Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On 13/04/12 15:13, Kris Craig wrote: > Again, the controller should NOT be a .phpp file. Likewise, your model > should NOT be hooking directly to the view. The controller hooks to the > model. The controller then sanitizes that and returns it to the view. > Alternatively, if you're not conformi

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

On 13/04/12 14:55, Stas Malyshev wrote: > Hi! > >> If this is a pecl module library developers cannot use it and trust >> that on php 5.n, it just works. That would fork the language in an >> undesirable way. It should be a core feature, no ini flag, no >> sometimes-there module. > PHP 5.n is at le

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 8:24 PM, John LeSueur wrote: > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:00 PM, Kris Craig wrote: > >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:51 PM, John LeSueur wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:49 PM, Kris Craig wrote: >>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:35 PM, David Muir

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

Hi! > To me it's not about renaming variables, but rather avoiding to clutter > the parent scope with variables, e.g.: > > $closure = function () use ($this->getFooBar() as $foo) { > $foo->stuff(); > } > That sounds like an interesting idea. If it can be done properly (i.e., what if that ex

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi! > If this is a pecl module library developers cannot use it and trust > that on php 5.n, it just works. That would fork the language in an > undesirable way. It should be a core feature, no ini flag, no > sometimes-there module. PHP 5.n is at least a year away, wide adoption of it - more like

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:00 PM, Kris Craig wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:51 PM, John LeSueur wrote: > >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:49 PM, Kris Craig wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:35 PM, David Muir >>> wrote: >>> >>> > On 13/04/12 11:03, Kris Craig wrote: >>> > >>> > >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi, 2012/4/13 Tom Boutell : > If this is a pecl module library developers cannot use it and trust that on > php 5.n, it just works. That would fork the language in an undesirable way. > It should be a core feature, no ini flag, no sometimes-there module. > We are saying not into core. Implement

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

The meaning is unclear, and it doesn't let you specify error reporting. Sent from my iPhone On Apr 12, 2012, at 9:37 PM, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > 2012/4/13 Arvids Godjuks : >> Well, i can say that any template engine that is not a pure php extension >> does template inclusion via an include of a f

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

If this is a pecl module library developers cannot use it and trust that on php 5.n, it just works. That would fork the language in an undesirable way. It should be a core feature, no ini flag, no sometimes-there module. Sent from my iPhone On Apr 12, 2012, at 10:00 PM, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: >

Re: [PHP-DEV] UPDATED RFC version 1.1: source files without opening

Hi, I think script only include should have it own function, since it's the current semantics of PHP. require/require_once/include/include_once why not script/script_once? Stats give an interesting idea. It can be normal function. How about write a PECL module for it? You can do that by scannin

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi, 2012/4/13 Yasuo Ohgaki : > Hi, > > 2012/4/13 Stas Malyshev : >> Hi! >> >>> If I exclude current code, then introducing script only include will be >>> preferred one. I preferred dedicated statement for it though. >>> >>> include >>> include_once >>> require >>> require_once >>> script >>> scri

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi, 2012/4/13 Stas Malyshev : > Hi! > >> If I exclude current code, then introducing script only include will be >> preferred one. I preferred dedicated statement for it though. >> >> include >> include_once >> require >> require_once >> script >> script_once > > I have a thought here. To implemen

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:35 PM, David Muir wrote: > On 13/04/12 11:03, Kris Craig wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:46 PM, David Muir wrote: > >> On 13/04/12 10:04, Kris Craig wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:46 PM, David Muir wrote: >> >>> On 13/04/12 09:38, Yasuo Ohgak

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:26 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > Well, i can say that any template engine that is not a pure php extension > does template inclusion via an include of a file with html and embedded php > code. Because to make things fast you have to convert your templates from > tags and ps

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On 12.04.2012 18:21, Nikita Popov wrote: > It would be nice to see a few real-life scenarios where this is > useful. Right now I can't think of situations where you'd want to > change the variable name between the outer scope and the closure > scope. Wouldn't that just be confusion for the programm

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

2012/4/13 Arvids Godjuks : > Well, i can say that any template engine that is not a pure php extension > does template inclusion via an include of a file with html and embedded php > code. Because to make things fast you have to convert your templates from > tags and pseudo code to that state and c

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:55 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > I should point out that if you make you mind about a feature - you will > twist and turn it like hell, but you can't be convinced that it may make > more damage than good, or is just plain pointless because out there in the > wild the world

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On 13/04/12 11:03, Kris Craig wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:46 PM, David Muir > wrote: > > On 13/04/12 10:04, Kris Craig wrote: >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:46 PM, David Muir > > wrote: >> >> On 13/04/12 0

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Well, i can say that any template engine that is not a pure php extension does template inclusion via an include of a file with html and embedded php code. Because to make things fast you have to convert your templates from tags and pseudo code to that state and cache the result so not to make pars

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:04 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > I will not write something like that any more, but you should understand > that Criss is writing to the list tons of e-mails and his attitude to other > people ideas and arguments is getting on people nerves. Remember thecphrase > from the M

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Hi, 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:03 PM, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> If we aren't going to consider saving current code risk, then >> we could use both new include and file name convention. >> >> Introduce application/x-httpd-php-script, then we could >> >> AddHan

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

2012/4/13 Yasuo Ohgaki : > Hi, > > If we aren't going to consider saving current code risk, then > we could use both new include and file name convention. > > Introduce application/x-httpd-php-script, then we could > > AddHandler php5-script .php > AddType text/html .php > AddType application/x-htt

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:03 PM, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > Hi, > > If we aren't going to consider saving current code risk, then > we could use both new include and file name convention. > > Introduce application/x-httpd-php-script, then we could > > AddHandler php5-script .php > AddType text/html .p

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

I will not write something like that any more, but you should understand that Criss is writing to the list tons of e-mails and his attitude to other people ideas and arguments is getting on people nerves. Remember thecphrase from the Mythbusters "I reject your reality and substitute my own!". It fe

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:46 PM, David Muir wrote: > On 13/04/12 10:04, Kris Craig wrote: > > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:46 PM, David Muir wrote: > >> On 13/04/12 09:38, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: >> > Hi, >> > >> > 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : >> >> Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for thi

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Hi, If we aren't going to consider saving current code risk, then we could use both new include and file name convention. Introduce application/x-httpd-php-script, then we could AddHandler php5-script .php AddType text/html .php AddType application/x-httpd-php-source .phps AddType application/x-

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:26 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > Well, I just don't know how i can appeal to common sence to some people on > the list anymore. First the type hinting threads, now this. > With all due respect, Arvids, get over it. People are going to propose ideas you don't like. I'm go

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi! > If I exclude current code, then introducing script only include will be > preferred one. I preferred dedicated statement for it though. > > include > include_once > require > require_once > script > script_once I have a thought here. To implement script/script_once you don't need it to be

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

I should point out that if you make you mind about a feature - you will twist and turn it like hell, but you can't be convinced that it may make more damage than good, or is just plain pointless because out there in the wild the world actually is wild. And peoe do things differently for a reason.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi! > Common sence is allien to some people on this list or what? While I think you make a good point, I also think we could do without personal (or multi-personal) attacks. It is fine to discuss and criticize ideas, but let's avoid attacks on personal level and disparaging personal qualities of

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi, 2012/4/13 David Muir : > On 13/04/12 10:02, Arvids Godjuks wrote: >> It will never get adopted, too many legacy stuff, to many external tools. >> And php native templates? I dont neet any twig, smarty or any other stuff. >> And guess what - most template engines cache compiled templates, and t

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On 13/04/12 10:04, Kris Craig wrote: > > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:46 PM, David Muir > wrote: > > On 13/04/12 09:38, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > > Hi, > > > > 2012/4/13 Kris Craig >: > >> Per recent discussions, I have

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Sorry, but how will i load a template then? I do that in a controller whose file is.plain php code with no html. Now i'm forced to use some kind of template engine that does not including a template, but parsing it and replacing keywords with data? I really do not have to put a sarcastic phrase her

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Well, I just don't know how i can appeal to common sence to some people on the list anymore. First the type hinting threads, now this. The world does not work only on one web server and there are different type ls of them out there. I for once use nginx and i configure how to run scripts by locati

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 5:02 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > You all know where the short_tags, register_globals, magic_quotes and other > stuff like that took the language and the problems it made. > Doesn`t history teach us a lesson? I see that it did not for some active > members of this list. > Ma

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

On 13/04/12 10:02, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > It will never get adopted, too many legacy stuff, to many external tools. > And php native templates? I dont neet any twig, smarty or any other stuff. > And guess what - most template engines cache compiled templates, and they > are - ta-daa - PHP EMBEDDED

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

Sent from my iPad 在 2012-4-13，2:07，Nikita Popov 写道： > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:38 PM, Robert Williams > wrote: >> Also, remember that the closure is in fact another function, a function >> that performs its own actions independent of the parent. Just as other >> functions can pick whatever pa

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:46 PM, David Muir wrote: > On 13/04/12 09:38, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > > Hi, > > > > 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : > >> Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for this. This proposal > >> offers what I believe to be a more sane and realistic approach to > >> addressing the

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Hi, 2012/4/13 Arvids Godjuks : > So ok, i write my code in files without extension, what happens? > > As it was said before, interpreter will not distinguish by the file > extension, ever. It is os dependant and so on. > > Why are you poluting the mailing list with things that are clearly said wil

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

You all know where the short_tags, register_globals, magic_quotes and other stuff like that took the language and the problems it made. Doesn`t history teach us a lesson? I see that it did not for some active members of this list. Many are still cleaning up the mess of thouse optional php.ini direc

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

Sent from my iPad 在 2012-4-13，2:07，Nikita Popov 写道： > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:38 PM, Robert Williams > wrote: >> Also, remember that the closure is in fact another function, a function >> that performs its own actions independent of the parent. Just as other >> functions can pick whatever pa

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Arvids Godjuks wrote: > So ok, i write my code in files without extension, what happens? > > As it was said before, interpreter will not distinguish by the file > extension, ever. It is os dependant and so on. > > Why are you poluting the mailing list with things t

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:38 PM, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > Hi, > > 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : > > Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for this. This proposal > > offers what I believe to be a more sane and realistic approach to > > addressing the question of incorporating a new breed of tag-le

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

On 13/04/12 09:38, Yasuo Ohgaki wrote: > Hi, > > 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : >> Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for this. This proposal >> offers what I believe to be a more sane and realistic approach to >> addressing the question of incorporating a new breed of tag-less PHP >> scripts.

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

So ok, i write my code in files without extension, what happens? As it was said before, interpreter will not distinguish by the file extension, ever. It is os dependant and so on. Why are you poluting the mailing list with things that are clearly said will never happen?

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Hi, 2012/4/13 Kris Craig : > Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for this.  This proposal > offers what I believe to be a more sane and realistic approach to > addressing the question of incorporating a new breed of tag-less PHP > scripts. > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/phpp This may work

Re: [PHP-DEV] Allow non-variable arguments to empty()

On Wed, 2012-04-11 at 00:53 +0200, Nikita Popov wrote: > > Currently the empty() language construct only works on variables. You > can write if (empty($array)) but not empty if (empty(getSomeArray()). I've mentioned this thought off-list already but let's discuss it officially: A fear I have is

[PHP-DEV] [RFC] New .phpp File Type for Pure-Code PHP Scripts

Per recent discussions, I have drafted an RFC for this. This proposal offers what I believe to be a more sane and realistic approach to addressing the question of incorporating a new breed of tag-less PHP scripts. https://wiki.php.net/rfc/phpp --Kris

Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Disabling PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options

Hi, 2012/4/12 Lester Caine : > Rasmus Lerdorf wrote: >>> >>> If you think it costs too much still, please let me know. >> >> Pretty much all of the code I have ever written would break. I use >> PHP-based templating everywhere and include my templates with >> include/require. How exactly can I fix

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow non-variable arguments to empty() and isset()

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 2:42 PM, Nikita Popov wrote: > > As per the comments I created an RFC, proposing to allow arbitrary > expressions to be passed to empty() and isset(): > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/empty_isset_exprs > > The patch is available as a PR: > > https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/

[PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow non-variable arguments to empty() and isset()

Hi internals! As per the comments I created an RFC, proposing to allow arbitrary expressions to be passed to empty() and isset(): https://wiki.php.net/rfc/empty_isset_exprs The patch is available as a PR: https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/54 Nikita PS: I added isset() too, to address the co

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Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 7:38 PM, Robert Williams wrote: > Also, remember that the closure is in fact another function, a function > that performs its own actions independent of the parent. Just as other > functions can pick whatever parameter names make the most sense to them > internally, I think

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Apr 12, 2012, at 12:21, Nikita Popov wrote: > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:06 PM, Laruence wrote: >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Dmitri Snytkine >> wrote: >>> I'm curious to know the benefits of this. >>> Care to explain why or when this would be useful? > > It would be nice to see a few

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On 4/12/12 10:09, "Anthony Ferrara" wrote: >I'm not against the idea, I just don't see a strong use-case for it. >It's not like your injecting the scoped vars into an existing >function, you're writing the function fresh. So why not just use the >existing var names? I can see this being occasi

[PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On 2012-04-12, Laruence wrote: > I have made a RFC to allow user use T_AS in the closure declaration, like: > > function () use($long as $l, &$long as $r) { > } > > here is the RFC: https://wiki.php.net/rfc/useas > > any ideas? thanks I really like this, as it brings a symmetry to how "use" is u

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:25 PM, Laruence wrote: > Now you can not use $this > >      class foo { >           public function bar() { >               return function() use ($this) {  // PHP Fatal error: > Cannot use $this as lexical variable >               } >           } >      } And it is good

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

The only real use that I can see would be that it allows: public function getCallback() { return function() use ($this as $that) { $that->doSomething(); } } However, I think that would be confusing, since $that would only have public access... I'm not against the idea, I just don

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On 4/12/12 11:25 AM, Laruence wrote: Now you can not use $this class foo { public function bar() { return function() use ($this) { // PHP Fatal error: Cannot use $this as lexical variable } } } so you have to write:

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 12:21 AM, Nikita Popov wrote: > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:06 PM, Laruence wrote: >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Dmitri Snytkine >> wrote: >>> I'm curious to know the benefits of this. >>> Care to explain why or when this would be useful? >> >> From what LawnGnome sa

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:06 PM, Laruence wrote: > On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Dmitri Snytkine > wrote: >> I'm curious to know the benefits of this. >> Care to explain why or when this would be useful? > > From what LawnGnome said: > >  " I think it's a nice bit of syntactic sugar, personal

RE: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

I'm curious to know the benefits of this. Care to explain why or when this would be useful? Dmitri Snytkine Web Developer Ultra Logistics, Inc. Phone: (888) 220-4640 x 2097 Fax: (888) 795-6642 E-Mail: dsnytk...@ultralogistics.com Web: www.ultralogistics.com "A Top 100 Logistics I.T. Provider in

Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 12:04 AM, Dmitri Snytkine wrote: > I'm curious to know the benefits of this. > Care to explain why or when this would be useful? >From what LawnGnome said: " I think it's a nice bit of syntactic sugar, personally. It's not something you'd ever _need_, but it's a neat way

[PHP-DEV] [RFC] Allow "use( $longname as $alias)" syntax for closures declaration

Hi: I have made a RFC to allow user use T_AS in the closure declaration, like: function () use($long as $l, &$long as $r) { } here is the RFC: https://wiki.php.net/rfc/useas any ideas? thanks -- Laruence  Xinchen Hui http://www.laruence.com/ -- PHP Internals - PHP Ru

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Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Optional PHP tags by php.ini and CLI options (Ver. 1.4)

2012/4/12 Yasuo Ohgaki : > Hi all, > > I think my RFC confused people on this list due to improper descriptions > and too much information. Sorry for the confusion. I revised the RFC so > that most important points can be understood at a glance. > > https://wiki.php.net/rfc/nophptags > > Please rea