icrofiche would be available on bitsavers,
> These are sheets of film with maybe 150 frames of very small images of
> computer pages.
>
>
> Tom Kern
>
> tlk_sysp...@yahoo.com
>
> On 2025-06-22 04:31 PM, William Donzelli wrote:
> > I would be interested in these. They w
I would be interested in these. They will be available to Al on bitsavers.
(I can not see a private return address, by the way).
--
Will
On Sun, Jun 22, 2025 at 4:17 PM Thomas Kern
<0041d919e708-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
>
> In cleaning up very old collection of antiques, I found
I think we could find interested people that could get the stuff to
good homes and Bitsavers. I would be interested in some of it - not
all, as it does need to travel.
I look forward to the pictures.
--
Will
On Tue, Jan 23, 2024 at 8:53 AM Robert Prins wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> My father worked fo
There are also some of us independents and other museums that take donations.
I personally am currently looking for equipment, docs, software, and
docs from the ES/9000 era and before.
Likewise, the Binghamton, NY group Techworks! is on the lookout for
any items related to Endicott.
--
Will
On
On all of my machines, and likely most of the machines IBM made, there
is an interlock that prevents changing the patchboard in any way.
There is a complex hinge arrangement that closes the door before any
connections are made, basically. Sure, a Sawzall would solve that, but
that is not provided i
> I doubt there is an "official"source for this term, but it was a commonly
> used slang term at the time.
>
> (This comment is from an old old timer who actually programmed and used a
> noodle picker a long time ago. One thing we learned early: if possible,
> keep datasets open and avoid the need
I think that is the console switch unit.
And yes, very likely a 1415.
--
Will
On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 10:08 PM Phil Smith III wrote:
>
> https://i.redd.it/kd2ebwoovbh51.jpg
>
>
>
> Best guess so far: 1415, console etc. for 1410. For extra credit, identify
> small box on desk, too (not the phon
> Yes its true, but before you let a disk spin backwards, you checked the
> fans in the logic gate, they were 3 ph too. Depending on how they spun
> (clockwise or counterclockwise), you had the phases corrected. I never
> spun up a drive that went backward using that technique.
> And if it was say
> DC rules
AC rules are harder, because of the extra Z.
--
Will
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All three phase IBM stuff from that era I have seen have phase
rotation sensors, and will simply not go through the proper power
sequence unless everything is fine.
--
Will
On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 11:35 AM Pommier, Rex wrote:
>
> Hi group,
>
> I have a light - probably trivia by now - question f
e the highest priority. Any guidance as
> to what is most likely to be of interest?,
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
>
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on beha
logic manuals so that I can annotate
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3/source/STOWBLDL.ASM with register equates.
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
>
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LIS
Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
>
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
> William Donzelli [wdonze...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2020 11:50 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSE
Hey, that's my video. Go watch it!
And remember, folks, I am always looking for this old stuff for the
collection - mostly anything pre-Z (I set up that limit so I do not
overcollect).
Anything from a box of IBM indicator lights (thanks, recent donor!) to
a 3090. I would make that happen.
--
Wil
For that matter, are there any references to how many terminals IBM
produced per model, from the 1015 to InfoWindows (or whatever was
last)? I have always wondered in IBM was the largest maker of
terminals ever.
--
Will
On Tue, May 12, 2020 at 10:45 AM Seymour J Metz wrote:
>
> I saw a lot more
> CDC until STAR-100
Well, actually CDC until the bitter end. Cyber 180s, introduced in the
early 1980s could do both.
The bitter end was last year, so you IBM guys can finally breathe a
sigh of relief with that bit of competition off the table.
--
Will
-
> Really? 40-year-old mainframes? That's close to impossible, and certainly
> ridiculous. I'm sure many of you remember better than me, but 1980 was the
> era of needing a megawatt or so to generate 20 MIPS or something like
> that. If you could find the parts and the expertise to keep it going.
Al "bitsavers" Kossow has a HUGE backlog of material to scan -
something like 25 pallets of stuff or something crazy like that - so
scanning and archiving, while constant, picks away at that pile
depending on which way the wind blows and who is begging for what.
Almost constant, I should say. Scan
Almost a lone wolf - there are a few other people that contribute
scans to bitsavers. The scans just have to be to Al's standards,
basically.
Still, Al is the 700 pound gorilla in the room. The other 100 pounds
is at Wild Hare Computers, but that gorilla focuses on everything and
anything Data Gen
> I’ve sort of become a computer storage historian for the Computer History
> Museum and have a particular interest in the first IBM caching storage
> controls, the 3880-11, 13, 21 and 23. They were followed by the 3990. IBM
> distributed these manuals on CD-ROM usually called something like X
> Does that mean that citations in wiki should use trailing-edge? If so, does
> wiki know?
Most bitsavers mirrors tend to be well synced, so it probably does not
really matter.
--
Will
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For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / arch
> Why trailing-edge rather than the bitsavers.org site?
Things may have changed over the years, but Al and Tim decided to
mainly point people towards Tim's servers, to keep Al's bandwidth
down.
--
Will
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For IBM-MAIN subscribe
> OK, you are referring to Seymours alleged drum tearing loose on a navy ship.
>
> Mea Culpa. I read this as you disputing that the Navy installed FirstRand 1
> on its ships.
Just a misunderstand, pretty much.
> There are a references to this model being a dancing behemoth, and that the
> count
hem in the telegram messaging systems.
> >
> >
> > RON HAWKINS
> > Director, Ipsicsopt Pty Ltd (ACN: 627 705 971)
> > m+61 400029610| t: +1 4085625415 | f: +1 4087912585
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf
&
> I'm thinking that just because one article says the story is urban legend,
> there are more references that talk to the FirstRand I actually being
> installed on a US Navy ship.
I have no doubts about a Fastrand being on installed on a ship. I have
my doubts about the spinning drum causing hav
> We had a professor who was on the inspection team out of the Navy Yard. Said
> the drum popped out and churned around like a 4000lb weed-eater for several
> minutes. I believe Adm. Hopper was on the review board and after a short
> synopsis. "Just stupid!"
If you could dig up the original ins
> Not myth.
Primary source info, please!
Otherwise, it is, as they even say in the video, a "legend".
--
Will
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> I recall hearing about a UNIVAC shipboard computer where the drum ripped
> loose from the deck when the ship was maneuvering quickly.
This is a myth. Warships of the era (1960s/70s) are loaded with really
big heavy spinning things (motor-generators and amplidynes), and they
do not rip off the d
One of the model 20s is more or less a parts car, probably used to
keep the production one running. They intend to use it for the same
purpose.
The 125 seems only to be the processor, as there were no S/370 era
peripherals with the lot, other than a 3504 with the top shaved off,
apparently used as
> Could the entire sunsetted website and shelf+book contents be donated to
> bitsavers.org or to cbttape.org for posterity? It seems very wrong to lose
> easy access to so much computing history simply because the site has "quality
> issues". Volunteers could and I suspect would gladly help re
> Heh, later on we had a Formation 4000 PCM (0.25MIPS!) with a whopping 4MB, as
> 64K RAM chips. At one point, a POR caused it to decide it had 16K chips
> instead of 64K, and it was quite unhappy that it couldn't find the other
> 48MB. Turned out to be a sloppy solder job that had shorted some
The upper picture is a model 75.
--
Will
On Thu, Oct 4, 2018 at 3:50 PM Seymour J Metz wrote:
>
> WTF? That doesn't look like and S/360 I've ever seen. 7030?
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
>
> From: IBM Mainframe Discu
> Are you sure you aren't talking about the Systems Measurement Instrument
> (SMI)? That was the only IBM hardware monitor available during the S360 era
> as far as I know. It had a number of probes that you attached to various
> points in the s/360. The SMI had a plug panel board that you wir
For the break:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RowwNXKEt4k
A good video to close with:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63ot5h08rKg
--
Will
On Sun, Apr 8, 2018 at 8:01 AM, Mike Beer wrote:
> Hi,
>
> TAPES:
> UNIVAC TAPE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KuoZ6cades
> Overland: https://www.youtu
Yes, there are indeed museums that would be interested in looking over
what you have, to see if you have something that would fit into the
collections. By all means, yes, let the Computer History Museum have a
chance at them. They are in my opinion the safest bet for the very
long term.
This bring
Just a "Navy story". There have been comparably heavy (and often
faster spinning) motor-generators on ships since the 1930s, and they
did not have problems. That, and a ship being tossed in a storm
subjects those heavy rotating machines to worse forces.
--
Will
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 12:12 PM, P
While not an actual rotating chunk of metal ("the drum"), there were
solid state units that certainly looked like one. The way to get high
density solid state memory back in the very early 1970s was to use MOS
shift registers (1024 bits on one chip!) that constantly circulated
the data. No random a
Thanks, I do not know why it did not return those results for me before?
--
Will
On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 10:52 AM, Norbert Friemel wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Dec 2017 10:13:29 -0500, William Donzelli wrote:
>
>>I suppose I should ask if anyone out there has this manual? It seems
>>
I suppose I should ask if anyone out there has this manual? It seems
to be gone for the archive.
--
Will
On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 8:58 AM, Parwez Hamid wrote:
> Manual is GA24-4187-04
>
> Regards
> Parwez
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN su
Great. thanks!
--
Will
https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon";
target="_blank">https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif";
alt="" width="46" h
Good information, thanks! What manual is this from? I will need to
start looking for it (I got very little documentation with the
system).
--
Will
https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon";
target="_
2-4
>
>
>
> Carmen Vitullo
>
> - Original Message -----
>
> From: "William Donzelli"
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Sent: Monday, December 18, 2017 1:27:37 PM
> Subject: Re: ES/9000 Console Cable
>
> I do not think they called them HMCs back
token ring network
>
>
> http://www-01.ibm.com/support/docview.wss?uid=isg2ba4122bfe6d689198525666e005d3c9f&aid=1
>
>
> this may help
>
>
>
> Carmen Vitullo
>
> - Original Message -
>
> From: "William Donzelli"
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.
Quick question:
On the small ES/9000s (9221-150), how exactly does the console cable
connect to the processor? Parallel port from the PC (apparently S/390
and 9370 are like this)?
--
Will
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> Famously, Thomas J. Watson, Jr. said around 1950 "Nobody's going to buy
> computers. The whole world will need about four of them."
This poor mangled quote...
Watson was specifically referring to one specific model of machine,
not computers in general.
--
Will
> Probably old news, but there's a graphic novel out called Spill Zone
> that's set in the ruins of a Chernobyl-like Poughkeepsie destroyed by,
> well who knows - I haven't read it yet.
Inspired by real life IBM Kingston.
--
Will
--
No, the console is an IBM PC750 (I think an early Pentium machine), so
just about any VGA or XGA tube will work.
I assume the original console was a PS/2 of some flavor.
--
Will
On Wed, Jun 14, 2017 at 11:01 PM, Edward Finnell
<000248cce9f3-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> What was th
; Will,
> I have a guy that can service your equipment should you need it. He is based
> out of Chattanooga so his preference would be to talk to you over the phone,
> determine the problem and ship you parts.
>
> Tony Thigpen
>
>
> William Donzelli wrote on 06/14/2017 09:49
So the ES/9000 is mostly in its new home. I took a roadtrip to inspect
and prep the machine for shipment, and ended up taking the processor
and DASD cabinets home. The console and tape are quite safe - now I
need to get that stuff backed up and verified.
Anyway, I did not get much in the way of do
> First, congrats, and welcome to the "basement mainframe club"...it's quiet
> exclusive. :)
I have been part of the club for years! The Cybers outnumber the IBMs
here, but we don't talk about them on this list.
> Second, a running ES/9000 is crazy-hard to come by; so that's a great score!
I wa
715FFA solid !important; padding-left:1ex !important; background-color:white
> !important; } Hey Will,
> I am curious...What is your OS running in your big iron?Dan
>
>
> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
>
>
> On Wednesday, May 31, 2017, 7:19 PM, William Donzelli
> wrote:
&
> From my memory, there were 2 or 3 major levels of 9221 microcode that was
> released and each major release had updates (MCLs). The problem is that even
> if you had a could find the base 9221 microcode that would work with a
> system, the microcode for a specific system includes files that a
So this idiot just purchased an 9221 system from Tennessee (apparently
it was still in service two years ago, and is in wonderful condition),
and I made damn sure that the console with the IMPL tape was included.
I even tracked down the machine's former admin just to be sure. I am
going to tell him
Just on Saturday, the 1401 at Binghamton's Center for Technology and
Innovation was powered up for the first time in about 25 years. The
fun lasted about 20 minutes before one of the power supplies shut the
machine down, but not before we verified successful reads and writes
to the core. We did not
I suppose I should chime in an modify my occasional plea for vintage
manuals, documentation, and software.
This stuff for the Japanese machines is very thin on the ground. The
computer museums in Japan (check out the IPSJ website, by the way,
when you have time) really do not have much at all, nor
> Perhaps against the advice of others, I'm considering getting an S/390 G6
> without the SE's. I know without them, it's a paperweight. However, my
> curiosity has lead me to wonder - can ANY S/390 G6 SE driver disk be used to
> restore a blank SE, or is it serial-linked? In the case of it b
(mostly dumb trivia follows)
> Anyone ever play with fanfold paper tape?
As far as I know, IBM products "never"* used fanfold paper tape, but
rather spools. The 1620 had a big paper tape reader, as did the 1130
and 1800 minicomputers. Interesting, when the System/7 came out, IBM
just rebadged ASR
> We know that as of a few years ago there were still functioning 3800s. People
> were buying up the remaining supply of toner on Ebay. However, since formal
> support ended years ago, and the last functioning machine in our lab was
> decommissioned, we have no information on where any working 3
Does anyone know of any 3800 laser printers still in service? Or not
in service but available?
--
Will
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> While many IBM-MAIN members including myself do believe in God, this
> discussion list is NOT about religion, but about mainframes.
God runs a Unisys MCP shop, anyway.
--
Will
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> I've seen a photo of the actual bug Grace had used to coin the phrase.
Yes, the moth was real, but the issue is that she did not coin the
phrase. It was well known in the engineering world.
--
Will
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No, she did not. The term "bug", relating to flaws and errors in a
circuit*, shows up a fair amount in 1930s ham radio literature, for
example.
* "bug" also applies to automatic Morse keys, of course.
--
Will
On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 2:52 PM, Lindy Mayfield wrote:
> Was watching NCIS Los Angeles
> Haven't there been stories quoted here about government agencies (Social
> Security, DMV, VA) using 20 and 30 year old equipment?
Machines that have run for 20 or 30 years are not as rare as one might
think. There are still a few CDC machines in real service today, for
example - and when did the
>>Is there any obscure lore about this machine
I was thinking about this specific machine. Each 729 has a no smoking
label in a different language, which is a bit unique. Perhaps someone
out there might drop a clue, like knowing a 1401 shop that had CE that
smoked five packs a day.
--
Will
-
OK, it is a long shot here, but hey, I get to help with restoring a
1401 system...
Is there any obscure lore about this machine with the no smoking tags
(zoom in on the picture of the 729s)? We can use any leads you guys
might dig up.
-
Will
We're looking to find someone who might recognize t
> For those interested in owning a real mainframe, we do have some MP3000s,
> some z890s, and some z9s that we would sell that are stored in Chattanooga.
Anything older?
> The z boxes would make great heaters in the winter. Just put one in the
> basement and power it up. :-)
Yes, that is the pla
> Those HUGE DASDs are 3380s, I believe, with the sideways belt
> drive.Yeah, they're a little louder than a laptop drive. But no
> worries; you don't really hear them over the background A/C noise.
I am still on the search for a 3380/3880 set.
> I don't know about 3380s, but earlier IBM DASD oft
A 4300 system was recently decommissioned out West, and the system was
broken apart. I think the processor and DASD went to a collector. The
card handling equipment will be coming east to me - real S/360 era
stuff that still works.
It seems the 4300 line were perhaps IBM's best machines - they nev
> (Fact checking is left to the interested reader.)
While 8086s are not by any stretch of the imagination scarce, the
specific 8086 based card that NASA needs (I think Multibus?) is fairly
scarce, but show up on Ebay from time to time.
--
Will
> Apparently a man bought a mainframe (Cray 1?) and the US Congress was not
> happy with it. It seemed they don't like that individuals may own a
> supercomputers because they feared that it could be misused [1] to threaten
> the government's military computers or so goes the story.
>
> He was e
> First of all, many congratulations on your $237 acquisition! You've got an
> interesting machine, a machine that figured prominently in mainframe
> history as the first genuinely "small" 64-bit mainframe --
Cough..cough..cough..Cyber 930..cough cough..
--
Will
-
Barf.
3290 or bust.
--
Will
On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 5:33 PM, Mike Schwab wrote:
> 3174? If it has a Token Ring connector you could connect a Apple ][
> with a token ring card as a master console.
>
> On Fri, Nov 6, 2015 at 2:23 PM, Connor Krukosky
> wrote:
>> On 11/6/2015 3:10 PM, Richard Pini
> As I understood it at the time, larger S/360 and S/370 also
> used motor-generator power supplies, though I don't know the
> output frequency. The higher frequency means less filtering.
Generally 415 Hz. Why this odd number is beyond me. The Hitachi clones
also used 415 Hz.
> But yes, you can
eer/comphist/ibmmodel.txt
>
> 1715 -IBM Digital Display Unit
>
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 5:46 PM, William Donzelli wrote:
>> Perhaps this might ring a bell in someones head.
>>
>> Does anyone know what an IBM 1751 Control and Switching Unit is, and
&g
Perhaps this might ring a bell in someones head.
Does anyone know what an IBM 1751 Control and Switching Unit is, and
what is was used for?
--
Will
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>> That sounds good to me. But, me being me, I would caution your friend
>> in one regard. That manual is most likely copyrighted. If it is, then
>> scanning it and uploading it _might_ result in prosecution. Especially
>> if the copyright holder objects. Given today's litigious society, and
>> the
> To commemorate the 50th anniversary of S/360 I wrote a blog that many of you
> may have seen already but just in case you missed it:
>
> http://butmostlyaboutcats.blogspot.com/2014/03/mainframe-memories.html
Very nice, thank you.
One thing I noted was the bit about the colors - how each upgrad
> Starring an 8-mb IBM 3033, 3330 disk, reel tape, punch cards, a liquid-ink
> plotter and a 1403 printer that plays Tiger Rag! (at 9:30)
Great video.
I looks like the processor is just about the only real IBM gear there.
The tape are STC, the 3350s are CDC, and the 3330s are from someone
that I
> Thought some of us might be interested.
>
> http://www.tnmoc.org/news/news-releases/flossie-first-mass-produced-business-computer-rescued
>
> Something to point at and paraphrase Crocodile Dundee: "That's not a
> computer. THIS is a computer!"
>
> 5.5 tons, 6 meters by 7 meters.
Take the article
> the SLT schematic for the clock module, part number 5803944, from a 360 model
> 20? I've checked the usual suspects (IBM archives in GHQ and POK, the IBM
> museum in Germany) -- any of our European friends have any suggestions of
> other places to try?
Annoyingly, my book jumps from 5803938 t
>>I have a Fiscal year 1978 ADP Price List here - what specific model
>>would you like me to look up?
>
> 3033 (3031 and 3032 if they have AP versions)
>
> 3158-3
>
> 3168-3
>
> I'd also like title, copyright data and URL if possible.
So I have some time to look into this now, but the listing is f
>>I have a Fiscal year 1978 ADP Price List here - what specific model
>>would you like me to look up?
>
> 3033 (3031 and 3032 if they have AP versions)
>
> 3158-3
>
> 3168-3
Sorry, I was pulled away out of town. I will try to get to this next week.
--
Will
---
> Does anybody have an IBM sales manual or other document that shows the
> price difference between AP and MP for S/370 and 303x systems? I need
> a citation for the wiki article on asymmetric multiprocessors. Thanks.
I have a Fiscal year 1978 ADP Price List here - what specific model
would you li
> Mainframes? The 8100 was a series of small machines that grew out of
> the 3790. They were no more mainframes than their competitor, the S/1.
> Perhaps you are thinking of DPPX/370, which ran on the 9370.
It is debatable (although maybe we shouldn't here!) - 8100 was a DPD
product, not GSD like
> 360s, 370s, etc ... have been microcode implemented on variety of other
> kinds of engines. circa 1980 there was an effort to replace the wide
> variety of internet microprocessors used for controllers, low&mid range
> 370s, the planned as/400 replacement for s/38, etc ... all with 801/risc
> Ili
> So if I start posting about art or metaphysics or other random topics, that
> makes it OK?
It seems that pretty much all of his posts are very IBM mainframe
related. And, a little history lesson never hurts anyone.
I have nothing more to add.
--
Will
--
> Lynn: This has nothing to do with EC12, or top-mounted cables. Are you
> generating these posts programmatically? Please stop if so. You have some
> interesting things to contirbute, but random word-matching doesn't qualify.
I, for one, welcome his posts, even if they can be a bit tangential.
-
> I may still have a copy of the "Wooden Paddle". I also have various
> old 1401< IBM 705 Autocoder and Honywell 800 manuals among others.
> When I pass on can I just tell my heirs and assigns to just pack them
> all up and send them to the Computer History Museum?
I think CHM has some sort of of
> Is CHM willing to scan donations for bittsavers? I've got hundreds of
> manuals that I'm willing to donate if someone will, pick them up, scan
> them and do the OCR.
CHM and bitsavers are sort of joined at the hip. Al Kossow's hip, specifically.
Yes, we would love to have the scans - it is just
> Pehaps he could send it to the Computer History Museum, on the
> condition that it not be used until the copyrights expire?
As one of Al Kossow's little minions, I say yes, please.
CHM works with IBM and the other computer companies, and they do get
commercial software out into the public, usua
> Totally off the wall request, but I've been contacted by a museum to try to
> locate a 4361 or 4381 CPU and console terminal. Slight preference for the
> 4361 because of the integrated 3270 and ICA adapters, but either will do.
This will be tough. It seems the big purge of 43xx hardware from t
> I find myself in possession of some old IBM tapes.
> Of no use to me, but maybe someone has "reel" tape drives
> (ie, not "cart"). All have labels of 9T, 1600bpi density.
>
> 1) Scientific Subroutine Package, V3M0, dated 9-19-74.
>
> 2) OS360, Rel 21.8, dated 10-08-74.
>
> 3) OS360, Rel 21.8,
Sad news. Over the past couple of years, he sent me a few of his older
manuals and such.
> They have OS/360 manuals that they were going to throw out. I am looking for
> someone in the Chicago area could possibly stop by his house in Woodridge and
> take possession, at least temporarily, of them
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