Very interesting Rick Brass. Just the way I see it and the way i saw it last Americas Cup. I have enjoyed all AC racing since the early ‘80’s before the Australian wing keel came out and i also enjoyed the last AC and was very impressed with high speed action and close encounters of these foiling boats going upwards of 40 kts. I am looking forward to the 2021 cup and sure do hope some tv network that i can get here in NS covers the event well.
On Wed, Jan 30, 2019 at 9:52 AM Joe Della Barba via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > Interesting perspective. > > This is *just me*, I well be a minority opinion, but the AC was not about > cutting edge sailing to me. The 12s and Js may well have been the newest > fastest things back in the 1920s, but by the time I was alive and watching > it was more like seeing the best drivers in the world racing MGs or > something. It was sailboat racing as it had been done for decades. Say kind > of like the Triple Crown, we all know cars are faster than horses but we > still like to see them race. > > So the foiling cats are fast and cool and demanding, but to me once New > Zealand pulled their BS way back when and we countered with the cat, the AC > was kind of done for me............ > > > Joe > > Coquina > On 1/29/2019 8:45 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List wrote: > > Joe; > > > > I do agree that the foiling cats were radically different than the > conventional sailboats we are accustomed to. And the crew work and training > is more demanding than on a monohull. The J class boats have hugely higher > sheet loadings and hardware that is light years bigger than what we have on > your 35 or my 38, but the boat itself is just bigger and not much faster. > Whether a J class or a catamaran, the sailing is still pretty much the same > as on one of our boats. > > > > Did you realize that Oracle was actually the faster boat in the AC finals > in Bermuda? Her average top speed was a smidgen over 41 knots, while the > Kiwi boat was between 40.5 and 41. Which is, on the whole, pretty cool > since none of the races was run in over about 12 knots of wind. > > > > So why did Oracle lose? Certainly there were slight difference in the > foils, the soft headsails, and the leg powered hydraulics of the Kiwis gave > a lot more consistent power for foils and trimmers than the coffee grinders > on Oracle. But from watching the races on the Jumbo Tron at the AC > pavilion, I’m pretty much convinced the margin was crew practice and work > load management. > > > > The skipper of Oracle was driving. He was calling tactics. He was > trimming the foils. He had a really cool steering wheel designed by BMW to > control all that, plus a suite of gauges and Heads-Up displays that would > probably rival an F18 fighter/bomber. In one race Oracle lost because, when > they tacked the boat, they went about 15’ outside the boundary of the race > course and had to do a 360. (The promo stuff in the BMW display area talked > about how the boat positon on the race course and other tactical data was > updated like 1000 times per minute. How could you run outside the > boundary?) In pretty much every race they fell off the foils once or twice > while tacking and jibing. And every time they fell off the foils (and > dropped to about 9 knots) the Kiwis picked up a couple of hundred yards > before Oracle got back up to speed. Spithill was just flat too busy and had > too many tasks to manage. > > > > The Kiwis almost never fell off the foils. The race commentators thought > the bicycle powered hydraulics had something to do with it because trimming > and changing foils was faster and perhaps had more reserve pressure in the > accumulators. But the skipper of the Kiwi boat was calling tactics and > trimming the foils. The helmsman was doing only that – driving. Someone > else was trimming the main. When the helmsman ran to the cockpit on the > other side of the boat a few seconds before each tack or jibe, the skipper > held the wheel to keep the boat in a straight line until the helmsman was > back in place. So I think superior crew work and coordination, and probably > more practice during the LV Cup races, was the winning margin for the Kiwis. > > > > Pretty similar to the J Class or 12 meter boats – just about 4 or 5 times > faster. > > > > Three of us on the list went out into the sound to watch the J Class races > in Bermuda. And I’ll admit that it was probably my most favorite part of > the trip. We are all familiar with the groaning of a loaded jib sheet when > you are grinding in those last few inches. Well, on a J class the winch is > about 4 feet tall and the sheet is an inch or more in diameter. And the > groaning of the winch was loud enough the be heard from my boat 100 or more > yards away. The J boats are romantic – majestic even – but one of them blew > out a spinnaker just after rounding the windward mark we were near – and > the spin that exploded probably cost $50 0r $60K. “Real” sailors can only > fantasize about sailing one. Hull speed on my boat is a bit over 7 knots – > on a J class about 40% more. Romantic as it is, J class or 12 meter racing > is basically a very expensive, though sexy and more closely competitive, > version of the beer can racing we all do. > > > > Now I don’t think I would go out and buy a foiling boat. There ARE > options: a Moth, one of the mid-20’ foiling monohulls Benneteau announced > it planned to build, an A Cat (think 40% scale AC catamaran, 20+ knots in > 12 knots of wind, and a race ready used one can be had for about 20K), > whatever the new maker calls the Gunboat G4 (though a Gunboat 55 or 60 > might be cool if I ever win big in the lottery). Those boats are just too > athletic for a fat 68 year old cruiser, and take too much practice and crew > work for racing in the occasional charity regatta. As Charlie said, “To > each his own”. > > > > The boats are all different, but the tactics, the teamwork, and the skills > needed to be successful at sailing are pretty constant. > > > > Rick Brass > > Washington, NC > > > > > > > > *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com > <cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>] *On Behalf Of *Della Barba, Joe via > CnC-List > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 29, 2019 9:11 AM > *To:* 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > *Cc:* Della Barba, Joe <joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov> <joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov> > *Subject:* Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: AC75 boats > > > > Foiling cats running around at 30-50 knots are an entirely different > universe. Racing them is a sport of some kind, but it does not resemble > what we think of as sailboat racing whatsoever to me. Among all the other > reasons, the traditional AC race was between boats that were very close in > speed. Absolutely superb tactics and boat handling were required to keep > ahead of the other boat. It was pretty rare for there to be enough speed > difference for a good crew to lose to an average one. 6.9 knots losing to > 7.1 knots is one thing, the 7.1 knot boat is just one mistake away from > losing. 45 vs. 55 knots, well you can still crash but it isn’t at all the > same. > > Joe > > Coquina > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > _______________________________________________ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > -- Sent from Gmail Mobile
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