On 9 July 2016 at 05:00, Swift Griggs wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
>> I can remember more functionality via WordStar keystrokes than I can via
>> vi ones! :-)
>
> That's the very reason I teach Vi in classes but privately still use Joe
> extensively. I prefer muscle-memory-macro
>>> [...] and directly write ANSI sequences, it'll just work.
>> (a) That is not my experience.
> I did acknowledge (but it was snipped in your reply---it's the
> missing footnote).
True enough.
> I've also checked the xterm use of DCS. I *still* don't understand
> where you would use those part
It was thus said that the Great Mouse once stated:
> > I've come to the conclusion [1] that terminfo and curses aren't
> > needed any more. If you target VT100 (or Xterm or any other
> > derivative) and directly write ANSI sequences, it'll just work.
>
> (a) That is not my experience.
I did ac
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Swift Griggs wrote:
Remember that scene in one of the Star Trek movies where he firsts
exclaims "You mean it's a MANUAL!" when he's told the computer he's
attempting to voice command won't respond ? You think he's going to fumble
with the keyboard then he starts typing so fast
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
> I can remember more functionality via WordStar keystrokes than I can via
> vi ones! :-)
That's the very reason I teach Vi in classes but privately still use Joe
extensively. I prefer muscle-memory-macro-keystrokes over what I'd call
"conscious modes". I
> I've come to the conclusion [1] that terminfo and curses aren't
> needed any more. If you target VT100 (or Xterm or any other
> derivative) and directly write ANSI sequences, it'll just work.
(a) That is not my experience.
(b) To the extent that it's true, it works only if you stick to a very
On 07/08/2016 01:42 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
> And, as I mentioned previously, it was quite common for secretaries
> moonlighting as typists to bring work in and use them after-hours.
> (sometimes with tacit approval from the boss! My boss gave me
> after-hours access to use 026 punches, ('course
It was thus said that the Great Chuck Guzis once stated:
>
> On occasion, I still use an editor that I wrote for CP/M and later
> ported to DOS. 11KB and it has lots of features that are peculiar to my
> preferences. I'd thought about porting it to Linux, but currently, it's
> still in assembly
It was thus said that the Great Paul Berger once stated:
> >
> The DOS editor I really like was originally call PE and an enhanced
> version "E" was shipped with later version of PC-DOS, there are also
> some clones of the editor floating around as well. I still use this
> editor regularly bec
[continued discussion from the URL that Evan posted]
If the MT/ST was released in 1964, then even with its high price, it
seems odd that so many years would go by before anybody used it for a
book manuscript.
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Paul Koning wrote:
I can think of any number of reasons. $10k, i
On 07/08/2016 12:33 PM, Paul Koning wrote:
> I may have missed it, but I haven't seen the IBM MT/ST mentioned.
> That's certainly a rather old system, dating back to 1964 according
> to Wikipedia, which says it's the oldest word processor (and
> references an article about WP history).
That was
What the hadn't looked at my cctalk messages in a few days and just
realized every subject line says my name. That is creepy.
> On Jul 8, 2016, at 3:43 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
>
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Paul Koning wrote:
>> I may have missed it, but I haven't seen the IBM MT/ST mentioned. That's
>> certainly a rather old system, dating back to 1964 according to Wikipedia,
>> which says it's the oldest word processor (and
On 2016-07-08 4:33 PM, Paul Koning wrote:
On Jul 8, 2016, at 3:13 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 07/08/2016 11:46 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
Before displaywriter the OP division of IBM produced the Office
system 6 which had a really cool inkjet printer as long as you
didn't have to fix them servic
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Paul Koning wrote:
I may have missed it, but I haven't seen the IBM MT/ST mentioned.
That's certainly a rather old system, dating back to 1964 according to
Wikipedia, which says it's the oldest word processor (and references an
article about WP history).
The original post
>
>
> There are or were lots of odd editors for the PC. IBM E was one --
> apparently it's quite like some mainframe tool. Came with PC-DOS and
> was... strange.
>
>
I liked EPM under OS/2, and had to get acquainted with TEDIT for disaster
recovery of same. I believe "E" under OS/2 was just a strip
> On Jul 8, 2016, at 3:13 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
>
> On 07/08/2016 11:46 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
>
>> Before displaywriter the OP division of IBM produced the Office
>> system 6 which had a really cool inkjet printer as long as you
>> didn't have to fix them service reps called them "Spray a
On 2016-07-08 4:28 PM, John Willis wrote:
There are or were lots of odd editors for the PC. IBM E was one --
apparently it's quite like some mainframe tool. Came with PC-DOS and
was... strange.
I liked EPM under OS/2, and had to get acquainted with TEDIT for disaster
recovery of same. I belie
I used, until my Windows XP days, an editor called Qedit. Q.exe It was
fast and one could edit columns as well as rows. This made it useful for
pre-parsing of data files.
I also used PEdit, an IBM program. I used to teach DisplayWrite 4 at the
IBM Customer Center in Wilmington, Delaware.
I mus
On 07/08/2016 11:46 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
> Before displaywriter the OP division of IBM produced the Office
> system 6 which had a really cool inkjet printer as long as you
> didn't have to fix them service reps called them "Spray and pray"
> They where not a thermal inkjet like most modern o
On 2016-07-08 3:45 PM, Liam Proven wrote:
On 8 July 2016 at 20:42, Chuck Guzis wrote:
There are or were lots of odd editors for the PC. IBM E was one --
apparently it's quite like some mainframe tool. Came with PC-DOS and
was... strange.
Originally, PC-DOS had only EDLIN, which, amazingly, was
On 2016-07-08 3:19 PM, Liam Proven wrote:
On 8 July 2016 at 20:00, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 07/08/2016 10:27 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
Only hardcore IBM customers used DisplayWrite. It had, naturally,
great support for IBM's (rather expensive but very solid) laser
printers, which were slightly com
On 8 July 2016 at 20:42, Chuck Guzis wrote:
>> There are or were lots of odd editors for the PC. IBM E was one --
>> apparently it's quite like some mainframe tool. Came with PC-DOS and
>> was... strange.
>
> Originally, PC-DOS had only EDLIN, which, amazingly, was *less* powerful
> than CP/M ED.
On 07/08/2016 11:19 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
> There are or were lots of odd editors for the PC. IBM E was one --
> apparently it's quite like some mainframe tool. Came with PC-DOS and
> was... strange.
Originally, PC-DOS had only EDLIN, which, amazingly, was *less* powerful
than CP/M ED.
"E" in
On 8 July 2016 at 20:00, Chuck Guzis wrote:
> On 07/08/2016 10:27 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
>
>
>> Only hardcore IBM customers used DisplayWrite. It had, naturally,
>> great support for IBM's (rather expensive but very solid) laser
>> printers, which were slightly competitive and popular around the e
On Fri, Jul 8, 2016 at 8:12 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
> But when I got my hands on early Macs and Windows 2 in my first job, I
> discovered the CUA model, and I've liked it ever since. I still miss
> CUA editing on the Linux command line.
>
> There are some: http://liam-on-linux.livejournal.com/4290
On 07/08/2016 10:27 AM, Liam Proven wrote:
> Only hardcore IBM customers used DisplayWrite. It had, naturally,
> great support for IBM's (rather expensive but very solid) laser
> printers, which were slightly competitive and popular around the end
> of the 1980s/beginning of the 1990s. Odd spi
On 8 July 2016 at 19:08, Chuck Guzis wrote:
>
> Wordstar allowed for "user routines" for various keyboard and display
> functions. I suspect you could have made any key or combination of keys
> do all sorts of strange things.
Ah, yes, I vaguely recall looking at that. But it was too much like
ha
On 07/08/2016 09:20 AM, Swift Griggs wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
>> WordStar commands for that operation would be: Mark beginning of
>> block: ^K B Mark end of block: ^K K (WordStar did not allow block
>> selection with the cursor keys.)
>
> AFAIK, original Wordstar didn't, but
On 8 July 2016 at 18:20, Swift Griggs wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
>> WordStar commands for that operation would be:
>> Mark beginning of block: ^K B
>> Mark end of block: ^K K
>> (WordStar did not allow block selection with the cursor keys.)
>
> AFAIK, original Wordstar didn't,
On 8 July 2016 at 18:15, Swift Griggs wrote:
> On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
>> WordStar commands are still used in some things, such as JOE.
>
> You are right and I use Joe daily, hmm, more like hourly. I'm typing this
> message in it, right now, in fact. It's my $EDITOR and default comp
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
> WordStar commands for that operation would be:
> Mark beginning of block: ^K B
> Mark end of block: ^K K
> (WordStar did not allow block selection with the cursor keys.)
AFAIK, original Wordstar didn't, but the Borland IDE and Joe does. Just
hold down ctrl
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016, Liam Proven wrote:
> WordStar commands are still used in some things, such as JOE.
You are right and I use Joe daily, hmm, more like hourly. I'm typing this
message in it, right now, in fact. It's my $EDITOR and default composition
editor in Alpine, my go-to mail client.
> H
On 8 July 2016 at 04:33, Rod Smallwood wrote:
> Ho Hum I ask understanding for seniors memory.
:-)
WordStar commands are still used in some things, such as JOE.
However, they went away before the GUI era and are mostly now
forgotten. Including by you! ;-)
WordPerfect replaced WordStar on DOS.
On 08/07/2016 01:28, Liam Proven wrote:
On 7 July 2016 at 20:31, Rod Smallwood wrote:
Try highlighting a word with shift and right arrow, then ctrlC.
Now move in your email and type crtlV.
Yes Wordstar keyboard commands are alive and well.
Nope. Sorry. Those aren't WordStar commands.
They
>> [modern "improvements" in monitor technology]
> Lord have mercy, just give me the damn pixels on 1/3rd of the monitor
> and give me the *option* to scale it if I want. Why is it so hard to
> understand that nobody wants to run an LCD in it's "non-native"
> resolution. It always looks like crap
On 8 July 2016 at 02:28, Liam Proven wrote:
> Then, use the cursor keys or to your destination position.
Sorry -- I meant to add in the WordStar character movement commands
but I forgot 'em. It has been about 25y since I last used it!
--
Liam Proven • Profile: http://lproven.livejournal.com/p
On 7 July 2016 at 20:31, Rod Smallwood wrote:
> Try highlighting a word with shift and right arrow, then ctrlC.
> Now move in your email and type crtlV.
>
> Yes Wordstar keyboard commands are alive and well.
Nope. Sorry. Those aren't WordStar commands.
They are CUA commands, adopted by more or
> From: Mouse
> "The most amazing achievement of the computer software industry is its
> continuing cancellation of the steady and staggering gains made by the
> computer hardware industry." - credited to Henry Petroski
There's a reason I run considerably older software (which I p
On Thu, 7 Jul 2016, Mouse wrote:
> I see it in monitors. I've been repeatedly annoyed by modern
> flatscreens that refuse to even try to do what CRTs from twenty years
> ago routinely did.
I'll pile on, too. I'm always grumbling about monitors that use some kind
of super-crap algorithm to scale
On 07/07/2016 02:45 PM, Mouse wrote:
> "The most amazing achievement of the computer software industry is
> its continuing cancellation of the steady and staggering gains made
> by the computer hardware industry." - credited to Henry Petroski by
> someone on a mud I hang out on.
I heard it from
> The effect of bloatware:
> http://hubpages.com/technology/_86_Mac_Plus_Vs_07_AMD_DualCore_You_Wont_Believe_Who_Wins
"Wordstar on an 4.077 MHz 8088 could keep up with my typing; WinWord
under Windoze on a 300 MHz PII can't." --Seth Breidbart
You can tell how old the quote is: it cites a PII/300.
On Thu, 7 Jul 2016, Chuck Guzis wrote:
> To this day, I still use "joe" as my all-around text editor under Linux
> and BSD. It uses mostly WS key conventions.
Same here. I love Joe. I got used to WS keystrokes from Borland compiler
suites. Incidentally, George R.R. Martin (author of the Song of
On 07/07/2016 01:53 PM, Terry Stewart wrote:
>> To this day, I still use "joe" as my all-around text editor under
>> Linux and BSD. It uses mostly WS key conventions.
>
> I remember using "Runoff" (for formatting text) and "Junior" (full
> screen editor) on a PRIME. Then there was "Mince" which
>To this day, I still use "joe" as my all-around text editor under Linux
>and BSD. It uses mostly WS key conventions.
I remember using "Runoff" (for formatting text) and "Junior" (full screen
editor) on a PRIME. Then there was "Mince" which I think was a "Junior"
port to the IBM-PC?
Terry (Tez)
On 07/07/2016 11:31 AM, Rod Smallwood wrote:
> ADM3A as a terminal and Diabolo Daisy as a printer. Forms on screen
> application and letter quality printing. Not to mention letter
> quality word processing single sheet feed etc.
The point is that word processing predates wide use of microproce
On 07/07/2016 18:57, Chuck Guzis wrote:
On 07/06/2016 07:15 PM, Murray McCullough wrote:
My first word processor was from Wang called “Word Processor” and
then IBM’s “Displaywriter”. I tried “Wordstar” originally called
“Wordmaster” but way too complicated.
The big oversight here is that nobo
On 07/06/2016 07:15 PM, Murray McCullough wrote:
> My first word processor was from Wang called “Word Processor” and
> then IBM’s “Displaywriter”. I tried “Wordstar” originally called
> “Wordmaster” but way too complicated.
The big oversight here is that nobody seems to collect old wapro stuff;
My first word processor was from Wang called “Word Processor” and then
IBM’s “Displaywriter”. I tried “Wordstar” originally called
“Wordmaster” but way too complicated. When desktop publishing came
along WYSIWYG printing was made possible - the writer’s true
handmaiden! In the microcomputer world,
[glitches and inaccuracies]
It talks about Isaac Asimov being given a TRS80 in 1983, and even has a
picture of a TRS80 model 1 (SAME picture as Wikipedia, without the
correct monitor, and missing the CPU/EI cable and no drives).
In 1983, the model 1 had been discontinued for years, completely
On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 8:15 AM, Mike Whalen
wrote:
> This was fascinating. Thanks for posting.
>
> On Tuesday, July 5, 2016, Evan Koblentz wrote:
>
> > All about some of the earliest people to write books using word
> processors.
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/0
This was fascinating. Thanks for posting.
On Tuesday, July 5, 2016, Evan Koblentz wrote:
> All about some of the earliest people to write books using word processors.
>
>
> http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/06/how-to-write-a-history-of-writing-software/489173/?platform=hootsuite
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