> On Sep 9, 2022, at 7:23 AM, EV List Lackey via EV <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 9 Sep 2022 at 3:49, Peri Hartman via EV wrote:
>> In the mean time, one possibility is for manufactures to make smaller,
>> light weight cars. Less weight, less battery. Maybe less cost, too. Is
>> there a market for that ? Could be, if people are impatient enough to
>> buy EVs.
>
> Less battery means less range,
No, it doesn’t, not inherently. That’s the whole point of the question.
The battery is storage for the energy to propel the laden vehicle, at a speed
which we can assume to be constant for convenience. So, the trade-off is
between weight and range.
There are three weights of concern: the weight of the payload, being the
driver, any passengers, and any cargo; the weight of the vehicle structure,
including the body/frame motor, wheels, upholstery, etc.; and the weight of the
battery itself.
The weight of the battery varies with the capacity of the battery, while the
other two are unrelated to the capacity of the battery.
The weight of the payload is variable: a bus might have to accommodate a
hundred people; a truck might have to carry twenty tons of cargo; while a
skateboard might need to carry a 60-pound child. So we can reduce weight and
increase range by reducing the actual payload.
The weight of the vehicle is also variable, and is very dependent on the
maximum possible (as opposed to the actual) payload. Thus an Electrameccanica
Solo is lighter than a Model X because the maximum possible payload is one
person rather than seven+ people. Less structure is needed to enclose space
which is sometimes empty. Likewise, less structure is needed to support and
enclose a smaller battery.
So, as Peri points out, all of these work together… If you make the vehicle
smaller, it gets lighter. If it’s lighter, it needs less battery. If it has
less battery, it can get smaller again… And that beneficial cycle continues
right up to the point where you get to an electric skateboard or roller-skate…
and then you’re constrained by the minimum useful payload of one person.
Smaller batteries and smaller vehicles have a lot of other benefits as well:
less power, faster charging, easier to park, less expensive, cause less damage
in a crash, easier to work on.
When we lived in California, my primary driver was a Smart, and my wife’s
primary driver was a Model X. Now that we live in Paris, my primary driver is
a Luna Stealth and my wife’s primary driver is a Tern GSD. But we also have a
Ford Kuga PHEV, which we rarely drive, and I’ve got orders in for four other
small vehicles:
- PodBike Frikar - Pre-ordered on Nov 23, 2021.
- Northern Light 630 - Pre-ordered on Jan 3, 2022.
- Nimbus One - Pre-ordered on June 12, 2022.
- Arcimoto Mean Lean Machine - Pre-ordered on July 28, 2022.
We’ll see if and when any of those arrive, but they’re all the kind of vehicle
that I see the greatest utility for, in the future. It’s hard for me to
imagine owning something as large as a Model X for personal use again.
> thus less buyer value
Not at all. The value of the Luna and the Tern are far higher than the value
of a Model X, to me, now. I ride one or the other of them three or four times
in an average day. Whereas the Kuga seems too big and unwieldy and a
pain-in-the-ass to bother getting out of the garage more than once or twice a
month. And a Model X would be that much worse, since it’s substantially larger
than the Kuga.
Another thing… Most of the vehicles we’re talking about are legal for kids to
drive (because they’re less lethal), so that’s another form of value: they’re
more accessible to more people. And, as I said, they kill fewer people, which
is good too. :-)
> so something like that had darn well better be less cost!
They are inherently much lower cost, but that’s because they cost less to
build, not because they’re lower value.
-Bill
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