On 7-Jan-09, at 9:43 PM, JZ wrote: > ok, Scott, that sounded sincere. I am not going to do the pic thing > on you. > > But do I have to spell this out to you -- somethings are invented > not for > home use? > > Cindy, would you want to do ZFS at home,
Why would you disrespect your personal data? ZFS is perfect for home use, for reasons that have been discussed on this list and elsewhere. Apple also recognises this, which is why ZFS is in OS X 10.5 and will presumably become the default boot filesystem. Sorry to wander a little offtopic, but IMHO - Apple needs to acknowledge, and tell their customers, that hard drives are unreliable consumables. I am desperately looking forward to the day when they recognise the need to ship all their systems with: 1) mirrored storage out of the box; 2) easy user-swappable drives; 3) foolproof fault notification and rectification. There is no reason why an Apple customer should not have this level of protection for her photo and video library, Great American Novel, or whatever. Time Machine is a good first step (though it doesn't often work smoothly for me with a LaCie external FW drive). These are the neglected pieces, IMHO, of their touted Digital Lifestyle. --Toby > or just having some wine and music? > > Can we focus on commercial usage? > please! > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Laird" <sc...@sigkill.org> > To: "Brandon High" <bh...@freaks.com> > Cc: <zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org>; "Peter Korn" <peter.k...@sun.com> > Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 9:28 PM > Subject: Re: [zfs-discuss] ZFS + OpenSolaris for home NAS? > > >> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:53 PM, Brandon High <bh...@freaks.com> >> wrote: >>> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 7:45 AM, Joel Buckley <joel.buck...@sun.com> >>> wrote: >>>> How much is your time worth? >>> >>> Quite a bit. >>> >>>> Consider the engineering effort going into every Sun Server. >>>> Any system from Sun is more than sufficient for a home server. >>>> You want more disks, then buy one with more slots. Done. >>> >>> A few years ago, I put together the NAS box currently in use at home >>> for $300 for 1TB of space. Mind you, I recycled the RAM from another >>> box and the four 250GB disks were free. I think 250 drives were >>> around >>> $200 at the time, so let's say the system price was $1200. >>> >>> I don't think there's a Sun server that takes 4+ drives anywhere >>> near >>> $1200. The X4200 uses 2.5" drives, but costs $4255. Actually adding >>> more drives ups the cost further. That means the afternoon I spent >>> setting my server up was worth $3000. I should tell my boss that. >>> >>> A more reasonable comparison would be the Ultra 24. A system with >>> 4x250 drives is $1650. I could build a 4 TB system today for *less* >>> than my 1TB system of 2 years ago, so let's use 3x750 + 1x250 >>> drives. >>> (That's all the store will let me) and the price jumps to $2641. >>> >>> Assume that I buy the cheapest x64 system (the X2100 M2 at $1228) >>> and >>> add a drive tray because I want 4 drives ... well I can't. The >>> cheapest drive tray is $7465. >>> >>> I have trouble justifying Sun hardware for many business >>> applications >>> that don't require SPARC, let alone for the home. For custom systems >>> that most tinkerers would want at home, a shop like Silicon >>> Mechanics >>> (http://www.siliconmechanics.com/) (or even Dell or HP) is almost >>> always a better deal on hardware. >> >> I agree completely. About a year ago I spent around $800 (w/o >> drives) >> on a NAS box for home. I used a 4x PCI-X single-Xeon Supermicro >> MB, a >> giant case, and a single 8-port Supermicro SATA card. Then I dropped >> a pair of 80 GB boot drives and 9x 500 GB drives into it. With >> raidz2 >> plus a spare, that gives me around 2.7T of usable space. When I >> filled that up a few weeks back, I bought 2 more 8-port SATA cards, 2 >> Supermicro CSE-M35T-1B 5-drive hot-swap bays, and 9 1.5T drives, all >> for under $2k. That's around $0.25/GB for the expansion and $0.36 >> overall, including last year's expensive 500G drives. >> >> The closest that I can come to this config using current Sun hardware >> is probably the X4540 w/ 500G drives; that's $35k for 14T of usable >> disk (5x 8-way raidz2 + 1 spare + 2 boot disks), $2.48/GB. It's much >> nicer hardware but I don't care. I'd also need an electrician >> (for 2x >> 240V circuits), a dedicated server room in my house (for the fan >> noise), and probably a divorce lawyer :-). >> >> Sun's hardware really isn't price-competitive on the low end, >> especially when commercial support offerings have no value to you. >> There's nothing really wrong with this, as long as you understand >> that >> Sun's really only going to be selling into shops where Sun's support >> and extra engineering makes financial sense. In Sun's defense, this >> is kind of an odd system, specially built for unusual requirements. >> >> My NAS box works well enough for me. It's probably eaten ~20 >> hours of >> my time over the past year, partially because my Solaris is really >> rusty and partially because pkg has left me with broken, unbootable >> systems twice :-(. It's hard to see how better hardware would have >> helped with that, though. >> >> >> Scott >> _______________________________________________ >> zfs-discuss mailing list >> zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org >> http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss > > _______________________________________________ > zfs-discuss mailing list > zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org > http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss _______________________________________________ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
