Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

If done carefully, this could be a good conversation to have. The trick will be to clear the underbrush of obvious stuff and not go endlessly in circles on that, in the hope of getting to something non-obvious. There is various obvious stuff about solitons (including some storms), roles of boun

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Yes, but didn't developments in differentiable manifolds and related mathematics make modeling those empirical discoveries possible? --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Wed, Sep 1, 2021, 9:31 PM David Eric Smith wrote: > Yes, probably amon

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

In the same vein, as Frank, I suppose: Isn’t logic a form of syntax? N Nick Thompson thompnicks...@gmail.com https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ From: Friam On Behalf Of Frank Wimberly Sent: Wednesda

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Dave writes: < Honors degrees, curricula, and courses are racist reasons that students from northern New Mexico cannot succeed at other universities and, as such, cannot be tolerated at Highlands. > Universities find and mature talent. They don’t make it. Students attach their talent to the

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Yes! Really pleasing project idea. My suspicion is the same as yours. Improved coverage; some small increase in variability. So the question becomes, what is the Pareto surface? There is a funny thing barely like this in language acquisition. Every language has a limited inventory of phon

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

> On Sep 1, 2021, at 11:41 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > I was made to take piano lessons for five years. I did minimal practice, but > still hated it and the idea of it. I can’t do it all now, and don’t wish I > could. Don’t tell me what is important. I will prioritize what I want. I am

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

>but largely having the error that analytical philosophers seem to me to make, of believing one can argue from syntax to truth. Sometimes pure math reveals physics truth even when it wasn't the mathematician's purpose. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 S

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

There’s a statistic I would like to see, but would be costly to collect and encounter ethics troubles (withholding of known help), so will probably not be available. For 2-shot vaccines, it is considered important that the second shot be the same formula as the first. Reason being that we buil

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Honors at Highlands: sounds like Manny Aragon. Is he out of jail yet? --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Wed, Sep 1, 2021, 6:09 PM Prof David West wrote: > Marcus, you seem to miss my point; perhaps just baiting me. > > Honors at Highla

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

A deep dive into the theory of reincarnation, Vedic version, reveals that the individual IS " simply a node in a system of interacting forces." The material aspect of that node, the incarnation, acts as a kind of inertial persistence - the forces repeat, moment to moment' the highly similar body

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Marcus, you seem to miss my point; perhaps just baiting me. Honors at Highlands: this was part of a policy, stated publicly at a Board of Regents meeting, "Highlands exists to provide degrees to Hispanic students that could never obtain one at any other university. Honors degrees, curricula, and

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Yeah, cowboys mostly do the same things in the same way as always. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Wed, Sep 1, 2021, 4:34 PM Marcus Daniels wrote: > Welfare ranchers, indeed. The rest of us have to constantly modernize > our skills..

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Welfare ranchers, indeed. The rest of us have to constantly modernize our skills.. But freeloading off the public land and environment that’s “multigenerational” and must be preserved? Why? Marcus From: Friam On Behalf Of Frank Wimberly Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 3:17 PM To: The Fr

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

I owned 40 acres in Torrance County, NM which was adjacent to a national forest. Ranchers were charged $1.21 per acre per year to use the NF land for grazing. I could have made $48 per year by charging a little less than the feds. My property taxes were $40 per year. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 C

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

EricS asked: What am I but an individual? Could you simply be a unique node in a system of interacting forces? I have long wanted to write an essay as a psychologist to a meteorology journal entitled “Should we name storms? The first part of the essay argues that we shouldn’t na

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Perhaps it could be done with AlphaFold? I wouldn't be surprised if mixing vaccines would be more effective. A little more coverage, but mostly the same information. -Original Message- From: Friam On Behalf Of David Eric Smith Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 2:37 PM To: The Friday M

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Dave, Hmmm! I cop to having thought you a pain in the ass, from time to time, but never you "an immoral idiot " It's hard for me to take any moral stance with a straight face. But I think you may confuse two issues: One is the stupidity of all laws. All laws speak to matters that they

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

That idea (not Dave, but the idea that someone who might be in fact a bot) reminds me of one or more trolls that used to, and maybe still do, hang out on comp.lang.lisp under a variety of pseudonyms. On Wed, Sep 1, 2021 at 10:26 AM Marcus Daniels wrote: > I’m already convinced Dave is bot. I kn

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Dave wrote: < More significant: I have had my curricular materials censured and have had my job threatened on a number of occasions because it was deemed inconsistent with liberal values. Ironically, many of these events occurred when I was teaching at a Catholic university where I could, with

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Well, induction relies on big data. So, you might be right that mimicking prose from a particular target is easier than mimicking poetry from a particular target. But that relies on low distribution drift. For example, if a poet always uses the same rules for all her poetry, then her product is

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

au contraire, prose is simpler than poetry. Mostly because there are more rules and constraints. Also, statistical analysis of prose to correctly identify author has been a thing for a long time. Richard has a really cool example of a prose story that emulates Hunter Thompson that, I would bet,

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Nice try glen, but I said I was afraid of the liberals, progressives, and democrats, not the radical fringe left, precisely because the former do have control of the government and do use that power to enforce their, mostly, non-"woke" ideology. The fact that Harris was a prosecutor reinforces

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Yeah, both social media posts *and* poetry are a low bar. Machine generated prose is more difficult, I expect. There are good examples from GPT3. But I don't know of any other algorithm that does a decent job. So I doubt the same techniques Gabriel uses to generate poetry and social media posts

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Richard Gabriel has created software that can generate poetry in the style of any poet. It also generates poetry that passes the Turing test in that experts are unable to distinguish between machine generated poetry and human generated poetry. He demoed this at an annual meeting of poets at Warr

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

If we collected years of FRIAM archives and train it with a recycle GAN, I think it would probably be possible to generate plausible sentences of each other. To the extent we pay attention to what we say at all; so it might not be the hard to fake really. I think we could get the basic intent

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Would I pass the turing test if I could, by my emails, convince you that I was Dave? Or is that just the dave Test. Would I pass the Turing test if I could convince you that I was Turing? Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men! n Nick Thompson

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Brace yourselves, everybody: EricC is about to remind you of E.B.Holt's Freudian Wish, the basic lesson of which is that a child cannot learn to avoid a flame he has never felt the heat of. An argument for Vygotsky’s scaffolding, long before Vygotsky ever thought of it. ERIC? Nick Nick Th

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

I’m already convinced Dave is bot. I know I am. https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2021/08/dead-internet-theory-wrong-but-feels-true/619937/ From: Friam On Behalf Of Marcus Daniels Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 8:23 AM To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group Sub

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Culture is online now, didn’t you hear? From: Friam On Behalf Of Prof David West Sent: Wednesday, September 1, 2021 8:12 AM To: friam@redfish.com Subject: Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning Glen quoted BC Smith: "What does all this mean in the case of AIs and computer systems generally? Perhaps at

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

Glen quoted BC Smith: *"What does all this mean in the case of AIs and computer systems generally? Perhaps at least this: that it is hard to see how synthetic systems could be trained in the ways of judgment except by gradually, incrementally, and systematically enmeshed in normative practices

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

Congrats to the cheapskates, you’ve successfully bankrupted social security for my generation. Let me think of a way to return the favor. On Sep 1, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Steve Smith wrote:  "half the politicians are trying to take my money and give it away... ... the other half are trying to t

Re: [FRIAM] Liberal dilemmas

"half the politicians are trying to take my money and give it away... ... the other half are trying to take it and keep it for themselves."         -anonymous On 8/31/21 4:53 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > Dave writes: > >   > > “And I am terrified of liberals (progressives, democrats) because, a

Re: [FRIAM] aversive learning

I was made to take piano lessons for five years. I did minimal practice, but still hated it and the idea of it. I can’t do it all now, and don’t wish I could. Don’t tell me what is important. I will prioritize what I want. That said, a vaccine is passive and takes no attention. > On Sep 1,

[FRIAM] aversive learning

UK judge orders rightwing extremist to read classic literature or face prison https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/sep/01/judge-orders-rightwing-extremist-to-read-classic-literature-or-face-prison I know several liberals who agree with the righties that vaccine and mask mandates are bad, th