hi everyone,
Since I joined the Project I have the feeling that people who still feel that they belong to the openoffice.org community do not understand how the ASF operates. I have the feeling Jörgs issues belongs to the same category. We do not have the Issue of a company that dominates OpenOffice. And I say every company has a hard time to do so, because of the people on the project. Lets take a minute, to take a look on the case. In my opinion a dominating company dominates by development power. They can push through development decision on the dev list using their developers. The PMC in the sense of Project domination is not that important. The PMC decides: 1) trademark enforcement of the market name OpenOffice. 2) decides how our funds are spend. (we have less then you think ;) and these funds are a special case left overs from Oracle ) 3) organize funds from the foundation if we need money for a topic. (like the trademark is paid from the funds. 4) It decides who can become a committer and who is invited to the PMC. (this is the most obvious power to lock down a project, and the most obvious.) 5) media / press communication 6) company / privat person inquery / complain address. I think except for 4) all point are not meaning full from a domination perspective. Now the Foundation as such is aware that companies can dominate. So the Foundation has some mechanism to control and act. 1) the board. Once a quarter the report is filed and reviewed by the board. 2) the mentors. When a project becomes a podling in the incubator mentors are supervising the project and help teaching the ASF way. After the incubator ends, the mentors remain in the projects. Our mentors are very silent because of the very experienced people we have. 3) ASF Members. Every ASF Member has full access to the private List. I hope this helps and my view is complete. So Jörg, you are fine with the ASF is our Steward and nothing more as the Steward? We had this issue with the paid resources, where the ASF will not pay for developers because they only Steward the projects. So we still have this topic on building our own community organization which can fills such a role. But this is OT. If we want to discuss this topic, please make a seperate topic. Also for companies or recruiting. Just discuss it in an own topic. All the Best Peter On 20.11.19 12:12, Jörg Schmidt wrote: > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Dr. Michael Stehmann [mailto:anw...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de] >> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 10:14 AM >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org >> Subject: Re: volunteer activity tracking (was: Ariel is back >> in our PMC and developer circle) >> >> Hello, >> >> Am 20.11.19 um 09:33 schrieb Jörg Schmidt: >>> Hello Peter, >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Peter Kovacs [mailto:pe...@apache.org] >>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 7:50 AM >>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org >>>> Subject: volunteer activity tracking (was: Ariel is back in >>>> our PMC and developer circle) >>>> >>>> Hello Jörg, >>>> >>>> >>>> It is still unclear why you want to track activity. Can you >>>> elaborate on >>>> this point maybe? >>> First let me say: I don't think it is necessary to find out >> in real time who is active at the moment, it would probably >> be enough to publish it once a month. >>> Why do I want to know who is active? >>> For decisions of the PMC the majority principle applies >> (imho). The majority, however, depends on the votes >> (respectively the opinions) of the people who are currently active. >>> >>> And in the long run: Has no one really thought about the >> principle that no one can be excluded from the PMC and that >> third parties can install majorities there? >>> for example: At first glance, activity is activity, but I >> think there is a certain difference between the activity of >> people who only work in the project because they are paid for >> it by companies and people who work in the project out of >> their own interest. >> I do not remember any case, in which a permanent inactive PMC member >> "jumps out of the box" to influence a voting. > I have not mentioned any names (elsewhere) because I do not want to turn > against people, because I don't hold them responsible for what companies have > done. > On the other hand, why is it merit for people if they have only done their > paid job... > > For me, and this may be my personal opinion, one must not put good agreement > above success - you have to find a balance between both things. > >> The influence of enterprises were drastic in the >> moment they stopped supporting us. > Exactly, and why are no consequences drawn? The problem was not that the > company stopped its support, but that one company was doing it at absolutely > the wrong time and under the wrong circumstances. > > Where was the PMC in this situation? Where was the attempt to influence? > Where was the will to discuss things openly with the community? > > > > > Enough for today, because I feel that any attempt at critical discussion here > is only perceived as disturbing. > > > > greetings, > Jörg > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org
