On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Jesse Keating wrote:
> That electricity would be eaten up on developer workstations...
...flaming endlessly on a topic where
- the glibc patch is clear
- the external workaround (which avoids changing glibc) is trivial
and has been posted
m
--
martin.la
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 10:06:17PM +, Peter Robinson wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 9:16 PM, Matt Domsch wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 09:32:37AM -0500, Jon Masters wrote:
> >> I've had a few off-list conversations with various community members
> >> about this. One thing that came up w
On 11/18/10 10:58 AM, Doug Ledford wrote:
> - "Richard W.M. Jones" wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 10:29:56PM -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> Most code is not performance critical.
>>>
>>> Much more code than you think is performance critical,
>>> particularly when I can throw up 1000
2010/11/19 Linuxguy123 :
> I realize that most people on this mailing list are focused on
> infrastructure and server/desktop usage.
>
> But some of us are looking forward to using future Fedora releases on
> tablets in vehicular infotainment systems.
>
> To this end, what are the plans for releasi
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 01:58:02PM -0500, Doug Ledford wrote:
> - "Richard W.M. Jones" wrote:
> > On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 10:29:56PM -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> > > Most code is not performance critical.
> >
> > Much more code than you think is performance critical, particularly
> > when
On 11/15/10 9:12 AM, Ville Skyttä wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Should the automated pre-F-14 gcc bug #634757 related rebuilds have been
> included in F-14? It seems that at least the ccache build did not make it.
>
> The build, 3.1-1.fc14.1, is in koji, but there's no entry for it in Bodhi,
> and
>
On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 09:24:26AM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote:
> Also, I gotta say, it really shouldn't be LAN on Motherboard, since it's
> just an adapter, not actually a whole lan. It should clearly be NIC on
> Motherboard, or "nom". And then you could silkscreen lolcats on to the
> servers, whi
On 11/18/10 12:48 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 09:51:24AM -0700, Jesse Keating wrote:
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> On 11/03/2010 09:21 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
>>>
>>> http://koji.fedoraproject.org/static-repos/
>>>
>>> is missing dist-f1
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 9:16 PM, Matt Domsch wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 09:32:37AM -0500, Jon Masters wrote:
>> I've had a few off-list conversations with various community members
>> about this. One thing that came up was that the alternative namespace is
>> necessary, but also that "lom" i
On Wed, 2010-11-17 at 17:11 -0500, Genes MailLists wrote:
> Lets also not forget that the motivation for changing memcpy was to
> get some speedup - has anyone seen evidence of any significant benefit
> of that glibc change?
There is one more reason to revert the change imho: abusing memcpy this
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 04:12:22PM +0200, Jussi Lehtola wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
> there seems to be something wrong with the updates system. I get
> HTTP error 500 both with fedpkg and in the web interface when trying to
> submit updates. Is anyone else seeing this?
>
> e.g.
> ServerError(https://admi
On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 08:48:09AM -0600, Chris Adams wrote:
> In any case, is this going to be something that can be disabled easily?
> We have something like 18 years of Linux networking history that says
> ethernet devices are "eth[0-9]+", and I'm not really interested in
> auditing all the tool
Jason L Tibbitts III wrote:
> They should be orphaned in pkgdb; you'll need to log in and take
> ownership.
I took GtkAda. I've been the de facto maintainer for some time anyway.
Björn Persson
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On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 09:32:37AM -0500, Jon Masters wrote:
> I've had a few off-list conversations with various community members
> about this. One thing that came up was that the alternative namespace is
> necessary, but also that "lom" is a sub-optimal choice. One idea that
> did come up was si
I realize that most people on this mailing list are focused on
infrastructure and server/desktop usage.
But some of us are looking forward to using future Fedora releases on
tablets in vehicular infotainment systems.
To this end, what are the plans for releasing Meego as part of Fedora in
F15 ?
On Fri, 2010-11-12 at 09:35 -0700, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> * Will NM finally be able to do bridging?
:drool:
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On 11/18/2010 05:17 PM, Emmanuel Seyman wrote:
> * Magnus Glantz [18/11/2010 17:07] :
>> I meant patching in general, doesn't have to be glibc. Just temporarily
>> solving the issue, in general by patching something :-)
> I'm unclear as why you feel the 'something' in question should be anything
>
On 11/17/2010 11:39 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
> Once upon a time, Matthew Garrett said:
>> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 10:30:00PM -0600, Chris Adams wrote:
>>> How is that relevant? If the behavior changes on only some
>>> architectures, then it is okay?
>>
>> If it's broken on non-x86 already then ther
On Thursday, November 18, 2010, 2:06:38 PM, Peter Jones wrote:
> On 11/17/2010 10:59 PM, Matthew Garrett wrote:
>> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 12:42:56AM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>>
>>> Because it's NOT a bug in glibc, because what glibc does is CORRECT,
>>> because
>>> it actually POINTS OUT bugs
On 11/17/2010 10:59 PM, Matthew Garrett wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 12:42:56AM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>
>> Because it's NOT a bug in glibc, because what glibc does is CORRECT, because
>> it actually POINTS OUT bugs in applications which are portability issues and
>> can hurt future opti
- "Richard W.M. Jones" wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 10:29:56PM -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> > Most code is not performance critical.
>
> Much more code than you think is performance critical, particularly
> when I can throw up 1000 instances of it in the cloud.
>
> /me considers makin
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 10:29:56PM -0500, Gregory Maxwell wrote:
> Most code is not performance critical.
Much more code than you think is performance critical, particularly
when I can throw up 1000 instances of it in the cloud.
/me considers making snide comment about Python and how many extra
p
On 11/18/2010 8:09, Dominik 'Rathann' Mierzejewski wrote:
> On Monday, 15 November 2010 at 12:29, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> [...]
>> This is a silly straw-man. No one[1] formats external HDs with
>> anything other than MS-DOS FAT. Fedora changing the default for the
>> main hard disk will not m
On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 08:03:35AM -0600, Bruno Wolff III wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 14, 2010 at 13:59:24 +0100,
> Till Maas wrote:
> > The optimal case is to provide well tested security updates fast, but
> > this is not what Fedora achieves. In my example there is no indication
> > that the update
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 04:29:25PM -0700, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> c) Provide better test cases to allow casual users to test the updates
> in vm's or the like.
Or provide a full remote test environment where people can log in to,
get notified about neglected updates and presented with test cases an
Zoltan Kota wrote:
> E.g. Now I can upgrade my F14 to devel. Later when F15 is branched I would
> like to follow F15 and not devel. Is it possible automatically or I need
> to tweak my system manually. Last time I missed the 'branching point' and
> I got the updates from rawhide.
The new "yum dist
Richard Zidlicky wrote:
> However for some of the reports it is only the matter of someone looking
> at them as they contain the obvious solution to the problem.
>
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=595165
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=582013
The solution is not obvious
commit 868d923c69785a2c31f0f05c6615cbc6c550bbf7
Author: Paul Howarth
Date: Thu Nov 18 16:49:28 2010 +
- Run release tests as well as standard test suite in %check
- Drop no-longer-needed buildreq perl(Filter::Util::Call)
- New buildreqs perl(Test::Perl::Critic), perl(Test::Pod),
Panu Matilainen wrote:
> It's not the script itself that's bad and bizarre, it's the entire
> %pretrans mechanism that's problematic.
>
> %pretrans runs before fingerprinting (this is required for the
> directory/symlink replacing tricks to work at all), which means that the
> transaction can abor
On 11/18/2010 03:47 PM, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 04:39:40PM +0100, Magnus Glantz wrote:
>> So..
>> Upside of patching: happy users :-)
>> Downside of patching: unhappy developers :-(
>
> and unhappy users because their software runs slower, apparently you've
> (intentionally?
* Magnus Glantz [18/11/2010 17:07] :
>
> I meant patching in general, doesn't have to be glibc. Just temporarily
> solving the issue, in general by patching something :-)
I'm unclear as why you feel the 'something' in question should be anything
other than libflashplayer.so .
Emmanuel
--
devel
On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 12:31:58PM -0500, Kyle McMartin wrote:
> A summary and the irc log will be posted and linked from the wiki after
> the discussion, if you're unable to watch it live.
>
The IRC logs of the discussion are available at:
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-townhall/2010-1
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 04:23:56PM +0100, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
> It is very sad that Intel/AMD just didn't make sure rep movsb
> isn't the fastest copying sequence on all of their CPUs,
> which underneath could do whatever magic based on size and src/dst
> alignment (e.g. for small length han
On 11/18/2010 04:47 PM, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 04:39:40PM +0100, Magnus Glantz wrote:
>> So..
>> Upside of patching: happy users :-)
>> Downside of patching: unhappy developers :-(
> and unhappy users because their software runs slower, apparently you've
> (intentionally?) m
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 06:13:51PM -0500, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 01:16:42PM -0800, John Reiser wrote:
> > On 11/17/2010 12:41 PM, Emmanuel Seyman wrote:
> > > 2) Issues found in proprietary software cannot be fixed by anybody except
> > >the vendor
> > False. In this p
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 04:39:40PM +0100, Magnus Glantz wrote:
> So..
> Upside of patching: happy users :-)
> Downside of patching: unhappy developers :-(
and unhappy users because their software runs slower, apparently you've
(intentionally?) missed that. There is absolutely no reason to punish
On 11/18/2010 03:28 PM, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 10:14:58AM +, Andrew Haley wrote:
>> On 11/17/2010 11:42 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>> How is any of that a reason not to patch glibc?
>>
>> Upside of patching: happy users.
>> Downside: nothing.
> Downside: slower memcpy on ss
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 10:09:56AM -0500, Genes MailLists wrote:
> On 11/18/2010 09:28 AM, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
> >> Downside: nothing.
> >
> > Downside: slower memcpy on sse4.2 machines
>
> Do you know how much slower in absolute time is it?
>
> And is it (or would it be) visible (1/10's of
On 11/18/2010 02:16 PM, Bill Nottingham wrote:
> Andrew Haley (a...@redhat.com) said:
>>> and, most importantly, because it is NOT our job to work around bugs
>>> in proprietary software!
>>
>> How is any of that a reason not to patch glibc?
>>
>> Upside of patching: happy users.
>> Downside: noth
On 11/18/2010 09:28 AM, Jakub Jelinek wrote:
>> Downside: nothing.
>
> Downside: slower memcpy on sse4.2 machines
Do you know how much slower in absolute time is it?
And is it (or would it be) visible (1/10's of seconds) or invisible
(ms) in some typical (or atypical) apps that call memcpy()
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 08:58:03AM +0100, drago01 wrote:
> Sure can.
> > 4.5 No Modification or Reverse Engineering. You shall not modify, adapt,
> > translate or create derivative works based upon the Software. You shall not
> > reverse engineer, decompile, disassemble, or otherwise attempt to
On Thursday, 18 November 2010 at 00:13, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 01:16:42PM -0800, John Reiser wrote:
> > On 11/17/2010 12:41 PM, Emmanuel Seyman wrote:
> > > 2) Issues found in proprietary software cannot be fixed by anybody except
> > >the vendor
> > False. In this par
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 01:08:01PM +, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 01:39:50PM +0100, Richard Zidlicky wrote:
> > after the experience that 90% of bugs filled against free software
> > get closed after the lifetime of a distribution (my subjective
> > estimate) without any
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 10:14:58AM +, Andrew Haley wrote:
> On 11/17/2010 11:42 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> How is any of that a reason not to patch glibc?
>
> Upside of patching: happy users.
> Downside: nothing.
Downside: slower memcpy on sse4.2 machines
Downside: if we workaround the Adobe f
Andrew Haley (a...@redhat.com) said:
> > and, most importantly, because it is NOT our job to work around bugs
> > in proprietary software!
>
> How is any of that a reason not to patch glibc?
>
> Upside of patching: happy users.
> Downside: nothing.
Downside: cranky libc maintainers
While possi
Hi,
there seems to be something wrong with the updates system. I get
HTTP error 500 both with fedpkg and in the web interface when trying to
submit updates. Is anyone else seeing this?
e.g.
ServerError(https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb/acls/name/dd_rescue/Fedora/13,
500, Unknown HTTP Server
On Monday, 15 November 2010 at 12:29, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
[...]
> This is a silly straw-man. No one[1] formats external HDs with
> anything other than MS-DOS FAT. Fedora changing the default for the
> main hard disk will not make any difference to this case of your
> contrarian user giving
On 11/18/2010 08:28 AM, Bruno Wolff III wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 21:03:02 -0600,
> It probably would have been nice to have enabled some debugging mode during
> the F14 development period to actively find code misuing the function.
Yes definitely - but for now, since,
No-one has yet
> "PP" == Petr Pisar writes:
PP> I can take: pl, yap.
They should be orphaned in pkgdb; you'll need to log in and take
ownership.
- J<
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On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 12:29 AM, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Nov 2010 23:38:38 +0100
> François Cami wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 11:04 PM, Kevin Kofler
>> wrote:
>> > Kevin Fenzi wrote:
>> >> So, there are no folks in the KDE sig using F13 anymore?
>> >>
>> >> Perhaps call for teste
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 21:03:02 -0600,
Chris Adams wrote:
>
> However, I still think that changing memcpy away from years of "it just
> works" is an ABI change that should not be taken lightly and IMHO
> shouldn't be done in a "stable" release of glibc. Is memcpy called
It didn't just work.
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 01:39:50PM +0100, Richard Zidlicky wrote:
> after the experience that 90% of bugs filled against free software
> get closed after the lifetime of a distribution (my subjective
> estimate) without anyone ever looking at them I am wondering if we
> should abandon free software
On Thu, 18 Nov 2010, Ville Skyttä wrote:
> On Wednesday 17 November 2010, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>> Ville Skyttä wrote:
>> > I'd get rid of the versioned javadoc dir altogether, and simply install
>> > to %{_javadocdir}/%{name}. Unversioned is good for bookmarking and
>> > javadoc crosslinking.
>>
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 11/18/2010 07:44 AM, Zoltan Kota wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Is there an automatic/smooth and/or recommended way to switch from rawhide
> to the branched-devel (when branching is being done) dist?
> E.g. Now I can upgrade my F14 to devel. Later when F15 is
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 03:32:02 +0100,
Lennart Poettering wrote:
> On Wed, 17.11.10 20:00, Bruno Wolff III (br...@wolff.to) wrote:
>
> > I am using rawhide now and am seeing some issues that might be systemd
> > related, but am not completely sure. Should I file these against the package
> > t
Hi,
Is there an automatic/smooth and/or recommended way to switch from rawhide
to the branched-devel (when branching is being done) dist?
E.g. Now I can upgrade my F14 to devel. Later when F15 is branched I would
like to follow F15 and not devel. Is it possible automatically or I need
to tweak
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 09:44:31PM +0100, Magnus Glantz wrote:
>
> Because a large part of the Fedora users, uses the flash plugin from
> Adobe, and if it does not work, they will go off and find a distribution
> where it does work. With less people using Fedora, the project becomes
> less s
On 11/18/2010 12:04 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Magnus Glantz wrote:
>> 2)
>> QUOTE
>> "And in the end, the big question is simple:
>> Are you seriously going to do a Fedora-14 release with a known
>> non-working flash player?"
>> END QUOTE
>>
>> For me, the answers to these questions is simple.
> [s
Magnus Glantz wrote:
> 2)
> QUOTE
> "And in the end, the big question is simple:
> Are you seriously going to do a Fedora-14 release with a known
> non-working flash player?"
> END QUOTE
>
> For me, the answers to these questions is simple.
[snip 1)]
> 2) No..
Newsflash: We already did.
Compose started at Thu Nov 18 08:15:33 UTC 2010
Broken deps for x86_64
--
balsa-2.4.7-2.fc14.x86_64 requires libnotify.so.1()(64bit)
beagle-0.3.9-19.fc14.x86_64 requires libmono.so.0()(64bit)
beagle-0.3.9-19.fc14.x86_6
Andrew Haley wrote:
> On 11/17/2010 11:42 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
>> Because it's NOT a bug in glibc, because what glibc does is CORRECT,
>> because it actually POINTS OUT bugs in applications which are
>> portability issues and can hurt future optimization opportunities
>> (regardless of whether
On 2010-11-16, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 05:15:03PM +, Joel wrote:
>> > Michel Alexandre Salim fedoraproject.org> wrote:
>> >> We might need a mass-orphaning if Gérard cannot
>> >> continue his Fedora work anymore.
>>
>> Paul Howarth city-fan.org> writes:
>> > Gér
On 11/17/2010 11:42 PM, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Andrew Haley wrote:
>> So we should be able simply to patch glibc, right? Can't see any reason
>> not to.
>
> Because it's NOT a bug in glibc, because what glibc does is CORRECT,
> because it actually POINTS OUT bugs in applications which are
> portab
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 10:16:25AM +0100, Magnus Glantz wrote:
> But are you referring to something as wide spread as flash? If you are
> thinking about mp3, then I would guess that if for example mp3 stopped
> working on Fedora, we would be in the same seat as today - where a lot
> of people ar
Dne 18.11.2010 05:27, Matthew Garrett napsal(a):
> Flash isn't crashing. It just sounds like it's trapped in a flooded
> submarine.
Does it make any difference if you listen via speakers or via
headphones? It does to me.
Matěj
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On Tue, 2010-11-16 at 11:39 -0500, Kyle McMartin wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 16, 2010 at 04:58:11PM +0100, Ilyes Gouta wrote:
> > Can we have this patch back ported into the current kernel for Fedora 14 and
> > possibly posted as an update? :)
> >
> > Would be wonderful!
> >
>
> Try this,
> http://kyle
Once upon a time, Jon Masters said:
> I've had a few off-list conversations with various community members
> about this. One thing that came up was that the alternative namespace is
> necessary,
I'm not sold on this, but:
> but also that "lom" is a sub-optimal choice. One idea that
> did come up
On 11/18/2010 05:23 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote:
> Well, I am glad that Adobe is committing to fixing the problem, but it is not
> something I would rely on happening in all cases.
I agree completely.
On 11/18/2010 05:23 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote:
> The majority of Fedora users also need support f
2010/11/18 Viji V Nair :
> Hi
>
> I would like to co-maintain gdal and grass packages. I am working on
> Fedora GIS spin:
>
> We need to fix some issues in the above packages:
Unfortunately GIS stack in Fedora needs love, especially in comparison
with other popular distributions, so I'm welcoming
Hi
I would like to co-maintain gdal and grass packages. I am working on
Fedora GIS spin:
We need to fix some issues in the above packages:
gdal : we care not shipping the jnis, java is broken and need to fix
grass : A very old GRASS version is packaged, it lacks more than 9000
fixes and enhancem
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 08:53:21AM +, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 01:16:42PM -0800, John Reiser wrote:
> > On 11/17/2010 12:41 PM, Emmanuel Seyman wrote:
> > > 2) Issues found in proprietary software cannot be fixed by anybody except
> > >the vendor
> >
> > False.
On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 01:16:42PM -0800, John Reiser wrote:
> On 11/17/2010 12:41 PM, Emmanuel Seyman wrote:
> > 2) Issues found in proprietary software cannot be fixed by anybody except
> >the vendor
>
> False. In this particular case, it is possible to binary edit the plugin
> libflashplay
On Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 12:48:01AM +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> Jóhann B. Guðmundsson wrote:
> > Dont we have an upstream mantra to uphold...
> >
> > Forward all Fedora users and otherwize that experience this to Adobe..
> >
> > If we are going hack around this on our side where are we going to d
On Wed, Nov 03, 2010 at 09:51:24AM -0700, Jesse Keating wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 11/03/2010 09:21 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> >
> > http://koji.fedoraproject.org/static-repos/
> >
> > is missing dist-f14-build-current ...
> >
> > Rich.
> >
>
> This p
On 11/18/2010 10:06 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote:
>
> Oh I must have misunderstood, I thought it was crashing. Well, at least it
> is
> going to be obvious that something is wrong, unless you are watching a video
> of people trying to talk in a flooded submarine.
Yes, *something* is wrong but go
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