Hi, 

This has just been published on the Mozilla community blog by Emma Irwin and I 
thought it could interest some of you here. 

https://blog.mozilla.org/community/2020/09/10/weaving-safety-into-the-fabric-of-open-source/

It brings insight into the experience of enforcing a code of conduct in an open 
source community.

Wikilove! 

Nattes à chat 
Envoyé de mon iPhone

> Le 12 sept. 2020 à 05:23, Zainan Zhou (a.k.a Victor) <[email protected]> a écrit :
> 
> 
> I might be wrong, but I couldn't help noticing some disagreements of whether 
> we should have a Universal CoC lies in the different mindset of how conflicts 
> should be governed, just like legal systems of Common Laws vs Civil Laws. 
> 
> 
>> On Fri, Sep 11, 2020 at 9:25 AM Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l 
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> {{trigger warning : French joke included}}
>> 
>> Dear Pete, let me explain  why this is problematic.  
>> 
>> First I am sorry to say there is no hidden agenda or awful witchery plot to 
>> uncover including WMF influence. I have myself severely criticised the WMF 
>> in the course of the branding process (and was never scolded for that so I 
>> think we can express criticism). Maybe not all the time, maybe not just in 
>> any format. 
>> 
>>  I made the initial comment, and no one pushed me into.  If it has offended 
>> people, I am sorry, maybe I should in effect have reached out to Dan 
>> privately first. Dan I am sorry of the attention, your wording is being 
>> given, and I would like us to move on, as suggested by Alphos to a more 
>> constructive debate. 
>> 
>> Pete, because your are asking repeatedly for clarification and only because 
>> of that, what I have learned from my #black lives matter friends, it that s 
>> not my obligation to educate you on why this is problematic.  In fact when 
>> you ask for clarifications, you are putting pressure on people who find the 
>> use of disrespectful language a problem instead of  asking why the initial 
>> comment had to include flatulistic scenery (and this for French speakers has 
>> nothing to do with Brice de Nice’s expression « ça farte » see for reference 
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhZ_kkVzx18 
>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhZ_kkVzx18>) which blurrs the actual 
>> meaning behind the criticisml, especially for people whose language is not 
>> English in the first place. Then one could argue that it is targeting people 
>> of an institution. Full stop. 
>> 
>> I wish to  move on to why I believe spaces should be moderated, which 
>> basically would mean enforcing a code of conduct, that many members of our 
>> community have been asking for for years.
>> 
>>  « As I am a nice guy » I will give a few ressources explaining why I think 
>> lists, and wikimedia spaces should be moderated. Basically it is because you 
>> can : 
>> 
>> 1- allow free roaming speech and leaving agressive behaviours unchecked 
>> creating a space where only certain social groups are over represented but 
>> thus you can’t claim to be designing the sum of all human knowledge
>> 
>> OR 
>> 
>> 2 - design free open source inclusive spaces  that are allowing anyone to 
>> participate but you then have to moderate content because, people have 
>> different « cultures" and may not understand what offends others, there is a 
>> learning curve. 
>> 
>> Here is  a timeline of incidents 
>> https://geekfeminism.wikia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_incidents#2018for 
>> <https://geekfeminism.wikia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_incidents#2018for> 
>> 
>> This time line of incidents is often cited by women as a reason for having 
>> OS code of conducts (which includes moderation of mailing lists most of the 
>> time) 
>> 
>> History tells us, that in the early internet days, the first experiments of 
>> virtual spaces encountered less harassment and more women. This is told in 
>> the following book : https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35953464-broad-band 
>> <https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/35953464-broad-band>, where the story 
>> of Stacy Horn and how she actually designed the Esat Coast Hanger (ECHO) see 
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stacy_Horn 
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stacy_Horn> is detailed.  Why? Because Stacy 
>> Horn moderated each chan and reached out to every member that left the 
>> community so that she would eventually know about abusive behaviours and 
>> document it. 
>> 
>> Designing a safe space does not mean you cannot address just any topic, it 
>> just means that you do so paying attention to how you treat potential 
>> readers, and contributors to create a discussion that is actually evolving 
>> around the subject, and not the format of it. 
>> 
>> A 2018 incident about wether or not a joke should be removed  
>> https://lwn.net/Articles/753646/ <https://lwn.net/Articles/753646/> 
>> questions wether there is a need for a safe space or not in open source 
>> projects. I’m taking this example, because it shows how power and privilege 
>> iin a community can be used to influence « keeping a joke that is upsetting 
>> to some ». 
>> 
>> So the question of « censorship » is central, but it usually has a pending 
>> side : who is silenced, whose voice is not being heard?  I like the way the 
>> Django FAQ adresses the problem of « censorship » in a community 
>> 
>> https://www.djangoproject.com/conduct/faq/ 
>> <https://www.djangoproject.com/conduct/faq/>
>> 
>> Quote from the above :
>> This is censorship! I have the right to say whatever I want
>> 
>> You do -- in your space. If you'd like to hang out in our spaces (as 
>> clarified above), we have some simple guidelines to follow. If you want to, 
>> for example, form a group where Django is discussed using language 
>> inappropriate for general channels then nobody's stopping you. We respect 
>> your right to establish whatever codes of conduct you want in the spaces 
>> that belong to you. Please honor this Code of Conduct in our spaces.
>> 
>> 
>> https://web.archive.org/web/20141109123859/http://speakup.io/coc.html 
>> <https://web.archive.org/web/20141109123859/http://speakup.io/coc.html>
>> 
>> Quote from the above : 
>> 
>> It's important to remember that a community where people feel uncomfortable 
>> or threatened is not a productive one
>> 
>> 
>> If people do not know how to issue gracefully formulated criticism, we 
>> should have ressources to them to study, maybe even courses on non violent 
>> communication. 
>> 
>> 
>> So I hope I have provided {{useful}} context and I will not answer anymore 
>> so that we can move on to something else. 
>> 
>> Kind regards, 
>> 
>> Nattes
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> > Le 11 sept. 2020 à 13:29, Peter Southwood <[email protected]> a 
>> > écrit :
>> > 
>> > There was no clear statement of "this is the problematic text and this is 
>> > why it is considered unacceptable", which is a thing that I consider a 
>> > reasonable expectation, as it is possible to learn from it, understand it, 
>> > pass constructive criticism or agreement, and use as it a precedent for 
>> > future expectations.
>> > Cheers,
>> > Peter
>> > 
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[email protected]] On 
>> > Behalf Of Adam Wight
>> > Sent: 11 September 2020 11:56
>> > To: [email protected]
>> > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] A Universal Code of Conduct draft for review
>> > 
>> >> Is there somewhere we can refer to the list of offensive and unacceptable
>> >> expressions, and how they are determined?
>> > 
>> > There were been several explanations already.  It's possible to use mild 
>> > words in a cruel way, for example a father telling their child "You've 
>> > always had beans for brains."  Editors are aware of this simple truth 
>> > and any feigned outrage must be disingenuous.
>> > 
>> > It's interesting that I've voiced some extremely harsh criticism of the 
>> > WMF, even suggesting that the editors form a union and sue for control 
>> > of the Board, yet I've never once been moderated.  Had my job threatened 
>> > perhaps, but never blocked.
>> > 
>> > The point here is that petty hostility only achieves the goal of 
>> > creating an unpleasant and unwelcoming environment.  If you (speaking to 
>> > the people here who are critical of the UCoC) want to make real change, 
>> > please organize yourselves somewhere else, come up with a coherent 
>> > argument, and present it here.  The constant attrition of "why can't I 
>> > say 'fart'?" is tiresome and dilutes any conversation of substance.
>> > 
>> > Kind regards,
>> > U:Adamw
>> > 
>> > 
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