Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-06-01 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Fri, 2012-06-01 at 11:59 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > Ben Hutchings writes: > > > On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > >> Ben Hutchings writes: > >> > Eventually (wheezy+2? +3?) we would stop building a kernel package for > >> > i386. > >> > >> As in drop

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-06-01 Thread Goswin von Brederlow
Ben Hutchings writes: > On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: >> Ben Hutchings writes: >> > Eventually (wheezy+2? +3?) we would stop building a kernel package for >> > i386. >> >> As in drop the i386 arch? > > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reduc

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-22 Thread Thorsten Glaser
Ben Hutchings dixit: >> >> As in drop the i386 arch? >> > >> >No, keep i386 userland only. >> >> Oh, definitely not! Please keep this runnable on at least >> machines such as Soekris (486-compatible), Pentium-M, etc. > >For ever and ever and ever? Hm, 2035 or thereabounds sounds good. ;-) Then l

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-22 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 07:27:21PM +0200, Jakub Wilk wrote: > * Ben Hutchings , 2012-05-20, 03:16: > >5. Installer for i386 prefers amd64 kernel on any capable machine > >(that's a one-line change!) and adds amd64 as secondary > >architecture if this is selected. > > We have still some software th

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-22 Thread Jakub Wilk
* Ben Hutchings , 2012-05-20, 03:16: 5. Installer for i386 prefers amd64 kernel on any capable machine (that's a one-line change!) and adds amd64 as secondary architecture if this is selected. We have still some software that doesn't work with 64-bit kernel, and (worse!) some maintainers clai

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-22 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Tue, May 22, 2012 at 01:25:21PM +, Thorsten Glaser wrote: > Ben Hutchings dixit: > > >> > Eventually (wheezy+2? +3?) we would stop building a kernel package for > >> > i386. > >> > >> As in drop the i386 arch? > > > >No, keep i386 userland only. > > Oh, definitely not! Please keep this ru

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-22 Thread Thorsten Glaser
Ben Hutchings dixit: >> > Eventually (wheezy+2? +3?) we would stop building a kernel package for >> > i386. >> >> As in drop the i386 arch? > >No, keep i386 userland only. Oh, definitely not! Please keep this runnable on at least machines such as Soekris (486-compatible), Pentium-M, etc. >> > h

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Steve Langasek
On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 05:39:06PM +0200, Andreas Barth wrote: > > > > > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even > > > > > that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to > > > > > ia32-libs today, only cleaner). > > > > Don't you believe in x32? >

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 14:02 -0700, Josh Triplett wrote: > Ben Hutchings wrote: > >On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > >> Ben Hutchings writes: > >>> Eventually (wheezy+2? +3?) we would stop building a kernel package > >>> for i386. > >> > >> As in drop the i386 arch?

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 18:24 +0200, Mike Hommey wrote: > On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 02:00:21PM +0100, Ben Hutchings wrote: > > On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > > > Ben Hutchings writes: > > > > > > > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > > > > popco

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Mike Hommey
On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 02:00:21PM +0100, Ben Hutchings wrote: > On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > > Ben Hutchings writes: > > > > > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > > > popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. > > > > > >

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Andreas Barth
* Marco d'Itri (m...@linux.it) [120520 17:31]: > On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: > > > > > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even > > > > that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to > > > > ia32-libs today, only cleaner). > > > Don't you beli

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Marco d'Itri
On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: > > > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even > > > that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to > > > ia32-libs today, only cleaner). > > Don't you believe in x32? > What do you mean, 'believe'? I'm aware it ma

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 16:41 +0200, Marco d'Itri wrote: > On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: > > > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even > > that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to > > ia32-libs today, only cleaner). > Don't you believe in x

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Marco d'Itri
On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: > No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even > that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to > ia32-libs today, only cleaner). Don't you believe in x32? -- ciao, Marco signature.asc Description: Digital signature

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Sun, 2012-05-20 at 11:27 +0200, Goswin von Brederlow wrote: > Ben Hutchings writes: > > > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > > popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. > > > > For some time we have also provided the amd64 kernel for i386, identical > >

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Thomas Goirand
On 05/20/2012 10:16 AM, Ben Hutchings wrote: > Does anyone see a problem with the above, in particular points 1 and 2? > I agree with all you said (you know better than I), but what I would really love to see would be the installer warning people when they try to install the i386 version on a 64

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Goswin von Brederlow
Ben Hutchings writes: > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. > > For some time we have also provided the amd64 kernel for i386, identical > in all but the package metadata. This has not always been perfectly > compa

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-20 Thread Marc Haber
On Sun, 20 May 2012 06:11:16 +0200, m...@linux.it (Marco d'Itri) wrote: >On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: >> Then in wheezy+1: >> 3. amd64 kernel flavour for i386 dropped. >Why can't we use the multiarch package in wheezy? Because changes of this magnitude less than a month before the first target

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-19 Thread Marco d'Itri
On May 20, Ben Hutchings wrote: > Then in wheezy+1: > 3. amd64 kernel flavour for i386 dropped. Why can't we use the multiarch package in wheezy? -- ciao, Marco signature.asc Description: Digital signature

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-19 Thread Ben Hutchings
On Sat, 2012-05-19 at 19:44 -0700, Steve Langasek wrote: > Hi Ben, > > On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 03:16:15AM +0100, Ben Hutchings wrote: > > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > > popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. > > > So in wheezy I would like to see:

Re: amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-19 Thread Steve Langasek
Hi Ben, On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 03:16:15AM +0100, Ben Hutchings wrote: > Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and > popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. > So in wheezy I would like to see: > 1. Default architecture (top of the list for installation media/manu

amd64 as default architecture

2012-05-19 Thread Ben Hutchings
Most new PCs have an Intel or AMD 64-bit processor, and popcon.debian.org shows amd64 numbers almost matching i386. For some time we have also provided the amd64 kernel for i386, identical in all but the package metadata. This has not always been perfectly compatible with i386 userland, but split