[Wikimediauk-l] Re: IT Development Updates

Tue, 02 Nov 2021 02:38:57 -0700 

Hi all,
Following from what Doug and Charles have said: this was indeed part of the change to a dedicated tech system, from things running on my personal VPS and on the WMF servers. In case it's not clear: there are multiple wikis that WMUK hosts, not just the public one. 


This was important for WMUK to be clearly separated from WMF, and it was 
also in a background of WMUK trying to improve its technical capacity - 
although this didn't quite go as I'd have liked to have see (would be 
really nice if WMUK did a WMDE and hosted the technical development of a 
Wikimedia project!).



It isn't too convenient, though - as well as the maintenance burden, you 
have to have separate logins, and you aren't connected with Wikidata 
(would have loved to connect Commons+WMUK wiki via Wikidata several 
times recently, but not possible!).



It's definitely worth having a fresh thinking through of how this works 
with WMUK's current situation and technical capacity!


Thanks,
Mike

On 2/11/21 02:05:16, Rex X wrote:

Hi Sam,


I think it's worth you bearing in mind that WMUK is a separate legal 
entity from WMF, and as a charity registered in the UK, is subject to 
all of the UK regulations concerning data protection.



The contents of the WMUK wikis have, since at least 2013, contained some 
sensitive information that is not publicly accessible, such as the 
minutes of /in camera/ sessions of Board meetings on the Board wiki, as 
well as potentially business-sensitive content on the staff wiki.



It was felt imperative in the past that the control of WMUK wikis must 
rest in the hands of the Board or delegated staff members.That would 
have to be the position in order to protect the organisation from any 
possible breaches of data protection if control did not ultimately lie 
with the Board. No setup that depended on the WMF servers could possibly 
satisfy that requirement and that was one of the principal reasons for 
WMUK using its own servers under its own control and with its own 
developers.



I appreciate your concern for WMUK, but I'm afraid that IMHO, it is 
misplaced as far as breaches of data security are concerned. The 
solution to using end-of-life versions of software is going to be to 
update them to newer versions, not to move the entire system elsewhere 
under the ultimate control of a foreign organisation.


Cheers

--

Doug



On 01 November 2021 at 22:38 "Sam (TheresNoTime)" 
<s...@theresnotime.co.uk> wrote:


No worries Lucy, I imagined that would be the case :)

As I said, I /really/ don't want to be causing problems and I hope my 
email reflects that..


Thank you for your attention to this, and please do reach out off-list



Kind regards,

*Sam*


User:TheresNoTime <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:TheresNoTime>/
/

/English Wikipedia: CU/OS/




On Mon, 1 Nov 2021 at 22:30, Lucy Crompton-Reid < 
lucy.crompton-r...@wikimedia.org.uk 
<mailto:lucy.crompton-r...@wikimedia.org.uk>> wrote:


    Just as a quick PS, I feel I should mention that the decisions you
    refer to took place several years before I joined the organisation
    (as per the phabricator thread) and so I will probably need to try
    to piece together why certain things happened with imperfect
    knowledge...but I will certainly do my best!

    On Mon, 1 Nov 2021 at 21:39, Sam (TheresNoTime) <
    s...@theresnotime.co.uk <mailto:s...@theresnotime.co.uk>> wrote:

        Hi all,

        Me again, bear with me...

        I emailed the list a while back about the IT Development
        pages, the issues with the Wiki etc. - I've seen today a
        number of edits (e.g.
        https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Special:Diff/82820
        <https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Special:Diff/82820>) which
        attempt to potentially explain the changes, but fall a bit
        short, as I initially suggested here (
        https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Special:Diff/82828
        <https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Special:Diff/82828>).

        I've attempted to fix some of the bigger issues with the wiki
        (
        
https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Engine_room#Recent_changes_to_MediaWiki_namespace_files
        
<https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Engine_room#Recent_changes_to_MediaWiki_namespace_files>),
        but a lot boils down to the fact you're using a very old,
        insecure version of MediaWiki and PHP (
        
https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Engine_room#Installed_versions_of_MediaWiki_and_PHP_are_end-of-life
        
<https://wikimedia.org.uk/wiki/Engine_room#Installed_versions_of_MediaWiki_and_PHP_are_end-of-life>).

        In regards to my comments about approaching the WMF to host
        the Wiki, I had this task pointed out to me (
        https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T58938
        <https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T58938>) which I found odd,
        especially some of the comments by your volunteers .

        I do not understand why Wikimedia UK migrated from a free,
        secure, managed MediaWiki installation to a VPS which I assume
        is either donated or is costing the charity money, and which
        isn't kept up to date?

        This doesn't strike me as an effective use of charity funds
        and volunteer time, and has unfortunately resulted in a
        MediaWiki install which is outdated and insecure (see
        CVE-2019-12468
        <https://nvd.nist.gov/vuln/detail/CVE-2019-12468> as just one
        example of an exploit against the currently installed version).

        As the UK chapter of the Wikimedia Foundation, running this
        MediaWiki installation is likely to "negatively impact the
        work or image of the Foundation" if exploited. Could someone
        please help me in understanding the decisions which led to
        moving away from the WMF infrastructure? Was there a conflict
        of mission?

        I appreciate I am "causing waves" here, and I _honestly don't
        want to be_ - Wikimedia UK has been a charity I've supported
        for quite some time, you do great work and I thank you for
        your commitment to open access to knowledge!
        How can we work together to resolve this? I'm fairly available
        this week and would be more than happy to chat with someone
        about how we can fix this.



        Kind regards,

        *Sam*

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    -- 


    Lucy Crompton-Reid

    Chief Executive




    <https://donate.wikimedia.org.uk/>

    Wikimedia UK <https://beta.wikimedia.org.uk/>is the national
    chapter for the global Wikimedia open knowledge movement.

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