These are valid points Mohammad. As you know, I was away from being active in the community in between. Life happens. However before I left, there was a move to shift tiddlywiki github Repo to an organizational Repo with roles assigned to volunteers - so that burden on Jeremy will be less. I don't know why it has not bore fruit after this much time. @PMario - care to chime in?
Also about newbies - here is what I have in mind about an ideal solution. As you said - it should be a wizard. A wizard that is a plugin, so that newbies could uninstall/delete the intro wizard once they are comfortable. It should sit at the top, like the menu-bar currently in tiddlywiki.com and give instructions. It should also highlight the button the newbie has to press - changing the color of that particular button svg for the step or something. Ideally there should not be a next button at all in the wizard. Instead, wizard should listen to events at the concerned button of current step and show the next instruction automatically. Yes, we need to start collecting and documenting. A good resource is your Wikis itself. If you would like to contribute to core documentation, I can help whatever ways I can. Also - in my opinion, you should try making pull requests for parts of your Shiraz plugin to the core. I know there is a radical redesign undertaking happening. But it never hurts to make small changes in the meantime. On Sunday, 3 May 2020 21:35:55 UTC+5:30, Mohammad wrote: > > Riz, > I don't want to go in details! but one of barrier for newbies using TW is > the documentation! Sometimes I say, to learn something you need a tutorial, > instruction, teacher, ... to take you from step A to step B! > Tiddlywiki is nonlinear so, in its wild nature it may not be a good > choice for documentation! Except if you force it to behave linear! Like by > adding a theme, a plugin, a script, ... etc > For example in Sistan, when you start from > http://sistan.tiddlyspot.com/#Button%20to%20Create%20New%20Task (the > first page) you have a next button to find the next page and gradually go > to the last page.. > > Another point is: the documentation is a mixed of TW 5 up to TW 5.1.22 For > doing something you find several solutions and you do not know which > method is better or even which operator, filter, widget command you should > use! Sometime I think I should prepare a tutorial, wiki, ... called *TW a > carefully crafted subset of the most recent version of Tiddlywiki.* > > Example: I see a lot of code in TW say <$list > filter="[<some-var>prefix[yes]]" for a long time I did not understand > that and then realized it means the variable value is yes. I come from a > numerical method/programming world! so this was very confusing for me! > later on match operator was born, and I talked to Jeremy to change it to > <$list > filter="[<some-var>match[yes]]" > > > I myself appreciate all the hard work by Jeremy and I know he is very > busy, yet put alot of time here free of charge, so I never expect him to go > through these and correct documentation. I think Mario well described the > situation, he said Tiddlywiki has an organic growth and so, you see all > these things. > > I may propose we need a movement to start correcting and revising document > and put the latest subset on tiddlywiki.com for public and then all old > out of use or obsolete/deprecated mark and have a link / note to the new > subset! > > > --Mohammad > > > > On Sunday, May 3, 2020 at 7:39:56 PM UTC+4:30, Riz wrote: >> >> Thank you Mohammad. If you have any objections to the points raised or >> other suggestions, please let me know. >> >> Sincerely, >> Riz >> >> On Sun, 3 May 2020, 20:38 Mohammad, <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> I absolutely support your idea Riz! >>> >>> On Saturday, May 2, 2020 at 2:17:57 AM UTC+4:30, Riz wrote: >>>> >>>> Sorry about the other post. It seems google groups is messing with me >>>> today. >>>> >>>> >>>> So, I made some changes to documentation changes and pushed them >>>> already. Some others, I felt like I would need to consult the community. >>>> >>>> Few things are very much in need of updates. >>>> >>>> Major Points >>>> >>>> 1. Despite tiddlyfox disappearing entirely from Firefox addon store, it >>>> is still documented as one of the main saving mechanisms for Tiddlywiki. >>>> >>>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted%20-%20Firefox >>>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted%20-%20Android >>>> >>>> Other saving methods are definitely documented. However the space and >>>> prominence given to TiddlyFox gives a false idea that it is somehow still >>>> relevant. >>>> >>>> Please note: I have edited and pushed changes regarding Termux and >>>> replaced AndTidwiki with Tiddloid. I felt like TiddlyFox warrants more >>>> discussion and approval owing to its community nature. >>>> >>>> 2. What is the actual point of "Getting started" tiddlers? All but the >>>> main getting started tiddlers are way outdated and provides false >>>> information. I already pointed out the "Getting started Firefox" and >>>> "Getting started Android" issues. Now look at "Getting started - Chrome" >>>> >>>> https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted%20-%20Chrome >>>> >>>> The first sentence says only HTML fallback mechanism works in Chrome. >>>> This is false info and other saver mechanisms are documented in TW5 itself. >>>> >>>> The only "Getting started" Tiddler that makes a reasonable sense is >>>> "Getting started Node JS". Delete the rest so that there is one source of >>>> truth to maintain. >>>> >>>> 3. There should be a feature comparison table between the multitude of >>>> saving options available. Throwing tons of options at a user will work >>>> better if the user knows what is the difference between them. >>>> >>>> >>>> 4. Most of the examples of filters in TW5 uses "sort". sortan is more >>>> advanced and natural with respect to non-technical users. However it is >>>> hard to find because user have to specifically search for it. So much so >>>> that even experienced TW5 users forgot about its existence. I suggest we >>>> change all filter examples from sort to sortan. >>>> >>>> Need for reorganisation >>>> >>>> 5. I know "Getting started" is one of the default tiddlers. However in >>>> the TOC organization, it appears in "Working with Tiddlywiki". For a >>>> newbie >>>> who accidentally closed the Getting started tiddler, one of the first >>>> places he will look in will be Table of contents. I say we retag the >>>> "Getting started" with HelloThere and push it to the top. >>>> >>>> 6. Is there a definite criteria for matters to be tagged. This is my >>>> understanding from the main site >>>> >>>> - HelloThere introduces and explains the philosophical aspects of >>>> tiddlywiki >>>> - "Working with Tiddlywiki" explains basic tasks. >>>> - "Learning" explains more advanced tasks >>>> - Customisation should ideally involve things you can do regarding >>>> styles, things you can achieve with CSS, color palettes. >>>> >>>> Points below is based on this understanding. >>>> >>>> 7. "Working with Tiddlywiki" should come before "Learning"? Because it >>>> is much more basic. >>>> >>>> >>>> 8. "Philosophy of tiddlers" should be under "HelloThere" with all other >>>> explanations - not under learning >>>> >>>> 9. https://tiddlywiki.com/#TaskManagementExampleDraggableTemplate does >>>> not require "Learning" tag >>>> >>>> 10. Suggested title changes >>>> "How to hide the author's and other fields with CSS" to "How to hide >>>> author/date/other parts of viewtemplate with CSS" >>>> "Simple ways to write protect tiddlers" to "How to write protect >>>> tiddlers" >>>> >>>> 11. Export tiddlers, Adopt a title policy - these two should be under >>>> "Working with Tiddlywiki" because these are basic things and one of the >>>> first things people might look for. >>>> >>>> 12. "How to Customize TiddlyDesktop" should be under Customisation >>>> >>>> 13. https://tiddlywiki.com/#Scalability is a claim. There should be >>>> links to specific instances of such Wikis IMO. >>>> >>>> 14. There is a need for rearranging Learning and Working with >>>> Tiddlywiki. Things like "Task Management example" and is variations should >>>> be together and they should also link to community resources that >>>> implemented complex task management systems. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>> Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/tiddlywiki/5y6dRfZxOgg/unsubscribe. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>> [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/1349661e-3855-47ad-8822-0cffa4f9e0aa%40googlegroups.com >>> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/1349661e-3855-47ad-8822-0cffa4f9e0aa%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. 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