that sometimes, anger at Israel seems to >>>>>>>>>>> trigger/release/self-justify hate crimes against Jews in the United >>>>>>>>>>> States. Similarly, hate crimes against Muslims soared after 9/11 >>>>>>>>>>> <https://naacp.org/resources/hate-crimes-against-muslims>; >>>>>>>>>>> African-Americans were lynched in New York City riots of 1863 >>>>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_draft_riots> by people >>>>>>>>>>> opposed to the Civil War draft; etc. All of these actions targeting >>>>>>>>>>> innocent people based on race or religion obviously are terrible. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> However, that real-life risk isn't sufficient reason to censor >>>>>>>>>>> good-faith criticism of Israel for actions that arguably also are >>>>>>>>>>> terrible - and at a scale at least thousands of times as large as >>>>>>>>>>> the increase in hate crimes in the U.S. that might result. >>>>>>>>>>> Especially when American taxpayer dollars are supporting those >>>>>>>>>>> actions, American citizens have not only a right, but also a moral >>>>>>>>>>> duty, to speak out against something they believe is unjustly >>>>>>>>>>> causing massive suffering in Gaza. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Of course in doing so such critics should clearly focus their >>>>>>>>>>> criticism on the morally responsible decision makers (e.g., >>>>>>>>>>> Netanyahu, American politicians who support his policies, etc.), >>>>>>>>>>> not Jewish people generally. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> - Paul Shorb >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 29, 2024 at 11:32 PM Rosa Elena >>>>>>>>>>> <rvillalobos3...@gmail.com <mailto:rvillalobos3...@gmail.com>> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> The description of the event (in the pdf attached to the original >>>>>>>>>>> email and copied below for context) is pretty one-sided and not >>>>>>>>>>> conducive to “thoughtful discussion” with multiple perspectives. >>>>>>>>>>> Honestly, I am shocked Bemis Hall would host an event where the >>>>>>>>>>> description has such strong inflammatory language, which could be >>>>>>>>>>> construed as an attack on a specific population, of which we have >>>>>>>>>>> citizens living in Lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> From the event description: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> “The Gaza genocide that began over a year ago has morphed into >>>>>>>>>>> Israel’s three-front strategy to expand its borders and replace >>>>>>>>>>> non-Jews living in Gaza, Lebanon, and the West Bank with an army, >>>>>>>>>>> citizens militia, and Jewish settlements. Based on past, >>>>>>>>>>> aggressively pro-Zionist policies, an incoming Trump administration >>>>>>>>>>> appears ready to confirm Israel as a Jewish supremacist/apartheid >>>>>>>>>>> state, and to further subjugate or eliminate non-Jews living in a >>>>>>>>>>> Greater Israel. In calling for an end to Israeli apartheid and for >>>>>>>>>>> a shared homeland for all, we join the struggle against the rise of >>>>>>>>>>> authoritarianism in Europe, the Global South, and the United >>>>>>>>>>> States. Zionism today, as ideology, theology and political project, >>>>>>>>>>> has emerged as an expression of neocolonialism, Christian >>>>>>>>>>> nationalism, and fascism.” >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Nov 28, 2024 at 12:33 PM Annamaria San Antonio >>>>>>>>>>> <into...@jaikaurhealingarts.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:into...@jaikaurhealingarts.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Agreed. Thank you, Sara !!! >>>>>>>>>>> I did not see this at all as propaganda and very much appreciated >>>>>>>>>>> hearing about an event with thoughtful discussion. Dangerous ? >>>>>>>>>>> Perhaps I did not read through but I did not see "false claims of >>>>>>>>>>> genocide and apartheid". >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Peace >>>>>>>>>>> ~Jai . >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Nov 27, 2024 at 4:38 PM Sara Mattes <samat...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:samat...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I would urge all to listen/attend before passing judgement. >>>>>>>>>>> We have few opportunities to hear rom and question directly such >>>>>>>>>>> individuals with direct experience. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Perhaps those objecting are familiar with the speakers and would >>>>>>>>>>> like to share their experiences so that others might know what to >>>>>>>>>>> expect? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Let’s keep an open mind and allow others to judge for themselves. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Namaste, >>>>>>>>>>> Sara >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 27, 2024, at 12:22 PM, Jonathan Sheffi <jshe...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:jshe...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Amen, Forest. Ideological diversity is well and good, but let's >>>>>>>>>>>> please keep LT apolitical and free from this sort of low-grade >>>>>>>>>>>> propaganda. >>>>>>>>>>>> ᐧ >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Nov 27, 2024 at 11:47 AM Forest Brown >>>>>>>>>>>> <forestbrow...@gmail.com <mailto:forestbrow...@gmail.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I appreciate your wanting dialogue on this issue, but advertising >>>>>>>>>>>> speakers who are sharing false claims of genocide and apartheid is >>>>>>>>>>>> dangerous and this isn’t the platform for that. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 27, 2024, at 9:07 AM, Stephen R. Low >>>>>>>>>>>>> <steve....@gordianconcepts.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:steve....@gordianconcepts.com>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve Low >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Stephen R. Low <steve....@gordianconcepts.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:steve....@gordianconcepts.com>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: November 27, 2024 9:07 AM >>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Exploring the Holy Land Problem: Friday, Dec 6 and >>>>>>>>>>>>> Saturday, Dec 7 >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Palestinians, Israeli Jews, and those of us who care about them >>>>>>>>>>>>> have never faced challenges greater than today’s. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Contributing to this mess has been the Biden administration’s >>>>>>>>>>>>> Holy Land policies, which have been—shall I be polite and say, >>>>>>>>>>>>> “awkward?” >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Now, we await a Trump administration, whose 2016–2020 Israel >>>>>>>>>>>>> policies were so ill-considered and unbalanced, that many believe >>>>>>>>>>>>> they helped to incite Hamas’s murderous attack on October 7, 2023. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> These “realities” pose major challenges for all of us seeking >>>>>>>>>>>>> peace, equality, and justice in the Holy Land. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rather than wring our hands in despair, the GRALTA Foundation has >>>>>>>>>>>>> organized two events to help us shape constructive, >>>>>>>>>>>>> outside-the-box thinking about how to refine the American >>>>>>>>>>>>> people’s understanding of the Holy Land Problem and how to >>>>>>>>>>>>> advocate for new U.S. Mideast policies that will improve >>>>>>>>>>>>> conditions and achieve security for all who live there. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Here are two (free) opportunities to hear two >>>>>>>>>>>>> internationally-known speakers—two experts on the Holy Land’s >>>>>>>>>>>>> human rights problem—who can help us to answer the question, >>>>>>>>>>>>> “Where can we go from here? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Friday, Dec. 6 @ 7:30 PM >>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Church of Boston >>>>>>>>>>>>> 565 Boylston St., Boston >>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/565+Boylston+St.,+Boston?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>>>>>>>>> accessible via the T, between Dartmouth & Clarendon or >>>>>>>>>>>>> discount vouchers available for Back Bay Parking Garage, 199 >>>>>>>>>>>>> Clarendon Street >>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/199+Clarendon+Street?entry=gmail&source=g>. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Saturday, Dec. 7 @ 2:00 PM >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Bemis Hall >>>>>>>>>>>>> 15 Bedford Rd., Lincoln, MA >>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/15+Bedford+Rd.,+Lincoln,+MA?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>>>>>>>>>>> park across the street at the “Stone Church” >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Please join us for one of these events. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Our speakers: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> <image002.jpg> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mazin Qumsiyeh Human Rights Activist, Professor, Bethlehem & >>>>>>>>>>>>> Birzeit Universities >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Prof. Qumsiyeh was born and raised in Beit Sahour on the >>>>>>>>>>>>> outskirts of Bethlehem. His evolving world views have been shaped >>>>>>>>>>>>> by living under Israeli occupation, the education he received at >>>>>>>>>>>>> universities in the Middle East and the U.S., and on years of >>>>>>>>>>>>> extensive travel throughout the world. After obtaining a >>>>>>>>>>>>> doctorate in Zoology and Genetics from Texas Tech, Mazin trained >>>>>>>>>>>>> at the St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital and taught at the >>>>>>>>>>>>> University of Tennessee, Duke, and then at Yale. He is author of >>>>>>>>>>>>> 190 scientific papers, hundreds of articles, and several books on >>>>>>>>>>>>> topics ranging from cultural heritage to human rights to >>>>>>>>>>>>> biodiversity conservation to cancer. >>>>>>>>>>>>> After returning to Palestine in 2008, Mazin and his wife Jessie >>>>>>>>>>>>> Chang founded and run (as volunteers) the Palestine Institute for >>>>>>>>>>>>> Biodiversity & Sustainability and the Palestine Museum of Natural >>>>>>>>>>>>> History—both situated on the Bethlehem University campus. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> <image004.jpg> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark Braverman Executive Director, Kairos, USA >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dr. Mark Braverman is a retired clinical psychologist and trauma >>>>>>>>>>>>> consultant. Raised in a traditional Jewish family, he was steeped >>>>>>>>>>>>> in Jewish religious observance, Bible study, the Hebrew language, >>>>>>>>>>>>> and the Zionist narrative. Confronted by the reality of ethnic >>>>>>>>>>>>> cleansing and ongoing colonial settlement of Palestine, Mark has >>>>>>>>>>>>> devoted himself since 2006 to working for a future of dignity and >>>>>>>>>>>>> peace for all the people living between the River and the Sea. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark has been closely involved in the international church >>>>>>>>>>>>> movement for Palestinian rights. He spoke at the launch of the >>>>>>>>>>>>> Kairos Palestine document in Bethlehem in 2009 and served on the >>>>>>>>>>>>> Palestine Ecumenical Forum of the World Council of Churches. He >>>>>>>>>>>>> is the author of two books and numerous journal articles and book >>>>>>>>>>>>> chapters on the Kairos movement, ecumenism, post-holocaust >>>>>>>>>>>>> theology, Jewish and Christian Zionism, and Christian-Jewish >>>>>>>>>>>>> relations. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve Low >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> <002 v-1 Qumsiyeh-Braverman Poster.pdf> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>>> 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https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>>>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>>>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>>>> Browse the archives at >>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>>>> Change your subscription settings at >>>>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>>>> >>> -- >>> The LincolnTalk mailing list. >>> To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org >>> <mailto:Lincoln@lincolntalk.org>. >>> Browse the archives at https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. >>> Change your subscription settings at >>> https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >>> > -- > The LincolnTalk mailing list. > To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org. > Browse the archives at https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. > Change your subscription settings at > https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln. >
-- The LincolnTalk mailing list. To post, send mail to Lincoln@lincolntalk.org. Browse the archives at https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/private/lincoln/. Change your subscription settings at https://pairlist9.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/lincoln.
