Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Surrette Battery, THE battery company suggests NO MORE the 3 parallel in a string & would like to see 2 preferably. If there are more the 3 then they really not interested in warrantee issues. Jamie where are you?? Now a days there are plenty of options for a good size/AH BB that can be confi

Re: [RE-wrenches] concord batteries, EQUALIZE Them!

Here is a good reason to spec out 2 volt cells, all of the manufactures have DC input windows that will allow you to remove 2 volts while getting a replacment.Conversly we have also installed 26/50 volt battery banks for hi inrush loads. Remember when you sized BB w/o charge controllers? -Or

Re: [RE-wrenches] PV Powered vs SMA

In the past I have seen a lot of issues with PVP inverters. There was a period, when I was subcontracting, where a half dozen or more of the units had to be replaced within a short time. Although I like many features of PVP, I've avoided them since. Have others found these units to be reliab

[RE-wrenches] Evergreen EC 110

Anyone have one of these around? Please contact me off list. THANKS t...@swnl.net www.SWNL.net Solarwinds Northernlights Serving Mid Coast Maine & Northern California Me.# 207-832-7574 Cl.# 610-517-8401

Re: [RE-wrenches] 2 vdc load testers

Much easier to use a load bank and test the entire pack than to just test a single cell, the procedure is the same for 1 as for 12 cells. There soon becomes a problem on recharging a single cell. Hard to find a potent 2 volt charger to refill them. Your too far for me to help, try renting a load t

[RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Petroleum jelly does work as you say to keep oxygen away from the metal surfaces but its melting temperature is relatively low making it not a long-term solution. A device I saw used on an industrial battery bank years ago used a solid brass alloy device. A small oblong plate fits over the batte

Re: [RE-wrenches] concord batteries, EQUALIZE Them!

Right on Larry, paralleled batteries is always as failure and it is very hazardous paralleled strings of sealed batteries can suffer thermal runaway one string getting destroyed and in the well known case the fire can spread. I have applied a high voltage to sulfated batteries at first they dra

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

This is similar to what I've been doing for a long time, I use high temp lithium based wheel baring grease, cover all surfaces and assemble. After 18+ years my own set of IBE 2v cells looks like the day I greased them, no corrosion. We keep a tub of this grease on the truck, and rubber gloves to ap

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Years ago we began using Quick-Cote terminal corrosion protector. At about $12 a can it has become pricey, but the can includes a brush-in-cap and works well. We have bought stock through AEE, but I'm not sure if AEE still carries it. I also tell customers that Vaseline works just as well. Done rig

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

MessageI would be very curious to hear THE battery company's, or any battery company's, interest in warranty on a system where the strings of batteries are paralleled through a buss bar rather than physically through the bank. The vulnerability to failure of an off-grid system with only one or

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

I know that C&D battery does not like parallel strings and they have a device that measures the currents in each string I investigated a fire from a battery bank of 48 volts 4 strings in parallel of 6 Volt 800 AH batteries. The parallel strings was indicated as bad practice and suspect as the

Re: [RE-wrenches] Evergreen EC 110

Hey Tump, Evergreen still makes these. I suspect Gro or one of the other Evergreen dealers stocks them. Daryl > Anyone have one of these around? Please contact me off list. THANKS > > t...@swnl.net > www.SWNL.net >Solarw

Re: [RE-wrenches] Old dual SW4048 system problem

Called in to trouble shoot a dual Trace SW4048 system that we did not install.    Yes, I know, and we almost never work on systems we did not install, but client was desparate and installer was long gone.  System has about 6 kW solar, 17 kW generator, 16 L-16 batteries, and is set up to "SELL" sola

Re: [RE-wrenches] Old dual SW4048 system problem

Called in to trouble shoot a dual Trace SW4048 system that we did not install.    Yes, I know, and we almost never work on systems we did not install, but client was desparate and installer was long gone.  System has about 6 kW solar, 17 kW generator, 16 L-16 batteries, and is set up to "SELL" sola

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

We cut a hole in the lid of the Vaseline can, and have a tooth brush stuck in for applying the goo. R. Walters r...@solarray.com Solar Engineer On Dec 2, 2009, at 10:28 AM, Allan Sindelar wrote: > Years ago we began using Quick-Cote terminal corrosion protector. At about > $12 a can it has beco

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

My (now retired) C&D flooded batteries came with a can of a dark, grease-like paste that was supposedly electrically conductive and that had a higher melting point than Vaseline. It did a good job of protecting the interconnect bars and the cable end connections. Maybe C&D sells this stuff, but

Re: [RE-wrenches] Old dual SW4048 system problem

We are finishing an upgrade on a similar system with a pair of SW4024s. I decided to keep the SWs for generator charging, and as a backup's backup. We then added a pair of Outbacks GVFXs for sell. The SWs only get powered up for generator charging, or if the Outbacks quit. Interesting thing about

[RE-wrenches] trenching for solar thermal

Esteemed Wrenches, What is your preferred method for running thermal lines underground? We are about to start a sizable ground-mount system and want to make sure we do this right. (I've already seen it done the wrong way, the dirty way, and the hard way.) Thanks in advance for any feedback. B

Re: [RE-wrenches] Other's thoughts on Autonomy?

Hi Joel, I think we are all pretty much on the same page. I'm speaking mainly about a full time off grid residence, commonly with flooded lead acid and of course a fossil back up generator. Most of my full time off gridders don't even need to their generator from late April to early Oct

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Darryl, Do you understand the difference between paralleling the "traditional" off-grid way through the bank and using a buss bar? That was my question. The installations are quite different. Tom -- From: "Darryl Thayer" Sent: Wednesday, Dece

Re: [RE-wrenches] concord batteries, EQUALIZE Them!

Remember when? Yeah, yesterday. I get more than a few tightwad, penny pinchers in our store and no matter what I say they are going to do it THEIR way. Quote: "I watch my meter and unhook the panel if it get's to 13 volts" I'm not kidding. Another quote: "Life's tough, ...it's even tougher w

[RE-wrenches] Batteries with no charge controller

Remember when? Yes, just yesterday. I get more than a few tightwad, penny pinchers in our store and no matter what I say they are going to do it THEIR way. Quote: "I watch my meter and unhook the panel if it get's to 13 volts" I'm not kidding. Another quote: "Life's tough, ...it's even toughe

Re: [RE-wrenches] Other's thoughts on Autonomy?

Hi all I did a paper for the ASES annual conference proceedings, where it suggested from actual 8yr? data for Minnesota, that 3 day even 5 day periods of low sun were common every year, but 7 to 10 days was rare, and longer than 15 days never occurred (in my data set). A Phd thesis by J. Clin

[RE-wrenches] 2 vdc load testers

Thanks for the lead it is Interesting. I noted that it only goes to 500 AHR and the smallest cell I have is 1,575AHR and biggest is 1,990AHR. I will call and see if this can be compensated for a larger cell. I have been a good enough boy at least this year. Dana Orzel Great Solar Works,

[RE-wrenches] Battery autonomy

We still work with 4-5 days autonomy. This matches our storm cycle here in western CO. If its full they make it through if not the generator backs it up. Every bank is a HUP solar one battery bank that I have installed in the last 16 years and is still in service and healthy: Except for : 1 house

[RE-wrenches] trenching for solar thermal

>From Snow country in CO this is our formula: Dig a clean trench with a flat bottom. Allow for height of insulated package and sufficient back fill so you do not end up with a dead line of grass across the yard. Line with 12 mil plastic or heavier, 12 mil poly has a 12,000 year lifespan wh

Re: [RE-wrenches] trenching for solar thermal

Nik, We cover our insulated copper pipes with the 4" plastic corrugated drain pipe available at Low's or Home Depot. After the pipe's are insulated we run this drain pipe from one end to the other. It takes two people, we try to avoid using 90 degree fittings instead two 45's or use flex

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

No, Tom I am not sure that I know the difference between bus bars and cable paralleling. But I do know that warmer batteries have a lower voltage than cold batteries, this difference is even greater for sealed than flooded. If one battery has a higher temperature than another battery that it

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Darryl, The process of paralleling through buss bars means attaching each serial string to a pair of buss bars rather than to neighboring series pairs so batteries aren't passing current through each other and aren't affected by each others internal resistance. The buss bars then feed the inv

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

I've used the Ilsco Polaris 14 hole Insultaps in the 250 MCM size for a large system (10 OB VFX3648's & two strings of the Rolls 2-KS-33's) battery bank Pos & Neg bus bars. They worked great. Sincerely, Chris Worcester Solar Wind Works NABCEP Certified PV Installer Phone: 530-582-4503 Fax: 530-

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Hello Chris, We use the Polaris Insultaps all the time, but we have usually used them for the battery paralleling only. Are you using these for the negative common bus bar as well (in place of the bus bar in the flexware??) And are you doing the same thing for the positive bus bar? Thanks W

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Vaseline simply is not very good for battery terminals. The melting point is too low. There are other things that are much better, such as some high temperature grease, and the silicone grease high temp greases. The silicone is the most chemical resistant but is a bit expensive. ..

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

I clean,apply grease, then apply antiseze to SS bolts and washers, then assemble. Then I apply grease over the exterior. The Lithium grease sounds good to me. But why wear gloves? DArryl --- On Wed, 12/2/09, wind...@wind-sun.com wrote: > From: wind...@wind-sun.com > Subject: Re: [RE-wren

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

I wish I understood this bus bar use better. Electrically, these seem to be the same thing. But by using the bus bar, there has to be more cables, cable ends, and connection points. And cost. I just drew a battery bank (see below link to graphic), three series strings in parallel. On the negat

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Another YES for silicon. We have used it for years. A very thin coat will last a long time. I have seen the gooey mess for heated vaseline more than once. Larry On Dec 2, 2009, at 4:01 PM, wind...@wind-sun.com wrote: Vaseline simply is not very good for battery terminals. The melting poin

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

I also have been following this thread and wondering "whazzup" about buss bars being better than just parallel cables from one battery string to the next. Agreed that the parallel cable method "is merely using the terminal of the battery as a connector between two cables." Maybe if there's big amp

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Hi Tump et al. In the UK, so sorry for slow response. Must echo your comments. A series string is, without a doubt, the most efficient and things just get more complicated (connections, numbers of cells, voltage disparity) as you add parallel strings. Per Tom's comments, the only solution to

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Michael: The bus bar solution has to do at least partially, with: - Equal resistance paths to each string of batteries (need to keep the circuit cables the same length). - Ability to remove (isolate) a string more easily. With two strings, if the bus bar capacity exists in the hardware of the

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Yes, I hate Vaseline - it has a melting point of around 105 deg F, so even a moderatly hot day will cause it to drip all over the place - except onto the terminals it is supposed to protect. .. North

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Basically I agree about the low melting point of Vaseline, but I see it as the canary in the coal mine: your batteries and connections shouldn't be getting that hot! Anything over 85 degrees and the cycle life of the battery drops fast. I switch to grease, when I think I might encounter higher te

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Problem with bussing in the Flexware, is that the bussbars only go to 1/0. (be great if they made an attachment like Sq D, that allowed you to bring bigger cables to their buss.) Another reason to go to a battery buss instead of cross tying is on complicated layouts where cross tying won't get

Re: [RE-wrenches] PV Powered vs SMA

Last I used a PVP was in 2005 and we had multiple failures. I've never had an SMA fail but there has been a disconcerting glitch on some units lately, where the inverter displays a GFDI fuse error for about a 1/2 hour after commissioning, and then kicks in. Still the best dependabilty and fit and

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

My question about the buss bar is this. Is this something that you are fabricating or are buying and if so where and what? thanks, jay peltz power ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options & s

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Two answers, Jay, Actually both. For a lot of systems, we use the ILSCO or POLARIS multi-barrel insulated mechanical compression device that holds up to 8 or more cables up to whatever size you purchase them in. Then, for larger systems, we use standard, 1/4 x 4" copper bus bar with isolating bu

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Bob Ellison is in Northern New York. I'm in Vermont. We usually have to thaw the Vaseline over the woodstove. Makes great hair gel too. Don't bother with the gloves. If we mix in a little maple syrup it sticks wicked. Dick Ratico Solarwind Electric --- You wrote: Yes, I hate Vaseline - it has a m

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Dust and dirt get stuck to Vaseline, grease and other sticky substances. Some particulates contain metal that can form a conductive path from the battery terminal to the case. Test your "battery bucket" for leaks by putting one of your voltmeter lead on the terminal and the other lead on the ca

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Michael, Here are photos of how it's done in a home situation http://www.wagonmaker.com/newbatt2.html What is handy about the buss bar is the ability to use much smaller cable from each series pair (in this case) to the buss bar, thus less expense in cables than otherwise and additional expe

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Thanks, Tom. I think I have seen those photos before. Am I seeing 16 cables hooked up to each bus bar? Are you using 2 cables for each end of each string? Is that 8 series strings? I can certainly see the advantage of being able to easily remove a string from the system. But I still do not see

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

When a system is installed in the Arizona desert, unless you put in an air conditioner, you have little choice over the temperature. .. Northern Arizona Wind & Sun - Electricity From The Sun Since 197

Re: [RE-wrenches] Strings and series of batteries

Michael, There are 12 1/0 cables running from the batteries for each side of the buss, pos and neg plus the two 4/0 cables. There are 12 series strings in that 24v system wXH consisting of two 12 volt 100-amphour DCS-100L Dynasty deep cycle AGM batteries. That system has so far been in plac

[RE-wrenches] PV Powered vs SMA

Yes I know the failures you were mentioning in 05-06. I had one that had 2 blown 20a ac midget fuses inside the cover. i was told by the service of their partner company at that time to replace the fuses- it might have been a grid surge that took out the fuses. i did so later that day and the i