Hi Jedy,
On vacation this week and don't have access to what I need for review.
I'll look early next week and get back.
Frank
Jedy Wang wrote:
Hi Frank,
Then what about thunderbird. Do we still want to use:
Proportional: Serif 11pt
Monospace: Deja Vu Sans Mono 10 pt
for it?
CCed Brian Lu cause he is the maintainer of thunberbird.
Regards,
Jedy
On Tue, 2008-08-12 at 10:03 -0700, Frank Ludolph wrote:
After a little further investigation I will agree with the change Ginn
suggests. When I set the default size to 16 in both Windows and
OpenSolaris they appeared to render the same pages at about the same
size. I believe that when I orginially did the evaluation I had
changed the default minimum size in my Windows Firefox and so the
comparison was invalid. I was, in fact, indirectly trying to address
Ginn's concern about rendering.
I am using Windows and, to a lesser extent, Mac as visual guidelines
to determine the default font settings for OpenSolaris. The reason for
this is that many users will use OpenSolaris within Virtual Box on
those systems and it is more comfortable for users if fonts and icons
appear to be closely matched in size when switching between the two.
It will also seem more "correct" for users who use multiple computers
with a variety of systems.
For those who may be wondering, I did check that both systems were set
for rendering at the same pixel resolutions, both dpi and overall
screen resolution. Many LCD/laptop users whose systems are set to
96dpi may find the font sizes a bit small (both Windows and
OpenSolaris) due to the higher dpi of laptop and some LCD displays.
They might want to adjust the dpi to about 120.
So Calum, can we adjust the UI Guidelines for FireFox default to 16pt?
Thanks everyone,
Frank
Ginn Chen wrote:
Hi Frank,
In OpenSolaris 2008.11 UI spec, it defines Firefox default font as
"Deja Vu Serif: 14pt".
I don't think we should do that.
Because IE, Safari, Firefox all use 16pt as default, so web
developers would test their pages with this setting.
If we use a smaller font, it may break the layout of some pages.
Yes, it's the fault of the web developers, they should specify the
font size to make sure it won't happen.
But the reality is not all the web developers would test their pages
with different settings.
So I think we'd better keep align with others.
Thanks,
Ginn
On Aug 12, 2008, at 4:00 PM, Frank Ludolph wrote:
Hi Jedy,
I'll reply since I was the one that suggested the sizes...
Be sure to distinguish the system font sizes (8 pt) from the font
sizes for Thunderbird and Firefox. The latter are larger. What are
you using to read emails.
I agree that the sizes sound quite small, but the default GNOME
default fonts look very, very large compared to the defaults on
Windows and Mac. The sizes shown in the UI spec provide
approximately the same appearance as those desktops. To arrive at
them I ran 2008.05 under virtualbox on Windows XP in an alternate
workspace and switched between Windows and OpenSolaris workspaces.
To test the system fonts I used preferences panels, menus, file
manager windows, etc. As a cross check I set the same sizes on a
bare metal install on a laptop.
This applies of course to roman character sets. Asian fonts may
require something else?
The same techniques were used to set the icon sizes.
BTW, my eyesight is now quite poor. I find the suggested sizes to
be legible though occasionally a size too small for my old eyes.
Frank
Jedy Wang wrote:
Hi Calum,
Are you really sure that default font size for GNOME is 8 pt? This size
is really small and make it very hard to read mails.
Developers of firefox also think 14/12 is too small for the browser. And
according to their feedback, most browsers use 16.
Regards,
Jedy
On Fri, 2008-08-08 at 17:41 +0100, Calum Benson wrote:
Since we didn't quite get around to implementing the UI spec for
2008.05, we've recently been tweaking it a bit for 2008.11 (and have
actually assigned people to make it happen this time...)
<http://opensolaris.org/os/community/desktop/uispecs/indiana-uispec/>
Comments welcome... it hasn't really changed too much since what we'd
planned for 2008.05, bar a bit more panel reshuffling (to try and
achieve a functional split of "actions and status" on top and "windows
and workspaces" on the bottom), and some minor changes to accommodate
upstream changes in GNOME 2.24.
Cheeri,
Calum.
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Ginn Chen
Software Engineer, Browser Team
Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Phone: x82869 / +86-10-62673869
Fax: +86-10-62780969
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