Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Ray Walters
All Cable and probably other companies can add striping and marking to any wire you need. R.Ray Walters CTO, Solarray, Inc Nabcep Certified PV Installer, Licensed Master Electrician Solar Design Engineer 303 505-8760 On 9/23/2013 10:57 PM, d...@energysolarnow.com wrote: Marco- You should not tr

[RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Marco Mangelsdorf
Can you, Don, or someone else please cite the specific code language where double-insulated conductors are required from beginning to end in such DC circuits? Thanks. Marco- You should not transition to THHN wire at all for the DC run. The PV wire is double insulated for a good reason- t

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread don
Marco- You should not transition to THHN wire at all for the DC run. The PV wire is double insulated for a good reason- the transformerless inverters are such suckers for a ground fault that they need the extra protection. That's why the NEC specifies PV wire.  I recently did an installation like y

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Marco Mangelsdorf
It’s my understanding that once one goes into a covered raceway that the double-insulated wire is no longer required. marco From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Jesse Dahl Sent: Monday, September 23, 2013 6:12 PM T

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Jesse Dahl
Marco, You said that after your "j-box" you will transition to THHN/THWN. Wouldn't you still need to use PVWire or some type of jacketed cable all the way to the inverter? Jesse Sent from my iPhone On Sep 23, 2013, at 4:09 PM, Brian Mehalic wrote: > The 2014 NEC addresses this in a change

Re: [RE-wrenches] XW 600 VDC Controller?

2013-09-23 Thread Jeff Yago
We do lots of off-grid and battery based systems having arrays over 200 feet from inverter. We have had very good success with the higher DC voltage Midnight Solar charge controllers which you may want to consider. This may also be a good candidate for putting a Sunny Boy at the remote array and

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Brian Mehalic
The 2014 NEC addresses this in a change in 215.12(C)(2), "Feeders Supplies from Direct-Current Systems". (There is similar language in 210.5(C)(2) in regards to branch circuits). I know many folks won't be on the 2014 cycle for some time, but at least it is defined now. Conductors 6 AWG or small

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Allen Frishman
my 2 cents - As I understand it we need to consider both the Solar Panel and the inverter. The use of a TL inverter requires the solar panels to be ungrounded which means that neither the Pos or Neg conductors from the solar panel are grounded and therefore no White wire. We can also use a ung

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Ray Walters
Hi Marco; Article 200.7 specifically prohibits using white wire for anything but grounded conductors. This came up last year on a large project with an ungrounded array, that also had white incorrectly specified in the plans. The appropriate colors would be red for positive, and black for n

Re: [RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Kelly Larson
Hi Marco, I don't think there are grounded current carrying conductors on the array side of any of the UL listed transformerless inverters available today in the US. NEC reserves the color white for grounded current carrying conductors, so for a NEC compliance, the white wire is a purchasing e

[RE-wrenches] transformerless inverters and conductor colors

2013-09-23 Thread Marco Mangelsdorf
Hi all, We're doing more and more installs with TL inverters (SMA and P1). I'm using double-insulated wire from the array string to the first enclosure, as in j-box, and then transitioning to standard THHN/THWN wire. I recently purchased some of that #10 double-insulated wire, getting a

Re: [RE-wrenches] Li-I question

2013-09-23 Thread Exeltech
Ray .. and everyone .. I've been consulting recently on a large off-grid project where the battery price is in the $300/kW-h range for a purchase quantity of 100,000 SCiB cells. That's actually a low cell count compared to the automotive industry. The cells can accept up to 8C charge/discharg

Re: [RE-wrenches] Li-I question

2013-09-23 Thread Ray Walters
That's almost $2000/ kwh, which is close to 10 times the cost of the best lead acid. That doesn't seem to make sense for solar yet, but it would for electric vehicles because of the weight reduction. Possibly their price has dropped in 2 years? I'm seeing some other sources in the EV world s

Re: [RE-wrenches] XW 600 VDC Controller?

2013-09-23 Thread Tom Duffy
Greg We too have had several installed for over a year with no problems whatsoever Kind regards Tom Duffy Senior Solar Design Engineer [Real-logo-X-195] E-Mail: t...@thesolar.biz Panama Office: 507-6126-1253 Direct Toll Free: 888-503-6772 International: 575-539-2111 SKYPE Address: thesolarbiz Al