Even GEO satellites can be useful for certain telemedicine applications: https://www.esa.int/Applications/Connectivity_and_Secure_Communications/Telemedicine_via_satellite_improves_care_at_astronaut_landings
Note that if all computer programs grow until they add functions to become email clients, all communication systems end up adding telehealth as an application. > Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2023 14:10:46 -0800 (PST) > From: David Lang <da...@lang.hm> > To: "David Bray, PhD" <david.a.b...@gmail.com> > Cc: " Network Neutrality is back! Let´s make the > =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_technical_aspects_heard_this_time!?=" > <nnag...@lists.bufferbloat.net>, David Lang <da...@lang.hm>, > rjmcmahon <rjmcma...@rjmcmahon.com>, starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net > Subject: Re: [Starlink] [NNagain] FCC Upholds Denial of Starlink's > RDOF Application > Message-ID: <045p54s4-r8p3-o2s7-7qq2-r2p6o28ss...@ynat.uz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" > > I don't disagree with anything that you say below, but the discussion was on > the > topic of starlink vs fiber, with the person I was responding to claiming > that we > needed to have women in charge of the Internet companies because of > telehealth > as well. > > I'm a remote worker and VERY aware of how limiting video calls are compared > to > in-person meetings. > > David Lang > > On Fri, 15 Dec 2023, David Bray, PhD wrote: > >> There’s good evidence that physical health can be done over LEO as long as >> it isn’t low latency dependent. Of course our illustrious listserv founder >> Dave Taht will be quick to point out high latency is also found via >> ground-based connections too. >> >> That said, there is still a lot of research debate on whether mental >> health >> services can be delivered effectively over video in general - regardless >> of >> LEO or not. The concern is two fold: >> >> * video is suboptimal to detect tiny tells and other signatures of a >> patient developing a relationship with a health provider >> >> * 2D video actually is worse for brainstorming and creative ideation. One >> might say so what relative to delivering healthcare, except the evidence >> showing that video is worse for brainstorming indicates there’s actually a >> continual subconscious confusion when folks do video calls prompted by the >> body trying to discern if the one or more disembodied heads are friend or >> foe. Since we cannot see a person’s hands and body movements we don’t know >> if they’re coming to attack us or not. >> >> So future generations may look back and decide that with video calls we >> were literally messing with our brains’ own natural biological processes? >> >> >> On Fri, Dec 15, 2023 at 16:42 David Lang via Nnagain < >> nnag...@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: >> >>> why do you think telehealth won't work over LEO services? >>> >>> I've used it personally. >>> >>> Even if women use telehealth more than men, that doesn't say that women >>> have any >>> particular advantage in moving the bits around that make telehealth >>> possible. >>> >>> David Lang >>> >>> On Fri, 15 Dec 2023, rjmcmahon wrote: >>> >>>> Women are the primary users and providers of telehealth services. They >>> are >>>> using broadband to care for our population. They also run most of the >>>> addiction services across our country, whatever the addiction may be. So >>>> gender actually matters. Ask them as providers. Telehealth doesn't work >>> over >>>> LEO (nor does it matter much for men on boats.) Same for distance >>> learning. >>>> >>>> >>> https://www.healthcaredive.com/news/women-more-likely-telehealth-patients-providers-covid-19-pandemic/608153/ >>>> >>>> As Washington considers which virtual care flexibilities should remain >>> in >>>> place post-COVID-19, experts are flagging that paring back telehealth >>> access >>>> and affordability will disproportionately affect women, even as a >>> growing >>>> share of startups emerge to address women’s unique health needs. >>>> >>>> While women are more likely than men to visit doctors and consume >>> healthcare >>>> services in general, telehealth seems to be uniquely attractive to >>>> women. >>>> >>>> Bob >>>>> who exactly do you think is calling for there to be no Internet >>>>> access? and what in the world does the sex of individuals have to do >>>>> with shipping bits around? >>>>> >>>>> Starlink (and hopefully it's future competitors) provides a way to get >>>>> Internet service to everyone without having to run fiber to every >>>>> house. >>>>> >>>>> As for the parallels with rural electrification, if that problem were >>>>> to be faced today, would the right answer be massive public agencies >>>>> to build and run miles of wire from massive central power plants? or >>>>> would the right answer be solar + batteries in individual houses for >>>>> the most rural folks, with small modular reactors to power the larger >>>>> population areas? >>>>> >>>>> Just because there was only one way to achieve a goal in the past >>>>> doesn't mean that approach is the best thing to do today. >>>>> >>>>> David Lang >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, 15 Dec 2023, rjmcmahon wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi All, >>>>>> >>>>>> We're trying to modernize America. LBJ helped do it for electricity >>>>>> decades ago. It's our turn to step up to the plate. Tele-health and >>>>>> distance learning requires us to do so. There is so much to follow. >>>>>> >>>>>> A reminder what many women went through before LBJ showed up. I'm >>>>>> skeptical a patriarchy under Musk is even close to capable. We >>> probably >>>>>> need a woman to lead us, or at least motivate us to do our best work >>> for >>>>>> our country and to be an example to the world. >>>>>> >>>>>> A Hill Country farm wife had to do her chores even if she was ill – no >>>>>> matter how ill. Because Hill Country women were too poor to afford >>> proper >>>>>> medical care they often suffered perineal tears in childbirth. During >>> the >>>>>> 1930s, the federal government sent physicians to examine a sampling of >>>>>> Hill Country women. The doctors found that, out of 275 women, 158 had >>>>>> perineal tears. Many of them, the team of gynecologists reported, were >>>>>> third-degree tears, “tears so bad that it is difficult to see how they >>>>>> stand on their feet.” But they were standing on their feet, and doing >>> all >>>>>> the chores that Hill Country wives had always done – hauling the >>> water, >>>>>> hauling the wood, canning, washing, ironing, helping with the >>> shearing, >>>>>> the plowing and the picking. >>>>>> >>>>>> Because there was no electricity. >>>>>> >>>>>> Bob >>>>>>> On Fri, 15 Dec 2023, Sebastian Moeller via Starlink wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hi Frantisek, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Dec 15, 2023, at 13:46, Frantisek Borsik via Nnagain >>>>>>>>> <nnag...@lists.bufferbloat.net> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thus, technically speaking, one would like the advantages of satcom >>>>>>>>> such as starlink, to be at least 5gbit/s in 10 years time, to >>> overcome >>>>>>>>> the 'tangled fiber' problem. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> No, not really. Starlink was about to address the issue of digital >>>>>>>>> divide - >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I beg to differ. Starlink is a commercial enterprise with the goal >>> to >>>>>>>> make a profit by offering (usable) internet access essentially >>>>>>>> everywhere; it is not as far as I can tell an attempt at >>> specifically >>>>>>>> reducing the digital divide (were often an important factor is not >>>>>>>> necessarily location but financial means). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Every Inernet company " commercial enterprise with the goal to make a >>>>>>> profit by offering (usable) internet" don't dismiss a company because >>>>>>> of that. Starlink (and the other Satellite ISPs) all exist to service >>>>>>> people who can't use traditional wired infrastructure >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> delivering internet to those 640k locations, where there is >>> literally >>>>>>>>> none today. Fiber will NEVER get there. And it will get there, it >>> will >>>>>>>>> be like 10 years down the road. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This is IHO the wrong approach to take. The goal needs to be a >>>>>>>> universal FTTH access network (with the exception of extreme >>> locations, >>>>>>>> no need to pull fiber up to the highest Bivouac shelter on Mt. >>> Whitney). >>>>>>>> And f that takes a decade or two, so be it, this is infrastructure >>> that >>>>>>>> will keep on helping for many decades once rolled-out. However given >>>>>>>> that time frame one should consider work-arounds for the interim >>> period. >>>>>>>> I would have naively thought starlink would qualify for that from a >>>>>>>> technical perspective, but then the FCC documents actually >>> discussion >>>>>>>> requirements and how they were or were not met/promised by starlink >>> was >>>>>>>> mostly redacted. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> what do you consider 'extreme locations'? how long a run between >>>>>>> houses is 'too far'? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> we've seen the failure of commercial fiber monopolies in cities with >>>>>>> housing density of several houses per acre (and even where there are >>>>>>> apartment complexes there as well) because it's not profitable >>>>>>> enough. >>>>>>> When you get into areas where it's 'how many acres per house' the >>>>>>> cost >>>>>>> of running FTTH gets very high. I don't think this is the majority of >>>>>>> the population of the US any longer (but I don't know for sure), but >>>>>>> it's very clearly the majority of the area of the US. And once you >>>>>>> get >>>>>>> out of the major metro areas, even getting fiber to every town or >>>>>>> village becomes a major undertaking. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Is running fiber 30 miles to support a village of 700 people an >>>>>>> 'extreme location'? let me introduce you to Vermontville MI >>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vermontville,_Michigan which is less >>>>>>> than an hours drive from the state capitol. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> David Lang _______________________________________________ Starlink mailing list Starlink@lists.bufferbloat.net https://lists.bufferbloat.net/listinfo/starlink
