The only progress from this point is what Jon said: enumerate and detail your issues in jira tickets.
On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 4:53 PM, Kenneth Brotman < kenbrot...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote: > Hi Akash, > > I get the part about outside work which is why in replying to Jeff Jirsa I > was suggesting the big companies could justify taking it on easy enough and > you know actually pay the people who would be working at it so those people > could have a life. > > The part I don't get is the aversion to usability. Isn't that what you > think about when you are coding? "Am I making this thing I'm building easy > to use?" If you were programming for me, we would be constantly talking > about what we are building and how we can make things easier for users. If > I had to fight with a developer, architect or engineer about usability all > the time, they would be gone and quick. How do approach programming if you > aren't trying to make things easy. > > Kenneth Brotman > > -----Original Message----- > From: Akash Gangil [mailto:akashg1...@gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 2:24 PM > To: d...@cassandra.apache.org > Cc: user@cassandra.apache.org > Subject: Re: Cassandra Needs to Grow Up by Version Five! > > I would second Jon in the arguments he made. Contributing outside work is > draining and really requires a lot of commitment. If someone requires > features around usability etc, just pay for it, period. > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 2:20 PM, Kenneth Brotman < > kenbrot...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote: > > > Jon, > > > > Very sorry that you don't see the value of the time I'm taking for this. > > I don't have demands; I do have a stern warning and I'm right Jon. > > Please be very careful not to mischaracterized my words Jon. > > > > You suggest I put things in JIRA's, then seem to suggest that I'd be > > lucky if anyone looked at it and did anything. That's what I figured too. > > > > I don't appreciate the hostility. You will understand more fully in > > the next post where I'm coming from. Try to keep the conversation > civilized. > > I'm trying or at least so you understand I think what I'm doing is > > saving your gig and mine. I really like a lot of people is this group. > > > > I've come to a preliminary assessment on things. Soon the cloud will > > clear or I'll be gone. Don't worry. I'm a very peaceful person and > > like you I am driven by real important projects that I feel compelled > > to work on for the good of others. I don't have time for people to > > hand hold a database and I can't get stuck with my projects on the wrong > stuff. > > > > Kenneth Brotman > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jon Haddad [mailto:jonathan.had...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Jon > > Haddad > > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 12:44 PM > > To: user@cassandra.apache.org > > Cc: d...@cassandra.apache.org > > Subject: Re: Cassandra Needs to Grow Up by Version Five! > > > > Ken, > > > > Maybe it’s not clear how open source projects work, so let me try to > > explain. There’s a bunch of us who either get paid by someone or > > volunteer on our free time. The folks that get paid, (yay!) usually > > take direction on what the priorities are, and work on projects that > > directly affect our jobs. That means that someone needs to care > > enough about the features you want to work on them, if you’re not going > to do it yourself. > > > > Now as others have said already, please put your list of demands in > > JIRA, if someone is interested, they will work on it. You may need to > > contribute a little more than you’ve done already, be prepared to get > > involved if you actually want to to see something get done. Perhaps > > learning a little more about Cassandra’s internals and the people > > involved will reveal some of the design decisions and priorities of the > project. > > > > Third, you seem to be a little obsessed with market share. While > > market share is fun to talk about, *most* of us that are working on > > and contributing to Cassandra do so because it does actually solve a > > problem we have, and solves it reasonably well. If some magic open > > source DB appears out of no where and does everything you want > > Cassandra to, and is bug free, keeps your data consistent, > > automatically does backups, comes with really nice cert management, ad > > hoc querying, amazing materialized views that are perfect, no caveats > > to secondary indexes, and somehow still gives you linear scalability > > without any mental overhead whatsoever then sure, people might start > > using it. And that’s actually OK, because if that happens we’ll all > > be incredibly pumped out of our minds because we won’t have to work as > > hard. If on the slim chance that doesn’t manifest, those of us that > > use Cassandra and are part of the community will keep working on the > > things we care about, iterating, and improving things. Maybe someone > will even take a look at your JIRA issues. > > > > Further filling the mailing list with your grievances will likely not > > help you progress towards your goal of a Cassandra that’s easier to > > use, so I encourage you to try to be a little more productive and try > > to help rather than just complain, which is not constructive. I did a > > quick search for your name on the mailing list, and I’ve seen very > > little from you, so to everyone’s who’s been around for a while and > > trying to help you it looks like you’re just some random dude asking > > for people to work for free on the things you’re asking for, without > offering anything back in return. > > > > Jon > > > > > > > On Feb 21, 2018, at 11:56 AM, Kenneth Brotman > > <kenbrot...@yahoo.com.INVALID> wrote: > > > > > > Josh, > > > > > > To say nothing is indifference. If you care about your community, > > sometimes don't you have to bring up a subject even though you know > > it's also temporarily adding some discomfort? > > > > > > As to opening a JIRA, I've got a very specific topic to try in mind > > now. An easy one I'll work on and then announce. Someone else will > > have to do the coding. A year from now I would probably just knock it > > out to make sure it's as easy as I expect it to be but to be honest, > > as I've been saying, I'm not set up to do that right now. I've barely > > looked at any Cassandra code; for one; everyone on this list probably > > codes more than I do, secondly; and lastly, it's a good one for > > someone that wants an easy one to start with: vNodes. I've already > > seen too many people seeking assistance with the vNode setting. > > > > > > And you can expect as others have been mentioning that there should > > > be > > similar ones on compaction, repair and backup. > > > > > > Microsoft knows poor usability gives them an easy market to take over. > > And they make it easy to switch. > > > > > > Beginning at 4:17 in the video, it says the following: > > > > > > "You don't need to worry about replica sets, quorum or read > > repair. You can focus on writing correct application logic." > > > > > > At 4:42, it says: > > > "Hopefully this gives you a quick idea of how seamlessly you > > > can > > bring your existing Cassandra applications to Azure Cosmos DB. No > > code changes are required. It works with your favorite Cassandra > > tools and drivers including for example native Cassandra driver for > > Spark. And it takes seconds to get going, and it's elastically and > globally scalable." > > > > > > More to come, > > > > > > Kenneth Brotman > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Josh McKenzie [mailto:jmcken...@apache.org] > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:28 AM > > > To: d...@cassandra.apache.org > > > Cc: User > > > Subject: Re: Cassandra Needs to Grow Up by Version Five! > > > > > > There's a disheartening amount of "here's where Cassandra is bad, > > > and > > here's what it needs to do for me for free" happening in this thread. > > > > > > This is open-source software. Everyone is *strongly encouraged* to > > submit a patch to move the needle on *any* of these things being > > complained about in this thread. > > > > > > For the Apache Way <https://www.apache.org/foundation/governance/> > > > to > > work, people need to step up and meaningfully contribute to a project > > to scratch their own itch instead of just waiting for a random > > corporation-subsidized engineer to happen to have interests that align > > with them and contribute that to the project. > > > > > > Beating a dead horse for things everyone on the project knows are > > serious pain points is not productive. > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 5:45 AM, Oleksandr Shulgin < > > oleksandr.shul...@zalando.de> wrote: > > > > > >> On Mon, Feb 19, 2018 at 10:01 AM, Kenneth Brotman < > > >> kenbrot...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote: > > >> > > >>> > > >>>>> Cluster wide management should be a big theme in any next major > > >> release. > > >>>>> > > >>>> Na. Stability and testing should be a big theme in the next major > > >> release. > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>> Double Na on that one Jeff. I think you have a concern there > > >>> about the need to test sufficiently to ensure the stability of the > > >>> next major release. That makes perfect sense.- for every release, > > >>> especially the major ones. Continuous improvement is not a phase > > >>> of development for example. CI should be in everything, in every > > >>> phase. Stability and testing a part of every release not just one. > > >>> A major release should be > > >> a > > >>> nice step from the previous major release though. > > >>> > > >> > > >> I guess what Jeff refers to is the tick-tock release cycle > > >> experiment, which has proven to be a complete disaster by popular > > opinion. > > >> > > >> There's also the "materialized views" feature which failed to > > >> materialize in the end (pun intended) and had to be declared > > >> experimental retroactively. > > >> > > >> Another prominent example is incremental repair which was > > >> introduced as the default option in 2.2 and now is not recommended > > >> to use because of so many corner cases where it can fail. So again > > experimental as an afterthought. > > >> > > >> Not to mention that even if you are aware of the default > > >> incremental and go with full repair instead, you're still up for a > sad surprise: > > >> anti-compaction will be triggered despite the "full" repair. > > >> Because anti-compaction is only disabled in case of sub-range > > >> repair (don't ask why), so you need to use something advanced like > > >> Reaper if you want to avoid that. I don't think you'll ever find > > >> this in the > > documentation. > > >> > > >> Honestly, for an eventually-consistent system like Cassandra > > >> anti-entropy repair is one of the most important pieces to get right. > > >> And Cassandra fails really badly on that one: the feature is not > > >> really well designed, poorly implemented and under-documented. > > >> > > >> In a summary, IMO, Cassandra is a poor implementation of some good > > ideas. > > >> It is a collection of hacks, not features. They sometimes play > > >> together accidentally, and rarely by design. > > >> > > >> Regards, > > >> -- > > >> Alex > > >> > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@cassandra.apache.org > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@cassandra.apache.org > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@cassandra.apache.org > > > > > > > -- > Akash > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@cassandra.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@cassandra.apache.org > >
