[Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Hello, When the talks about Sound Indicator started on this mailing list I had some ideas for what the applet could look like but I never got around drawing them. Now I have and I would like to ask what you think of them. They're essentially two variants of the same idea where the first mock-up is

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

How about a dinamic ordering in the indicator? So if I don't have any music player currently running (or playing), the an "active" application should appear first (for example, Firefox, or better even - VOIP application, such as empathy or Skype). If the "active" application doesn't support audio

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 11:04, Alex Lourie wrote: > How about a dinamic ordering in the indicator? > > So if I don't have any music player currently running (or playing), the an > "active" application should appear first (for example, Firefox, or better > even - VOIP application, such as empathy or Skype).

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: > On 3 May 2010 11:04, Alex Lourie wrote: > > How about a dinamic ordering in the indicator? > > > > So if I don't have any music player currently running (or playing), the > an > > "active" application should appear first (for example, Fire

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

I think it'd be better to keep the ordering static and alphabetical, in order to make it easier for users to establish muscle memory of how to use the menu. Nicholas Ipsen ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launc

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:31 PM, Nicholas Ipsen(Sephiroth_VII) < sephiroth7...@gmail.com> wrote: > I think it'd be better to keep the ordering static and alphabetical, in > order to make it easier for users to establish muscle memory of how to use > the menu. > > I don't agree. What if I have 10 a

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 05:44 PM, Alex Lourie wrote: > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:31 PM, Nicholas Ipsen(Sephiroth_VII) > mailto:sephiroth7...@gmail.com>> wrote: > > I think it'd be better to keep the ordering static and alphabetical, > in order to make it easier for users to establish muscle

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 11:44, Alex Lourie wrote: > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:31 PM, Nicholas Ipsen(Sephiroth_VII) > wrote: >> >> I think it'd be better to keep the ordering static and alphabetical, in >> order to make it easier for users to establish muscle memory of how to use >> the menu. >> > > I don't

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:57 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: > > I think we should limit the list to applications that are registered > in PulseAudio or that have registered themselves with the Sound > Indicator. It would have no use to have non-running applications in > the Sound Indicator. > Absolut

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 11:15, Alex Lourie wrote: > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: >> On 3 May 2010 11:04, Alex Lourie wrote: >> > How about a dinamic ordering in the indicator? >> > >> > So if I don't have any music player currently running (or playing), the >> > an >> > "active"

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 12:04, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > On 3 May 2010 11:15, Alex Lourie wrote: >> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: >>> On 3 May 2010 11:04, Alex Lourie wrote: >>> > How about a dinamic ordering in the indicator? >>> > >>> > So if I don't have any music playe

Re: [Ayatana] Finger Swipe Gadgets

Hi Jan ;) aaah, my favourite topic, AR ;) On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 03:44, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > > Or looking like he’s using Opera Face Gestures: > http://labs.opera.com/news/2009/04/01/ ;) > where did Compiz' AR feature go ( head tracking ) i'd like me some real 3d again.. what a shame.

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:04, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > If certain notifications are masked by loud music, there should be a > function to automatically slightly dim every other sound when a > notification is playing (in a subtle, not in an annoying way, of > course). > > yah, that would be

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 12:11, Sense Hofstede wrote: > On 3 May 2010 12:04, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: >> On 3 May 2010 11:15, Alex Lourie wrote: >>> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: On 3 May 2010 11:04, Alex Lourie wrote: > How about a dinamic ordering in the indicat

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Hello Sense: As far as I can see, in your mail you only mention using PulseAudio's functionality as the main justification for your design, which is a purely technical reason. We should rather start by thinking about use cases: what are people supposed to do with this functionality? My problem wi

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 06:54 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > On 3 May 2010 12:11, Sense Hofstede wrote: >> On 3 May 2010 12:04, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: >>> On 3 May 2010 11:15, Alex Lourie wrote: On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: > On 3 May 2010 11:04, A

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Yes, there is one use-case you're missing. If you've started a game(windowed), and, after you start playing, you want to listen to some music instead of the game's soundtrack. Instead of navigating a complex menu, you simply open the Sound Indicator and mute the game. Perhaps this would be most use

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Besides, this will also empower the user to do stuff with it we probably can't imagine, or maybe even see the point of. In short, it's certainly useful for me, and I'm sure others use this functionality as well. Nicholas Ipsen ___ Mailing list: https://l

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 07:03 PM, Martín Soto wrote: > Hello Sense: > > As far as I can see, in your mail you only mention using PulseAudio's > functionality as the main justification for your design, which is a > purely technical reason. We should rather start by thinking about use > cases: what ar

Re: [Ayatana] Reducing Resistance to Change

2010/4/30 Diego Moya > 2010/4/30 Martín Soto : > > The fact that human brains posses such a high plasticity, however, is no > > excuse for us not getting our act together. Whenever you change a UI, you > > will break someone's habituation to that UI. > > Not if you support both interactions, the

[Ayatana] Windicators

Hello! Starting a new topic to discuss the suggestions, comments, ideas regarding the windicators Mark blogged about. The idea seems awesome, but there are many minor details which require discussion in my opinion. Some of them were already noticed b

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

Hey, In terms of the sound indicators id like if all the sound levels could be controlled from the main sound indicator rather than having 2 sound level controls. So when an application that uses sound starts playing, another sound level bar is added with a description above it. Just an idea but I

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

2010/5/3 Martín Soto : > My problem with your design is that, as far as I can tell, the large > majority of people won't want to play more than one sound source at the same > time. You are watching a video, or playing some background musing, or > chatting with someone, but doing two or more of thes

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On 03/05/10 13:22, Roth Robert wrote: > Another tiny detail I have a problem with... having progress status > indicators on the top right side and having the transient status > message appear on the bottom left side seems strange... do the status > messages have to appear on the bottom left? Until

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 09:38 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > 2010/5/3 Martín Soto : >> My problem with your design is that, as far as I can tell, the large >> majority of people won't want to play more than one sound source at the same >> time. You are watching a video, or playing some backgrou

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Chow Loong Jin wrote: > I think listening to music while chatting is not rare at all. I do it, and > many > other people I know do the same. And considering how much noise was made > over > the one-application-rules-the-sound-card bug that existed prior to ALSA's >

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Can we all please completely not consider this odd idea that there is muscle memory for something like mousing around your desktop? Any mouse or track pad has limited area, and any normal user has plenty of muscle memory training them to be accurate using it in any minor or major way. Muscle memory

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 4:11 PM, Chow Loong Jin wrote: > Think of all those flashy annoying myspace pages that play music and don't > provide any controls. Do you honestly believe that all the video and audio > players out there embedded into web pages have volume controls? > > And what about all

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 10:17 PM, Martín Soto wrote: > > > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Chow Loong Jin > wrote: > > I think listening to music while chatting is not rare at all. I do > it, and many > other people I know do the same. And considering how m

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Monday 03,May,2010 10:22 PM, Martín Soto wrote: > > > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 4:11 PM, Chow Loong Jin > wrote: > > Think of all those flashy annoying myspace pages that play music and > don't > provide any controls. Do you honestly believe that all the

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

[I'm really sorry about this, GMail bit me while handling it!] 2010/5/3 Martín Soto > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 1:23 PM, Chow Loong Jin wrote: > > I have a habit of playing music (softly) while talking to friends on Skype >> due >> to my multitasking habits, and due to the fact that I can't really

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

I did not consider the toolbar being there as a problem, just like there was no problem with notifyOSD notifications appearing on the top of window controls, because when the user hovers the mouse over the notification, it becomes almost invisible, and it sits on top of the toolbar just for a few s

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 10:01 AM, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > On 03/05/10 13:22, Roth Robert wrote: >> Another tiny detail I have a problem with... having progress status >> indicators on the top right side and having the transient status >> message appear on the bottom left side seems strange... do

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

This depends from my point of view in the way 10.10 will integrate Gnome-Shell ... because if it will be the main window manager, than only mutter has to be supported as far as I know, because GS uses only mutter, and there is currently no possibility of changing the window manager, and there is n

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 16:19, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Can we all please completely not consider this odd idea that there is muscle > memory for something like mousing around your desktop? Any mouse or track > pad has limited area, and any normal user has plenty of muscle memory > training them to be accura

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

2010/5/3 Chow Loong Jin > There's a difference between "not so common," and "non-existent." I > understand > your concern that my use cases may be uncommon, but what you appeared to be > doing earlier was saying something like "well most people would do X, so > let's > assume that everyone acts t

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

Excuse that last one. I meant to send to all. This entire conversation is moot, in leiu of the windicators announcement. 2010/5/3 Martín Soto > > > 2010/5/3 Chow Loong Jin > > There's a difference between "not so common," and "non-existent." I >> understand >> your concern that my use cases ma

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

Which is sort of my point. It doesn't seem to me like Ubuntu is ever planning on using gnome-shell, or they wouldn't be duplicating work on the exact same areas of the desktop. On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 8:29 AM, Roth Robert wrote: > I agree, I'm not a Gnome Shell fan either, I like Gnome in its cur

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 5:23 PM, Sense Hofstede wrote: > Many people have said that adding all sound using applications is not > useful because they wouldn't use it. A few points: > * There is nothing that prevents you from ignoring the applications > in the list. In fact, I think we should make

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

I second everything said by Soto. Simplicity is a luxury that shouldn't be ignored. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchp

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

Rather then adding complexity, windicators Indicators are icons, different applications have different icons. http://meson.us/x/gnome/Nautilus.jpg --assume distro polish of course All the app needs is an minimize icon/close icon. The rest of the design is up to the app designer, who could can

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

I disagree. I think it will only be good for the user if we have consistent rules in the windicator area. Many mans can be moved their for simplification of control. I'm thinking we'll see a huge explosion of using rolled up windows again, as much functionality can be contained in this area. On Ma

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:45 AM, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > I disagree. I think it will only be good for the user if we have > consistent rules in the windicator area. Many mans can be moved their > for simplification of control. I'm thinking we'll see a huge explosion > of using rolled up windows aga

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

2010/5/3 Martín Soto wrote: > Providing tools people can install to satisfy specialized needs is the Right > Thing to Do (TM). Trying to support  specialized needs in the default user > interface at the expense of a large majority of users is just plain wrong. I agree, as long as installing specia

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

"I disagree. I think it will only be good for the user if we have consistent rules in the windicator area." Okay, I think I see what your getting at. This is good, and consistent rules are good at a programing level, however what you see directly in-front of you is also art, and there are places w

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On 3 May 2010 12:06, Dylan McCall wrote: > On the other hand, it may be interesting to explore shading as a > complete replacement to minimizing, though there's probably something > else to be done. If my history is right, earlier GUIs did shading > instead of having a window list to minimize to, b

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

To treat UI as art before usability is the worst idea ever. good, rational, usability focused design is target number one. Otherwise we will end up with exactly what we used to have in the notification area: chaos, dependent on the relative designs of app designers with different ideas of what is g

Re: [Ayatana] Work by project

Hi, I have made a two news mockups. The first is the overview with a new menu to manage projects. You can to drag and drop a project to the workspace you want. http://nsa15.casimages.com/img/2010/05/03/100503101754810934.png The second is a fullscreen mockup with a project activated. http://nsa15

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

"To treat UI as art before usability is the worst idea ever" woh there cowboy I didn't mean to take it that far. I just meant to say usability and art go hand in hand. Take the ipod scroll wheel for example, you know, what made apple famous to begin with. _

[Ayatana] "Unsaved state" and the Cloud

Mark commented on the Windicators presentation post about the convenience of an "unsaved" indicator for transient changes in a document. With the recent emphasis in Ubuntu ONE and data storage in the Cloud, I think a simple unsaved warning is not enough. The Windicators design gives us an opportun

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

"and there are places where art needs priority over rules" "I just meant to say usability and art go hand in hand" feel free to make up your mind. On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 11:05 AM, David Hamm wrote: > "To treat UI as art before usability is the worst idea ever" woh there > cowboy > I didn't mea

Re: [Ayatana] "Unsaved state" and the Cloud

imagine being able to open your contact list from the top right hotcorner, choose a contact and drag the app to the message box. Check the box that says fuse. This sends an email/im to the user and Ubuntu's share service now kicks in and syncs the applications like gwave. This is your share icon co

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

feel free to make up your mind. - my brain is in quantum flux. rules, like having icons for everything, ex. nautilus usability, like only having a home button on an iphone. Sorry for destroying the thread! :D I will try to proceed more quietly. btw. can't wait for ff4, it couldn't come soon enough

[Ayatana] Idea: windicator add-ons, an extensible window border

Hello, The idea of 'windicators' and the examples of their possible appliances that appears on Mark Shuttleworth's blog really intrigued me. The idea behind them is great and I would love to see them fully developed in one of the next Ubuntu releases. (Offline/online, UbuntuOne sharing, save-state

Re: [Ayatana] "Unsaved state" and the Cloud

On 3 May 2010 14:09, David Hamm wrote: > imagine being able to open your contact list from the top right > hotcorner, choose a contact and drag the app to the message box. Check > the box that says fuse. This sends an email/im to the user and > Ubuntu's share service now kicks in and syncs the app

Re: [Ayatana] "Unsaved state" and the Cloud

Actually, this is something I have very much been thinking about in terms of workspaces. I've been doing some polls and such (I'm one of the writers at omgubuntu.co.uk) and I've been working on a few mockups of hotcorner activated mini-apps that would work very well for simple tasks in place of evo

Re: [Ayatana] "Unsaved state" and the Cloud

nice to hear that! love to see it. On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 1:48 PM, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Actually, this is something I have very much been thinking about in terms of > workspaces. I've been doing some polls and such (I'm one of the writers at > omgubuntu.co.uk) and I've been working on a few mo

[Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

I recently installed Ubuntu 10.04 for a friend who had never used Ubuntu before. After the installation we were trying to remember the wifi password. We took an initial guess at the password, and were left confused about whether or not it worked. There was no feedback other than some animation i

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

Hey Scott, I actually find the network indication ok at the moment. When the bars are ascending its connecting, when there is no animation its connected, if its failed to connect the password dialog pops up. If you click on the icon it tells you what you are connected to and offers a disconnect be

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On Mon, 2010-05-03 at 15:43 -0700, Scott Ritchie wrote: > > In short, the process of connecting to the internet for the very first > time did not work very well, as the indicator in its current form is > simply failing to indicate what we needed to know. There is an outstanding design issue surr

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 7:10 PM, Martin Owens wrote: > We talked about it at UDS-L and the conclusion was: Network Manager > backend needs improving before designs can be done. > Do you have links to what backend work needed done? i've got some experience with nm's core and might be able to knock

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On 05/03/2010 04:15 PM, Alex Launi wrote: > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 7:10 PM, Martin Owens > wrote: > > We talked about it at UDS-L and the conclusion was: Network Manager > backend needs improving before designs can be done. > > > Do you have links to what back

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On Mon, 2010-05-03 at 19:15 -0400, Alex Launi wrote: > > Do you have links to what backend work needed done? i've got some > experience with nm's core and might be able to knock it out. I had to > do a lot of nm hacking at a job once. Here is the blueprint wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Blu

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On 05/03/2010 04:03 PM, Shane Fagan wrote: > Hey Scott, > > I actually find the network indication ok at the moment. When the bars > are ascending its connecting, when there is no animation its connected, > if its failed to connect the password dialog pops up. If you click on > the icon it tells y

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

2010/5/3 Martín Soto > > What I conclude from this is that putting a mixer-style interface in the > sound menu, as proposed originally is not a good idea, even for more or less > advanced use cases like this. What would be interesting is a mechanism for > pausing playback automatically when more u

Re: [Ayatana] How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 03:51, Scott Ritchie wrote: > On 05/03/2010 04:03 PM, Shane Fagan wrote: > > Hey Scott, > > > > I actually find the network indication ok at the moment. > this might be OT but let me say it: i think the indication is just fine, configuring a pppoe connection should be hand

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

2010/5/3 Frederik Nnaji > > > d) are indicators going to be obviously clickable buttons in the end? > > so far, indicators are dynamic informative icons, informing with the option > of interaction onClick. onRelease is only losely defined, onDrag not at all > as far as implementation is concerned.

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

I was going to post this as a comment on Mark's blog post but it's giving me a 404 when I hit submit. Sorry if I have repeated some things that have already been answered. Mark, Interesting idea and I'll reserve final judgement till I see it in action, or some clearer definitions of what would go

[Ayatana] BluePrints/OnlineStatus [was: How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?]

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 03:39, Martin Owens wrote: > > Here is the blueprint wiki page: > > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BluePrints/OnlineStatus > > It's got some cruft in there, but the basics are a set of tests that > when combined together produce a status. > thanks, Martin. a thought on this: can

Re: [Ayatana] Work by project

On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 19:51, Kao Chen wrote: > Hi, > I have made a two news mockups. > The first is the overview with a new menu to manage projects. > You can to drag and drop a project to the workspace you want. > http://nsa15.casimages.com/img/2010/05/03/100503101754810934.png > > The second

Re: [Ayatana] Two suggested designs for the Sound Indicator

On 3 May 2010 22:12, Gavin Langdon wrote: > One feature I like in at least the Gnome volume applet is the ability to use > the scrollwheel on it to change the master volume. Hopefully this would be > implemented as well. Just a comment. And one feature I miss is having a volume slider always shown

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On 3 May 2010 22:14, Benjamin Humphrey wrote: > Interesting idea and I'll reserve final judgement till I see it in action, > or some clearer definitions of what would go into the windicator space. I > have a few thinking points, however: I have some more questions. What will happen with windicator

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

Actually I believe Mark gave some pretty clear reasons why. They want the upper right to have a particular analogy, just like they want the upper left. Right is for notifications, volume, brightness, and similar controls, the left is for menus, opening and closing, and other window management. It r

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Tue, 2010-05-04 at 15:14 +1200, Benjamin Humphrey wrote: > - Would removing the status bar get rid of the grab handle for > resizing windows? I believe it would. It should, however, still be possible for developers to add resize handles using gtk.Window.begin_resize_drag. ___

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 1:09 AM, Luke Morton wrote: > I believe it would. It should, however, still be possible for developers > to add resize handles using gtk.Window.begin_resize_drag. > Yes, but it's crazy to ask every developer to implement resizing. That's * why* we have a window manager. I

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Tue, 2010-05-04 at 01:13 -0400, Alex Launi wrote: > On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 1:09 AM, Luke Morton > wrote: > I believe it would. It should, however, still be possible for > developers > to add resize handles using gtk.Window.begin_resize_drag. > > Yes, but it's crazy to a

Re: [Ayatana] BluePrints/OnlineStatus [was: How do I know when I'm connected to the network successfully?]

IMHO Online Status and IM availability should be separate indicators. The network is connectivity is much broader and for all applications (including checking for updates, browsing, many other services you may be using). It is also important to provide toggles for wireless for boarding airplains, b

Re: [Ayatana] Windicators

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 1:30 AM, Luke Morton wrote: > > Ambiance has a 1px border on the left and right--I don't think that's > enough to negate the case for a resize grip. As to your example, I find > resizing the terminal to be particularly frustrating. The tiny border is EXTREMELY annoying on