Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 07:04, Alex Lourie wrote: > Maybe think of another metaphor? I don't believe that tablet usability > issues should dictate > what happens on the desktop where we do have a keyboard and a mouse. yeah right, tablets alone are not enough reason to become real with clicking..

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

2010/5/23 Kristoffer Lundén > > The problem with all of those is that they are hard, and complicated. > Lassoing is somewhat fine for files next to each other, but not for a > distributed selection. For everything else, it becomes a two-hand operation > and I need to keep track of CTRL and SHIFT

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

2010/5/21 Mark Shuttleworth > > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and > shift-click to continue a selection along a list. > > I don't see a need for the checkboxes at all. And I definitely don't > lik

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders on Tablets

I agree that tablets should be treated as a special case and we should not dictate how the normal desktop should work. I see the following possibilities on tablets: 1. If it supports multitouch you could click and hold on the first item then select the rest by clicking on them while holding the fir

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 8:39 PM, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > Hello SABDFL ;) > > On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 12:28, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > > > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > > lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and > > shift-click to co

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Hello SABDFL ;) On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 12:28, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and > shift-click to continue a selection along a list. Of course we have keyboard shortcu

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I added Google Docs examples to the wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/DoubleClick ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.lau

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

long press should be reserved for menu's ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

How are you planning on allowing users to control click on touchscreens with no keyboard? On May 21, 2010, at 3:28 AM, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > Folks, I don't want to pour water on your flames but... > > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > lasso a set of icons

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, 2010-05-21 at 13:53 +0200, Joern Konopka wrote: > -Clicking opens the file as usual > -Click and Hold will select the File after a Timeout of 250 ms > -Double-Click! Since its "disabled" in Single-Click Mode it could be > used to select files too, that would make more sense than having it

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Okay, that was quite some input right now, i ran some loops in my brain and just thought "We need to make this simpler" So lets look at our targets again: - We want to be able to select multiple or single files conveniently - We dont wan't it to conflict with dragging a file - We don't want

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 13:25, Diego Moya wrote: > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/DoubleClick?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=FileSelectionMockupBottomNotice-3.PNG > > I've subverted the beautiful mockup created by Joern to show my idea. > The design doesn't include a checkbox, just the drag hand

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Select multiple files, then drag? This is no different in single click mode. On 21 May 2010 13:34, Alex Launi wrote: > How do you drag multiple files? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscrib

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

How do you drag multiple files? -- -- Alex Launi ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 21 May 2010 12:13, Diego Moya wrote: > Joern, your current design doesn't make clear what will happen if the > user clicks the area right under the checkbox. Will that open the file > or select the checkbox? Could you create a new mockup where that area > includes a vertical drag handle? https:

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

> I want to give a +1 on single click. When this thread started I was > hugely skeptical of the idea and dismissed it as absolute crap, but I > decided to give the entire thread a read through and my mind was > changed. I tested out single click on my machine, and it's pretty > good. It needs imp

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, 2010-05-21 at 11:25 +0100, Joe Lanman wrote: > I'm not sure a drag handle is really necessary - simply clicking and > dragging the file would seem the most straightforward interface, and > would add less visual clutter. Again - google docs is a good exmple of > this. Yes. You usually see

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 21 May 2010 12:28, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > Folks, I don't want to pour water on your flames but... > > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and > shift-click to continue a selection along a list. Th

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

sorry - forgot to reply-all > > We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to > lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and > shift-click to continue a selection along a list. > > I don't see a need for the checkboxes at all. And I definitely don't > lik

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 21 May 2010 11:44, Alex Launi wrote: > This looks awesome! But why do we need the dismiss all button? Shouldn't > just clicking into white sufficient? Having a button like that will give a > lot of users the impression that that's the only way to deselect files, when > really it's a kind of inef

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Folks, I don't want to pour water on your flames but... We already have mechanisms for multiple selection, with dragging to lasso a set of icons, ctrl-click to select an arbitrary set, and shift-click to continue a selection along a list. I don't see a need for the checkboxes at all. And I defini

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I'm not sure a drag handle is really necessary - simply clicking and dragging the file would seem the most straightforward interface, and would add less visual clutter. Again - google docs is a good exmple of this. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 21 May 2010 11:52, Alex Launi wrote: > Some concern has been raised about the discoverability of drag, this might > be crack but what if on hover we did something like what is shown in Joern > Konopk's mockup[0], but part of what appears on hover is something that > resembles a window border/tit

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Some concern has been raised about the discoverability of drag, this might be crack but what if on hover we did something like what is shown in Joern Konopk's mockup[0], but part of what appears on hover is something that resembles a window border/title bar. Users already know that they can drag t

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 10:24 PM, David Hamm wrote: > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1890515/FileSelectionMockup1.png > surprisingly sexy. > > I want to give a +1 on single click. When this thread started I was hugely skeptical of the idea and dismissed it as absolute crap, but I decided to give the ent

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

> > > http://blogs.georgiasouthern.edu/googleapps/files/2010/01/chb3q7hq_200drc9c7f8_b1.png > > This allows easy de-selection, and other actions such as renaming > I think thats a good idea too, even though its pretty much only recreating the right-click options its very accessible to Users and co

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I think Google Docs is a good reference point for single click - and one important aspect of their UI is an action bar at the top: http://blogs.georgiasouthern.edu/googleapps/files/2010/01/chb3q7hq_200drc9c7f8_b1.png This allows easy de-selection, and other actions such as renaming _

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I think having a status message with the number of selected items at the bottom is good, because this is a result of your action. Action on top, result on bottom. A Deselect All command right next to that message makes sense because of the very close relation. You can think of this unit of message

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I forgot to add something, sure we could use a Windicator for Selected Files, but i think we still should deliver something like the Notice in the Mockups, the Notice's only purpose is to cancel the Selection anyways, so its just a quick click if you mess up your Selection or change your mind. The

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Okay, two new Mockups. The First One removes the Bottom Bar in Favor of a Chrome-Style Notice for the File Selection: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1890515/FileSelectionMockupBottomNotice.png The Second One uses a Top Notice for File Selection, also it gives a little clue on how the hovered Icons would

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Personally I would prefer the status bar to be similar to chrome, appear on select. Note:http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1890515/FileSelectionMockup1.png the highlighting of the box instead of icon/text is similar to windows (this is a good thing) I say change nothing, be dam awesome to see something lik

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

A windicator, perhaps? Isn't the entire status bar supposed to basically disappear? On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 8:24 PM, Luke Morton wrote: > On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 19:00 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > > Great mockup! I like the look of it. > > I agree. Nice work. > > Could you do another one keeping

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 19:00 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Great mockup! I like the look of it. I agree. Nice work. Could you do another one keeping the current Nautilus visuals for selected items? (I.e. just put a background colour on the text, tint the icon and add the checkbox.) > On May 20

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1890515/FileSelectionMockup1.png surprisingly sexy. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/L

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Great mockup! I like the look of it. On May 20, 2010, at 6:47 PM, Joern Konopka wrote: I created a little Mockup so we get a feel of what it might look like with the CheckBoxes, additionally i added a "Dismiss all" Button to the Bottom of the Window. You`ll find the Mockup here: http://dl.drop

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I created a little Mockup so we get a feel of what it might look like with the CheckBoxes, additionally i added a "Dismiss all" Button to the Bottom of the Window. You`ll find the Mockup here: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1890515/FileSelectionMockup1.png -- Why don't you start at the begi

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 23:19 +0200, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > On 2010-05-20, David Hamm wrote: > > Mouse modes > > sounds bad already :p > > hahaaah yop. > that's why i don't support the idea anymore.. > > so what would y'all vote for? > Checkboxes? GNOME guidelines on this kind of stuff? Definit

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 2010-05-20, David Hamm wrote: > Mouse modes > sounds bad already :p hahaaah yop. that's why i don't support the idea anymore.. so what would y'all vote for? Checkboxes? GNOME guidelines on this kind of stuff? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Mouse modes sounds bad already :p On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 10:23 AM, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 01:38, Joern Konopka wrote: >> a) Just wanted to know if i got this right, by Menu Option you mean >> something like Edit->Select Files in the Nautilus Menu that acts like: >> -Dis

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 01:38, Joern Konopka wrote: > a) Just wanted to know if i got this right, by Menu Option you mean > something like Edit->Select Files in the Nautilus Menu that acts like: > -Disable File Opening and enable File Selection in the current Folder > Like that? i suggested a sma

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 01:45, David Hamm wrote: > b)Bottom's up- > I'm really just throwing scant remarks out there as if to spark other > possibilities. > > a)Menu Option (select mode) > could even be, and option to switch to a double click kinda thing. ex. > single clicking to select/deselect,

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

seeing as single click is grasping hold, check-box's aren't far off. Kde's way of having the plus icon would seem to be a good way to do this, either plus or a checkbox. This is probably the best way to do it, however I must ask if maybe a menu option (select files) or a bottom popup of some sort

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

i s love the checkbox idea for selecting list/compact view! ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

BTW, the user response from those who have read my blog and made the switch seems overwhelmingly positive. A lot of people are permanently making the switch, so we have a lot of valid reason to pursue further implementation. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:52 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < inqu...@googl

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 17 May 2010 02:37, Jan-Christoph Borchardt wrote: > Thanks to everyone contributing to the discussion. But please, before > you answer or link to this, read/link the wiki page Thorsten Wilms > created for this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/DoubleClick > > Our essential findings should be wri

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

oops On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 7:37 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < inqu...@googlemail.com> wrote: > On 18 May 2010 14:59, Akshat Jain wrote: > > An interested workaround can be that we diable clicking on the same item > for > > 1 or 2 seconds so that heavy double-clickers will not open two windows

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 18 May 2010 14:59, Akshat Jain wrote: > An interested workaround can be that we diable clicking on the same item for > 1 or 2 seconds so that heavy double-clickers will not open two windows > instead of one.Problem Solved. Please, read the entire thread before you answer: On 13 May 2010 02:1

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

An interested workaround can be that we diable clicking on the same item for 1 or 2 seconds so that heavy double-clickers will not open two windows instead of one.Problem Solved. -- I am 13 year old and make a lot of typos. I am a non-native english speaker. I will never answer emails half-aslee

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 17 May 2010 07:41, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:39 PM, Rob Greer wrote: >> >> Would Windows XP info be useful or only current versions of OSes? >> > Probably anything but vista would be helpful... jk. > I'd imagine even older OS's would be pertinent, given how many people

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Probably anything but vista would be helpful... jk. I'd imagine even older OS's would be pertinent, given how many people still use XP. If they had a particularly different way of doing things, it'd be good to know about. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:39 PM, Rob Greer wrote: > Would Windows XP inf

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Would Windows XP info be useful or only current versions of OSes? On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 01:36, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > I just added info about windows 7. > > On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < > inqu...@googlemail.com> wrote: > >> On 17 May 2010 04:42, Rob Greer wrote:

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I just added info about windows 7. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < inqu...@googlemail.com> wrote: > On 17 May 2010 04:42, Rob Greer wrote: > > Tell me what in particular we need screenshots of and I'll grab em. > > How the system is indicating possible file operations

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 17 May 2010 04:42, Rob Greer wrote: > Tell me what in particular we need screenshots of and I'll grab em. How the system is indicating possible file operations like selecting, dragging etc. in single click mode (probably on hover). I already added 5 screenshots of KDE’s Dolphin with a short d

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

how precisely do we get screenshots of single clicks over double clicks? :P On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 7:42 PM, Rob Greer wrote: > Tell me what in particular we need screenshots of and I'll grab em. > > > On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 20:37, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < > inqu...@googlemail.com> wrote: >

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Tell me what in particular we need screenshots of and I'll grab em. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 20:37, Jan-Christoph Borchardt < inqu...@googlemail.com> wrote: > Thanks to everyone contributing to the discussion. But please, before > you answer or link to this, read/link the wiki page Thorsten Wilms

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Thanks to everyone contributing to the discussion. But please, before you answer or link to this, read/link the wiki page Thorsten Wilms created for this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/DoubleClick Our essential findings should be written down there and read first to minimize redundant discussion

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, 2010-05-16 at 22:37 +0200, Remco wrote: > On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 22:15, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > > Only incidentally. The primary way of opening a file in the open dialog, and > > the way I see mothers, fathers, and the basically uninformed using it, is by > > selecting then pushing the op

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 22:15, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Only incidentally. The primary way of opening a file in the open dialog, and > the way I see mothers, fathers, and the basically uninformed using it, is by > selecting then pushing the open button, not double clicking. I've actually > had peop

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Only incidentally. The primary way of opening a file in the open dialog, and the way I see mothers, fathers, and the basically uninformed using it, is by selecting then pushing the open button, not double clicking. I've actually had people freak out by how quick I get through that navigation, becau

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Switching the behavior in Nautilus to single click causes inconsistency with the Open File dialog of any application. The Open File dialog of Firefox, OO.org, etc still uses the traditional double click.

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 17:52, Alex Lourie wrote: > > OK. So I guess it's pointless to tell again my opinion on the subject. > Your concern is also mine, still, this thread is a creative approach at a new vision - let's not rattle against it too much (see Walt Disney Method) [1]. > Here's an i

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 6:38 PM, Jeremy Bicha wrote: > In response to this thread, I turned on single click mode and found it to > be quite usable once it was explained how to do things. Even though it goes > against what Mac, Windows, and most Linux distributions are doing, I think > this single

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Jeremy Bicha wrote: > In response to this thread, I turned on single click mode and found it to > be quite usable once it was explained how to do things. Even though it goes > against what Mac, Windows, and most Linux distributions are doing, I think > this single

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

In response to this thread, I turned on single click mode and found it to be quite usable once it was explained how to do things. Even though it goes against what Mac, Windows, and most Linux distributions are doing, I think this single click file management thing could be a smart decision. It's su

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

yeah, they even have a "like" button, loving the site, i didn't go there that often: On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 11:33, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > I've taken the liberties of taking this to a much larger group of > contributers on OMG! Ubuntu! to get some feedback from a nice and large > audience of end

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I've taken the liberties of taking this to a much larger group of contributers on OMG! Ubuntu! to get some feedback from a nice and large audience of end-users. http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/05/ayatana-and-single-click-navigation.html

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 23:01, Alex Lourie wrote: > > On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 7:51 PM, Frederik Nnaji > wrote: > >> >> User testing has revealed that single click comes more intuitively to >> users than double click. >> >> > Would you care to elaborate on that? What user testing? > okay you cau

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 12:07 AM, David Hamm wrote: > As a matter of dignity and manly pride I challenge you, Alex Lourie, > to open nautilus>edit>preferences>behavior>single click, for a week. > And after that week, comeback and complain! > > btw. the whole freaking internet is single click. psh

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I'm changing my computer to single click to see what I think. On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 2:07 PM, David Hamm wrote: > As a matter of dignity and manly pride I challenge you, Alex Lourie, > to open nautilus>edit>preferences>behavior>single click, for a week. > And after that week, comeback and compl

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

As a matter of dignity and manly pride I challenge you, Alex Lourie, to open nautilus>edit>preferences>behavior>single click, for a week. And after that week, comeback and complain! btw. the whole freaking internet is single click. psh. On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 2:01 PM, Alex Lourie wrote: > > On

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 7:51 PM, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > > User testing has revealed that single click comes more intuitively to users > than double click. > > Would you care to elaborate on that? What user testing? 90% of computers used today (Windows) using double click, another 5% of Mac using

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

ps. select on hover-over (for devices w/ keyboards) is kinda necessary if we switch to single click, which i'm all for btw. the only thing that can enslave a person, is another person. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayata

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 08:47, SorinN wrote: > On the topic of double click or single click - the user should choose > not others. Open Source should not became a prison. > you are absolutely correct. that's why there are other distributions and desktop environments out there. we are merely disc

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

"The more options and questions and choices we present to the user, the less they will want to know about *any* of them." btw, you have seen the power menu right? .right, back to single click discussion. I'd say get everyone round the office to set single click and have a vote after a week. reaso

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 15/05/10 07:47, SorinN wrote: > On the topic of double click or single click - the user should choose > not others. Open Source should not became a prison. > Imagine if we presented choices to a new user, for all the options available to them. The install would take hours (choosing between a

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

ubject: Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders > > On the topic of double click or single click - the user should choose > not others. Open Source should not became a prison. > > 2010/5/12 Jan-Christoph Borchardt : > > What about that? Are there any pla

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On the topic of double click or single click - the user should choose not others. Open Source should not became a prison. 2010/5/12 Jan-Christoph Borchardt : > What about that? Are there any plans already to default to single > click for opening files and folders in Ubuntu? > > It is way more intu

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

At first I was against this idea but after trying Kubuntu I am in favour of this idea,It only took me a few minutes to be adjusted.I tried this 10 people(old people and 4-6 year old children)who had never used computers and they were comfortable with single click but had problems with Double-Click

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 3:51 AM, Conscious User wrote: > > > I mentioned doing usability tests. My point is that the most used > > should be the most easily accessible. Does anyone disagree on that? > > The discussion is not boolean. It is not about disagreeing or not > that it should be easy, but

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 14/05/10 14:48, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > On May 14, 2010, at 4:00 AM, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > > >> On Fri, 2010-05-14 at 11:58 +0200, Conscious User wrote: >> >> >>> Again, I think some of you are giving *way* too much importance >>> to "most used" and treating it as if it meant the same

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On May 14, 2010, at 4:00 AM, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > On Fri, 2010-05-14 at 11:58 +0200, Conscious User wrote: > >> Again, I think some of you are giving *way* too much importance >> to "most used" and treating it as if it meant the same as "the >> only one used". > > Like way too often, this read

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Fri, 2010-05-14 at 11:58 +0200, Conscious User wrote: > Again, I think some of you are giving *way* too much importance > to "most used" and treating it as if it meant the same as "the > only one used". Like way too often, this read is running in circles now. I would like to suggest to just st

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

> I mentioned doing usability tests. My point is that the most used > should be the most easily accessible. Does anyone disagree on that? The discussion is not boolean. It is not about disagreeing or not that it should be easy, but about *how* easy it should be. One thing that is being forgotten

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 14 May 2010 11:58, Conscious User wrote: >> A valid point I got from a Mac user: Selecting the file to use quick >> look is more often used than actually opening the file (because it is >> quicker …). That would be a problem if we actually had quick look or >> another kind of preview. ;) > > Ag

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

> A valid point I got from a Mac user: Selecting the file to use quick > look is more often used than actually opening the file (because it is > quicker …). That would be a problem if we actually had quick look or > another kind of preview. ;) Again, I think some of you are giving *way* too much

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On 14 May 2010 02:18, Sohail Mirza wrote: > On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Luke Morton > wrote: >> Nothing's lost, but learnt behaviours would have to change. > > Changing learnt behaviours is easier said than done! That is exactly why interaction needs to be intuitive and not require learning

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 14:20 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Perhaps read the rest of the conversation and you will read all the > previous examples of difficulty with some functions. You said impossible. Now suddenly it's "difficulty". It would help this list tremendously if everyone tried to be p

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I'm sorry if I misunderstood your position. Thanks for the clarification. :) On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 8:35 PM, Luke Morton wrote: > On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 20:18 -0400, Sohail Mirza wrote: > > Changing learnt behaviours is easier said than done! > > I agree. > > > A cost of this change is the frus

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 20:18 -0400, Sohail Mirza wrote: > Changing learnt behaviours is easier said than done! I agree. > A cost of this change is the frustration of users who are accustomed > to Windows' default behaviour at their workplace, or at home. This is > potentially a level of frustrati

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 5:37 PM, Luke Morton wrote: > Nothing's lost, but learnt behaviours would have to change. > Changing learnt behaviours is easier said than done! A cost of this change is the frustration of users who are accustomed to Windows' default behaviour at their workplace, or at h

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 15:26 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > > How in the world is highlight selecting folders for copying or moving > supposed to be easier on the user? I never said selecting a folder for copying or moving would be easier. In fact, I said the methods for doing so (some of them) wo

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

How in the world is highlight selecting folders for copying or moving supposed to be easier on the user? Further, what I said was "in the curren icon mode" as in, if we are going to do this, we have to rethink everything about it, not just changing open to a single click. As in, we have to rethink

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 14:36 +0200, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 12:02, Remco wrote: > On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 11:29, Alex Lourie > wrote: > > So how would a simple selection be solved? If I want to > select a file or a > > folder, I singl

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 18:12 +0200, Frederik Nnaji wrote: > On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 17:50, Jan-Christoph Borchardt > > how do i know that what i am touching can be moved? At the moment you don't, but overlays could fix that. > how do i know that i'm selecting it, At the moment your cursor is an

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 11:14 -0700, David Hamm wrote: > For the short term I would copy windows7 to the T. > Hovering over and icon selects it. The overlay idea seems sound to me. It would have the added advantage of making draging, etc far more easily discovered. > For the long run I would consi

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 11:18 +0200, Conscious User wrote: > I'm not talking about selecting an item first and then initiating > a drag. I'm talking about starting a drag *without wondering > whether you will activate the link or not*. I've never had that problem. But if you have, then I guess other

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

Perhaps read the rest of the conversation and you will read all the previous examples of difficulty with some functions. On May 13, 2010, at 1:18 PM, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 13:02 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: >> Good usability does not mean we aim for the lowest possible >>

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 16:34 +0200, Conscious User wrote: > > > honestly, please name the use cases for file operations. > > i want to see thumbs for photos, not filenames. > > i want to read metadata (artist, album, title, artwork) for songs. I thought long and hard about the use cases for wantin

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

On Thu, 2010-05-13 at 13:02 -0700, Tyler Brainerd wrote: > Good usability does not mean we aim for the lowest possible > denominator, it means we find the most usable possibility. This sentence seems to be devoid of actual sense. > in the current icon mode of layout, simply switching to single >

Re: [Ayatana] Default to single click to open files and folders

I'm curious to how "pure" this discussion is. Is the aim of Ayatana simply to provide the most intuitive design ever, or does it take into account how things are done in Windows and Mac and make reservation for it? Single-click to open is the reason I immediately dismissed Mepis in 2005 and ended

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