And for expressing that you think of it as if I need to be taught something
as a little child.

2012/7/16 Pierre Smits <[email protected]>

> Thank you, Adrian, for your opinion.
>
>
> 2012/7/16 Adrian Crum <[email protected]>
>
>> If anyone is placing themselves over anyone else, it is you. Scott and I
>> are trying to help you understand how this community works, but you are not
>> interested in being taught - you are only interested in railroading through
>> your opinions.
>>
>> -Adrian
>>
>>
>> On 7/16/2012 10:59 AM, Pierre Smits wrote:
>>
>>> This isn't about what the mailing lists are for.
>>>
>>> Don't try to fill in what others care about or need. But it would
>>> definitely help if you would be a community member first, in stead of
>>> placing yourself above it.
>>>
>>>
>>> 2012/7/16 Scott Gray <[email protected]>
>>>
>>>  It all comes back to a general misunderstanding of the difference
>>>> between
>>>> the user and dev lists.
>>>>
>>>> The user list is for people who are using OFBiz as a business user or
>>>> developing customized applications.  When these types of people have a
>>>> question, the user list is definitely appropriate.  They don't
>>>> necessarily
>>>> care about the ongoing development of OFBiz itself, they need to discuss
>>>> how to use what has been released.
>>>> The dev list is for people who are interested in the ongoing development
>>>> of OFBiz and wish to contribute code, documentation and ideas.  If you
>>>> care
>>>> about the future of OFBiz then this is where you come and contribute.
>>>>
>>>> No one is attempting to exclude OFBiz users from any discussions, if
>>>> they
>>>> want to be involved in the development of OFBiz then they subscribe to
>>>> the
>>>> dev list just like everyone else.  I feel like a broken record though,
>>>> is
>>>> there some way that we can more clearly articulate the distinction to
>>>> the
>>>> community?
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>> On 16/07/2012, at 9:11 PM, Pierre Smits wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  You mean excluding parts of the community from participating in the
>>>>> decision-taking processes?
>>>>>
>>>>> 2012/7/16 Adrian Crum 
>>>>> <adrian.crum@sandglass-**software.com<[email protected]>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>  No, it smells like the current goal of moving things we don't want in
>>>>>>
>>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> main project to external projects. This type of decision-making has
>>>>>> been
>>>>>> going on for years.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Adrian
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7/16/2012 9:45 AM, Pierre Smits wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  I agree with Ruth. This sounds like a user requirement. And the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> community
>>>>
>>>>> should decide on this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Furthermore, the remark 'users might like a new feature, but that
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> doesn't
>>>>
>>>>> mean the dev community wants it in the project' smells like measuring
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> with
>>>>
>>>>> double standards; as if the meritocratic principle doesn't apply when
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> committers don't want it in. Or as if changes always get in, when only
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> committers want it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2012/7/15 Adrian Crum 
>>>>>>> <adrian.crum@sandglass-**softw**are.com<http://software.com>
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> adrian.crum@sandglass-**software.com<[email protected]>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>> Ruth,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I understand your viewpoint. Personally, I prefer to present my
>>>>>>>> ideas
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> to
>>>>
>>>>>  the dev list to see if it is something the dev community wants
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> included
>>>>
>>>>>  in
>>>>>>>> the project. Users might like a new feature, but that doesn't mean
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> dev
>>>>>>>> community wants it in the project. If there was no interest from the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> dev
>>>>
>>>>>  community, then I would offer it as an add-on product and announce it
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> on
>>>>
>>>>>  the user list.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am also a user, and the design was based on the requirement to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> monitor
>>>>
>>>>>  and control server performance. I suppose I could go to the user list
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> for
>>>>
>>>>>  more ideas, but the code I'm planning to commit is pretty basic, and
>>>>>>>> users
>>>>>>>> will be free to enhance it in whatever way they please.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Adrian
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 7/15/2012 12:13 PM, Ruth Hoffman wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Adrian:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Shouldn't this be discussed on the "user" list? IMHO Words like
>>>>>>>>> "applications" and "stats about services and entities"...those are
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> all
>>>>
>>>>>  indicative of user requirements, not developer requirements.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Users should be driving requirements gathering and analysis for
>>>>>>>>> OFBiz
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> not developers.
>>>>>>>>> Just my 2 cents.
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> Ruth
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>

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