--
> > Many people however believe that we [read: our government(s)]
> > are in a downward spiral that is converging on
> > police-and-welfare-state. In the US for example, we long ago
> > abandoned our constitution. We still give it much lip
> > service and we still have one of the "more fr
Politech coverage:
"Feds nab two PC crypto-exporters allegedly shipping to China"
http://www.politechbot.com/p-02453.html
On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:58:27PM -0700, Malcolm Idaho wrote:
> Customs halts export to China, charges 2
> By Jerry Seper
> THE WASHINGTON TIMES
>
>
>
> Two men, o
On Thu, 30 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote :
>
>
> my old stuff :
> >> Another facet is that the well-to-do are attempting to remove their
> >> funds from the systems so they can use those funds to educate their
> >> children as they choose. A voucher system would s
On Thu, 30 Aug 2001, Declan McCullagh wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 09:12:50PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > On Wed, 29 Aug 2001, Declan McCullagh wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > > But
> > > even given the tattered First Amendment, there is still a difference
> > > between speech and action.
On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 09:12:50PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Aug 2001, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>
>
>
> > But
> > even given the tattered First Amendment, there is still a difference
> > between speech and action.
>
> Complete and utter bullshit.
"Measl" sometimes posts wort
On Thursday, August 30, 2001, at 02:11 PM, Faustine wrote:
> True, of course they do. "Technology is morally neutral," sure,
> whatever.
> Yay capitalism. I still think handing over your security product beta
> on a
> silver platter in exchange for a nice fat government contract is a
> stupid,
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On Thu, 30 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> (the Russian communist revolution was not a
> revolution, but merely a coup by a little conspiracy. Same for
> the Sandinista revolution).
I'm curious how you draw the line? I.e., what defines a genuine
revolution as opposed to a "mere" coup?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote :
my old stuff :
>> Another facet is that the well-to-do are attempting to remove their
>> funds from the systems so they can use those funds to educate their
>> children as they choose. A voucher system would surely benefit me
>> financially. This is a reasonable desire
--
On 29 Aug 2001, at 14:25, Faustine wrote:
> Which reminds me, I don't know why people here seem to think
> that any sort of "deception operation" would come from people
> who show up using nyms to express unpopular opinions. (e.g.
> "you said something I don't want to hear; threfore its
--
On 28 Aug 2001, at 23:00, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> The objection was raised, yes, it is moral, but is it
> profitable? There are not many communist-opposed freedom
> fighters around today, not much money to be made there.
Most regimes on President Bush's shit list have an insurrection
going a
--
On 29 Aug 2001, at 16:40, Gary Jeffers wrote:
> My fellow Cypherpunks,
>
>Some time ago Tim May flamed me and I responded with the
>post:
> Tim May goes bush shooting.
> http://www.inet-one.com/cypherpunks/dir.2000.09.25-2000.10.01/m
> sg00388.html
>.
> Note: The 3rd reference
> Adam writes:
> As far as your opinions of our business, well, I'm really uninterested
> in getting into a pissing match with you. The reality is that
customers
> and investors give us money tp produce privacy tools, and they, not
you,
> are the ones I need to keep happy.
The reality is that pe
Tim May writes:
> And in both of these examples I gave, "Nomen Nescio" took a literal
> reading of the examples. "But Ireland is not a communist regime!" "But
> they are not Jews!"
>
> Examples, like the half dozen I gave, are designed to convey to the
> reader the range of uses, needs, and jus
Tim,
It's not easy to find great links but I still say that speech + action
is something that a prosecutor can use to the disadvantage of the
accused even if the speech is legal and the action appears to be
ineffectual or undirected. Look at how AP was used. 18 U.S.C. 23 1 seems
to link speech di
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At 09:12 PM 8/30/01 -0500, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> But
>> even given the tattered First Amendment, there is still a difference
>> between speech and action.
>
>Complete and utter bullshit.
And complete and utter loss of reputation capital on your part. It disagrees
100% with my interactions
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On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 09:14:46PM -0700, Tim May wrote:
| A mixnet of the N extant remailers offers pretty damned good
| untraceability. Needs some work on getting remailers more robust, but
| the underlying nested encryption looks to be a formidable challenge for
| Shin Bet to crack.
http://
Title: RE: Re: The Privacy/Untraceability Sweet Spot
>When you were asked where were all the supposed wealthy freedom fighters
>in communist controlled regimes, you came back with Osama bin Laden.
Tim's point, which many seem to have missed, is that by design a tool that enforces the privacy
On Thu, 30 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> All I said was that actions can have unintended consequences. Make well
> considered choices. Look at the power industry deregulation in CA. Too
> much, too quickly and poorly crafted. By all means let's improve the
> educational opportunities in thi
>When you were asked where were all the supposed wealthy freedom fighters
>in communist controlled regimes, you came back with Osama bin Laden.
Tim's point, which many seem to have missed, is that by design a tool that
enforces the privacy, anonymity, and pseudonymity of a women striving for
equa
"A. Melon" wrote:
[...]
> I'm not sure if Reese was replying to one of my messages, but this
> obsession less productive posters have with Tim is peculiar.
>
> Looked at as an engineering problem, one tends to look at the
> underperforming components. Let's say you are running a steel mill,
>
Ken Brown bragged:
>OTOH I know people who have sampled the air in underground stations for
>spores and bacteria so on. There are a lot of odd organisms down there
>:-)
A skivvied MoD scientist from Portland Downs raced past me ogling
Buckingham in my red plaid tam and matching sweater, whisp
Nomen Nescio replied to Tim May:
[...]
> You need to read your own posting more carefully:
>
> > Draw this graph I outlined. Think about where the markets are for tools
> > for privacy and untraceability. Realize that many of the "far out' sweet
> > spot applications are not necessarily immoral
Is it necessary to send this message to cypherpunks twice?
-Declan
---
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: The Privacy/Untraceability Sweet Spot
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 08:21:45 -0500 (CDT)
Faustine wrote:
[...]
> Of course it has a trap door, that's probably the whole point of getting it
> over there in the first place. And by the way, if you're going to question
> SafeWeb for cooperating with CIA, you might as well criticize ZeroKnowledge
> for selling a boatload of the Freedom b
On 31 Aug 2001, Anonymous wrote:
> When I saw the "general response to bombz" post with the below mentioned book, I
>asked my significant other to please order a copy for me, because she gets a very
>nice reduction on prices of books she buys as an employed of Borders Bookstore chain.
>
> She
At 10:02 AM 8/30/01 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>Alas, the marketing of such "dissident-grade untraceability" is
>difficult. Partly because anything that is dissident-grade is also
>pedophile-grade, money launderer-grade, freedom fighter-grade,
>terrorist-grade, etc.
>
>--Tim May
How about a marketi
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On Thursday, August 30, 2001, at 10:20 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Tim,
>
> It's not easy to find great links but I still say that speech + action
> is something that a prosecutor can use to the disadvantage of the
> accused even if the speech is legal and the action appears to be
> ineffectua
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--On Wednesday, 29 August, 2001 23:25 -0700 Bill Stewart
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> http://fyi.cnn.com/2001/TECH/internet/08/29/stealth.computing/index.html
> http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/08/29/199205&mode=thread
>
> A group of researchers at Notre Dame figured out how to use the
>
--
On 30 Aug 2001, at 14:52, Faustine wrote:
> And as long as you have companies like ZeroKnowledge who are
> willing/gullible/greedy/just plain fucking stupid enough to
> sell their betas to the NSA, you never will.
There is nothing wrong with selling betas to the NSA. I make my
crypto
--
On 30 Aug 2001, at 14:41, Faustine wrote:
> Of course it has a trap door, that's probably the whole point
> of getting it over there in the first place. And by the way, if
> you're going to question SafeWeb for cooperating with CIA, you
> might as well criticize ZeroKnowledge for selling
--
James A. Donald:
> > (the Russian communist revolution was not a revolution, but
> > merely a coup by a little conspiracy. Same for the
> > Sandinista revolution).
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> I'm curious how you draw the line? I.e., what defines a
> genuine revolution as opposed to a "mere" coup
At 02:52 PM 8/30/01 -0400, Faustine wrote:
>
>And as long as you have companies like ZeroKnowledge who are
>willing/gullible/greedy/just plain fucking stupid enough to sell their
>betas to the NSA, you never will.
>
>~Faustine.
If knowledge of how something works breaks it, it wasn't worth
hav
On Fri, 31 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> A revolution involves mass participation, and widespread
> spontaneous defiance of state authority.
A revolution is when one part of a populace takes up arms against another
part of the populace. The argument is over who gets the final say. It's
wo
On Friday, August 31, 2001, at 07:10 AM, Fisher Mark wrote:
>> Look at how AP was used.
>
> Mike, the main reason the Jim Bell prosecution started was his actions,
> not
> his words. Some of us on the list (myself included) would be majorly
> upset
> if a stink bomb strong enough to make us vo
Mark Leighton Fisher writes:
> Tim's point, which many seem to have missed, is that by design a tool that
> enforces the privacy, anonymity, and pseudonymity of a women striving for
> equal rights in Afghanistan can also be used by the Taliban in their quest
> to track down and kill Afghans who c
Tim May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote :
>Which is why I asked for you some actual cases. I pointed out that--so
>far as I have heard--there have been _no_ prosecutions for "paramilitary
>training." (There may have been some paramilitary types busted for
>firing AK-47s, for trespassing, whatever. T
On Fri, 31 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Where I think you misread me is this : I don't think that the government
> *has* this power, I think the way the laws are written and discussed,
> this degree of power is something for which they reach.
Which must be continously tested by 'controv
On Fri, 31 Aug 2001, Tim May wrote:
> By the way, the SS also demanded that I give them my name and show them
> my driver's license. I refused, so at least they never got my name
> entered into the Master Data Bank of Presidential Threateners.
There is this device called a camera...
--
At 02:41 PM 8/30/01 -0400, Faustine wrote:
>And by the way, if you're going to question
>SafeWeb for cooperating with CIA, you might as well criticize ZeroKnowledge
>for selling a boatload of the Freedom beta to the NSA in 1999 as well. What
>did they think they wanted it for, farting around on
On Friday, August 31, 2001, at 07:22 AM, Fisher Mark wrote:
>> When you were asked where were all the supposed wealthy freedom
>> fighters
>> in communist controlled regimes, you came back with Osama bin Laden.
>
> Tim's point, which many seem to have missed, is that by design a tool
> that
> e
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Duncan Frissell wrote:
>
> On Thu, 30 Aug 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > All I said was that actions can have unintended consequences. Make well
> > considered choices. Look at the power industry deregulation in CA. Too
> > much, too quickly and poorly crafted. By all means let's improve t
Tim wrote:
>But, as with Kirchoff's point, the attacker is going to get the design
>eventually.
If getting the design "eventually" were good enough, why the keen interest
in putting in a large order for the beta? There's a reason.
Maybe in the long run, it's right to view any objections as
On 31 Aug 2001, at 19:50, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> But the more sophisticated technologies are not self-contained tools.
> They require a supported and maintained infrastructure to operate.
> Anonymous posters are painfully aware of how inadequate the current
> remailer system is. A truly reliable
Jim wrote:
> On 29 Aug 2001, at 14:25, Faustine wrote:
>> Which reminds me, I don't know why people here seem to think
>> that any sort of "deception operation" would come from people
>> who show up using nyms to express unpopular opinions. (e.g.
>> "you said something I don't want to hear; thr
At 02:43 PM 8/31/2001 -0400, Fausting wrote:
>Tim wrote:
> >But, as with Kirchoff's point, the attacker is going to get the design
> >eventually.
>If getting the design "eventually" were good enough, why the keen interest
>in putting in a large order for the beta? There's a reason.
What's the rea
On Friday, August 31, 2001, at 11:43 AM, Faustine wrote:
> Tim wrote:
>
>> But, as with Kirchoff's point, the attacker is going to get the design
>> eventually.
>
> If getting the design "eventually" were good enough, why the keen
> interest
> in putting in a large order for the beta? There's a
> There are *no* tools which are useful *only* for powering down
> government.
Well, there are some *biased* tools.
Anuthing that builds real or virtual walls impedes the spread of monocultural
fungal infection (aka the government). The more power an entity has, the less
walls it needs. So wall-
On Fri, 31 Aug 2001, Faustine wrote:
> Tim wrote:
>
> >But, as with Kirchoff's point, the attacker is going to get the design
> >eventually.
>
> If getting the design "eventually" were good enough, why the keen interest
> in putting in a large order for the beta? There's a reason.
As I recall, t
On Friday, August 31, 2001, at 11:43 AM, Faustine wrote:
> Tim wrote:
>> But, as with Kirchoff's point, the attacker is going to get the design
>> eventually.
> If getting the design "eventually" were good enough, why the keen
> interest in putting in a large order for the beta? There's a reason.
To : [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Learn to read poopyhead (isn't that now the official CP insult?).
>
>Actually, I think the currently "hip" term would be "twit" :-)
>
Dunno, I've seen both recently. Just trying to live up to my slave
training and conform.
>> Look at the part you snipped :
>>
>> I'm
"An efficient Scheme for Proving a Shuffle", Crypto 2001, Jun Furukawa and
Kazue Sako (NEC Corporation), apparently could be used to show that a
remailer is processing all messages without revealing the header or contents
of any message. (Apparently because I haven't read the paper -- just heard
On Fri, Aug 31, 2001 at 11:59:04AM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Second, why do you think that when someone is a government employee they
> are automatically inferior to everyone in the private sector? That's
> irrational.
Right. Folks in the policy arms of the federal government can be quite
http://slashdot.org/articles/01/08/31/194207.shtml
--
--
natsugusa ya...tsuwamonodomo ga...yume no ato
summer grass...those mighty warriors'...dream-tracks
At 02:29 PM 8/31/01 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Some jobs do not attract the best and brightest but I think it's safe to
>assume that even in what you might consider the least likely places you
>will find some very sharp people. Your example of the Bush WH staffers
>is proof ;)
More seriousl
--
> > Whether Aimee is a fed or not, her quite genuine ignorance
> > made her incapable of knowing what views sounded
> > cypherpunkish, and what views sounded violently anti
> > cypherpunkish. If she is a fed, she probably also goes
> > around buying crack and pretending to be a thirte
gale has scaling problems to large numbers of users, in particular
for group messaging.
-derek
Eugene Leitl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Gale http://www.gale.org/ seems a well thought out infrastructure. Is the
> consensus "this is it", or have I missed any alternatives?
>
> TIA,
>
> -- Euge
> gale has scaling problems to large numbers of users, in particular
> for group messaging.
What doesn't? :)
Gale seems to have a better security story, but Jabber certainly has the
momentum and large force behind it.
Plus, it's XML so you *know* it's good.
/r$
--
Zolera Systems, You
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