Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Matthew Larsen
mwuahahaha you poor ITIL slave. I am trying VERY hard to avoid that myself. And where's my beer? Regards, On 07/09/2007, Chris Rowson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I think you are correct in that companies (directors managers etc) are > > looking for IT process. But IT departments are run by t

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Chris Rowson
> I think you are correct in that companies (directors managers etc) are > looking for IT process. But IT departments are run by those people. The > heads of IT/IT Managers/IT Directors/CTOs (who are on 50k+) are responsible > for such business. The IT department, or the team itself needs to be ma

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Michael Holloway
Let me just firstly apologise to anyone who got offended by the generalisation. Although i do agree that the whole thing came out a bit bias, and a bit prejudice... it wasn't my intention :) Re: Matthew Larsens comments on business process: I think you are correct in that companies (directors man

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Matthew Larsen
hey, not all us comp sci people are bad! :-( I am very much a geek tyvm. I'm a business geek. I do understand what you are saying though. A lot of comp-sci grads just want to go away thinking they are the dogs bollocks in programming and what-not. But that simply isnt important to companies. Prog

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Chris Rowson
It is weird... I work with an IT department of say around a hundred people. Of which, not one IT degree educated person knows how to administer a Linux system. The only people who will do anything with Linux, Unix etc are the fiddlers and hackers (mostly no degree or Uni drop-outs). We run a Wind

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Rhys Morgan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > The way i see it, there are 2 types of compter poeple: "Geeks", and > "Comptuter Experts". (and no offence to those who dont like the term geek) > > A Geek doesn't like to be told how/why things work - he/she like to > figure things out... so probably no university degr

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Michael Holloway
The way i see it, there are 2 types of compter poeple: "Geeks", and "Comptuter Experts". (and no offence to those who dont like the term geek) A Geek doesn't like to be told how/why things work - he/she like to figure things out... so probably no university degrees etc. A Computer expert has done

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Green, Matthew
Apologies for the long post. I've followed this debate with interest. I am a university lecturer and I used to manage the Industrial Placements Unit at the School of Computing and IT at the University of Wolverhampton. One option that is often overlooked is that of university placement stude

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Eddie Armstrong
Mark Harrison wrote: >>> Money seems to do quite well in them.Oh, talk about a Freudian slip. >>> That should have been "Einstein and Monet" :-) >>> >>> In my defence, I use a qwerty keyboard :-) :- >>> I thought that was the latest nickname for the CEO of M$ :-) He does all right in them t

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-07 Thread Mark Harrison
Matthew Larsen wrote: >> However, realise that programming skill is only PART of what a typical >> employer is looking for - ability to work as part of a team, rather than >> adopt a "primadona" attitude. If everyone else in the organisation wears >> suits, don't expect to show up in jeans a T-shir

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Rhys Morgan
I can certainly relate to the hardship of breaking into the IT industry, I personally am not qualified to any sort of recognisable level in IT specific qualifications/certifications but on the other hand i am far more knowledgable than 90% of people i know with degrees in IT related subjects. I

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Matthew Larsen
> However, realise that programming skill is only PART of what a typical > employer is looking for - ability to work as part of a team, rather than > adopt a "primadona" attitude. If everyone else in the organisation wears > suits, don't expect to show up in jeans a T-shirt... on the flip side, > i

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Mark Harrison
Michael Holloway wrote: > Am i the only one who thinks this, or is it a linux geek prerequisite? > I can understand (these days) a Windows support person no longer needing to understand subnetting, but a Cisco one?? > Additionally, if anyone knows of good recruitment methods for the > above,

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Paul Tansom
** Matthew Larsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2007-09-06 13:40]: > On 06/09/07, John Levin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Michael Holloway wrote: > > > Additionally, if anyone knows of good recruitment methods for the above, > > > i would love to hear it! > > > > Go straight to the source: > > > > "As a n

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Matthew Larsen
I'm interested, but currently doing a placement year then got another year at uni (comp sci at Manchester). If you dont mind waiting until 2009 drop me an e-mail and i'l forward my CV :-) Regards, PS Your not the only one with this problem. Most companies are having problems recruiting grads (esp

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread John Levin
Michael Holloway wrote: > > Additionally, if anyone knows of good recruitment methods for the above, > i would love to hear it! > > Go straight to the source: "As a new feature, we are beginning to list Ubuntu related job opportunities offered by employers other than Canonical. If you are an

Re: [ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Dave Walker
On Thu, 2007-09-06 at 12:53 +0100, Michael Holloway wrote: > > Additionally, if anyone knows of good recruitment methods for the > above, i would love to hear it! There is the Linuxjobs* mailing list that might help. * https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/linuxjobs signature.asc Descr

[ubuntu-uk] Where to find good labour

2007-09-06 Thread Michael Holloway
In my experience, there are too many MCSE graduates who don't even know what dual booting is! I recently did a Cisco course with with 3 guys (all with MCSE) that didn't even understand the basics of IP sub-netting etc... and yet still passed the course!!! Am i the only one who thinks this, or is