On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 10:25:32PM +0100, Simon Hobson wrote:
> KatolaZ wrote:
>
> > Replace 'links2' with 'openssh-server' and 'libfbdirect' with
> > 'libsystemd0', and you should see what I mean. Most of the De??an
> > installations actually have tons of libraries that are never used, or
> > ar
Simon Hobson wrote on 25.07.2018 23:25:
> KatolaZ wrote:
>
>> Replace 'links2' with 'openssh-server' and 'libfbdirect' with
>> 'libsystemd0', and you should see what I mean. Most of the De??an
>> installations actually have tons of libraries that are never used, or
>> are just used to probe for a
On 26-07-18 10:00, KatolaZ wrote:
>
> The main problem is that those packages need to be maintained, and not
> just stripped of the libsystemd0 dependency once, and then forgotten,
> which is what happened with most of the Jessie packages that were
> forked for that reason.
>
> The medium-term pla
Dear D1rs,
just to point out the nice article written by Michael Plura and
recently published in the German computer magazine "iX":
https://www.heise.de/select/ix/2018/8/1533453649894916
HND
KatolaZ
--
[ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - Devuan -- Freaknet Medialab ]
[ "+. katolaz [a
On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 12:01:54PM +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> On 26-07-18 10:00, KatolaZ wrote:
> >
> > The main problem is that those packages need to be maintained, and not
> > just stripped of the libsystemd0 dependency once, and then forgotten,
> > which is what happened wi
On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 06:50:43PM +0200, Irrwahn wrote:
> Hendrik Boom wrote on 25.07.2018 17:59:
> [cut]
> > Package dependencies are of the form
> > Install X if Y is installed
> > Too bad it doesn't handle
> > Install X it Y and Z are installed.
> > I suspect, though, we don't wand to
On 26-07-18 12:15, KatolaZ wrote:
>
> The libsystemd API does not provide any way to check *which* init
> system is running (ehm...for "obvious" reasons, right?). But we could
> put in place a mechanism that allows to shell out the calls to
> libsystemd functions to a set of scripts with pre-define
I found this article online.
https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/debian-without-systemd-devuan/
It doesn't really get into the problems with systemd, unfortunately.
-- hendrik
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Hendrik Boom wrote on 26.07.2018 12:35:
> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 06:50:43PM +0200, Irrwahn wrote:
>> Hendrik Boom wrote on 25.07.2018 17:59:
>> [cut]
>>> Package dependencies are of the form
>>> Install X if Y is installed
>>> Too bad it doesn't handle
>>> Install X it Y and Z are install
KatolaZ wrote on 26.07.2018 12:03:
> Dear D1rs,
>
> just to point out the nice article written by Michael Plura and
> recently published in the German computer magazine "iX":
>
> https://www.heise.de/select/ix/2018/8/1533453649894916
That was a pleasant read, thanks for the link! I hope we'll
On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 12:45:53PM +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> On 26-07-18 12:15, KatolaZ wrote:
> >
> > The libsystemd API does not provide any way to check *which* init
> > system is running (ehm...for "obvious" reasons, right?). But we could
> > put in place a mechanism that
Hi,
Joel Roth writes:
> Katolaz wrote on March 2, 2018:
>
>> leloft wrote:
>
>>
>> I issued $locate systemd
>> and got 200 lines of output, including
>> /etc/systemd/system/* (23 files)
>> /lib/systemd/system/* (60 files)
>> /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libsystemd.so.0 (and 0.17.0)
>> /usr/lib/systemd (
Hi,
KatolaZ writes:
> The medium-term plan is to replace libsystemd0 with a libnosystemd
> which Provides: libsystemd0 and noops everything, with the possibility
> of shelling-out some actions, if the admin wants so. We will get
> there.
+1, although I'd prefer a more original and playful name ;
Hi,
KatolaZ writes:
> On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 12:45:53PM +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl
> wrote:
>> On 26-07-18 12:15, KatolaZ wrote:
>> >
>> > The libsystemd API does not provide any way to check *which* init
>> > system is running (ehm...for "obvious" reasons, right?). But we could
>>
Hi,
Minor correction in-lined below.
Olaf Meeuwissen writes:
> Hi,
>
> KatolaZ writes:
>
>> The medium-term plan is to replace libsystemd0 with a libnosystemd
>> which Provides: libsystemd0 and noops everything, with the possibility
>> of shelling-out some actions, if the admin wants so. We will
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Hi,
Am Mo den 23. Jul 2018 um 14:24 schrieb Rolf Schmidt:
> I would ask, if it is true, that the openssh-server still needs
> libsystemd0 in ascii?
>
> Can I expect e fix?
If you trust me ( :-D ) you can use my package[0].
It is the debian packag
On 07/26/2018 04:01 PM, Klaus Ethgen wrote:> Hi,
>
> Am Mo den 23. Jul 2018 um 14:24 schrieb Rolf Schmidt:
>> I would ask, if it is true, that the openssh-server still needs
>> libsystemd0 in ascii?
>
>> Can I expect e fix?
>
> If you trust me ( :-D ) you can use my package[0].[snip]
Looking at th
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Am Do den 26. Jul 2018 um 14:23 schrieb Lars Noodén:
> Looking at the DSC files, it seems that the culprit is either gnome or
> ssh-askpass-gnome or both.
>
> Is there an alternative ssh-askpass-* graphical utility likely to be
> more portable which
On 26-07-18 14:05, KatolaZ wrote:
>> Of course does the libsystemd API not provide it, but we can. First call
>> to libsystemd API == systemd installed? If no, call to libnosystemd API
>> which init system == installed? Or something like that. But put in place
>> a mechanism that allows to shell ou
On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 04:13:41PM +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
[cut]
> > But that would entail forking and patching all the packages which use
> > libsystemd to force them to check if systemd is available... which is
> > exactly what we are trying to avoid by nooping libsystemd0
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 12:15:13 +0200
KatolaZ wrote:
> This would in principle allow people to "catch" systemd-related events
> and "translate" them to events for any other init system, using a
> simple mechanism.
Sounds like a great idea. The daemon phones home to what it thinks is
systemd to da
On 26-07-18 16:22, KatolaZ wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 04:13:41PM +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl
> wrote:
>
> [cut]
>
> I guess our main problem is to maintain packages that depend on
> systemd, and provide alternatives for that dependency. Not to ease the
> life of developers that de
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 12:45:53 +0200
info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> On 26-07-18 12:15, KatolaZ wrote:
> >
> > The libsystemd API does not provide any way to check *which* init
> > system is running (ehm...for "obvious" reasons, right?). But we
> > could put in place a mechanism that allow
On 26-07-18 16:34, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 12:45:53 +0200
> info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
>>
>> Of course does the libsystemd API not provide it, but we can. First
>> call to libsystemd API == systemd installed? If no, call to
>> libnosystemd API which init system == insta
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 07:13:52 -0400
Hendrik Boom wrote:
> I found this article online.
>
> https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/debian-without-systemd-devuan/
I could have swapped the phrase "s6 plus s6-rc" for "systemd" and that
entire video would have been true except the part that says if you're
usi
It's called 'herd behavior'. Someone told them that systemd constituted
'the way to go'. Nevermind if that way results irrational.
Regards
On Thu, 2018-07-26 at 10:49 -0400, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 07:13:52 -0400
> Hendrik Boom wrote:
>
> > I found this article online.
> >
> >
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:45:29 +0200
info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> systemd is in principle
> nothing new in functionality but provides an uniform API for some
> information you otherwise have to program yourself. We can serve them
> the same information without serving systemd this way.
On Thursday 26 July 2018 at 17:16:56, Эльбрус Кондратьев wrote:
> It's called 'herd behavior'. Someone told them that systemd constituted
> 'the way to go'. Nevermind if that way results irrational.
Oh well, at least it wasn't Hurd behaviour, otherwise we wouldn't have an
Operating System at all
Am Donnerstag, 26. Juli 2018 schrieb Steve Litt:
> [...]
> Can I ask all of you something? How do people, who call themselves
> developers, joyfully embrace a false choice like systemd vs sysvinit?
> Do these same "developers" neglect to put in error handling for a bad
> value, because the program
I would like to recall that RedHat is a company of the American military
complex. With close relations with civil intelligence and the military of the
United States
I acknowledge that I used this argument with the DGN trap prior to the fork.
My opinion has not changed systemd is a troll horse n
El miércoles, 25 de julio de 2018 21:21:39 (CEST) Rick Moen escribió:
> Quoting Basati (bas...@basatu.org):
> > But what do you think about this?
>
> Personally, I think: Nola esaten da 'someone is a bit provincial'
> euskaraz? ;->
>
> Ongi etorri. Pozten naiz zu ezagutzeaz. (Ez dakit euskara
On 26-07-18 18:00, Basati wrote:
> I would like to recall that RedHat is a company of the American military
> complex. With close relations with civil intelligence and the military of the
> United States
>
> I acknowledge that I used this argument with the DGN trap prior to the fork.
>
> My opini
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 13:17:21 +0200
Irrwahn wrote:
> Hendrik Boom wrote on 26.07.2018 12:35:
> > On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 06:50:43PM +0200, Irrwahn wrote:
> >> Hendrik Boom wrote on 25.07.2018 17:59:
> >> [cut]
> >>> Package dependencies are of the form
> >>> Install X if Y is installed
>
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:13:41 +0200
info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> No it would not, it will offer developers who want to use some systemd
> API call in their development the opportunity to do so for nosystemd
> systems too.
Eu!
What makes you different from the devs at Gnom
On 26-07-18 18:21, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:13:41 +0200
> info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
>
>> No it would not, it will offer developers who want to use some systemd
>> API call in their development the opportunity to do so for nosystemd
>> systems too.
> Eu!
>
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 18:00:45 +0200
Basati wrote:
> I would like to recall that RedHat is a company of the American
> military complex. With close relations with civil intelligence and
> the military of the United States
Damn Americans! Every one of them voted for Trump, owns ten
semiautomatic ri
On Thu, 2018-07-26 at 18:10 +0200, info at smallinnovations dot nl
wrote:
> On 26-07-18 18:00, Basati wrote:
> > I would like to recall that RedHat is a company of the American military
> > complex. With close relations with civil intelligence and the military of
> > the
> > United States
> >
>
Quoting Basati (bas...@basatu.org):
> I think there should be a little more respect for Europe's greatest
> cultural treasure.
I hope you understand that I was speaking in _exactly_ that spirit. (In
case it wasn't clear, the person of whom I was saying 'Someone is a bit
provincial' was very much
Steve Litt wrote on 26.07.2018 18:17:
> On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 13:17:21 +0200
> Irrwahn wrote:
>> What's more, I'd
>> go even further and say I wouldn't mind at all if every daemon
>> package came with support for all init systems in current use
>> (rc-style sysv|openrc, runit, ... , systemd), as tha
On 07/25/2018 12:27 PM, aitor_czr wrote:
By the way, I have also noticed here that inserting a CD/DVD in this
Devuan installation does not mount the medium automatically, neither it
opens a file manager. How to make it the same way as it does in
Ubuntu/Debian? Tnx.
It seems to me that this is
Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com):
> Anyone thinking of dissing a nation on this *technical* list should
> look long and hard at the deficiencies of his/her own country. Let he
> who is without sin cast the first stone.
Careful. Those Icelanders have plenty of hard rocks, and some o
Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com):
> Can I ask all of you something? How do people, who call themselves
> developers, joyfully embrace a false choice like systemd vs sysvinit?
The same way that the more-vocal djbware fans, and Prof. Bernstein
himself, compared qmail _only_ with sendm
Quoting KatolaZ (kato...@freaknet.org):
> Dear D1rs,
>
> just to point out the nice article written by Michael Plura and
> recently published in the German computer magazine "iX":
>
> https://www.heise.de/select/ix/2018/8/1533453649894916
That is a truly outstanding article. Thank you for th
Quoting Luciano Mannucci (luci...@vespaperitivo.it):
> Wasn't there something called uselessd that had this very goal some
> time ago? It was promising but died, I don't know why ...
The anonymous author felt his initial versions (through 2014's
uselessd-8) had successfully made his point -- that
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On 2018-07-26 14:32, info at smallinnovations dot nl wrote:
> It would help maintaining packages that depend on systemd too. You
> only would have to add some code to use the libnosystemd instead
> of libsystemd0.
If a libnosystemd package provides
On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:07:42AM -0700, Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com):
>
> > Anyone thinking of dissing a nation on this *technical* list should
> > look long and hard at the deficiencies of his/her own country. Let he
> > who is without sin cast the first sto
dear fellow dng'ers
let me bring your attention to this recent and sad message by Patrick
Volkerding, founder and maker of Slackware, a distribution we all owe
much in many different ways: knowledge, spirit, honesty and minimalism
https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/donating-to-
I offered to introduce him to some lawyers. I've certainly made good use of
them over the past year. Were it not for good lawyers willing to work cheap
or free, I'd be in some hot water right now.
Thanks
Bruce
On Thu, Jul 26, 2018 at 1:46 PM, Jaromil wrote:
>
> dear fellow dng'ers
>
>
Rick Moen [2018-07-26 19:38]:
> Quoting Basati (bas...@basatu.org):
>
>> I think there should be a little more respect for Europe's greatest
>> cultural treasure.
>
> I hope you understand that I was speaking in _exactly_ that spirit. (In
> case it wasn't clear, the person of whom I was saying
Sorry, this may break the thread but I already deleted the original message.
To make things short: this a minimal "libnosystemd" for sshd on ascii. It
basicly does nothing at all. To be more specific, it does exactly the same that
libsystemd0 does, which is nothing.
Unpack where you like, comp
Steve Litt [2018-07-26 18:44]:
> On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 18:00:45 +0200
> Basati wrote:
>
>> I would like to recall that RedHat is a company of the American
>> military complex. With close relations with civil intelligence and
>> the military of the United States
>
> Damn Americans! Every one of th
Am Freitag, 27. Juli 2018 schrieb Dr. Nikolaus Klepp:
> Sorry, this may break the thread but I already deleted the original message.
>
> To make things short: this a minimal "libnosystemd" for sshd on ascii. It
> basicly does nothing at all. To be more specific, it does exactly the same
> that l
Bruce,
It sounds like you have personal contact with him. Do you have for sure
knowledge as to whether the https://www.paypal.me/volkerdi is Patrick's
and funds I put in it would actually go to Patrick?
Thanks,
SteveT
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 14:11:32 -0700
Bruce Perens wrote:
> I offered to intr
On 2018-07-26 17:04, Harald Arnesen wrote:
Rick Moen [2018-07-26 19:38]:
Quoting Basati (bas...@basatu.org):
I think there should be a little more respect for Europe's greatest
cultural treasure.
I hope you understand that I was speaking in _exactly_ that spirit.
(In
case it wasn't clear,
Not a Bruce, but... Source reference for that address is on page 11 on the
LinuxQuestions.org thread quoted by Jaromil below. Here's a direct link.
Decide for yourself, or wait for http://www.slackware.com/ to post.
https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/donating-to-slackware-417563
* On 2018 26 Jul 18:14 -0500, Steve Litt wrote:
> Bruce,
>
> It sounds like you have personal contact with him. Do you have for sure
> knowledge as to whether the https://www.paypal.me/volkerdi is Patrick's
> and funds I put in it would actually go to Patrick?
I'm reasonably certain that it is Pa
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 21:49:45 +0900
Olaf Meeuwissen wrote:
> KatolaZ writes:
>
> > The medium-term plan is to replace libsystemd0 with a libnosystemd
> > ...
>
> +1, although I'd prefer a more original and playful name ;-)
libsystemc =p
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On Wed, 25 Jul 2018 21:15:39 +0200
Basati wrote:
> I've already named it: azeri (in Basque it means fox, children will
> need the skills of a fox for this)
Children will GET the skills of a fox with this. :)
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htt
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 22:46:17 +0200
Jaromil wrote:
> https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/donating-to-slackware-4175634729/#post5882751
Thanks for sharing. Six more pages were added while I was reading the
thread.. people really care.
My roots are from Slackware, and I've alway
"Propoganda"? Why not use the more appropriate word, "marketing"? This
kind of mail threads should be marked as SPAM or TRASH. Devuan needs
to prove itself to be a viable alternative that works, and that lets
computer admins/users configure their systems as they need, without
the requirement of unn
Quoting goli...@dyne.org (goli...@dyne.org):
> Communication often gets lost in 'translation' especially across
> cultures but sometimes even within the same culture. Rick's posts
> often contain subtle language that could challenge even native
> speakers.
I thank you very much -- and have to tr
Hi all,
I have a headless Odroid C2 running "Devuan GNU/Linux 2.0 (ascii)
(3.8.13.30)", all packages are up to date.
Often, when I try to connect through ssh I get the following error:
ssh_exchange_identification: read: Connection reset by peer
The only way to get access to it is removing powe
> $telnet odroid.lan
> Trying 192.168.1.2...
> Connected to odroid.lan.
> Escape character is '^]'.
> Connection closed by foreign host.
>
> Any ideas what could be causing this?
It could be that your process table is full - Run ps fax and
understand what each process does.
Alternatively /dev/p
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