On 2017-01-17 20:01, wkitty42--- via Lazarus wrote:
> sometimes too much is too much ;)
+1 :)
Regards,
Graeme
--
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On 2017-01-17 18:11, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
> fpGUI is, in every way possible, a wrapper.
In that case even the Writeln() call is a wrapper function (for a low
level system call). So as you can see, your quest not to use wrappers is
getting a bit ridiculous. Object Pascal is a high level language
On 01/17/2017 01:11 PM, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
fpGUI is, in every way possible, a wrapper.
It wrapps low level x11/win32 calls into a usable frameworks called fpGUI
Object orientation is often a wrapper around system calls, fpGUI is object
oriented and makes low level calls so someone can use
On Tue, January 17, 2017 2:22 am, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
> On 2017-01-16 20:18, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> GUI's require wrappers.
>>
>
> No they don't.
>
Sane GUI programming requires wrappers...
Insane programmers will program a GUI without a wrapper...
;-)
>
>> Delphi 5 as an
On 17.01.2017 10:22, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
Yes, Delphi's VCL is a wrapper around the common Win32 widgets. LCL is a
wrapper around Win32, Qt, Cocoa, Carbon and even fpGUI.
And for ease of use as well Delphi as Lazarus come with an IDE that is a
combination of source code editor,
On 2017-01-16 20:18, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
> GUI's require wrappers.
No they don't.
> Delphi 5 as an example, is a wrapper around the win32api
Yes, Delphi's VCL is a wrapper around the common Win32 widgets. LCL is a
wrapper around Win32, Qt, Cocoa, Carbon and even fpGUI. But not all GUI
toolki
On 16.01.2017 21:24, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
Except when you find a bug in the lcl, and have to dig in to it..
I don't suppose Lazrus is so bad that it can't be used for the simple
programs the students will start with when learning programming :-):-):-).
-Michael
--
On Mon, January 16, 2017 3:19 am, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> On 15.01.2017 15:30, Martin Vahi via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> have came to a conclusion that GUI-s are inherently something that
>> require "dynamic programming" or the code gets really bloated.
>>
>>
> The nice thing about Lazarus "
> On Sunday 15 January 2017 15:30:44 Martin Vahi via Lazarus wrote:
>
>>
>> I haven't used Lazarus yet, I need to learn it,
>> but during the development of my own JavaScript GUI library I have came
>> to a conclusion that GUI-s are inherently something that require "dynamic
>> programming" or the
On Sunday 15 January 2017 15:30:44 Martin Vahi via Lazarus wrote:
>
> I haven't used Lazarus yet, I need to learn it,
> but during the development of my own
> JavaScript GUI library I have came to a conclusion
> that GUI-s are inherently something that require
> "dynamic programming" or the code ge
On 15.01.2017 15:30, Martin Vahi via Lazarus wrote:
have came to a conclusion
that GUI-s are inherently something that require
"dynamic programming" or the code gets really bloated.
The nice thing about Lazarus "RAD" paradigm is that this is completely
hidden (in the library) from application p
On Sun, Jan 15, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Martin Vahi via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> Sorry for sending my previous letter about
> teaching Pascal to the mailing list.
> The letter was meant to be sent directly to
> the Adrian De Armas, not the mailing list.
> My mistake.
> --
> _
Sorry for sending my previous letter about
teaching Pascal to the mailing list.
The letter was meant to be sent directly to
the Adrian De Armas, not the mailing list.
My mistake.
--
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On 10/12/2016 09:10 PM, Adrian De Armas via Lazarus wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> I am a professor of "introduction to programming". Currently we are working
> with matlab and c.
>
> Today I had a meeting about doing the module more interesting to the
> students. Currently we teach algorithms making
On 10/27/2016 11:15 AM, Paul Breneman via Lazarus wrote:
On 10/25/2016 11:23 AM, Travis Ayres via Lazarus wrote:
So...who wants to work on a modern course outline with me? We have a
lot of
opinions and people willing to chime in, maybe we can do something
good for
the community?
Some suggestio
On 10/25/2016 11:23 AM, Travis Ayres via Lazarus wrote:
So...who wants to work on a modern course outline with me? We have a lot of
opinions and people willing to chime in, maybe we can do something good for
the community?
Some suggestions:
1) As the OP wrote (in a later message) "All my stude
On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:23 AM, Travis Ayres via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> So...who wants to work on a modern course outline with me? We have a lot
> of opinions and people willing to chime in, maybe we can do something good
> for the community?
>
> On Oct 25, 2016 4:03 AM
So...who wants to work on a modern course outline with me? We have a lot of
opinions and people willing to chime in, maybe we can do something good for
the community?
On Oct 25, 2016 4:03 AM, "Michael Schnell via Lazarus" <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
>
>
> On 24.10.2016 18:11, Travis A
On 24.10.2016 18:11, Travis Ayres via Lazarus wrote:
With over 100 replies, we could have already written a course outline,
introduction, ...
It seems we have lost (or silenced) the OP long since :-(
-Michael
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On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Martin Schreiber via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On Monday 24 October 2016 19:53:21 Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> >
> >
> > My opinion is that event based programming needs special care .
> > A simulation example may be useful ,
On Monday 24 October 2016 19:53:21 Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
>
>
> My opinion is that event based programming needs special care .
> A simulation example may be useful , for example , by using PetriSim
> sources , adapted to Free Pascal .
>
The last chapter of "Programmieren macht Sp
On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 3:25 PM, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 2016-10-24 21:29, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> > http://www.blaisepascal.eu/subscribers/UK/UK_Book_Department.html
>
> I believe Blaise Pascal is now the official publisher of
On 2016-10-24 21:29, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> http://www.blaisepascal.eu/subscribers/UK/UK_Book_Department.html
I believe Blaise Pascal is now the official publisher of that book. From
what I can see, they now offer a PDF version of that book, so “out of
print” should be of no co
On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 1:00 PM, wkitty42--- via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 10/24/2016 01:53 PM, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> I have the book :
>>
>> https://www.amazon.com/Lazarus-Complete-Guide-pascal-teachin
>> g/dp/9490968021
>> ( Lazarus The complete
On 10/24/2016 01:53 PM, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
I have the book :
https://www.amazon.com/Lazarus-Complete-Guide-pascal-teaching/dp/9490968021
( Lazarus The complete Guide )
i've been looking for that book off and on since i heard about it... amazon
currently shows it as unava
The part I'm most interested in is using Lazarus to full effect with good
architecture; I don't think the GUI portion would make a good first (or
even second) course in computers/computing.
I would like to see a "Software Architecture" course that used
Delphi/FreePascal/Lazarus
On Mon, Oct 24, 20
On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 9:11 AM, Travis Ayres via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> With over 100 replies, we could have already written a course outline,
> introduction, and some notes about events and RAD programming, maybe also
> the observer pattern?
>
> On Oct 24, 2016 3:51 AM
With over 100 replies, we could have already written a course outline,
introduction, and some notes about events and RAD programming, maybe also
the observer pattern?
On Oct 24, 2016 3:51 AM, "Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus" <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
Am 2016-10-24 um 12:20 schrieb Mi
Am 2016-10-24 um 12:20 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
> On 21.10.2016 11:09, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
>> What is the use of a program? Entertainment?
> Nowadays in 90% of the usage exactly this.
> Maybe other usage cases are more "important", but still the money is made
with Ent
Am 2016-10-24 um 12:13 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
> On 18.10.2016 17:16, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
>> Yes, therefore start with simple procedural (console)
>> programs that let them have immediate success with
>> all the elementary things that a program consists of
>> (variabl
Am 2016-10-24 um 11:57 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
> On 21.10.2016 09:51, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>> The concept of callbacks is very similar to events.
> The difference is that with a callback you usually know both sides and hence
how exactly it is called,
> while with an event (especia
On 21.10.2016 10:12, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
Today's bloatware applications are so large no one can understand them
IMHO, you did a good job to scare everybody away from even thinking
about starting to try programming. So we should just stop "Teaching
Pascal at College".
-Michael
--
_
On 21.10.2016 11:09, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
What is the use of a program? Entertainment?
Nowadays in 90% of the usage exactly this.
Maybe other usage cases are more "important", but still the money is
made with Entertainment.
-Michael
--
On 18.10.2016 17:16, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
Yes, therefore start with simple procedural (console)
programs that let them have immediate success with
all the elementary things that a program consists of
(variables/types, loops, commands, etc.).
Yep. Satisfying for a Nerd, but it
On 21.10.2016 14:05, Martin Schreiber via Lazarus wrote:
Win32 API works with message queues.
Happily, the application programmer does not need to know about that, as
the LCL completely hides the underlying complexity. He sees the same
type of "GUI"-events, independent of running on Winx (OS-in
On 21.10.2016 09:51, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
The concept of callbacks is very similar to events.
The difference is that with a callback you usually know both sides and
hence how exactly it is called, while with an event (especially when
fired by the LCL on behalf of something that happens in th
On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 12:51 AM, Lars via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On Mon, October 17, 2016 7:32 pm, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote:
> > One obvious point is that an "event" driven programming knowledge is a
> > must to become a competent programmer . The problem is how this
On Friday 21 October 2016 13:26:13 Lars via Lazarus wrote:
> On Fri, October 21, 2016 2:11 am, Martin Schreiber via Lazarus wrote:
> > On Friday 21 October 2016 09:51:38 Lars via Lazarus wrote:
> >> I'm not so sure event driven programming is a must to become a
> >> competent programmer, I would ha
On Fri, October 21, 2016 2:11 am, Martin Schreiber via Lazarus wrote:
> On Friday 21 October 2016 09:51:38 Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm not so sure event driven programming is a must to become a
>> competent programmer, I would have to think about that.
>
> "Event driven" probably means that
Am 2016-10-21 um 11:35 schrieb Lars via Lazarus:
> There are two sides to this story, I'm afraid. I'm a fan of the console
> program teaching method myself but the issue is: console mode programs are
> irrelevant and useless.
> Today, MS DOS doesn't exist any more. Even when
> ms dos existed, cons
El 21/10/16 a les 11:09, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus ha escrit:
Am 2016-10-21 um 09:20 schrieb Lars via Lazarus:
The issue with console mode programs is students see utterly no use
for them.
Why should they not?
A computer is a information processing machine and GUI is not necessary to
proce
On Fri, 21 Oct 2016 03:41:49 -0600
Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>[...]
> The word engineer is so overloaded, that I hate it, with my guts.
>
> What is an engineer? A guy "who makes stuff".. which pretty much describes
> every single profession.
This is going off-topic. Please stick to the topic.
Ma
Am 2016-10-21 um 11:28 schrieb Lars via Lazarus:
> Hmmm.. I'm not so sure learning about the internals of the CPU is so good.
> IMO that is computer science, whereas programming is computing science.
> I was interested in how computers physically worked, before I became a
> programmer. One of the
On Fri, October 14, 2016 4:42 am, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 1:18 AM, Michael Schnell via Lazarus <
> lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
>
>> On 13.10.2016 10:20, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>>
>>
>>> +1
>>> That would be the best solution. GUI pr
On Tue, October 18, 2016 9:16 am, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
> Am 2016-10-18 um 16:47 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
>
>> If you start with complex stuff that does not yield immediate success
>> (i.e. a working program that does something that might be useful) The
>> students will
On Tue, October 18, 2016 7:23 am, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
> Am 2016-10-18 um 12:53 schrieb Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus:
>
>> Order of teaching is not so critical : As you say , write a GUI program
>> for events : Say : "Now it is necessary to define what will be done for
>> the
>> Il 13/10/2016 16:48, Reimar Grabowski via Lazarus ha scritto:
>>
>>
>>> If you want modern, teach them Java and let the programs run on their
>>> phones or keep doing console programs and do the GUI in JS (aka web
>>> applications). ^^
Wait, wasn't java killed, the day someone thought up the
Am 2016-10-21 um 10:08 schrieb Lars via Lazarus:
> Sometimes knowing the internals and details can be a disadvantage because
> instead of thinking about the abstract program you are thinking about cpu
> cycles, bit popping, bit twiddling, low level API calls.
How do you think about "the abstract
> Both points are important,
> being popular is also important, network effect is important. More users
> means more libraries, more beta testers, more information, more tools. So,
> better frameworks.
Popular isn't always good. Look at perl's Cpan, or heck even java.
Basically if you have a bu
On Fri, October 14, 2016 6:11 am, wkitty42--- via Lazarus wrote:
> On 10/14/2016 07:04 AM, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> On 2016-10-14 12:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>>
>>> and maybe incite them every now and again
>>
>> Oops, that meant to read: "...and maybe entice them..
Am 2016-10-21 um 09:20 schrieb Lars via Lazarus:
> The issue with console mode programs is students see utterly no use for them.
Why should they not?
A computer is a information processing machine and GUI is not necessary to
process information, it's just a cosmetic thing.
The interaction of a pr
On Tue, October 18, 2016 4:53 am, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> My application was like the following ( as a very simple example ) :
>
>
> Pose a problem "Display your name ."
> After this is done :
>
>
> "Display your name 10 times ."
>
>
> The students were not able to write their pr
On Tue, October 18, 2016 4:42 am, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
> One unfortunate situation is that there is not much Pascal software for
> Petri Nets processing , except the following ( which its license is very
> ambiguous means not usable )
Hopefully in these situations, you can find
On Mon, October 17, 2016 3:48 am, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> On 17.10.2016 11:07, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>
>
>> YES ...YES...NO...
>>
>
> IMHO a personal POV that is not very helpful in a totally general
> discussion (please keep in mind that the intention of the OP to consi
On Mon, October 17, 2016 3:07 am, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
> On 2016-10-17 09:52, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> - do I need know how/why the GUI builder creates the code that makes a
>> Button visible on a Form and my Event handler be called when a button
>> is pressed ?
>
>
On Mon, October 17, 2016 2:52 am, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> On 14.10.2016 16:10, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
>
>>
>> In most cases they never get to the step "find out how it works".
>> If it works, nobody wants to invest time anymore to look under the hood.
>> So they always
On Friday 21 October 2016 09:51:38 Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>
> I'm not so sure event driven programming is a must to become a competent
> programmer, I would have to think about that.
"Event driven" probably means that there is an event queue with a central
toolkit-main-eventloop which dispatche
On Mon, October 17, 2016 7:32 pm, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote:
> One obvious point is that an "event" driven programming knowledge is a
> must to become a competent programmer . The problem is how this can be
> learned . Without knowing how to program an algorithm when a related event
> is occurred
On Tue, October 18, 2016 2:11 am, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> The big issue with teaching using a RAD tool, is welding the program
>> logic into the onclick events, instead of decoupling the logic in
>> separate procedures that can be reused elsewhere.
> As you point out in the text th
Am 2016-10-18 um 16:47 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
> If you start with complex stuff that does not yield immediate success (i.e. a
working program that does something that might be useful) The students will loose
interest and run away, unless they are nerds like ourselves.
Yes, therefo
On 18.10.2016 15:23, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
IMO the order is extremly important!
If you start with the fundamental informations
(how does the processor work in general,
how are variables stored (stack/heap/etc.),
what does the processor do in loops, etc.)
then this information is r
On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 6:23 AM, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> Am 2016-10-18 um 12:53 schrieb Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus:
> > Order of teaching is not so critical : As you say , write a GUI program
> for events : Say : "Now it is necessary to define
Am 2016-10-18 um 12:53 schrieb Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus:
> Order of teaching is not so critical : As you say , write a GUI program for events :
Say : "Now it is necessary to define what will be done for the events ? ... Its way is
the following : Write your program parts in that way ...
On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 1:11 AM, Michael Schnell via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 17.10.2016 21:05, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> The big issue with teaching using a RAD tool, is welding the program logic
>> into the onclick events, instead of decoupling the logic in separat
On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 12:48 AM, Travis Ayres wrote:
> I'm all for this effort, and hope it leads to new and modern tutorials,
> books or notes that would be useful for others that use FreePascal/Lazarus
> to convey graphical system interactions. If there's any need to proofread
> such materials
On 17.10.2016 21:05, Lars via Lazarus wrote:
The big issue with teaching using a RAD tool, is welding the program logic
into the onclick events, instead of decoupling the logic in separate
procedures that can be reused elsewhere.
As you point out in the text this is as well a pro (easy fast solvi
I'm all for this effort, and hope it leads to new and modern tutorials,
books or notes that would be useful for others that use FreePascal/Lazarus
to convey graphical system interactions. If there's any need to proofread
such materials, I'll gladly help out!
On Oct 17, 2016 6:32 PM, "Mehmet Erol S
On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 12:05 PM, Lars via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> > On 14/10/16 08:30, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> >
> >
> > Of course there are decent drawbacks regarding relying too much on RAD
> > and about not really understanding the fundamentals behind it.
> On 14/10/16 08:30, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
>
>
> Of course there are decent drawbacks regarding relying too much on RAD
> and about not really understanding the fundamentals behind it. But in the
> end the addressees are non-computer engineers.
The big issue with teaching using a RAD
On 17.10.2016 11:07, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
a programmer needs to know how the internals of a program works and
This obviously includes the details of the OS API and the assembler code
(while admittedly other examples I (posted don't need to be denoted as
related to the "progra
Generally speaking:
Getting confronted with the limits, imposed by lack of knowledge to
your work to get a task done is a great motivation for learning.
Being forced by the tutor to learn stuff you don't immediately need to
get the task at hand done is a great motivation to give up.
-Micha
On 17.10.2016 11:07, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
YES ...YES...NO...
IMHO a personal POV that is not very helpful in a totally general
discussion (please keep in mind that the intention of the OP to consider
Pascal instead of C was to keep the students from running away too soon.
Th
On 2016-10-17 09:52, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> - do I need know how/why the GUI builder creates the code that makes a
> Button visible on a Form and my Event handler be called when a button
> is pressed ?
Yes
(I.e. do I need to be able to write the code myself
> without the help
On 14.10.2016 16:10, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
In most cases they never get to the step "find out how it works".
If it works, nobody wants to invest time anymore to look under the hood.
So they always operate on the surface and repeat the same
subobtimal programming over and over agai
On 14-Oct-16 17:16, Reimar Grabowski via Lazarus wrote:
On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 16:24:04 +0100
Lukasz Sokol via Lazarus wrote:
D'oh, really.
D'oh, really? (fixed that for you)
Answer: No (well actually the part about matlab I meant serious)
Ah Matlab. Happy TU days. Calculating 2D FFT of a
On Fri, 14 Oct 2016 16:24:04 +0100
Lukasz Sokol via Lazarus wrote:
> D'oh, really.
> D'oh, really? (fixed that for you)
Answer: No (well actually the part about matlab I meant serious)
Reminder to myself:
The interwebz dozn't get sarcazm
The interwebz dozn't get sarcazm
The interwebz dozn't get
On 13/10/16 15:48, Reimar Grabowski via Lazarus wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Oct 2016 10:37:53 -0300 Adrian De Armas via Lazarus
> wrote:
>
>> Introducing GUI is an efford to make the module more attractive to
>> the students (the droupout rate is high). The module is taught as a
>> basic science. All my
On 2016-10-14 15:10, Jürgen Hestermann via Lazarus wrote:
> desperately click on this and that and some have luck and suddenly it works
> (more or less).
> But they do not know why and they also do not know why the performance is so
> bad,
> but hey, as long as it more or less works
Straigh
El 13/10/2016 a las 23:11, Giuliano Colla via Lazarus escribió:
> but then one should always select the most "appropriate" technology,
> and not be influenced by what is "modern".
More modern means maybe with a few extra features. And in this context I
suppose that "modern" also means more popula
Am 2016-10-14 um 15:52 schrieb Michael Schnell via Lazarus:
> On 14.10.2016 13:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>> They will be thrown into the deep end and sink.
> I don't think so. You can learn to drive a car even if you don't know how the
engine is constructed.
> At first you can just
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 6:52 AM, Michael Schnell via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 14.10.2016 13:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>
> They will be thrown into the deep end and sink.
>
> I don't think so. You can learn to drive a car even if you don't know how
> the e
On 14.10.2016 13:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
They will be thrown into the deep end and sink.
I don't think so. You can learn to drive a car even if you don't know
how the engine is constructed.
At first you can just *use* the GUI and later you can find out how it
works.
-Michae
On 10/14/2016 07:04 AM, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
On 2016-10-14 12:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
and maybe incite them every now and again
Oops, that meant to read: "...and maybe entice them..."
incite works, too :)
--
NOTE: No off-list assistance is given without pri
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 5:05 AM, Martin Schreiber via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On Friday 14 October 2016 13:08:13 Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
>
> >
> > In previous years
> >
> > https://sourceforge.net/projects/mseide-msegui/
> >
> > was limited to Linux .
>
>
On Thu, 13 Oct 2016 23:11:31 +0200
Giuliano Colla via Lazarus wrote:
> Il 13/10/2016 16:48, Reimar Grabowski via Lazarus ha scritto:
>
> > If you want modern, teach them Java and let the programs run on their
> > phones or keep doing console programs and do the GUI in JS (aka web
> > applicati
On Friday 14 October 2016 13:08:13 Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
>
> In previous years
>
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/mseide-msegui/
>
> was limited to Linux .
MSEide+MSEgui runs on Windows and Linux from start at 1999. Since several
years it runs on FreeBSD too.
Martin
--
___
On Friday 14 October 2016 10:50:28 Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
>
> With a more careful design it's absolutely possible to do "non RAD"
> programs by doing "GUI units" and "business code Units" that interact
> via Objects with functions, properties and events (callback-properties) .
>
Separat
On 2016-10-14 12:08, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote:
> program can not be compiled as a Lazarus program or an fpGUI program as it
> is like compiling the same program by Delphi ( with required compiler
> directives ) . It is necessary either use Lazarus or fpGUI programming .
I am yet to see that in
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 3:48 AM, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 2016-10-13 23:13, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus wrote:
> > The problem is that you should separate your business logic and
> > the GUI. With Delphi like RAD it's very difficult to do that.
On 2016-10-14 12:01, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
> and maybe incite them every now and again
Oops, that meant to read: "...and maybe entice them..."
Regards,
Graeme
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On 2016-10-14 09:18, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
> The OP explained that his main purpose is to introduce more fun in the
> education. That can be done by plunging into programming directly with
> GUI development.
So for somebody that doesn't know anything about programming, then
suddenl
On 2016-10-13 23:13, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus wrote:
> The problem is that you should separate your business logic and
> the GUI. With Delphi like RAD it's very difficult to do that. (but it is
> possible) Everything is coded in events and connected to database aware
> GUI controls. (In t
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 1:50 AM, Michael Schnell via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 14.10.2016 00:13, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm not a big fan of the RAD development way any more. (I was years ago).
>> The problem is that you should separate your busin
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 1:18 AM, Michael Schnell via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> On 13.10.2016 10:20, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
>
>> +1
>> That would be the best solution. GUI programming is based on
>> fundamentals than need to be understood first.
>>
>
> -1 !!
>
On 14/10/16 08:30, Michael Schnell via Lazarus wrote:
Of course there are decent drawbacks regarding relying too much on RAD
and about not really understanding the fundamentals behind it.
But in the end the addressees are non-computer engineers.
Seconded. If I could make a general observation:
On 14.10.2016 00:13, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus wrote:
I'm not a big fan of the RAD development way any more. (I was years
ago). The problem is that you should separate your business logic and
the GUI.
This is absolutely true especially when doing large systems or
(embedded) systems that
On 13.10.2016 10:20, Graeme Geldenhuys via Lazarus wrote:
+1
That would be the best solution. GUI programming is based on
fundamentals than need to be understood first.
-1 !!
The OP explained that his main purpose is to introduce more fun in the
education. That can be done by plunging into p
On 10/14/2016 08:28 AM, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk via Lazarus wrote:
I consider QT a very big trap . Please be careful about its license if
you want to develop commercial software and also if you want to teach
computer programming to the students that they will work for commercial
companies .
I am
On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 3:13 PM, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus <
lazarus@lists.lazarus-ide.org> wrote:
> Although I use Free Pascal/Lazarus a lot (because we have a lot of
> existing pascal code) I think C++ and some GUI framework like QT might be a
> better option. C/C++ is the number one used
On 10/13/2016 05:13 PM, Erwin van den Bosch via Lazarus wrote:
...
Another problem with the RAD way is that a lot is stored in forms (.lfm
files) and it's difficult to see/notice changes to those files. They can
be very big and it's difficult to see if some control is missing, for
example, an eve
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