[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

David W. Lambert added the comment: I recall an experience with a random file in /dev that was considerably slow after consuming its cache. I used it as a seeder. I've now got an ubuntu system for which /dev/urandom gives me a hundred million bytes quickly. Perhaps a nosy one has more info

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Changes by Brian Curtin : -- keywords: +needs review stage: -> patch review ___ Python tracker ___ ___ Python-bugs-list mailing list U

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: ping Please look at the last patch. It's very simple and would be helpful. This is not very complicated and shouldn't take months to consider. -- ___ Python tracker __

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

chuck added the comment: I think many people who are looking for a random number generator end up on this page and need to be informed if there are alternatives so they can make up their own mind. If you want to discourage people to use it, that's fine and we can do so, but I think it's wrong

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: There is a whole paragraph about WichmanHill at the top of this page already and (if anything) I think that WichmanHill is less notable (basically only used in legacy applications). However SystemRandom is very useful. I don't want to make claims about urandom th

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Raymond Hettinger added the comment: I'm disinclined to move this to the top of the page but will keep this open and consider further at a later date. The SystemRandom class is an alternative generator like WichmanHill which is typically not the right choice for many applications. -- p

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: How about this, sweet and simple. -- Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file15252/random.patch ___ Python tracker ___ ___

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: So, all I really want to do is call attention to SystemRandom from the top of the page, because it is easily not noticed at the bottom. Do you guys have any suggestions for how to do that that doesn't repeat too much and doesn't claim things that you aren't comfo

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Raymond Hettinger added the comment: The wording looks reasonable but it doesn't seem to add much that is not already said: ''' class SystemRandom( [seed]) Class that uses the os.urandom() function for generating random numbers from sources provided by the operating system. Not available on a

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: I rewrote the description, mostly using the claims form urandom, so that we don't claim something new. What do you guys think? -- Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file15251/random.patch ___ Python tracker

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: A major pro for pseudo-random number generators is that they are deterministic, that is, you can save a load the state, start from the same seed and reproduce results, etc. At least in science (and probably other areas) this reproducibility can be vital in a rand

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

chuck added the comment: Depends on how verbose we want to be. It should say why one might want to use urandom() instead of random (if you decide you are interested you can still look up the documentation). I think it would be nice to say why random does not use urandom if urandom is better,

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: Ah, sorry for the misunderstanding. I agree, better not to mislead. Perhaps we should side with the urandom documentation and say that it is a cryptographically secure random number generator with no accessible state? -- __

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Jan Hosang added the comment: Maybe os.urandom is "more random" than the module random in the sense that it is harder to figure out what comes next, but still deterministic. The readings from the hardware are random and you usually don't know them, yet what comes out of urandom is determined

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Shawn Ligocki added the comment: Oh, urandom is almost always non-deterministic. It mixes completely random bits from hardware sources with its pseudo-random number state. The more random bits it gets from hardware, the less predictable its output is. However, as long as it's getting any random

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Changes by Raymond Hettinger : -- assignee: georg.brandl -> rhettinger ___ Python tracker ___ ___ Python-bugs-list mailing list Unsubsc

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Raymond Hettinger added the comment: FWIW, the docs for os.urandom() state: """Return a string of n random bytes suitable for cryptographic use. This function returns random bytes from an OS-specific randomness source. The returned data should be unpredictable enough for cryptographic applicat

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

Jan Hosang added the comment: I think non-determinism is more then os.urandom can deliver. As far as I know the OS still does deterministic calculations, though they are maybe less obvious. Maybe call it "safer, OS dependent"? -- nosy: +chuck ___ P

[issue7076] Documentation add note about SystemRandom

New submission from Shawn Ligocki : I did not notice the existence of random.SystemRandom until after I had implemented my own version. I thought it would be nice to mention it in the opening section. I've added a tiny note about random.SystemRandom. What do you guys think, feel free to reword it