On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 20:07 +0200, Björn Sund wrote:
> repoquery --whatprovides MDA
> repoquery --whatprovides MUA
Honestly, I think things like that would be better off as pkgtags on the
pkgs in the pkgdb!
-sv
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On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 17:06 -0400, seth vidal wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 16:47 -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
> > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 4:23 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> > > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:15:12PM -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
> > >> It would be good to define such a nonstandard abbrev
On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 8:04 AM, Ben Boeckel wrote:
> Chris Adams wrote:
>> sendmail has always worked out of the box for some things, including
>> sending mail from local programs to remote email addresses
>
> I thought this was a speed trip to spamhaus' lists (the `localhost'
> part I've found)
On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 6:04 AM, David Woodhouse wrote:
> On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 18:09 -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
>> What more do you want an MTA to do at install? It was decided a long
>> time ago that the MTA shouldn't listen for remote SMTP connections by
>> default. Pretty much any other thing
Chris Adams (cmad...@hiwaay.net) said:
> Once upon a time, Garrett Holmstrom said:
> > While it may be debatable what benefit one might get from removing it
> > from the default install, can we at least remove MTAs from @core to help
> > make things easier for appliance folks? One can still go
Chris Adams wrote:
> sendmail has always worked out of the box for some things, including
> sending mail from local programs to remote email addresses
I thought this was a speed trip to spamhaus' lists (the `localhost'
part I've found). I had to get my machine off of it when I failed to
setup KMa
On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 18:09 -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> What more do you want an MTA to do at install? It was decided a long
> time ago that the MTA shouldn't listen for remote SMTP connections by
> default. Pretty much any other thing I can think of (such as
> delivering root mail to a non-root
Once upon a time, Jesse Keating said:
> >Why is sendmail also in @Base
>
> You can opt out of base but not core. If any changes are made it should be so
> that one can install just core and not get an mta.
Yes, I know that. I was wondering how it ended up in both (if there's a
reason and it i
"Chris Adams" wrote:
>Once upon a time, Garrett Holmstrom said:
>> While it may be debatable what benefit one might get from removing it
>> from the default install, can we at least remove MTAs from @core to help
>> make things easier for appliance folks? One can still go in @base,
>> whic
Once upon a time, Garrett Holmstrom said:
> While it may be debatable what benefit one might get from removing it
> from the default install, can we at least remove MTAs from @core to help
> make things easier for appliance folks? One can still go in @base,
> which would make it continue to ap
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 05:31:58PM -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
>> > Useful information is being generated and then lost. That shouldn't happen.
>> This is not a sudden realization, there are bugs open about this for
>> multiple releases.
On Aug 26, 2010, at 13:50, Adam Williamson wrote:
> On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 20:30 +0200, Krzysztof Halasa wrote:
>> Jon Masters writes:
>>
>>> What's the benefit of having no default MTA at all? Is it that Desktop
>>> users don't care about MTAs being installed? what about those of us who
>>> care
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 05:31:58PM -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> > Useful information is being generated and then lost. That shouldn't happen.
> This is not a sudden realization, there are bugs open about this for
> multiple releases. Why wait till there is even less need for it to
> want to fix
Once upon a time, Adam Williamson said:
> We're going in circles. I already said that I think the best fix for
> this is to replace sendmail with an MTA which works 'out of the box'.
You need to define "works". sendmail has always worked out of the box
for some things, including sending mail fro
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 5:26 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 05:25:18PM -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
>> > We're going in circles. I already said that I think the best fix for
>> > this is to replace sendmail with an MTA which works 'out of the box'.
>> For what purpose? It ha
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 05:25:18PM -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> > We're going in circles. I already said that I think the best fix for
> > this is to replace sendmail with an MTA which works 'out of the box'.
> For what purpose? It has never worked in all of Fedora's existence --
> no one expec
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 4:22 PM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 16:00 -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
>
>> > I think that makes sense if we're talking about adding a default, but
>> > taking one out - especially something that's been default in all Unix-y
>> > OSes for ever - is a d
On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 16:00 -0400, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> > I think that makes sense if we're talking about adding a default, but
> > taking one out - especially something that's been default in all Unix-y
> > OSes for ever - is a different case.
> sendmail currently serves little to no use on
On 26/08/10 21:10, mike cloaked wrote:
Or put another way I
> wonder what fraction of users would include "yum install sendmail" (or
> equivalent) as one of the first actions after an install?
>
As an ordinary? user, it's "yum install exim",
as I dont know of another method as of yet,
to get
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 8:58 PM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 01:14 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
>> On 08/27/2010 12:20 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
>> > That wasn't the question. The question was what is the benefit of not
>> > having one. Is it simply that it saves 1.6MB of disk
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 3:58 PM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 01:14 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
>> On 08/27/2010 12:20 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
>> > That wasn't the question. The question was what is the benefit of not
>> > having one. Is it simply that it saves 1.6MB of disk
On Fri, 2010-08-27 at 01:14 +0530, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> On 08/27/2010 12:20 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > That wasn't the question. The question was what is the benefit of not
> > having one. Is it simply that it saves 1.6MB of disk space? If so, uh,
> > woop?
>
> I think, that reverses the re
On 08/27/2010 12:20 AM, Adam Williamson wrote:
> That wasn't the question. The question was what is the benefit of not
> having one. Is it simply that it saves 1.6MB of disk space? If so, uh,
> woop?
I think, that reverses the responsibility. If anything is installed by
default, *that* needs a
On Thu, 2010-08-26 at 20:30 +0200, Krzysztof Halasa wrote:
> Jon Masters writes:
>
> > What's the benefit of having no default MTA at all? Is it that Desktop
> > users don't care about MTAs being installed? what about those of us who
> > care more about server installations than Desktop?
>
> I h
Jon Masters writes:
> What's the benefit of having no default MTA at all? Is it that Desktop
> users don't care about MTAs being installed? what about those of us who
> care more about server installations than Desktop?
I have desktops with no MTA. I can read mail on them using remote
pop3/imap
Matthew Garrett, Tue, 24 Aug 2010 15:43:36 +0100:
> If the question is "How do I ensure that important
> system messages get delivered to someone who can do something about them
> in a timely manner", a local MTA isn't a great answer.
It would be if (rather obvious) https://bugzilla.redhat.com/sho
Matthew Miller, Tue, 24 Aug 2010 10:09:52 -0400:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:58:50AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
>> Why are you complaining? If your package needs an MTA - put in a
>> Requires!
>
> If we follow the general state of things: "if a package might need
> something, toss it in as
2010/8/25 Adam Williamson :
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:41 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:52:45AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
>>
>> > FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
>> > an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, a
pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> Its got nothing to do with gnome what so ever. I don't see what that
> has to do with the discussion. I actually want it so its easy to make
> tiny appliances and routers without having to manually strip a whole
> lot of crap out. As I mentioned above there's nothing
On Wed, 2010-08-25 at 09:01 +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Adam Williamson wrote:
> > FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
> > an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
> > a tiny amount of disk space (especially if we pick a lighter-w
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:41 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:52:45AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
>
> > FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
> > an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
> > a tiny amount
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Till Maas wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 10:20:44AM +0100, mike cloaked wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 9:12 AM, drago01 wrote:
>>
>> >> It also takes up live image space, which is a very scarce resource, it's
>> >> always a fight to keep our live images with
On 08/25/2010 03:05 PM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
> Ralf Corsepius writes:
>
>> On 08/25/2010 09:08 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>>> Chris Adams wrote:
How many users use "at" or "bc" (well, I use "dc" all the time)?
>>>
>>> Well, at least "at" is a nice command and some people use it, but…
>>>
W
Ralf Corsepius writes:
> On 08/25/2010 09:08 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>> Chris Adams wrote:
>>> How many users use "at" or "bc" (well, I use "dc" all the time)?
>>
>> Well, at least "at" is a nice command and some people use it, but…
>>
>>> What about "ed"?
>>
>> … it's time we drop such legacy ju
On 08/25/2010 09:08 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Chris Adams wrote:
>> How many users use "at" or "bc" (well, I use "dc" all the time)?
>
> Well, at least "at" is a nice command and some people use it, but…
>
>> What about "ed"?
>
> … it's time we drop such legacy junk!
What you offend as "legacy jun
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 09:08:22AM +0200, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> > What about "ed"?
> … it's time we drop such legacy junk! Scripts are all written to sed (or
> something entirely different, like awk or perl) these days, and nobody
> seriously uses ed for interactive editing (there are tons of mor
* mike cloaked [25/08/2010 12:27] :
>
> I wonder what fraction of users don't use DVD these days?
I've switched to PXE-based installs. Haven't used a DVD/CD in ages.
Emmanuel
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2010/8/24 pbrobin...@gmail.com :
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 9:36 AM, Rudolf Kastl wrote:
>> my desktop runs on software mirror raid below an lvm. not for
>> performance but for data recovery reasons. mdmonitor does mail
>> notification. will this be fixed? how about logwatch, it is really
>> useful
On 08/24/2010 05:47 PM, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Till Maas wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>>
>>> The problem with delivering this to a user's mailbox via an MTA is that
>>> in the typical case it doesn't result in th
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 07:44:55AM +0100, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> has to do with the discussion. I actually want it so its easy to make
> tiny appliances and routers without having to manually strip a whole
> lot of crap out. As I mentioned above there's nothing to stop it being
> included i
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 10:20:44AM +0100, mike cloaked wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 9:12 AM, drago01 wrote:
>
> >> It also takes up live image space, which is a very scarce resource, it's
> >> always a fight to keep our live images within the size constraints.
> >
> > Which is fixable by admi
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 9:12 AM, drago01 wrote:
>> It also takes up live image space, which is a very scarce resource, it's
>> always a fight to keep our live images within the size constraints.
>
> Which is fixable by admitting that we lost that fight and move to a
> modern medium that actually
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 9:01 AM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Adam Williamson wrote:
>> FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
>> an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
>> a tiny amount of disk space (especially if we pick a lighter-weigh
Chris Adams wrote:
> How many users use "at" or "bc" (well, I use "dc" all the time)?
Well, at least "at" is a nice command and some people use it, but…
> What about "ed"?
… it's time we drop such legacy junk! Scripts are all written to sed (or
something entirely different, like awk or perl) th
Adam Williamson wrote:
> FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
> an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
> a tiny amount of disk space (especially if we pick a lighter-weight one
> than sendmail to be the default). I think it makes
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 7:36 AM, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Wed, 2010-08-25 at 07:23 +0100, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 12:34 AM, Jon Masters
>> wrote:
>
>> > I have an MTA installed because I expect to get emailed logs, and root@
>> > does go somewhere. Now, there are a
On Wed, 2010-08-25 at 07:23 +0100, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 12:34 AM, Jon Masters wrote:
> > I have an MTA installed because I expect to get emailed logs, and root@
> > does go somewhere. Now, there are a couple of things I should admit:
> >
> > 1). I did replace the
On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 12:34 AM, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 17:54 -0400, seth vidal wrote:
>> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:52 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>> > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 05:43:49PM -0400, seth vidal wrote:
>> >
>> > > that seems like a bit of odd logic. The logs are em
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 17:54 -0400, seth vidal wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:52 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> > On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 05:43:49PM -0400, seth vidal wrote:
> >
> > > that seems like a bit of odd logic. The logs are emitted to syslog with
> > > the same thought in mind - that
> -Original Message-
> From: devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org
> [mailto:devel-boun...@lists.fedoraproject.org] On Behalf
> Of pbrobin...@gmail.com
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 3:03 PM
> To: Development discussions related to Fedora
> Subject: Re: drop defa
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:52 PM, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 05:43:49PM -0400, seth vidal wrote:
>
>> that seems like a bit of odd logic. The logs are emitted to syslog with
>> the same thought in mind - that someone will read them - but that is
>> also not necessarily true.
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:52 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 05:43:49PM -0400, seth vidal wrote:
>
> > that seems like a bit of odd logic. The logs are emitted to syslog with
> > the same thought in mind - that someone will read them - but that is
> > also not necessarily t
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 05:43:49PM -0400, seth vidal wrote:
> that seems like a bit of odd logic. The logs are emitted to syslog with
> the same thought in mind - that someone will read them - but that is
> also not necessarily true. But I would not want to see us discarding
> syslog, either.
We
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 22:41 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:52:45AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
>
> > FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
> > an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
> > a tiny amount
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:27:04PM +0100, Adam Huffman wrote:
> Not really related to the original discussion, but perhaps firstboot
> could be amended to add an alias when the first user is created such
> that they receive root's mail?
At the point where you're writing more code to fix a problem
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:52:45AM -0700, Adam Williamson wrote:
> FWIW, I'm with Jon and Adam on this one. I just don't see how not having
> an MTA by default is a win, except in disk space terms, and it takes up
> a tiny amount of disk space (especially if we pick a lighter-weight one
> than sen
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:27:04PM +0100, Adam Huffman wrote:
> Not really related to the original discussion, but perhaps firstboot
> could be amended to add an alias when the first user is created such
> that they receive root's mail?
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=135592
and relat
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:47 PM, pbrobin...@gmail.com
wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Till Maas wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>>
>>> The problem with delivering this to a user's mailbox via an MTA is that
>>> in the typical case it doesn't re
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:27, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Paul Howarth wrote:
>> I use "at" on a regular basis, to schedule large downloads and uploads
>> when my ADSL bandwidth becomes unmetered after midnight.
>>
>> And I like getting the resulting email in the morning showing that all
>> went
>> > > My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a
>> > > "Desktop" distribution in Fedora. I want a server-usable distribution.
>> > > Sure, it's just a dep and one can go install an MTA. But today it's
>> > > killing the MTA, tomorrow it's removing something else that
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:37 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:36 -0400, Matthias Clasen wrote:
> > On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:19 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a
> > > "Desktop" distribution in Fedo
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:58:50AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
>> Why are you complaining? If your package needs an MTA - put in a Requires!
>
> If we follow the general state of things: "if a package might need
> something, toss it in
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 3:19 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:09 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:58:50AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
>> > Why are you complaining? If your package needs an MTA - put in a Requires!
>>
>> If we follow the general stat
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Till Maas wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>
>> The problem with delivering this to a user's mailbox via an MTA is that
>> in the typical case it doesn't result in the user noticing anything
>> until they've logged in as roo
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> The problem with delivering this to a user's mailbox via an MTA is that
> in the typical case it doesn't result in the user noticing anything
> until they've logged in as root and find out that the "you have new
> mail" message
"Andrew Haley" wrote:
>On 08/24/2010 02:58 PM, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
>> Chris Adams wrote:
>>> What do we gain by not having any MTA installed (other than a little bit
>>> of disk space)? I understand that "a little bit of disk space" can add
>>> up quick, but a local queueing MTA is a pr
Once upon a time, Michael Cronenworth said:
> What benefit do I, or anyone else, receive by shipping a 100% Unix-clone
> environment >by default Unix-like be necessary for much longer? Are we making a Fedora for
> people to use or for researchers to study?
So, according to you, Unix-like system
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 10:53:13AM -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> > There's certainly a set of people who want an MTA for this - in a server
> > environment it's obviously far more straightforward to get mailed on
> > failure, and
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 09:46:26AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Matthew Garrett wrote:
> > The long term fix would arguably be to provide a stub /usr/sbin/sendmail
> > that ties into a more generic event reporting interface, which in turn
> > could be configured to send mail elsewhere but wo
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:10 -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Andrew Haley wrote:
> > I think there's a much more fundamental question here, which is
> > whether a default Fedora installation is intended to be a real
> > UNIX-like system or just the dependencies for GNOME.
>
> I was going to rep
Andrew Haley wrote:
> I think there's a much more fundamental question here, which is
> whether a default Fedora installation is intended to be a real
> UNIX-like system or just the dependencies for GNOME.
I was going to reply to Chris, but I'll reply here.
What benefit do I, or anyone else, rece
On 08/24/2010 03:37 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:36 -0400, Matthias Clasen wrote:
>> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:19 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a
>>> "Desktop" distribution in Fedora. I want a server-u
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 03:43:36PM +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> There's certainly a set of people who want an MTA for this - in a server
> environment it's obviously far more straightforward to get mailed on
> failure, and that's something that you'll probably configure when
This isn't serve
Matthew Garrett wrote:
> The long term fix would arguably be to provide a stub /usr/sbin/sendmail
> that ties into a more generic event reporting interface, which in turn
> could be configured to send mail elsewhere but would default to popping
> up some sort of desktop notification.
Already works
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:56:21AM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> They can't be configured that way; they don't implement SMTP. It is a
> de-facto standard for Unix programs to send mail by piping the message
> to either /bin/mail or /usr/{sbin,lib}/sendmail. That has the advantage
> of queueing fo
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:36 -0400, Matthias Clasen wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:19 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
>
> >
> > My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a
> > "Desktop" distribution in Fedora. I want a server-usable distribution.
> > Sure, it's just a dep
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:19 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
>
> My previous objection was based on the precedent it sets. I don't want a
> "Desktop" distribution in Fedora. I want a server-usable distribution.
> Sure, it's just a dep and one can go install an MTA. But today it's
> killing the MTA, tomo
Paul Howarth wrote:
> I use "at" on a regular basis, to schedule large downloads and uploads
> when my ADSL bandwidth becomes unmetered after midnight.
>
> And I like getting the resulting email in the morning showing that all
> went well, or not as the case may be.
No one will prevent you from do
On Tue, 2010-08-24 at 10:09 -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:58:50AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> > Why are you complaining? If your package needs an MTA - put in a Requires!
>
> If we follow the general state of things: "if a package might need
> something, toss it
On 24/08/10 15:13, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Michael Cronenworth said:
>> Chris Adams wrote:
>>> What do we gain by not having any MTA installed (other than a little bit
>>> of disk space)? I understand that "a little bit of disk space" can add
>>> up quick, but a local queueing MTA
Matthew Miller wrote:
> If we follow the general state of things: "if a package might need
> something, toss it in as a requires!", this will totally defeat the purpose
> of the comps change, since it will get pulled in by something important at
> some point. Rsyslog, for example, can send output v
Once upon a time, Michael Cronenworth said:
> Chris Adams wrote:
> > What do we gain by not having any MTA installed (other than a little bit
> > of disk space)? I understand that "a little bit of disk space" can add
> > up quick, but a local queueing MTA is a pretty standard part of a Unix
> > s
Andrew Haley wrote:
> Not everything that runs on Fedora is a Fedora package: people run
> their own programs, too. Some things, like the existence of /bin/ls
> or being able to send mail by piping the message to either /bin/mail
> or/usr/{sbin,lib}/sendmail are basic features of UNIX.
No one is
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:58:50AM -0500, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Why are you complaining? If your package needs an MTA - put in a Requires!
If we follow the general state of things: "if a package might need
something, toss it in as a requires!", this will totally defeat the purpose
of the co
On 08/24/2010 02:58 PM, Michael Cronenworth wrote:
> Chris Adams wrote:
>> What do we gain by not having any MTA installed (other than a little bit
>> of disk space)? I understand that "a little bit of disk space" can add
>> up quick, but a local queueing MTA is a pretty standard part of a Unix
>>
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 08:56:21AM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> I'm still of the opinion that there should be _something_ at the
> de-facto standard location of /usr/sbin/sendmail that can queue messages
> for later delivery. I don't care whether it is actually sendmail or
> not. Preferably, it sh
Chris Adams wrote:
> What do we gain by not having any MTA installed (other than a little bit
> of disk space)? I understand that "a little bit of disk space" can add
> up quick, but a local queueing MTA is a pretty standard part of a Unix
> system.
Why are you complaining? If your package needs
Once upon a time, pbrobin...@gmail.com said:
> Neither of those need to run a MTA locally to work, you just need to
> point them to a mail server, even then they need to be configured to
> send the mail to something other than root anyway.
They can't be configured that way; they don't implement S
On 08/24/2010 12:47 PM, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Andrew Haley wrote:
>> On 08/23/2010 08:15 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
>>> On Sun, 2010-08-22 at 20:10 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Rex Dieter wrote:
> pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> On 08/23/2010 08:15 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
>> On Sun, 2010-08-22 at 20:10 +0200, drago01 wrote:
>>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Rex Dieter wrote:
pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
> I know its been discussed in the past but ther
On 08/23/2010 08:15 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Sun, 2010-08-22 at 20:10 +0200, drago01 wrote:
>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Rex Dieter wrote:
>>> pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
I know its been discussed in the past but there's been reasons not to
drop a default MTA but now that c
On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 9:36 AM, Rudolf Kastl wrote:
> my desktop runs on software mirror raid below an lvm. not for
> performance but for data recovery reasons. mdmonitor does mail
> notification. will this be fixed? how about logwatch, it is really
> useful to have to get an overview what happen
my desktop runs on software mirror raid below an lvm. not for
performance but for data recovery reasons. mdmonitor does mail
notification. will this be fixed? how about logwatch, it is really
useful to have to get an overview what happened on the system in a
neat summary. also handy for desktops bu
On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 16:47 -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 4:23 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> > On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:15:12PM -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
> >> It would be good to define such a nonstandard abbreviation as "MTA"
> >> when posting a new thread so that more p
On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 4:23 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:15:12PM -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
>> It would be good to define such a nonstandard abbreviation as "MTA"
>> when posting a new thread so that more people would know what is being
>> discussed.
>
> It's actually a
On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 15:48 -0400, Jon Masters wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-08-23 at 20:37 +0100, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> > Given the degree to which sysadmins are religious about MTA choice, I'd
> > suspect that a large proportion of people who run an MTA on Fedora are
> > probably already swapping it
On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 04:15:12PM -0400, Orcan Ogetbil wrote:
> It would be good to define such a nonstandard abbreviation as "MTA"
> when posting a new thread so that more people would know what is being
> discussed.
It's actually a long-standing and well-recognized term.
I think it's one of t
> pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I know its been discussed in the past but there's been reasons not to
>> drop a default MTA but now that cronie (the last actual dependency)
>> has support for logging to system logs is there any reason to include
>> an MTA by default for F-14?
>
It would be good
This has all been talked about in the past and there was even some
action taken on it. I wrote up the wiki page, but Will Woods did all
the heavy lifting. We missed our target and appear to have been side
tracked since but there aren't really many line items left before we
can pull the trigger.
ht
On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 8:30 PM, Jon Ciesla wrote:
> On 08/23/2010 02:21 PM, pbrobin...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 8:15 PM, Jon Masters wrote:
>>> On Sun, 2010-08-22 at 20:10 +0200, drago01 wrote:
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Rex Dieter wrote:
> pbrobin...@gmail.co
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