org/en-US/fesco/Who_is_allowed_to_modify_which_packages/#minor_general_or_cleanup_changes
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Fedora Code of
ia in this
release adding extra UEFI boot entries. We caught this too late to
reasonably pull things back. For details, see
* https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/148774
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On Tue, Mar 11, 2025 at 10:44:48AM -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
> > What's going on there? Did the bot bug out? Or is the Red Hat security
> > team shutting down? I'm very confused.
>
> The team isn't shutting down -- I just talked to some people about
> _expa
n't?
>
> It's throwing a whole bunch of javascript errors ... and isn't working
> even for the bits that do work.
It _is_ supposed to be working. Please file problem reports at
https://gitlab.com/groups/fedora/infrastructure/konflux/-/issues
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On Tue, Mar 11, 2025 at 11:26:06AM -0400, Matthew Miller wrote:
> It _is_ supposed to be working. Please file problem reports at
> https://gitlab.com/groups/fedora/infrastructure/konflux/-/issues
Oh, I see you found it. :)
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t's going on there? Did the bot bug out? Or is the Red Hat security
> team shutting down? I'm very confused.
The team isn't shutting down -- I just talked to some people about
_expanding_ their contributions to Fedora. I'll trace
-nvr-nvrb/39954
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directly from their upstreams in Flathub, or
via Docker images?
What do we gain from building, say, Inkscape ourselves — other than allowing
us to check the boxes of our own rules? Is it worthwhile to try to package
Home Assistant? And, not, like, quixotically worthwhile — what impact does
it have?
If
don't think we want to do this.)
Aleksandra has a long-standing proposal for putting this in a "build id" in
the binary RPM. https://github.com/rpm-software-management/rpm/discussions/2031
Is the "why" important long-term?
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On Tue, Jan 21, 2025 at 08:21:26AM -0500, Neal Gompa wrote:
> If Koschei could trigger non-scratch rebuilds, that would go a long
> way toward this.
This is what draft builds are for, isn't it?
https://docs.pagure.org/koji/release_notes/release_notes_1.34/#draft-builds
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On Tue, Dec 17, 2024 at 02:28:09PM +0100, Vít Ondruch wrote:
> This is not recent example, but really bad example of PP's work IMHO:
> https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/ruby/c/c31c7edb6913eb7417ee68c59997548df2943dde
I do not think nitpicking over _ten year old_ commits is helpful.
la will send bugmail for packages associated with the group.
That's fine -- I have no objection to lists used this way (and hopefully
restricted to those bugzilla messages). I just want to avoid more which
are mostly crickets punctuated by the occasional outbreak of spam.
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ailing list. :)
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ode of Conduct Committee is stressful enough as it is.
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be used as a "shadow" CoC
enforcement mechanism.
I'm not sure today of everything we need to do to make things right, but the
Council will work this week on immediate actions before the holiday, and
then longer-term in January.
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Ma
ot;update feedback" is perfectly clear and more descriptive.
I also do not think our use of the term is particularly special to Fedora.
I'm not sure if Slashdot popularized it, or if they just absorbed it from
somewhere else, but it definitely wasn't unique when we began using
sus at all on what
it means to "strive to protect user privacy" (but I think all of us agree
that we should).
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ords.
Do we need individual rows for each record, or just a row which includes a
count of the number of such records?
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agree that
we should have a stated policy. There was some work on a "privacy policy for
the OS" a while ago, but that basically ran aground in the choppy waters of
legal statements -- and I think a similar attempt would run into the same
problems. But, we could have a policy that _isn't_
that we will take the
second question's responses in that context. That was our intention, but we
should have allowed for explict negative responses in the second question,
or made it contingent on positive responses to the first.
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iew, I certainly
would like to hear that. I don't want the poll to exclude any position. But
at the same time, I think it's clear that the status quo at this point is
"there is some AI in some places".
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proven packagers (and perhaps more).
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out
whether doing two updates in a row was really useful, if I remember.) That
may be a big source of pain.
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er hand, if we have some other big conversion efforts (like a
virtual hackfest or something), maybe factoring in a big jump _is_ right.
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well. If you upgrade from an earlier Fedora Linux
release, you'll get them as part of that. For new systems, please
make sure to check for and apply updates as soon as possible.
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e been stronger.
"Gone in 40" _does_ technically fit into the letter of "drop by 41"... but
maybe not the spirit?
I think a "drop in 41" change (and a clear item in the F40 release notes!)
is probably the best way to clear the air -- but I don&
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives:
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Do not reply to spam, report it:
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
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per ran the tests, but not on S390. Or, with a
different timezone database than current in Fedora. Or etc.
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On Tue, Oct 03, 2023 at 04:36:20PM +0200, Michael J Gruber wrote:
> Thank you for all the effort you have put into maintaining these
> packages so far, for the benefit of all of Fedora, and consequently
> its downstream!
Indeed -- thank you Todd.
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rse-dropped-an-email-address-from-my-preferences-today/89614
>
> I still do not understand what happened 2 days ago.
Sorry, I missed that -- the infrastructure team doesn't actually handle
Discourse. I'll respond to you there.
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_
s, but
before I'd personally back that, I'd like to see it _really_ revitalized...
it needs to be more than a heroic effort by a few people. Otherwise, we'll
be back in the same place in few years.
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ot; to "always", if it
isn't already.
8. Optional: notification messages will set a List-Id corresponding to the
Change Proposals category. You can set up your mail filters to do what
you like with those.
9. To interact, you can either come to the Discussion web interfa
pick & mix is definitely not the intention and it
> has already proven futile in a previous mishap.
Right -- I really don't want to split the conversation. With the telemetry
change, I didn't ask moderators here to take a heavy hand, because people
had a lot they wanted to say and
this change, thanks for working on this Jens
> and for keeping it simple!
Me too!
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Fedo
be a separate document. And,
unrelatedly, the existing privacy statement is in the process of an update
-- needs a refresh for legal changes, and there are number of things that it
suggests we might do that I think we have no interest in and should drop
(like asking for geo coordinates).
-
at the developer
portal hoops are more... hoopy... than would be idea. But once set up, it
shouldn't be difficult. If you _are_ finding rough spots in that, I can
raise the issues and see if we can make things beter.
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;t have any interest in playing that game.)
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On Mon, Jun 12, 2023 at 09:46:26AM -0700, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> I don't think there's a formal change filed yet.
>
> Matthew: Did you want to do that? Or would you like me or someone else
> to do so?
I would love someone else to do so, but if no one else wants to, I can. :
people do things.)
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On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 02:30:09PM +0200, Lukas Javorsky wrote:
> This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
> occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].
Oh no! I will have to update my joerc! And remember how to update my joerc!
Thanks for the notice!
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erness that also removes doc-build dependencies without package
changes?)
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" streams. Ideally
that's orthogonal to Fedora runtime release, but practically speaking that's
what we have now. Maybe in the future we could build a "slow" stream as part
of EPEL on a UBI or CentOS Stream runtime?
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ing point with Software Collections was the complixity it
introduced into spec files -- lots of special macros that had to be used
just-so.
(And of course there were a lot of disagreements about naming things.)
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w docs site isn't perfect, but it is, at least, _docs_.
1. My predecessor as FPL, for the new folks around here.
2. Standard warning: Do not visit TV Tropes if you value the next 10 hours
of your life. :)
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On Thu, Apr 27, 2023 at 12:49:02AM +0200, Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
> Matthew Miller wrote:
> > I've written this:
> > https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/guide-to-interacting-with-this-site-by-email/25960
> > and I'd love feedback on it.
>
> Asking
ttle concerned that because you don't like mailing lists,
> Fedora must migrate away, and to something where you'll be making more
> individual decisions.
Honestly, it's just plain not sustainable for me to keep doing that, whether
or not it's good or bad. :)
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NNTP. Gmane is a software that specifically exists to bridge email to NNTP.
I actually love the idea of a Discourse-to-NNTP bridge.
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7;s arrow-key control feature turned on (F7 in
Firefox), you can use this in combination — j/k to move between posts, and
then arrow keys over to shift-arrow select the part you want, and then again
q to quote (or if it is a post you have permission to edit — your own, or a
wiki post, or you'
r
subthread, if so I'll probably rename publicly-facing option to something
more descriptive.
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not sure how to get it from Matrix. We can get it from Discourse with
some SQL queries. https://discourse.org/plugins/data-explorer.html
Once we have such a query defined, I can make it available for anyone (or
certain groups of people) to run. (It's not generally available because you
can query
On Sun, Apr 23, 2023 at 06:11:45PM +, Randy Barlow via devel wrote:
> On 4/21/23 14:05, Matthew Miller wrote:
> >Accessiblity is important to Fedora, and I take this seriously. For
> >Discourse, hit the ? key to bring up the page describing keyboard shortcuts.
>
> One t
installed, even though it's not running...)
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can't subscribe to
> notifications yet. Sorry about that! Badges is on our list of tech debt to
> handle, so hopefully it won't last too long.
s/tech debt/older software that needs work to reduce ongoing maintenance costs/
:)
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* Discourse developers and designers see the web interaction as primary, and
that isn't going to change.
* Dealing with email has a lot of corner cases, so there will be rough
edges.
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devel maili
ct ones. (Including replacing the 10+ answers one.)
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se the result is two separate discussions.
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ead than they should be. The same is true in your other
> mails, it's not a one-off thing.]
This is probably Gmail's web client. It does this, and other odd things that
make it very frustrating to use for anything but "top-post,
quote-everything".
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oth the html and "uncooked" message, a bunch of metadata. And it
can trigger on post, edit, metadata change, and other things. That's
probably a better interface than email mangling.
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d
sn't change URLs or
anything.
> - Another problem is that there are already too many tags available and
> the tag description is not visible in the post submit form. I think a
> new user would be confused what tag to use. I'm confused too, but that's
> probably just
is clear
> that we can do that without losing contributors.
Fair enough! I intend to only submit the Changes move to FESCo at this time
(or, once this discussion has settled), and the rest can come as it does. I
just wanted to also give a clear picture of what I'm aiming for right up
front
/?id=16692. (In short, the
consequences are that processes which map more memory can do so, which is
bad for memory usage overall and can hurt performance.)
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T
andalone program[0] which is not built in the package, so it should
> be clear that it isn't available.
Silly question: would it make any sense at all to use _podman_ as a
replacement for firecracker's jailer?
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ne team to see if they think it
would be a good fit.
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reminder (and
hopefully something interesting) but keeps the web site as primary for
actual notifications and for keeping track of what's read and not read.
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t everything
> by default and then opt out of the things I'm not interested in.
In that case, subscribing by category should do the trick. Categories are
not light-weight, so we're unlikely to create new ones without fanfare. It's
not just one checkbox, but there are only a han
f
I talk to a lot of people about getting involved in Fedora. "Sign up for
this mailing list and introduce yourself" is a big drop-out point.
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To u
for the client-side. (These are very
easy to install into a given site, unlike weightier server-side plugins.)
Or maybe even just some CSS. What exactly did you have in mind?
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ally for privacy and
> security reasons).
Reasonably enough. There might be an option to embed images -- I'll look.
For what it's worth, the images should all (and only) come from the
dedicated CDN site for our hosting, and there's no linked tracking on our
side or Discourse&#x
s (in fact, I couldn't see a way to log in or
> post/comment).
I'm actually pretty impressed with how decent it is in elinks for a modern
website. I do think you need Javascript to post, though. (And our elinks
does not seem to be built with such support, which probably isn't suffi
at. Instead, choose specific tags that you want to subscribe to, just as
you would subscribe to individual mailing lists.
I have a post about this and Fedora Discussion specifically:
https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/navigating-fedora-discuss
On Fri, Apr 21, 2023 at 11:07:16AM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Matthew Miller said:
> > * also, to fix typos :)
>
> So, I will say this is kind of a peeve of mine about server-based
> discussion systems (whether web or client like Slack/Discord): allowin
ut we do have some options for
handling this. We are (very soon now) going to have sync of FAS groups to
Discourse. If we want or need to, we could limit posting in Project
Discussion to people who are members of one or more FAS groups.
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A simple grouping by
> year/month like the mailing lists is very comfortable in comparison.
There isn't (as far as I know) a browsable year/month view, but you can
limit searches with before and after:
https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/search?q=%23server-wg%20after%3A2021-01-01%20before
h queries, and whenever there is a
new patch, you get a notification. (You can decide if you want these
immediately, hourly, daily, or weekly.)
https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/new-site-feature-saved-searches-get-notifications-if-a-new-post-matches/4689
s.
I really don't think that's a _tooling_ issue.
>
> This is an experience I want to avoid. If this is what Matthew is
> proposing a Fedora development discussions to be, then sorry, this is
> not an improvement.
Well, no. It is not what I am proposing.
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t; time. Keeping up with fedora-devel takes very little of my time;
> keeping up with Discourse instances is a much slower affair.
What could we do to make that easier for you?
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scourse sites, where I can
see all of the notifications in one place.
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7;s better than most other forum software's email
interfaces.
> I enjoyed Fedora being on mailing lists, nothing ever came close to the
> threading of emails. I was not getting lost in threads of conversation
> while still being under the umbrella topic, no need to open who knows how
>
_do_ include
`X-Discourse-Tags` and `X-Discourse-Category` headers, so if that's the
your primary way of interacting, you _can_ do something with them. But it
doesn't apply to on-site notifications.)
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On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 08:24:48PM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Matthew Miller said:
> > I am proposing that over the course of 2023, starting with the Changes
> > process, we move Fedora development conversations from this mailing list to
> > the D
o use as an offline or local
> reference.
I don't have an effort like that planned, but I would not be opposed to
someone who wants to work on that.
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To
ongly believe it
will be worth it.
Devel list actually covers a lot of different topics. Discourse lets us
categorize those better while still keeping it all together.
The first thing I suggest moving is discussion around proposed Changes. This
is a FESCo decision. The rest I won't dupli
ing down devel overall is ultimately a Fedora Council
decision.
For right now, though: let’s discuss — on the list!
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ing on building up a bigger moderation team to help with
that. (This too is waiting on the FAS group sync.)
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s most limits. (The "trust level 0" limits are pretty important
to stop spammers and trolls, so I don't want to relax them further.)
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To uns
aproject.org/en-US/legal/license-field/#_basic_policy
Yeah, this is a change from previous guidance. Instead of trying to calculate
the effect, just state what's there. Even if it makes the expression kind of
long and unwieldy.
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le, version 6.x contains a Fedora icon, while previous versions
> do not.
Version 5.x contains an an unauthorized not-so-great single-color hackup of
the "classic" logo. Version 6.x contains an authorized rendition of the
legit current logo.
Is 6.x backwards compatible with 5?
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future products. (They're going to Jira.) RH Bugzilla isn't officially shut
down, but its days are numbered. We need to come up with something else.
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To un
elease time" would be the easiest way to go. And the default
config could be changed in DNF at any time for F38+.
It doesn't sound like it's really worthwhile to bother changing F36 or F37.
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deve
llion people using them but getting an average 0.01% size
benefit... that probably doesn't outweigh the costs.
But, we _can_ tell (again, see previous discussion) that what we're
currently providing is really unlikely to be very useful. So, I'm not
actually sure th
n the place we're in. If you have
a constructive, alternate proposal, let's hear that, please.
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n your definition of "very long time". There is work in
the right direction, and supporting that can only help.
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* delays
* ongoing maintenance work
* other?
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because it did
bring some real benefits (and could possibly do even more.)
But, I think it's time to move on. We have ostree and various
container-delta approaches. We should focus on those — and give DeltaRPMs a
sad, fond farewell.
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https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/guide-to-interacting-with-this-site-by-email/25960
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#x27;t working.
If anyone is interested in tackling this, I'd love to hear your thoughts
(either now, or save them up for when we get to planning the details of that
part of the strategy).
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benefits of
distro packaging (with, you know, guidelines and policies and transparency
and so on) to people who might be running a different distro underneath.
(And then hopefully coax them over entirely. I mean, if they want. No
pressure.)
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efully we can get you connected with the right people!
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https:
d people to assume the worst about others. Lets
> reset and take the time to heal first, so people start actually
> talking about real solutions again.
Yep, I definitely agree with this.
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