Yes, TT: PERMAlink should be just that -which is why i advocate for tying it to something that is both guaranteed unique AND immutable by its very nature -not by convention (i.e. best practice).
In fact one should be free to change Title of a tiddler, as it is the right thing to do under certain circumstances -e.g. narrowing the specificity of a topic, as i tried to illustrate- even in a public wiki. in fact -as anybody who has ever managed a large relational database can tell you- this is the very good reason why any industrial strength RDBMS assigns a UID automatically (taking Primary Key declaration out of the user's hands) because names can always change... and do, as a rule. You might think a person's name is both guaranteed unique (if it's long & weird enough) AND immutable, but -when your DB gets large enough- there's almost sure to be some other(s) with such name AND some person(s) who change their name (gender, even!) legally. So you can see that, even in a public wiki, if you have tiddlers named after living persons, you need to be able to rename such tiddlers. /walt On Wednesday, May 5, 2021 at 2:30:40 PM UTC+1 TiddlyTweeter wrote: > Ciao walt, > > I feel your pain. BUT a PERMAlink is as its name suggests. > > All the gizmoidology we have in TW now to CHANGE the Titles of tiddlers > and correctly RELINK them will NOT address the PERMAurl issue if the > clickee ONLY has your previous version of the link. > > This leads me to think you are seeking for an INTERNAL-REDIRECT mechanism > (parallel to what servers do everyday) in TW such that an old address gets > redirected to the latest version of the Title. > > I have NO idea how complex that would be to make. > NOR do I think it is needed. > > Truth is if you are INTERNET FACING then the easiest method is to NEVER > publicly publish a permalink that could cease to exist---and don't change > Titles ever on public wiki. :-) > > My 2 cents :-) > TT > > > On Wednesday, 5 May 2021 at 14:15:43 UTC+2 ludwa6 wrote: > >> OK @Tones & @TT: if neither of you guys sees this as problematic, then >> i'd better explain myself better. Here's a meta-example i've just >> documented: >> >> 1. Create a tiddler on this topic, and give it a permalink: >> https://meta.tiddlyhost.com/#AvoidingLinkRot. Share link with >> friends, to engage their support in taming this dragon! >> 2. Recall that "Link Rot" is a well-known problem, which Wikipedia >> might know about- and indeed: see >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_rot >> 3. Realise that- in keeping w/ principle of AtomicGranularity- i >> should probably limit this tiddler to describing the problem (including >> link to that Wikipedia article and maybe just my review of that material) >> and rename it after that article: "ProblemOfLinkRot" >> 4. Work away on that renamed tiddler, adding my detailed analysis of >> the article, and the problem. >> 5. Puzzled after a time as to why nobody is commenting on my work, >> check the link -and find out that it's broken. (yeesh! and nobody told >> me? >> did they even click the link i shared?) >> >> i've run through this loop enough times, it's already getting old. Could >> it be that it's just me, i wonder? >> >> /walt >> On Wednesday, May 5, 2021 at 10:51:28 AM UTC+1 TiddlyTweeter wrote: >> >>> Ciao walt, >>> >>> Right. Tiddler PERMALINK-ability posted as URLs elsewhere is intimately >>> tied to NOT changing Titles. >>> >>> Personally I can't get in a hot sweat over that. That is no different >>> than any other web page. >>> SURE you could get into REDIRECTS on a server or up the complexity >>> within TW of self-REDIRECTS I guess? >>> >>> I don't really see the point though :-). >>> >>> Best wishes >>> TT >>> >>> On Wednesday, 5 May 2021 at 10:34:24 UTC+2 ludwa6 wrote: >>> >>>> The more i use TW, the more concerned i become about maintaining data >>>> integrity -and so this issue has boiled to the top of my queue: how can i >>>> continue to enjoy the benefits of TW (+ Relink plugin) flexibility, >>>> without >>>> compromising the integrity of Permalinks? >>>> >>>> This feels like a deep problem that goes right to core TW architecture- >>>> since, as PMario explained in last thread >>>> <https://groups.google.com/g/tiddlywiki/c/kTrAbuneCkA/m/lAsdkriFAgAJ>, >>>> tiddler immutability is tied to its Title (so how can Relink even work, i >>>> wonder?)- but if i've learned anything here, it is to not underestimate >>>> the >>>> creative problem-solving ability of this group :-)... SO: >>>> >>>> From a non-technical perspective, what i'd like to do is have some >>>> immutable UID (based on date-time, or maybe date+ a serial number, like >>>> yyyy-mm-dd-serialnum) that is used for Permalinks (i.e. shared w/ the >>>> outside web that is not Relink-aware), but still have Title field and >>>> Relink plugin (and everything else for that matter) work just as it does >>>> now, from the TW editor's perspective. >>>> >>>> Is this a reasonable feature design goal, i wonder? If so, i'd like to >>>> do what i can to help make it happen! >>>> >>>> /walt >>>> >>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/0aabf7b0-95eb-498a-92f4-ffdf5dc63b0cn%40googlegroups.com.
