On 08/11/2014 07:49 AM, Cameron Norman wrote:
> El dom, 10 de ago 2014 a las 11:39 , Kees de Jong
> escribió:
>> Why are we discussing CD/DVD sizes? Why not just use an USB
>> netinstall? It's then possible to download and install the stuff you
>> need, if you don't want to use a lot of bandwidth
I enjoy the way you keep ignoring the relevant points, memory usage and
performance regressions. And the way you benchmarked gnome against gnome.
How about warsaw on xfce on the same hardware or your benchmarks pretty
much show nothing except that your 'slight performance increase when using
gnome-
Le mardi 12 août 2014 à 13:12 +0100, Anthony F McInerney a écrit :
> Virtualbox Results (no guest drivers installed)
Glxgears is not a relevant 3D benchmark.
But the funniest thing is that you did this test without any 3D
acceleration, which is not representative at all of most real-world
comput
>
> We happen at work to have users with very important needs of 3D
> resources, so one of my colleagues conducted some performance tests with
> and without a compositor (the compositor being GNOME 3).
>
> It turns out that with a recent adapter, 3D applications are running a
> small bit faster und
On 12 August 2014 09:51, Wookey wrote:
>
> Could you do MATE too please?
>
> MATE: (with mate-desktop-environment-extras)
free ^[[C total used free shared buffers cached Mem: 506756 397480 109276
7096 58820 166076 -/+ buffers/cache: 172584 334172
Swap: 392188 0 392188
The ctrl characters came wit
Le mardi 12 août 2014 à 03:03 +0100, Anthony F McInerney a écrit :
> I had stated previously XFCE had started showing memory usage similar
> to gnome. This has quite obviously changed. I was wrong, and i'm
> posting it as a correction to my statement.
You’re comparing apples and oranges. These me
+++ Anthony F McInerney [2014-08-12 00:02 +0100]:
>XFCE:
>
> total used free sharedbuffers cached
>Mem:506756 362468 144288 6568 22756 179264
>-/+ buffers/cache: 160448 346308
>Swap: 392188
+++ Kees de Jong [2014-08-12 02:03 +0200]:
>Are we really comparing RAM here as if it were the 90's? How many people
>here use Android? Today it needs 512 MB to function properly. In two years
>that could be 1 or 2 GB and that's a mobile OS. How much RAM does your
>browser use?
To
Hi,
Noel Torres:
> I think we should not care about Gnome's target audience, but about Debian's
> target audience. Remember Debian Social Contract , #4.
>
No single DE can be the perfect DE-to-end-all-DE-flames^Wdiscussions to all
users.
If the missing min+max buttons is the only problem here,
On 12 August 2014 01:03, Kees de Jong wrote:
> Are we really comparing RAM here as if it were the 90's?
>
I had stated previously XFCE had started showing memory usage similar to
gnome. This has quite obviously changed. I was wrong, and i'm posting it as
a correction to my statement.
I also just
On Monday, 11 de August de 2014 16:34:04 Matthias Urlichs escribió:
> Hi,
>
> Lennart Sorensen:
> > it needs buttons on windows that people expect to see where they expect
> > to see them
>
> You mean left vs. right side?
>
> > Would Debian be willing to make gnome3 have different defaults than
Are we really comparing RAM here as if it were the 90's? How many people
here use Android? Today it needs 512 MB to function properly. In two years
that could be 1 or 2 GB and that's a mobile OS. How much RAM does your
browser use? My Chrome/Firefox easily uses 1 GB. My GNOME 3.10 desktop
(running
XFCE:
total used free sharedbuffers cached
Mem:506756 362468 144288 6568 22756 179264
-/+ buffers/cache: 160448 346308
Swap: 392188 0 392188
GNOME:
total used free shared
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 10:40:04PM +0200, Michael Biebl wrote:
[snip]
>
> Are you missing anything from the GNOME Classic mode *)? It offers
> exactly what you are asking for, with zero need for configuration.
> It's available right next to the GNOME session on your login manager.
>
> Michael
>
Am 11.08.2014 22:09, schrieb David Weinehall:
> On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 01:47:53PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote:
>> On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 07:42:41PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
>>> Available in GNOME 3.
>>>
>>> Available in GNOME 3.
>>>
>>> Not enabled by default (if I remember correctly), but
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 01:47:53PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 07:42:41PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> > Available in GNOME 3.
> >
> > Available in GNOME 3.
> >
> > Not enabled by default (if I remember correctly), but possible to enable
> > using gnome-tweak-tool.
How do you measure memory? Free?
Could you quite possibly post the output of free and whatever else you
measure with? (the full output)
For reference against jessie, i'm installing an up to date jessie right
now...
Thanks
Anthony (bofh80)
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 07:42:41PM +0200, David Weinehall wrote:
> Available in GNOME 3.
>
> Available in GNOME 3.
>
> Not enabled by default (if I remember correctly), but possible to enable
> using gnome-tweak-tool.
I shouldn't have to know that. And I am pretty sure when gnome3 appeared
in s
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 01:35:28PM -0400, Lennart Sorensen wrote:
> All I personally expect from a window manager is:
>
> Be able to launch programs (ideally using alt+F2)
Available in GNOME 3.
> Be able to resize the window using the edge of the window
Available in GNOME 3.
> Have a maximize/
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 05:34:04PM +0200, Matthias Urlichs wrote:
> You mean left vs. right side?
Or even showing them at all (certainly last time I bothered to look at
gnome 3 it seemed to think buttons on windows were mostly to be avoided).
> People who are so afraid of new stuff to learn that
On Mon, 2014-08-11 at 03:20 +0100, Anthony F McInerney wrote:
[...]
> If people have old CD only machines i would not like to attempt to get
> kernel 3.16 +drivers +userland working on that. I've been in that
> situation plenty of times, where woody or potato are better simply
> because the drivers
Hi,
Lennart Sorensen:
> it needs buttons on windows that people expect to see where they expect
> to see them
You mean left vs. right side?
> Would Debian be willing to make gnome3 have different defaults than
> upstream in the interest of actually being useable to new users who are
> used to o
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 11:15:15AM +0200, Thomas Weber wrote:
> Not sure why you'd want to go for third world countries, but let's look
> at Germany (Aldi is one of the two biggest discounters here):
> http://www.presseportal.de/pm/112096/2653870/aldi-senkt-preise-fuer-fischprodukte-oel-und-smoothi
at bottom :-
On 8/11/14, Thomas Weber wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 03:20:49AM +0100, Anthony F McInerney wrote:
>> Would the people who are claiming that blank cdr are cheaper than dvdr,
>> especially in third world countries, please cite sources (shops, price
>> checkers etc) of the price of
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014, at 12:23, Anthony F McInerney wrote:
Can we now move on to choosing a DE?
Nope, we still don't have enough anecdotic evidence and
trolling yet[1]...
O.
1. Not target at you, just general observation of d-d...
--
Ondřej Surý
Knot DNS (https://www.knot-dns.cz/) – a hig
On Mon, 11 Aug, 2014 at 10:15 AM, Thomas Weber
wrote:
Not sure why you'd want to go for third world countries, but let's
look
at Germany (Aldi is one of the two biggest discounters here):
http://www.presseportal.de/pm/112096/2653870/aldi-senkt-preise-fuer-fischprodukte-oel-und-smoothies
CD
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 03:20:49AM +0100, Anthony F McInerney wrote:
> Would the people who are claiming that blank cdr are cheaper than dvdr,
> especially in third world countries, please cite sources (shops, price
> checkers etc) of the price of say 5 pack or 10 pack, even up to 50pack of
> CD's,
Would the people who are claiming that blank cdr are cheaper than dvdr,
especially in third world countries, please cite sources (shops, price
checkers etc) of the price of say 5 pack or 10 pack, even up to 50pack of
CD's, vs the same amount of DVD's, from those third world countries. Is the
price
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On 08/10/2014 02:39 PM, Kees de Jong wrote:
> Why are we discussing CD/DVD sizes? Why not just use an USB
> netinstall? It's then possible to download and install the stuff you
> need, if you don't want to use a lot of bandwidth then choose no
> des
El dom, 10 de ago 2014 a las 11:39 , Kees de Jong
escribió:
Why are we discussing CD/DVD sizes? Why not just use an USB
netinstall? It's then possible to download and install the stuff you
need, if you don't want to use a lot of bandwidth then choose no
desktop environment or XFCE/LXDE. But if y
2014/08/08 18:14 "Yves-Alexis Perez" :
>
> [...]
>
> Put it another way, Xfce (and other DEs) have been hurt by the various
> enforced transitions (ConsoleKit,
> hal/devicekit-power/upower/upower-0.99), yes. Combined with the lack of
> resources, that means it lays behind the people who decided tho
Why are we discussing CD/DVD sizes? Why not just use an USB
netinstall? It's then possible to download and install the stuff you
need, if you don't want to use a lot of bandwidth then choose no
desktop environment or XFCE/LXDE. But if you can spare some more time
then you can install GNOME/KDE. See
On 08/08/2014 11:14 AM, Yves-Alexis Perez wrote:
On jeu., 2014-08-07 at 23:57 +0200, Jordi Mallach wrote:
Hi Debian,
About the decision itself, as Debian Xfce main maintainer, I honestly
don't really care. I don't think the default desktop matters that much
on Debian (while I guess it means a l
On ven., 2014-08-08 at 18:38 -0700, Paul C. Bryan wrote:
> With all due respect to XFCE, I'd hate the interpretation to be along
> the lines of, "Oh, Debian state of the art desktop environment feels
> something like Windows, circa 2000." But, XFCE's lightweight. It's
> meant
> to lack such fancy f
On 20140808_1050-0700, Andrew Kelley wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 10:44 AM, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz
> wrote:
>
> > On 08/08/2014 12:00 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> > > I see a solution that would satisfy everybody: whoever is interested in
> > > supporting this kind of situations could build CD imag
On 08/08/2014 01:50 PM, Andrew Kelley wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 10:44 AM, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz
> wrote:
>
>> On 08/08/2014 12:00 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
>>> I see a solution that would satisfy everybody: whoever is interested in
>>> supporting this kind of situations could build CD images a
On Fri, 08 Aug 2014, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> of the third world can continue using a modern desktop as usual.
As if lxde, xfce, mate is not modern? Only Gnome3? Come down from your horse.
Norbert
PREINING, Norbert
El vie, 8 de ago 2014 a las 9:00 , Marco d'Itri escribió:
On Aug 08, Joey Hess wrote:
I recently spent some time installing community computer labs in
rural
Brazil. Internet bandwidth was nearly nonexistant[1], so if you were
I am sure that we could have a great competition for finding
po
On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 10:44 AM, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz
wrote:
> On 08/08/2014 12:00 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> > I see a solution that would satisfy everybody: whoever is interested in
> > supporting this kind of situations could build CD images appropriate for
> > them, and everybody else who does
On 08/08/2014 12:00 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Aug 08, Joey Hess wrote:
>
>> I recently spent some time installing community computer labs in rural
>> Brazil. Internet bandwidth was nearly nonexistant[1], so if you were
> I am sure that we could have a great competition for finding potential
>
Hi,
Michael Gilbert writes:
> The default has no bearing whatsoever on whether well-connected users
> can or can't install one of the shiny desktops if they so choose.
The default has no bearing whatsoever on whether un-connected users can
or can't install one of the more minimal desktops, if th
On Fri, Aug 8, 2014 at 12:00 PM, Marco d'Itri wrote:
>> If the xfce iso didn't exist, people in these situtations would
>> not be able to install a usable Debian system.
> I see a solution that would satisfy everybody: whoever is interested in
> supporting this kind of situations could build CD ima
On Aug 08, Joey Hess wrote:
> I recently spent some time installing community computer labs in rural
> Brazil. Internet bandwidth was nearly nonexistant[1], so if you were
I am sure that we could have a great competition for finding potential
users with even crappier connectivity and even more o
Yves-Alexis Perez wrote:
> I actually think having no default desktop would be just fine, instead
> having the current 3-4 desktop installation media. Then anyone can pick
> the DE she likes.
I recently spent some time installing community computer labs in rural
Brazil. Internet bandwidth was near
On jeu., 2014-08-07 at 23:57 +0200, Jordi Mallach wrote:
> Hi Debian,
About the decision itself, as Debian Xfce main maintainer, I honestly
don't really care. I don't think the default desktop matters that much
on Debian (while I guess it means a lot for Ubuntu, for example). I
actually think havi
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