I also think implementing Behavorial testing (applying BDD) is very relevant for us, as we are focussing a lot on user interface and interaction.
So imo we should start on a project which we can use as a playground for both unit an behavorial testing. Does anyone know of good vala bdd frameworks? Jaap Op 26 apr. 2013 22:21 schreef "Cassidy James" <cass...@elementaryos.org> het volgende: > I don't think we need any convincing; everything I've heard from the devs > is that we need to do this. It's just a matter of figuring out a common way > of doing it. > > Craig, a relatively small/new project that could use testing is the new > Scratch or even the new work going on with Contractor. Both are (from what > I understand) fresh codebases and now might be the time to work on tests. > I recommend you hop into #elementary-dev and work with the devs on getting > some tests worked out. > > Regards, > Cassidy > On Apr 26, 2013 11:04 AM, "Pál Dorogi" <pal.dor...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I dunno, I am a newbie here. >> >> On 26 April 2013 22:24, Craig <webe...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > That's exactly what I'd like to know: how can I help. I can try and post >> > some tutorials, but I'd like to know who is interested and what the >> > development community already knows. >> > >> > On Apr 26, 2013 6:39 AM, "Pál Dorogi" <pal.dor...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi Craig, >> >> >> >> I agree 100% /w you, but I think you should write some tutorials and >> >> post them in your blog, if you have any. But in my opinion that the >> >> human beings do not like "re-learn" things and the real OOP, Design >> >> Patterns, SOLID, TDD etc. etc. are very steep and time for a non-real >> >> OOP/DP experienced Programmer/Developer. >> >> Also, the learning curve is very steep for these advanced stuffs and >> >> needs long time to get there. But, nobody would not know how good are >> >> they until haven't learnt and used those stuffs, would they?.:) >> >> >> >> I did sine similar things, getting some new fresh things (TDD, >> >> MvvM/Presentation Model Design Pattern) to programming in Vala >> >> >> >> (( >> http://ilapstech.blogspot.com/2013/04/advanced-programming-in-vala-dafs.html >> ) >> >> but you should keep in mind that this kind of new things (TDD, DP, >> >> SOLDI, MVVM etc. etc.) are like evolution (evolution in Programming) >> >> which needs some time to get it succeeded (or failed).:) >> >> >> >> On 26 April 2013 20:36, Craig <webe...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> > Hello everyone, >> >> > >> >> > I'm just leaving San Jose after having spent a week listening to a >> lot >> >> > of >> >> > smart people talk about, among other things, Test Driven Development >> >> > (TDD). >> >> > I know I keep harping on this, but among the people who write the >> >> > coolest, >> >> > best software (and other average software folks) TDD is seen as >> >> > absolutely >> >> > critical. I can't point to anything other discipline in the software >> >> > world >> >> > that is of comparable importance. And here's why: >> >> > >> >> > When we start writing software, we can manage it with a couple of >> >> > developers, perhaps all the way up through the first release; >> however, >> >> > as we >> >> > add features, our software becomes more complex. It's hard for us to >> >> > remember what parts of our programs worked well before and what parts >> >> > are >> >> > broken. We often make changes to the underlying architecture to >> >> > facilitate a >> >> > new feature, but we're not exactly sure if in doing so, we broke an >> >> > existing >> >> > feature. And we'll of course do a little ad hoc manual testing to >> verify >> >> > that things still work, but we're only going to really check 5-10% of >> >> > the >> >> > code that we most suspect would break. And even if we do power >> through, >> >> > we're only going to ever check 60-70% of the code, and it's all a >> very >> >> > slow, >> >> > unreliable process. Soon we spend all of our time fighting bugs and >> we >> >> > can >> >> > never get around to any interesting work. Does this pattern sound >> >> > familiar? >> >> > >> >> > With TDD, you write a simple, small test for every piece of >> interesting >> >> > code >> >> > you write, and every time you rebuild the project, all of your old >> tests >> >> > run. If you're writing good tests, you can be assured that all of >> your >> >> > code >> >> > works as you intend it to every single time you build, and if someone >> >> > merges >> >> > in a bug, it will be caught immediately (and the test that fails will >> >> > give >> >> > you some good information about what broke/where the bug is hiding). >> >> > >> >> > Of course, it takes time to write tests; however, it's still much >> less >> >> > time >> >> > than you would spend debugging your code. Furthermore, when you write >> >> > tests >> >> > before you write your production code, you are forced to design your >> >> > code >> >> > modularly just to make it testable. Among software professionals, >> TDD is >> >> > seen as the fastest way to write software. I mean, Luna has been 90% >> >> > complete for 90% of its development cycle, and this is a common >> pattern >> >> > in >> >> > the software world. >> >> > >> >> > With all of this in mind, I'd like to know how I can help you guys >> start >> >> > practicing TDD? If this hasn't persuaded you, I'd appreciate it if >> you >> >> > would >> >> > respond and give your perspective so we can talk about it. I'm very >> >> > interested in seeing you guys continue to put out great software, but >> >> > I'm >> >> > concerned that as you write more code, you're going to be creating >> more >> >> > for >> >> > yourselves to maintain and the amount of time you spend writing new >> >> > software >> >> > is going to drop off exponentially as the complexity (as complexity >> >> > produces >> >> > bugs) increases. >> >> > >> >> > Please let me know if/how I can help you. >> >> > >> >> > Craig >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community >> >> > Post to : elementary-dev-community@lists.launchpad.net >> >> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community >> >> > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> >> > >> >> -- >> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community >> Post to : elementary-dev-community@lists.launchpad.net >> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community >> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> > > -- > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community > Post to : elementary-dev-community@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~elementary-dev-community > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > >
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