+1, Deryck On 28 July 2017 at 16:53, Deryck Chan <[email protected]> wrote:
> I agree with Lucy's approach here. We should try to raise this issue > directly and privately with the museum involved to let them know they've > made a mistake with the copyright of the object and ask them to correct it. > > My feeling is that Tullie House is a small museum with limited staff, so > they sloppily applied the "no photo because copyright" tag onto the stands > of any borrowed exhibit and simply forgot that this object is >200 years > old and therefore no longer copyrighted. Starting the message with > "copyfraud" catches Wikimedians' attention, but isn't helpful towards > achieving our outcome of actually getting things into open copyright or > making sure public domain things don't get restricted. > > --Deryck > > On 28 July 2017 at 15:52, Richard Symonds <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Trigger warning: sensible suggestions, I know those can be upsetting >> >> Might a friendly email to the museum have helped, just explaining the >> issue and suggesting a solution? >> >> On 28 Jul 2017 14:32, "Fæ" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Thanks for the feedback. Just to be clear, this absolutely is a >>> classic example of copyfraud. To say "I see no evidence of copyfraud >>> by the BM" is precisely correct, however this is still copyfraud. It's >>> an example that is very handy for Wikimedia Commons to use to >>> illustrate its own policies with regard to deletions and allowed >>> photographs where there are false claims of copyright being made. >>> Certainly I would be extremely concerned if the Wikimedia Foundation >>> were in any way funding events or projects in partnership with a GLAM >>> institution that continues to propagate copyfraud, rather than taking >>> positive action to stamp it out. >>> >>> We can see by simply looking at the photographs that copyfraud is >>> being committed by the Tullie House Museum, as they give members of >>> the public tickets for the exhibition, and are fully responsible for >>> the exhibition itself. I agree it is not clear yet whether the British >>> Museum have specifically required the Tullie House Museum to use this >>> particular sign and text. That would be a great question to get >>> answered. >>> >>> I find it highly unlikely that the THM have used a notice that was not >>> agreed with the BM, in just the same way as the text of the related >>> labels and posters would be agreed. Despite the same exhibition having >>> many other artefacts from different museums across Europe and several >>> objects on loan from personal collections, I could not see any other >>> signs of this type against anything other than objects on loan from >>> the BM. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Fae >>> >>> On 28 July 2017 at 14:14, Michael Maggs <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > While the text on the labels is obviously wrong, I see no evidence of >>> > copyfraud by the BM. >>> > >>> > The labels are most likely placed by the Tullie House Museum in a >>> (confused) >>> > effort to comply with a contractual term of the loan, under which the >>> > receiving museum must not allow photography. >>> > >>> > Such terms are pretty common where works are sent out on loan, >>> sometimes to >>> > protect delicate artworks from flash. Here of course there is no need >>> for >>> > such protection. >>> > >>> > A quiet word with >>> > Tullie House Museum would seem the best way forward, first to see >>> whether >>> > they are indeed required by the BM to prohibit photography, and second >>> to >>> > explain that any such restriction has nothing to do with copyright and >>> > should not be expressed as such. Enquiry and education, not shaming. >>> > >>> > Michael >>> > >>> > On 28 Jul 2017, at 13:11, Richard Nevell < >>> [email protected]> >>> > wrote: >>> > >>> > Attempting to embarrass the British Museum is misguided and certainly >>> would >>> > not build bridges for future collaboration. >>> > >>> > On 28 Jul 2017 13:03, "Fæ" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> The Tullie House Museum in Carlisle has a number of objects on loan >>> >> from the British Museum,[3] and it appears that it is only those >>> >> objects that have any restrictions on photography. I took photographs >>> >> of two of these (without any flash), as the restrictions are >>> >> shockingly obvious cases of copyfraud, and not for any reason that >>> >> might protect the works from damage.[1][2] It seems incomprehensible >>> >> as to why the British Museum would ever want to make copyright claims >>> >> over ~2,000 year old works especially considering they are not a >>> >> money-making commercial enterprise, but a National institute and >>> >> charity, with a stated objective[4] that "the collection should be put >>> >> to public use and be freely accessible". >>> >> >>> >> Does anyone have any ideas for action, or contacts in the Museum, that >>> >> might result in a change of how loans from the BM are controlled? I'm >>> >> wondering if the most effective way forward is to make some social >>> >> media fuss, to ensure the Trustees of the museum pay attention. The >>> >> reputational risk the apparent ignorance over copyright by the BM >>> >> loans management team seems something that would be easy to correct, >>> >> so changes to policy are overdue. My own experience of polite private >>> >> letters to a Museum's lawyer demonstrates that you may as well save >>> >> hours of volunteer time by filing these in the bin, compared to the >>> >> sometimes highly effective use of a few pointed tweets written in a >>> >> few minutes and shared publicly and widely across social media. >>> >> >>> >> Those of us Wikimedians who work closely with GLAMs tend to shy away >>> >> from any controversy, wanting the organizations to move towards >>> >> sharing our open knowledge goals for positive reasons. I'm happy to >>> >> try those types of collegiate ways of partnering, however drawing a >>> >> few lines in the sand by highlighting embarrassing case studies, might >>> >> mean we make timely progress while activist dinosaurs like me are >>> >> still alive to see it happen. >>> >> >>> >> Links >>> >> 1. >>> >> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:British_Museum_2nd_c >>> entury_bronze_jug,_with_copyfraud_notice.jpg >>> >> 2. >>> >> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:British_Museum_Fortu >>> na_statue,_with_copyfraud_notice.jpg >>> >> 3. Tullie House, Roman Frontier exhibition: >>> >> >>> >> http://web.archive.org/web/20161030151228/www.tulliehouse.co >>> .uk/galleries-collections/galleries/roman-frontier-gallery >>> >> 4. British Museum "about us": >>> >> >>> >> http://web.archive.org/web/20170714042800/www.britishmuseum. >>> org/about_us/management/about_us.aspx >>> >> 5. Commons village pump discussion: >>> >> >>> >> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump#Brit >>> ish_Museum_and_blatant_copyfraud >>> >> >>> >> Contacts >>> >> * https://twitter.com/britishmuseum >>> >> * https://twitter.com/TullieHouse >>> >> >>> >> Thanks, >>> >> Fae >>> >> -- >>> >> [email protected] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> Wikimedia UK mailing list >>> >> [email protected] >>> >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >>> >> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Wikimedia UK mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >>> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Wikimedia UK mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >>> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> [email protected] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia UK mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >>> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia UK mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l >> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia UK mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk >
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