[USRP-users] UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Olo via USRP-users]

Hello,
Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in .pro file 
(using qmake) UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files to my project with 
boost (1.82.0) library and I cant do pretty mutch anything. I tried to list all 
devices and I cant event set uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got exeption 
there (Stopped in thread 0 by: Exception at ... read access violation ...). The 
examples in UHD folder works great. Please dont be mad at me because of my 
english or lack of info but I fell like Im really lost at this point.

my SW:
-windows 10
-Qt 5.12.2
-msvc2019 x64
-uhd 4.3.0.0
-boost 1.82.0

Thanks for any response.
Olo

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[USRP-users] E320 not powering on

[Maria Muñoz]

Hi all,

I have a problem trying to power up the USRP E320.

When I push the power button, the power led doesn't light up and the eth
leds blink for a few seconds and then shut down. This is not the first time
this has happened to an E320 device (for the other cases I recovered them
by pushing the button longer or enter to the serial port to reboot) but now
it seems like trying the things I did before does not work.
I connect the serial port to my PC and see this every time I push the
button:

- ARM CPU (stuck in that step)
[image: image.png]
- Microcontroller:
[image: c5f7ed4f-ad15-4a5c-b126-28bed47bb253.png]

The ARM CPU does not allow me to log in, but from the microcontroller, I
can run commands. I try to reboot the device from it, but it always says
this line:
[image: image.png]

Is this a known issue? I haven't tried anything strange, I always shut them
from the ssh connection so this happens by chance. I'm sure it is not
broken just stuck in the boot state, but I don't know which are the right
steps to start it up.
Any help will be appreciated.

Kind Regards,
Maria
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[USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Marcus Müller]

Hi Olo,

nobody's going to be mad at you because of your English, which, by the way, is very good! 
English isn't my first language, either :) Welcome to the USRP developer community.


So, let's tackle this one by one:

If you take the code from init_usrp.cpp [1] and try to compile it in your project instead 
of your own code, does it also segfault?


If not, then we need to look at your code.

If yes, then we need to look at your compilation settings. I'm not a Windows user myself, 
but I remember (at least older) MSVC was not happy when you mix debug builds of libraries 
and release builds of software, or vice versa.


Best regards,
Marcus

[1] https://github.com/EttusResearch/uhd/tree/UHD-4.3/host/examples/init_usrp

On 17.04.23 09:18, Olo via USRP-users wrote:


Hello,
Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in .pro file (using 
qmake)  UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files to my project with boost (1.82.0) 
library and I cant do pretty mutch anything. I tried to list all devices and I cant 
event set uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got exeption there (Stopped in thread 0 by: 
Exception at ... read access violation ...). The examples in UHD folder works great. 
Please dont be mad at me because of my english or lack of info but I fell like Im really 
lost at this point.


my SW:
-windows 10
-Qt 5.12.2
-msvc2019 x64
-uhd 4.3.0.0
-boost 1.82.0

Thanks for any response.
Olo

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[USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Olo via USRP-users]

I copied init_usrp.cpp to ConsoleApplication in visual studio and in properties 
I set Configuration properties >> C/C++ >> Additional Include Directories:
C:\Program Files\UHD\include
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0

Configuration properties >> Linker >> General:

C:\UHD\lib
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0\lib64-msvc-14.3

Configuration properties >> Linker >> Input:

uhd.lib

It got me:
Exception thrown at 0x7FFCCAC64065 (uhd.dll) in ConsoleApplication1.exe: 
0xC005: Access violation reading location 0x0039A1F2.

I think there will be problem with my libraries. The UHD I installed via 
bianaries 
https://files.ettus.com/binaries/uhd/latest_release/4.3.0.0/Windows-10-x64/
and the boost same 
https://sourceforge.net/projects/boost/files/boost-binaries/1.82.0/.

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--- Original Message ---
On Monday, April 17th, 2023 at 10:14, Marcus Müller  
wrote:

> Hi Olo,
>
> nobody's going to be mad at you because of your English, which, by the way, 
> is very good! English isn't my first language, either :) Welcome to the USRP 
> developer community.
>
> So, let's tackle this one by one:
>
> If you take the code from init_usrp.cpp [1] and try to compile it in your 
> project instead of your own code, does it also segfault?
>
> If not, then we need to look at your code.
>
> If yes, then we need to look at your compilation settings. I'm not a Windows 
> user myself, but I remember (at least older) MSVC was not happy when you mix 
> debug builds of libraries and release builds of software, or vice versa.
>
> Best regards,
> Marcus
>
> [1] https://github.com/EttusResearch/uhd/tree/UHD-4.3/host/examples/init_usrp
>
> On 17.04.23 09:18, Olo via USRP-users wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>> Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in .pro file 
>> (using qmake) UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files to my project with 
>> boost (1.82.0) library and I cant do pretty mutch anything. I tried to list 
>> all devices and I cant event set uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got 
>> exeption there (Stopped in thread 0 by: Exception at ... read access 
>> violation ...). The examples in UHD folder works great. Please dont be mad 
>> at me because of my english or lack of info but I fell like Im really lost 
>> at this point.
>>
>> my SW:
>> -windows 10
>> -Qt 5.12.2
>> -msvc2019 x64
>> -uhd 4.3.0.0
>> -boost 1.82.0
>>
>> Thanks for any response.
>> Olo
>>
>> Sent with [Proton Mail](https://proton.me/) secure email.
>>
>> ___
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>> usrp-users@lists.ettus.com
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[USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Marcus Müller]

Interesting! Can you run it in debugger, to see in which call/where 
exactly it crashes?


On 4/17/23 11:10, Olo via USRP-users wrote:
I copied init_usrp.cpp to ConsoleApplication in visual studio and in 
properties I set Configuration properties >> C/C++ >> Additional 
Include Directories:

C:\Program Files\UHD\include
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0

Configuration properties >> Linker >> General:
C:\UHD\lib
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0\lib64-msvc-14.3

Configuration properties >> Linker >> Input:
uhd.lib

It got me:
Exception thrown at 0x7FFCCAC64065 (uhd.dll) in 
ConsoleApplication1.exe: 0xC005: Access violation reading location 
0x0039A1F2.



I think there will be problem with my libraries. The UHD I installed 
via bianaries 
https://files.ettus.com/binaries/uhd/latest_release/4.3.0.0/Windows-10-x64/
and the boost same 
https://sourceforge.net/projects/boost/files/boost-binaries/1.82.0/.



Sent with Proton Mail  secure email.

--- Original Message ---
On Monday, April 17th, 2023 at 10:14, Marcus Müller 
 wrote:



Hi Olo,

nobody's going to be mad at you because of your English, which, by 
the way, is very good! English isn't my first language, either :) 
Welcome to the USRP developer community.


So, let's tackle this one by one:

If you take the code from init_usrp.cpp [1] and try to compile it in 
your project instead of your own code, does it also segfault?


If not, then we need to look at your code.

If yes, then we need to look at your compilation settings. I'm not a 
Windows user myself, but I remember (at least older) MSVC was not 
happy when you mix debug builds of libraries and release builds of 
software, or vice versa.


Best regards,
Marcus

[1] 
https://github.com/EttusResearch/uhd/tree/UHD-4.3/host/examples/init_usrp


On 17.04.23 09:18, Olo via USRP-users wrote:


Hello,
Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in 
.pro file (using qmake) UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files 
to my project with boost (1.82.0) library and I cant do pretty mutch 
anything. I tried to list all devices and I cant event set 
uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got exeption there (Stopped in 
thread 0 by: Exception at ... read access violation ...). The 
examples in UHD folder works great. Please dont be mad at me because 
of my english or lack of info but I fell like Im really lost at this 
point.


my SW:
-windows 10
-Qt 5.12.2
-msvc2019 x64
-uhd 4.3.0.0
-boost 1.82.0

Thanks for any response.
Olo

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[USRP-users] Re: E320 not powering on

[Marcus D. Leech]

On 17/04/2023 03:51, Maria Muñoz wrote:

Hi all,

I have a problem trying to power up the USRP E320.

When I push the power button, the power led doesn't light up and the 
eth leds blink for a few seconds and then shut down. This is not the 
first time this has happened to an E320 device (for the other cases I 
recovered them by pushing the button longer or enter to the serial 
port to reboot) but now it seems like trying the things I did before 
does not work.
I connect the serial port to my PC and see this every time I push the 
button:


- ARM CPU (stuck in that step)
image.png
- Microcontroller:
c5f7ed4f-ad15-4a5c-b126-28bed47bb253.png

The ARM CPU does not allow me to log in, but from the microcontroller, 
I can run commands. I try to reboot the device from it, but it always 
says this line:

image.png

Is this a known issue? I haven't tried anything strange, I always shut 
them from the ssh connection so this happens by chance. I'm sure it is 
not broken just stuck in the boot state, but I don't know which are 
the right steps to start it up.

Any help will be appreciated.

Kind Regards,
Maria

I don't have an E320, so this is a "shot in the dark" type of 
answer--you could try refreshing the system image:


https://kb.ettus.com/E320_Getting_Started_Guide#Updating_the_files_system_by_writing_the_disk_image


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[USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Marcus Müller]

Oh, interesting, I would have expected it to crash *inside* one of these 
functions. Huh!



On 4/17/23 13:54, Olo wrote:

It crash in 37th row, which is :
uhd::usrp::multi_usrp::sptr usrp = uhd::usrp::multi_usrp::make(args);



Sent with Proton Mail secure email.

--- Original Message ---
On Monday, April 17th, 2023 at 13:43, Marcus Müller  
wrote:



Interesting! Can you run it in debugger, to see in which call/where
exactly it crashes?

On 4/17/23 11:10, Olo via USRP-users wrote:


I copied init_usrp.cpp to ConsoleApplication in visual studio and in
properties I set Configuration properties >> C/C++ >> Additional
Include Directories:
C:\Program Files\UHD\include
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0

Configuration properties >> Linker >> General:
C:\UHD\lib
D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0\lib64-msvc-14.3

Configuration properties >> Linker >> Input:
uhd.lib

It got me:
Exception thrown at 0x7FFCCAC64065 (uhd.dll) in
ConsoleApplication1.exe: 0xC005: Access violation reading location
0x0039A1F2.

I think there will be problem with my libraries. The UHD I installed
via bianaries
https://files.ettus.com/binaries/uhd/latest_release/4.3.0.0/Windows-10-x64/
and the boost same
https://sourceforge.net/projects/boost/files/boost-binaries/1.82.0/.

Sent with Proton Mail https://proton.me/ secure email.

--- Original Message ---
On Monday, April 17th, 2023 at 10:14, Marcus Müller
marcus.muel...@ettus.com wrote:


Hi Olo,

nobody's going to be mad at you because of your English, which, by
the way, is very good! English isn't my first language, either :)
Welcome to the USRP developer community.

So, let's tackle this one by one:

If you take the code from init_usrp.cpp [1] and try to compile it in
your project instead of your own code, does it also segfault?

If not, then we need to look at your code.

If yes, then we need to look at your compilation settings. I'm not a
Windows user myself, but I remember (at least older) MSVC was not
happy when you mix debug builds of libraries and release builds of
software, or vice versa.

Best regards,
Marcus

[1]
https://github.com/EttusResearch/uhd/tree/UHD-4.3/host/examples/init_usrp

On 17.04.23 09:18, Olo via USRP-users wrote:


Hello,
Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in
.pro file (using qmake) UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files
to my project with boost (1.82.0) library and I cant do pretty mutch
anything. I tried to list all devices and I cant event set
uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got exeption there (Stopped in
thread 0 by: Exception at ... read access violation ...). The
examples in UHD folder works great. Please dont be mad at me because
of my english or lack of info but I fell like Im really lost at this
point.

my SW:
-windows 10
-Qt 5.12.2
-msvc2019 x64
-uhd 4.3.0.0
-boost 1.82.0

Thanks for any response.
Olo

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[USRP-users] rfnoc user group

[Kevin Williams]

Would anyone be interested in forming a USRP RFNoC interest group?

My interest is in model-based firmware design, and am having success with 
Simulink and HDL Coder. I have a fractional resampler running on a x310, with 
all the design benefits. There is a lot to contribute. One huge step would be 
to get the Ettus BFM into Matlab.
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[USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows

[Milo H Fields III]

I am also having issues with the uhd libraries on Windows using Visual Studio.  
My observations so far:

*   First – be sure any linked app’s are using Multi-Byte character set as 
it VS defaults to unicode
*   The default binary libraries did not work for me at all when trying to 
link them to my applications – I assumed it might have something to do with 
using Visual Studio 2022. To work around this problem I built & installed UDE 
using my system & Visual Studio 2022 enterprise environment.
*   The DEBUG & Release builds (BUILD_ALL project) of the UDE library built 
without error and the RUN_TEST execute with 100% of the tests reporting success 
– however the DEBUG versions of  ‘und_find_devices’ and other UHD utilities all 
fail with ‘Error: bad allocation’ while the ‘Release’ versions executed without 
error.  Same was true of my application which I original built by adding it to 
the UHD generated solution using one of the other application project 
frameworks.
*   I eventually settled on building & Installing the ‘RelWithDebInfo’ 
version of the UHD library and created an external solution for my app that 
references the installed version of UDE that I built
*   The failures of the DEBUG builds ‘appear’ to be related to argument 
processing as I have found senecios where normal argument strings are not 
processed correctly by the UDE C++ API’s (appear as junk when stepping into the 
library code). Where building apps with Release  or RelWithDebInfo will operate 
correctly. Have not isolated which ‘Release’ code generation option is critical 
to UHD.
*   I have also found similar argument parsing issues with my Ubuntu UDE 
targets but haven’t run them to ground as I currently need to be able to field 
a b200 application on a Windows target



Hope this helps… I’m still looking into the debug builds as time permits but 
haven’t found anything specific  - not sure what optimization (other than not 
using Unicode) is critical to the Windows build of UDE library maybe someone in 
the group can provide insight.



From: Olo via USRP-users 
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2023 05:11
To: usrp-users 
Subject: [USRP-users] Re: UHD in Qt c++ windows



I copied init_usrp.cpp to ConsoleApplication in visual studio and in properties 
I set Configuration properties >> C/C++ >> Additional Include Directories:

C:\Program Files\UHD\include

D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0



Configuration properties >> Linker >> General:

C:\UHD\lib

D:\Boost\boost_1_82_0\lib64-msvc-14.3



Configuration properties >> Linker >> Input:

uhd.lib



It got me:

Exception thrown at 0x7FFCCAC64065 (uhd.dll) in ConsoleApplication1.exe: 
0xC005: Access violation reading location 0x0039A1F2.





I think there will be problem with my libraries. The UHD I installed via 
bianaries 
https://files.ettus.com/binaries/uhd/latest_release/4.3.0.0/Windows-10-x64/

and the boost same 
https://sourceforge.net/projects/boost/files/boost-binaries/1.82.0/.





Sent with Proton Mail secure email.



--- Original Message ---
On Monday, April 17th, 2023 at 10:14, Marcus Müller 
mailto:marcus.muel...@ettus.com>> wrote:




   Hi Olo,

   nobody's going to be mad at you because of your English, which, by the way, 
is very good! English isn't my first language, either :) Welcome to the USRP 
developer community.

   So, let's tackle this one by one:

   If you take the code from init_usrp.cpp [1] and try to compile it in your 
project instead of your own code, does it also segfault?

   If not, then we need to look at your code.

   If yes, then we need to look at your compilation settings. I'm not a Windows 
user myself, but I remember (at least older) MSVC was not happy when you mix 
debug builds of libraries and release builds of software, or vice versa.

   Best regards,
   Marcus

   [1] https://github.com/EttusResearch/uhd/tree/UHD-4.3/host/examples/init_usrp

   On 17.04.23 09:18, Olo via USRP-users wrote:

  Hello,

  Im trying to work with my B210 in Qt. The thing is I have added in .pro 
file (using qmake) UHD (4.3.0.0) lib and include header files to my project 
with boost (1.82.0) library and I cant do pretty mutch anything. I tried to 
list all devices and I cant event set uhd::device_addr_t hint; because I got 
exeption there (Stopped in thread 0 by: Exception at ... read access violation 
...). The examples in UHD folder works great. Please dont be mad at me because 
of my english or lack of info but I fell like Im really lost at this point.



  my SW:

  -windows 10

  -Qt 5.12.2

  -msvc2019 x64

  -uhd 4.3.0.0

  -boost 1.82.0



  Thanks for any response.

  Olo



  Sent with Proton Mail secure email.



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[USRP-users] Test

[Milo H Fields III]

Just checking if my signed emails are getting blocked.

 



smime.p7s
Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
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[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[David Bengtson]

You've seen the filters from Pole-Zero, right? Tunable, but very narrow BW.
I keep reading abstracts in IEEE journals but I haven't seen anything
interesting.  Sub-octave band counts add up fast :-(

Dave

On Sun, Apr 16, 2023 at 9:36 PM Marcus D. Leech 
wrote:

> On 16/04/2023 21:13, David Bengtson wrote:
>
> Yes, it's pretty typical that the output of an SDR needs additional
> filtering and gain on the transmit side, and similarly filters and gain on
> the receive side. I spent a substantial fraction of my time at a previous
> job designing application specific front ends for Ettus SDR's.
>
> Dave
>
>
> In my other job, I do radio astronomy.   "Filter early, filter often" is
> what gets the job done in that domain.  A many-octave
>   tunable filter with variable bandwidth would be a nice thing, except for
> the ongoing miners strike at the
>   unobtanium mines...
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 8:39 PM Marcus D. Leech 
> wrote:
>
>> On 12/04/2023 20:28, Ron Economos wrote:
>>
>> This is what I see with a B210 at 145 MHz fundamental. I had the analyzer
>> on a large RBW, so the even order harmonic are buried in the analyzer noise.
>>
>> I don't think there's any remedy except for external filters.
>>
>> Ron
>> [image: B210 harmonics]
>>
>> Thanks Ron.  That looks like what my TinySA produced for 250Mhz carrier.
>> I need to learn more about it so that I can
>>   record spectra with it.  There's a Linux app for it that I need to
>> explore
>>
>>
>> Anyway, the basic issue, having consulted some older Analog Devices forum
>> posts is that the LO produces a square-wave
>>   signal, which means that all the odd-order harmonics will be present in
>> it, and naturally, mix with the baseband.
>>   There's nothing that can be done other than, as you point out, filter.
>> As you move up in frequency, this becomes
>>   very much easier of course, and at 2GHz, the 3rd harmonic is outside
>> the supported passband of the AD9361, and
>>   you won't see it.
>>
>> I didn't realize this about the AD9361 chip, and other Ettus devices have
>> automatically switchable filters that can
>>   (often, not always) remediate this issue.  The E3xx series, the N3xx
>> series, the TwinRX cards for the X310 and friends.
>>
>> But I'll point out again that "built for purpose" radios nearly-always
>> have output (input) filtering to reduce or eliminate
>>   unintended consequences of architecture choices deeper within the
>> radio.   Since SDRs in general don't get to be
>>   "built for purpose" either ever, or until some specific application is
>> using them as their "radio bits", it's hard to come up
>>   with a universal RF filtering scheme that is suitable for all
>> applications.
>>
>> I'd never noticed this issue because I don't really ever TX in my "day
>> job" use of these devices (radio astronomy), and on
>>   the RX side, I always pre-filter anyway, usually rather aggressively.
>>
>>
>> On 4/12/23 16:20, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users wrote:
>>
>> The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.
>>
>> I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for several
>> harmonics). The carrier is clearly visible at all frequencies. I can see
>> copies of the 10kHz tone on odd multiples of the carrier, but not on the
>> even multiples.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Marcus D. Leech 
>> 
>> *Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
>> *To:* Shenk, Trey E  
>> *Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:
>>
>> I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was that the even
>> harmonics (2*fundamental, …) did not change power, and the odd harmonics
>> decreased by the same amount as the fundamental. This means that the dBc
>> for the odd harmonics stayed the same with decreasing gain.
>>
>>
>>
>> Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same effect. Even
>> harmonics stayed at the same power level, odd harmonics decreased while
>> maintaining dBc.
>>
>> What is the nature of the modulating signal?
>>
>> If you use an example app like "tx_waveforms" with, let's say, 10kHz SIN
>> signal, what are the harmonic results?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Marcus D Leech 
>> 
>> *Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 8:39 AM
>> *To:* Shenk, Trey E  
>> *Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini
>>
>>
>>
>> Check twice before you click! This email originated from outside PNNL.
>>
>>
>>
>> Turn down the RF gain a bit as well as the baseband amplitude. Does this
>> make any difference?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2023, at 9:41 AM, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users <
>> usrp-users@lists.ettus.com> wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> I'm using a B205mini to transmit signals. When transmitting, I can see
>> copies of the SOI at harmonics of the center frequency. I ran some
>> measurements of total harmonic distortion, and found it to range from 39%
>> with a 1

[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[Marcus D. Leech]

On 17/04/2023 20:22, David Bengtson wrote:
You've seen the filters from Pole-Zero, right? Tunable, but very 
narrow BW. I keep reading abstracts in IEEE journals but I haven't 
seen anything interesting.  Sub-octave band counts add up fast :-(


Dave
I've seen various interesting bits of "physics experiment" over the 
years, but nothing that screams "every radio should have
  some of these".  The Ettus/NI approach on some of the USRP radios is 
to use a filter-bank of selectable OTS filters with overlapping
  ranges with relatively large fractional bandwidths.  This works for a 
significant fraction of the applications out there, but

  not all, obviously.  "Some engineering required" as they say.





On Sun, Apr 16, 2023 at 9:36 PM Marcus D. Leech 
 wrote:


On 16/04/2023 21:13, David Bengtson wrote:

Yes, it's pretty typical that the output of an SDR needs
additional filtering and gain on the transmit side, and similarly
filters and gain on the receive side. I spent a substantial
fraction of my time at a previous job designing application
specific front ends for Ettus SDR's.

Dave



In my other job, I do radio astronomy.   "Filter early, filter
often" is what gets the job done in that domain.  A many-octave
  tunable filter with variable bandwidth would be a nice thing,
except for the ongoing miners strike at the
  unobtanium mines...



On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 8:39 PM Marcus D. Leech
 wrote:

On 12/04/2023 20:28, Ron Economos wrote:


This is what I see with a B210 at 145 MHz fundamental. I had
the analyzer on a large RBW, so the even order harmonic are
buried in the analyzer noise.

I don't think there's any remedy except for external filters.

Ron

B210 harmonics


Thanks Ron.  That looks like what my TinySA produced for
250Mhz carrier.  I need to learn more about it so that I can
  record spectra with it.  There's a Linux app for it that I
need to explore


Anyway, the basic issue, having consulted some older Analog
Devices forum posts is that the LO produces a square-wave
  signal, which means that all the odd-order harmonics will
be present in it, and naturally, mix with the baseband.
  There's nothing that can be done other than, as you point
out, filter.  As you move up in frequency, this becomes
  very much easier of course, and at 2GHz, the 3rd harmonic
is outside the supported passband of the AD9361, and
  you won't see it.

I didn't realize this about the AD9361 chip, and other Ettus
devices have automatically switchable filters that can
  (often, not always) remediate this issue.  The E3xx series,
the N3xx series, the TwinRX cards for the X310 and friends.

But I'll point out again that "built for purpose" radios
nearly-always have output (input) filtering to reduce or
eliminate
  unintended consequences of architecture choices deeper
within the radio.   Since SDRs in general don't get to be
  "built for purpose" either ever, or until some specific
application is using them as their "radio bits", it's hard to
come up
  with a universal RF filtering scheme that is suitable for
all applications.

I'd never noticed this issue because I don't really ever TX
in my "day job" use of these devices (radio astronomy), and on
  the RX side, I always pre-filter anyway, usually rather
aggressively.



On 4/12/23 16:20, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users wrote:


The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.

I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for
several harmonics). The carrier is clearly visible at all
frequencies. I can see copies of the 10kHz tone on odd
multiples of the carrier, but not on the even multiples.

*From:* Marcus D. Leech 

*Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E 

*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:

I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was
that the even harmonics (2*fundamental, …) did not
change power, and the odd harmonics decreased by the
same amount as the fundamental. This means that the dBc
for the odd harmonics stayed the same with decreasing gain.

Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same
effect. Even harmonics stayed at the same power level,
odd harmonics decreased while maintaining dBc.

What is the nature of the modulating signal?

If you use an example app like "tx_wa

[USRP-users] Re: Test

[White, Joshua J]

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Engineering & Support Solutions Directorate

  www.riversideresearch.org 

T: 937.986.3153 | F: 937.431.3811

 

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From: Milo H Fields III  
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2023 5:44 PM
To: usrp-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: [USRP-users] Test

 

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[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users]

Hi all,

Thanks for the input on this issue. I’m still trying to pin it down. I’m using 
gnuradio to drive a B205mini. I’m seeing harmonics of the carrier particularly 
at odd harmonics. The third harmonic, 3*carrier, is only 10dB down from the 
carrier itself, and I’m seeing significant carrier leakage.

I’ve tried changing the sampling rate, as well as modulating a QPSK signal 
(both direct conversion and using some off-tuning). I still see spectral images 
at the odd harmonics.

Is this known behavior for the B205mini? I’m trying to decide if I need to 
change how I’m driving it, use a RF filter at the output, or switch to a 
different SDR.

Thanks,
Trey

From: Shenk, Trey E
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2023 4:21 PM
To: Marcus D. Leech 
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: RE: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.

I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for several harmonics). The 
carrier is clearly visible at all frequencies. I can see copies of the 10kHz 
tone on odd multiples of the carrier, but not on the even multiples.



From: Marcus D. Leech mailto:patchvonbr...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
To: Shenk, Trey E mailto:trey.sh...@pnnl.gov>>
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:
I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was that the even harmonics 
(2*fundamental, …) did not change power, and the odd harmonics decreased by the 
same amount as the fundamental. This means that the dBc for the odd harmonics 
stayed the same with decreasing gain.

Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same effect. Even harmonics 
stayed at the same power level, odd harmonics decreased while maintaining dBc.
What is the nature of the modulating signal?

If you use an example app like "tx_waveforms" with, let's say, 10kHz SIN 
signal, what are the harmonic results?




From: Marcus D Leech 
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2023 8:39 AM
To: Shenk, Trey E 
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

Check twice before you click! This email originated from outside PNNL.

Turn down the RF gain a bit as well as the baseband amplitude. Does this make 
any difference?


Sent from my iPhone


On Apr 10, 2023, at 9:41 AM, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users 
mailto:usrp-users@lists.ettus.com>> wrote:


I'm using a B205mini to transmit signals. When transmitting, I can see copies 
of the SOI at harmonics of the center frequency. I ran some measurements of 
total harmonic distortion, and found it to range from 39% with a 100MHz to 23% 
with a 1GHz carrier. The second harmonic is <-50dBc, but the third harmonic is 
usually around -10dBc.

My main concern is for the lower frequency carriers, like 100MHz, because 
multiple harmonics will show up on a spectrum analyzer set to a wideband. I've 
looked at putting an RF filter at the output, but I need the system to be able 
to switch transmit center frequencies in a range from 100MHz to 5GHz.

Is it possible to reduce the harmonics by some hardware setting (driving with 
gnruadio)?

Thanks,
Trey


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[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[Marcus D. Leech]

On 17/04/2023 22:49, Shenk, Trey E wrote:


Hi all,

Thanks for the input on this issue. I’m still trying to pin it down. 
I’m using gnuradio to drive a B205mini. I’m seeing harmonics of the 
carrier particularly at odd harmonics. The third harmonic, 3*carrier, 
is only 10dB down from the carrier itself, and I’m seeing significant 
carrier leakage.



I’ve tried changing the sampling rate, as well as modulating a QPSK 
signal (both direct conversion and using some off-tuning). I still see 
spectral images at the odd harmonics.


Is this known behavior for the B205mini? I’m trying to decide if I 
need to change how I’m driving it, use a RF filter at the output, or 
switch to a different SDR.


Thanks,
Trey


Two things.

The LO leakage can be dealt with using an LO offset.

However, the AD9361 uses a square-wave LO into the mixer, which means 
that odd harmonics will make it out of the device.
  This has been discussed extensively in the ADI forums, and a couple 
of folks on this list have discussed it as well with
  spectrum analyzer screen dumps showing it.  I confirmed it with my 
own modest spectrum analyzer as well.  Because it's
  an odd-harmonic problem, any application operating above 2GHz will 
naturally not have this problem, because the 3rd
  harmonic (and all other odd harmonics) will fall outside the 
operating range of the AD9361 chip.


The only solution is filtering.

Some USRPs have a built-in switchable filter bank that can help with 
this in some cases, but it really depends on the
  frequency scheme of your application.   A discrete filter bank cannot 
possibly deal with all applications.


I personally tend to think of SDRs as *components* in an overall 
engineered RF *system*.   It is certainly the case that
  ready-for-type-acceptance radios, regardless of internal 
architecture, will almost always have filters at the edges to
  deal with architectural unpleasantness deeper in the radio 
architecture. The B2xx series were designed to be
  relatively inexpensive, and as such, they don't have a switchable 
filter-bank on them--and as previously pointed out,
  even THEN, that may not necessarily make the radio "application 
ready" in terms of formal type-acceptance, etc.




*From:* Shenk, Trey E
*Sent:* Wednesday, April 12, 2023 4:21 PM
*To:* Marcus D. Leech 
*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* RE: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.

I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for several 
harmonics). The carrier is clearly visible at all frequencies. I can 
see copies of the 10kHz tone on odd multiples of the carrier, but not 
on the even multiples.


*From:* Marcus D. Leech 
*Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E 
*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:

I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was that the even
harmonics (2*fundamental, …) did not change power, and the odd
harmonics decreased by the same amount as the fundamental. This
means that the dBc for the odd harmonics stayed the same with
decreasing gain.

Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same effect. Even
harmonics stayed at the same power level, odd harmonics decreased
while maintaining dBc.

What is the nature of the modulating signal?

If you use an example app like "tx_waveforms" with, let's say, 10kHz 
SIN signal, what are the harmonic results?



*From:* Marcus D Leech 

*Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 8:39 AM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E  
*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

Check twice before you click! This email originated from outside PNNL.

Turn down the RF gain a bit as well as the baseband amplitude.
Does this make any difference?

Sent from my iPhone



On Apr 10, 2023, at 9:41 AM, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users
 wrote:



I'm using a B205mini to transmit signals. When transmitting, I
can see copies of the SOI at harmonics of the center
frequency. I ran some measurements of total harmonic
distortion, and found it to range from 39% with a 100MHz to
23% with a 1GHz carrier. The second harmonic is <-50dBc, but
the third harmonic is usually around -10dBc.

My main concern is for the lower frequency carriers, like
100MHz, because multiple harmonics will show up on a spectrum
analyzer set to a wideband. I've looked at putting an RF
filter at the output, but I need the system to be able to
switch transmit center frequencies in a range from 100MHz to 5GHz.

Is it possible to reduce the harmonics by some hardware
setting (driving with gnruadio)?

Thanks,
Trey

   

[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users]

Got it. Thanks very much, Marcus! I didn’t realize that the LO was a square 
wave going in.

Thanks for the info and the tips about moving forward!

From: Marcus D. Leech 
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2023 8:02 PM
To: Shenk, Trey E 
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 17/04/2023 22:49, Shenk, Trey E wrote:
Hi all,

Thanks for the input on this issue. I’m still trying to pin it down. I’m using 
gnuradio to drive a B205mini. I’m seeing harmonics of the carrier particularly 
at odd harmonics. The third harmonic, 3*carrier, is only 10dB down from the 
carrier itself, and I’m seeing significant carrier leakage.

I’ve tried changing the sampling rate, as well as modulating a QPSK signal 
(both direct conversion and using some off-tuning). I still see spectral images 
at the odd harmonics.

Is this known behavior for the B205mini? I’m trying to decide if I need to 
change how I’m driving it, use a RF filter at the output, or switch to a 
different SDR.

Thanks,
Trey

Two things.

The LO leakage can be dealt with using an LO offset.

However, the AD9361 uses a square-wave LO into the mixer, which means that odd 
harmonics will make it out of the device.
  This has been discussed extensively in the ADI forums, and a couple of folks 
on this list have discussed it as well with
  spectrum analyzer screen dumps showing it.  I confirmed it with my own modest 
spectrum analyzer as well.  Because it's
  an odd-harmonic problem, any application operating above 2GHz will naturally 
not have this problem, because the 3rd
  harmonic (and all other odd harmonics) will fall outside the operating range 
of the AD9361 chip.

The only solution is filtering.

Some USRPs have a built-in switchable filter bank that can help with this in 
some cases, but it really depends on the
  frequency scheme of your application.   A discrete filter bank cannot 
possibly deal with all applications.

I personally tend to think of SDRs as *components* in an overall engineered RF 
*system*.   It is certainly the case that
  ready-for-type-acceptance radios, regardless of internal architecture, will 
almost always have filters at the edges to
  deal with architectural unpleasantness deeper in the radio architecture. 
The B2xx series were designed to be
  relatively inexpensive, and as such, they don't have a switchable filter-bank 
on them--and as previously pointed out,
  even THEN, that may not necessarily make the radio "application ready" in 
terms of formal type-acceptance, etc.



From: Shenk, Trey E
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2023 4:21 PM
To: Marcus D. Leech 
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: RE: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.

I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for several harmonics). The 
carrier is clearly visible at all frequencies. I can see copies of the 10kHz 
tone on odd multiples of the carrier, but not on the even multiples.



From: Marcus D. Leech mailto:patchvonbr...@gmail.com>>
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
To: Shenk, Trey E mailto:trey.sh...@pnnl.gov>>
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:
I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was that the even harmonics 
(2*fundamental, …) did not change power, and the odd harmonics decreased by the 
same amount as the fundamental. This means that the dBc for the odd harmonics 
stayed the same with decreasing gain.

Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same effect. Even harmonics 
stayed at the same power level, odd harmonics decreased while maintaining dBc.
What is the nature of the modulating signal?

If you use an example app like "tx_waveforms" with, let's say, 10kHz SIN 
signal, what are the harmonic results?





From: Marcus D Leech 
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2023 8:39 AM
To: Shenk, Trey E 
Cc: USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
Subject: Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

Check twice before you click! This email originated from outside PNNL.

Turn down the RF gain a bit as well as the baseband amplitude. Does this make 
any difference?


Sent from my iPhone



On Apr 10, 2023, at 9:41 AM, Shenk, Trey E via USRP-users 
mailto:usrp-users@lists.ettus.com>> wrote:


I'm using a B205mini to transmit signals. When transmitting, I can see copies 
of the SOI at harmonics of the center frequency. I ran some measurements of 
total harmonic distortion, and found it to range from 39% with a 100MHz to 23% 
with a 1GHz carrier. The second harmonic is <-50dBc, but the third harmonic is 
usually around -10dBc.

My main concern is for the lower frequency carriers, like 100MHz, because 
multiple harmonics will show up on a 

[USRP-users] Re: Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

[Marcus D. Leech]

On 17/04/2023 23:34, Shenk, Trey E wrote:


Got it. Thanks very much, Marcus! I didn’t realize that the LO was a 
square wave going in.


It's a fairly common practice these days.  The VFO operates at a very 
high frequency, and then a
  eye-wateringly-fast divider chain produces the final frequency. VFOs 
up at 12GHz in chips like
  this aren't uncommon--so the PLL controls the VFO over a 
relatively-small range, and the divider

  does the rest.

But even when you're driving a mixer with a nice pure sine-wave, the 
mixer tends to chop it, since mixers
  are basically switching devices, so there'll always be some harmonic 
content coming out of a mixer even
  with sine-wave inputs.   They'll just be at lower levels in my 
understanding.




Thanks for the info and the tips about moving forward!

*From:* Marcus D. Leech 
*Sent:* Monday, April 17, 2023 8:02 PM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E 
*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 17/04/2023 22:49, Shenk, Trey E wrote:

Hi all,

Thanks for the input on this issue. I’m still trying to pin it
down. I’m using gnuradio to drive a B205mini. I’m seeing harmonics
of the carrier particularly at odd harmonics. The third harmonic,
3*carrier, is only 10dB down from the carrier itself, and I’m
seeing significant carrier leakage.


I’ve tried changing the sampling rate, as well as modulating a
QPSK signal (both direct conversion and using some off-tuning). I
still see spectral images at the odd harmonics.

Is this known behavior for the B205mini? I’m trying to decide if I
need to change how I’m driving it, use a RF filter at the output,
or switch to a different SDR.

Thanks,
Trey

Two things.

The LO leakage can be dealt with using an LO offset.

However, the AD9361 uses a square-wave LO into the mixer, which means 
that odd harmonics will make it out of the device.
  This has been discussed extensively in the ADI forums, and a couple 
of folks on this list have discussed it as well with
  spectrum analyzer screen dumps showing it.  I confirmed it with my 
own modest spectrum analyzer as well.  Because it's
  an odd-harmonic problem, any application operating above 2GHz will 
naturally not have this problem, because the 3rd
  harmonic (and all other odd harmonics) will fall outside the 
operating range of the AD9361 chip.


The only solution is filtering.

Some USRPs have a built-in switchable filter bank that can help with 
this in some cases, but it really depends on the
  frequency scheme of your application.   A discrete filter bank 
cannot possibly deal with all applications.


I personally tend to think of SDRs as *components* in an overall 
engineered RF *system*.   It is certainly the case that
  ready-for-type-acceptance radios, regardless of internal 
architecture, will almost always have filters at the edges to
  deal with architectural unpleasantness deeper in the radio 
architecture. The B2xx series were designed to be
  relatively inexpensive, and as such, they don't have a switchable 
filter-bank on them--and as previously pointed out,
  even THEN, that may not necessarily make the radio "application 
ready" in terms of formal type-acceptance, etc.




*From:* Shenk, Trey E
*Sent:* Wednesday, April 12, 2023 4:21 PM
*To:* Marcus D. Leech 

*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* RE: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

The original signal that I showed was an unmodulated carrier.

I tried a 10kHz complex exponential (plots included for several
harmonics). The carrier is clearly visible at all frequencies. I
can see copies of the 10kHz tone on odd multiples of the carrier,
but not on the even multiples.

*From:* Marcus D. Leech 
*Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 10:22 PM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E 
*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] Harmonic Distortion with B205mini

On 10/04/2023 14:28, Shenk, Trey E wrote:

I first tried turning the gain down. What I saw was that the
even harmonics (2*fundamental, …) did not change power, and
the odd harmonics decreased by the same amount as the
fundamental. This means that the dBc for the odd harmonics
stayed the same with decreasing gain.

Decreasing the baseband amplitude had the exact same effect.
Even harmonics stayed at the same power level, odd harmonics
decreased while maintaining dBc.

What is the nature of the modulating signal?

If you use an example app like "tx_waveforms" with, let's say,
10kHz SIN signal, what are the harmonic results?



*From:* Marcus D Leech 

*Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2023 8:39 AM
*To:* Shenk, Trey E 

*Cc:* USRP-users@lists.ettus.com
*Subject:* Re: [USRP-users] H