Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-27 Thread Sahil
Hi, On Friday, March 15, 2024 5:04:13 PM IST carlo von lynX wrote: > [...] > A lot about GNUnet and related projects hasn't changed dramatically > in the past fifteen years. We had our vision laid out even before > Snowden and suddenly became relevant, so there are many worthwhile > videos from ar

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-17 Thread carlo von lynX
> On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: > > No, there are machines that *need* to be online, but there are > > always human beings that *like* to have machines always online > > even if they don't need it for GNUnet. On Sat, Mar 16, 2024 at 07:54:56PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: > Again thats wher

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread Martin Schanzenbach
On Sat, 2024-03-16 at 21:35 +0200, MSavoritias wrote: >   > >   >   > On 3/16/24 20:57, t3sserakt wrote: >   >   > >    > > > >   > >   > > On 16.03.24 18:54, MSavoritias wrote: > >   > >   > > > On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: > > >   > > >   > > > > On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread MSavoritias
On 3/16/24 20:57, t3sserakt wrote: On 16.03.24 18:54, MSavoritias wrote: On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: Federation has failed us big time and it is all the reason why GNUnet exists. By federation i mean that the room i

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread t3sserakt
On 16.03.24 18:54, MSavoritias wrote: On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: Federation has failed us big time and it is all the reason why GNUnet exists. By federation i mean that the room is hosted by all participants. We can

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread Martin Schanzenbach
On Sat, 2024-03-16 at 19:54 +0200, MSavoritias wrote: > On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: > > > On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: > > > By servers I mean a separate machine that is used to run services > > > non > > > graphically that usually needs to be always onl

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread MSavoritias
On 3/16/24 17:08, carlo von lynX wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: By servers I mean a separate machine that is used to run services non graphically that usually needs to be always online. No, there are machines that *need* to be online, but there are always h

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-16 Thread carlo von lynX
On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 04:19:21PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: > By servers I mean a separate machine that is used to run services non > graphically that usually needs to be always online. No, there are machines that *need* to be online, but there are always human beings that *like* to have machines

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-15 Thread MSavoritias
On 3/15/24 15:00, carlo von lynX wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 02:32:51PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: - XMPP uses the XEP 0313 which is basically a protocol to retrieve messages. Where these messages stored is left as an exercise to the reader although most people use servers including secushare

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-15 Thread carlo von lynX
On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 02:32:51PM +0200, MSavoritias wrote: > - XMPP uses the XEP 0313 which is basically a protocol to retrieve messages. > Where these messages stored is left as an exercise to the reader although > most people use servers including secushare it seems which made my interest > in

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-15 Thread MSavoritias
On 3/15/24 13:34, carlo von lynX wrote: [...] Since most of XMPP is designed as a client-server-protocol, you are actually in a territory doing something new. Sorry, I haven't really understood this. By "something new" are you referring to the implementation of this XEP using the GNUnet Name Sy

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-15 Thread carlo von lynX
On Thu, Mar 14, 2024 at 01:26:18PM +0530, Sahil wrote: > Sorry for the delayed response. I was trying to wrap my head around > this. That's the most noble thing to say and all the reason why asynchronous messaging was invented in the first place. :) > Thank you for your reply. I am able to make

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-14 Thread MSavoritias
On 3/14/24 09:56, Sahil wrote: Hi, Sorry for the delayed response. I was trying to wrap my head around this. I mean, do XMPP message and IQ stanzas really provide a lot more than what bare XML would do? Also, isn't the industry standard in this field called JSON, which also has its defects, a

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-14 Thread Sahil
Hi, Sorry for the delayed response. I was trying to wrap my head around this. On Tue, Mar 12, 2024 at 06:26:09AM +, Martin Schanzenbach wrote: > Yes. The transports are not meant to provide p2p functionality. That is > why it does not matter if XMPP is client-server based or not. > HTTP is al

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-13 Thread Undescribed Horrific Abuse, One Victim & Survivor of Many
Hi, Apologies for my shocking name, it is for a different thing than this. I wanted to add some backstory that, in my perception, the people here who designed GNU Social had previously spent many years defending key user rights that were blatantly excluded from mainstream federated protocols, and

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-13 Thread Christian Grothoff
Secure multiparty computation scalar product. See https://grothoff.org/christian/bfh2017.pdf (implemented as the 'scalarproduct' service) On 3/13/24 15:47, Runa Loki Schmidt wrote: Talking about twitter like uses, I am really curious how a content curating algorithm would be implemented on a

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-13 Thread Runa Loki Schmidt
Talking about twitter like uses, I am really curious how a content curating algorithm would be implemented on a decentralised multicast network. These kind of algorithms have been a major point of attraction to that kind of platform (twitter, instagram, tiktok), as people want content that is br

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-12 Thread carlo von lynX
Hi Sahil, On Tue, Mar 12, 2024 at 02:37:36AM +0530, Sahil wrote: > This looks very interesting. "Multicast distribution trees" is a new topic for > me. I'll read up on this too. It's the way how cloud technologies achieve scalability, and it is the biggest failure of the free world that it let fr

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-12 Thread em...@msavoritias.me
On 3/12/24 10:36, carlo von lynX wrote: Moin Martin, On Tue, Mar 12, 2024 at 06:26:09AM +, Martin Schanzenbach wrote: - Hiding in "common" Internet traffic: e.g. if two peers communicate via HTTPS (and assuming we can obfuscate the traffic patterns of the applications in GNUnet), they l

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-12 Thread carlo von lynX
Moin Martin, On Tue, Mar 12, 2024 at 06:26:09AM +, Martin Schanzenbach wrote: > - Hiding in "common" Internet traffic: e.g. if two peers communicate > via HTTPS (and assuming we can obfuscate the traffic patterns of the > applications in GNUnet), they look like browser/web server to an > atta

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-11 Thread Martin Schanzenbach
On Tue, 2024-03-12 at 02:37 +0530, Sahil wrote: > Hi, > > Thank you for all your emails. I thought I would do some homework > before replying but I don't have much to contribute to this thread. > This > discussion has been quite overwhelming, and I have got a lot to > learn. > > On Friday, March

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-11 Thread Sahil
Hi, Thank you for all your emails. I thought I would do some homework before replying but I don't have much to contribute to this thread. This discussion has been quite overwhelming, and I have got a lot to learn. On Friday, March 8, 2024 12:39:31 AM IST carlo von lynX wrote: > [...] > In GNUnet

Re: unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-11 Thread Martin Schanzenbach
Note that a large variety of standard transport protocols that gnunet runs over is what we need, not (only) the most efficient and newest protocol that can transport our payload. Eventually, peers may want to "hide" inside HTTPS, DNS, Bluetooth, WiFi etc, ideally with traffic that looks like those

unsuitable protocols and standards that block innovation

2024-03-11 Thread carlo von lynX
On Sat, Mar 09, 2024 at 10:30:07AM +0200, em...@msavoritias.me wrote: > XMPP can work fine through p2p. Its just not being done a lot because of > other reasons i can expand if needed. Yes, you can rewrite any protocol radically enough to cook rice or iron your shirts but then you are really just