Re: Death of the Application Browser

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 27 Nov 2015, at 04:26, Richmond  wrote:

> For exactly the same reason why the Application Browser is being hived off to 
> the "community",
> because, while Lip-service is being paid to listening to the community . . .

Given Mark Waddingham’s recent view of LiveCode stacks and GPL, if the 
Application Browser is hived off to the community anybody using it would only 
be able to sell it under the GPL. :-)

Peter



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Re: Death of the Application Browser

[Peter W A Wood]

Monte 

> On 27 Nov 2015, at 06:29, Monte Goulding  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On 27 Nov 2015, at 9:24 am, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>> 
>> Given Mark Waddingham’s recent view of LiveCode stacks and GPL, if the 
>> Application Browser is hived off to the community anybody using it would 
>> only be able to sell it under the GPL. :-)
> 
> Actually that would appear to only be the case if the edits were made using 
> LiveCode Community as the IDE is MIT licensed:
> https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/blob/develop/IDE%20License.txt 
> <https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/blob/develop/IDE%20License.txt>

Given Mark’s earlier explanation, it is difficult to see how the IDE can be MIT 
licensed. After all, it is just a stack and if other stacks run with the 
Community engine can only be issued under the GPL, surely the IDE can only be 
issued under the GPL if it is run by the Community engine? In fact, surely 
anything distributed within LiveCode Community must be under the GPL? 

Regards

Peter
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Re: Livecode Server and script only stacks

[Peter W A Wood]

David

> On 23 Dec 2015, at 17:49, David Bovill  wrote:
> 
> I'm looking to produce a better coding experience for revIgniter / Livecode
> server, and I'd like to be able to use script only stacks on the server, so
> I can test code locally as stacks, and easily keep it versioned in Github
> and live on the site.
> 
> Does anyone know if script only stacks work with Livecode Server and if so
> which version of the server I need to be running?

Yes they do. I use them to run my tests under LiveCode Server - 
https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-Tests/blob/master/ServerTestRunner.livecode
 
.

I run them under LiveCode 8.

Regards

Peter


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Re: More questions regarding Server oddities

[Peter W A Wood]

Lyn

> On 26 Dec 2015, at 05:34, Lyn Teyla  wrote:

> 6.6.2 is not the latest version of LiveCode Server.
> 
> The suggestion that I had put forth regarding the original issue was for Tim 
> to perform both of the following:
> 
> 1. Use the "put header" line provided;

I don’t think the problem is related to the HTTP Header. It is the same for 
both Tim’s rev page and his lc page:



> 
> and
> 
> 2. Utilize any one of the latest versions of LiveCode: 6.7.8, 7.1.1 or 
> 8.0.0dp12.
> 
> That would indeed fix the original issue.

Tim doesn’t really have a choice over which version of the server to use with 
the On-Rev service. The version is chosen by LiveCode.

I suspect Tim will need to wait until LiveCode update the server before porting 
his scripts to .lc

Regards

Peter


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Re: cipherNames

[Peter W A Wood]

John 

> On 17 Jan 2016, at 19:30, John Dixon  wrote:
> 
> When asking for the cipher names that are available to liveCode... a long 
> list is produced.. In the case of aes 256 there are many variants as depicted 
> by three letters after 'aes'... What do they mean ?... Is it important to use 
> the correct one ?
> 
> example of different cipher names in the list
> 
> aes-128-cbc,128
> 
….
> 
> aes256,256

They are different mechanisms for handling multiple blocks of data. (A block 
length being determined by the key length.). This may help 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Block_cipher_mode_of_operation

Regards

Peter


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Re: LC Server Call Javascript Function?

[Peter W A Wood]

Scott

> On 29 Jan 2016, at 18:30, Scott Rossi  wrote:
> 
> Can a LiveCode server script call a Javascript function?
> 
> I want to write some text into a div in an LC server web page without
> refreshing the entire page.  AFAICT, generating any text from a LiveCode
> server script will replace the contents of page, but cannot target a a
> specific DOM element on the page.  Since Javascript can do this, is there
> any way to trigger a Javascript function from an LC server script?

It is easy enough to do, if the JavaScript calls the LC Server Script. I 
believe that pushing content from the server to the browser can be achieved 
using the HTML5 WebSocket API (which will be a lot more complicated).

Regards

Peter
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Re: Would love to see this blog with 1,001 Uses stay FRESH

[Peter W A Wood]

Mark 

There are two problems with keeping the blog fresh. The first is that people 
are not submitting possible entries. The second is that I don’t have the time 
to actively maintain it. I’m not sure which of these is the chicken and which 
is the  egg.

If somebody has the time and motivation to take over the site, I would gladly 
pass it over to them.

Regards

Peter

> On 16 Mar 2016, at 21:20, Mark Rauterkus  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> http://livecode1001.blogspot.com/
> 
> This is a great resource. I would LOVE to see it stay FRESH. A couple posts
> a month would be fine. I wanted to turn people onto LiveCode -- and seeing
> that with a most recent post from October 2015 is getting dated. Only two
> were posted in 2015.
> 
> Cheering from the distance
> 
> Can new energy be gathered?
> 
> 
> --
> Ta.
> 
> 
> Mark Rauterkus   m...@rauterkus.com
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Re: Would love to see this blog with 1,001 Uses stay FRESH

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 22 Mar 2016, at 23:39, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> What is the process for submitting entries there?

Send me an email with a description/story of the app and a few screenshots. I 
use them to write an entry. I chose to always write the entry myself to 
establish and maintain a consistent style.

Regards

Peter


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Delete the first entry of an array.

[Peter W A Wood]

I have an array which contains a second array. (myArray[“numbers”][]). The 
numbers array is a traditional array with elements 1..n. I want to remove the 
first element of the numbers array and shuffle all the others up. Is there a 
simple way of doing this in LiveCode (equivalent to the shift() function in 
JavaScript)?

I looked in the dictionary and found delete  but couldn't get it to 
work, perhaps because I am trying to do this in a function that takes the array 
as an argument.

The essence of the function is:

function shift @pList
  local tItem
  put pList[“numbers”][1] into tItem
  delete pList[“numbers”] 1 ## Is this the 
correct syntax?
  return tItem
end shift

If I can get delete to remove the first element of the array, will it 
automatically change the index of the remaining entries?

Thanks in advance.

Peter
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Re: Delete the first entry of an array.

[Peter W A Wood]

Peter

Thanks for the suggestions.

> On 25 Mar 2016, at 16:03, Peter TB Brett  wrote:
> 
> On 2016-03-25 08:33, Peter W A Wood wrote:
>> I have an array which contains a second array. (myArray[“numbers”][]).
>> ...
>> automatically change the index of the remaining entries?
> 
> Hi Peter,
> 
> LiveCode arrays are actually dictionaries (more like JavaScript objects than 
> JavaScript arrays).  There aren't currently any push/pop syntax for LiveCode 
> arrays.

Thanks for the confirmation as I wasn’t sure that was the case for all arrays 
due to the existence of the extents function.

> I would recommend two things:
> 
> 1) Arrange your algorithm so that you extract things one-by-one from the 
> _end_ of the numbered array, rather than the start.  This is more efficient!  

It is not possible in this case as the order of the elements is significant. I 
use a different function to remove the last element of the array.

> 
> 2) Alternatively, you can shift everything along, which will be slow:
> 
>   function PopStart @xArray
>  local tLength, tItem, tKey
> 
>  put the number of elements in xArray into tLength
>  if tLength is 0 then return empty
> 
>  put xArray[1] into tItem
> 
>  repeat with tKey = 2 to tLength
> put xArray[tKey] into xArray[tKey - 1]
>  end repeat
>  delete xArray[tLength]
> 
>  return tItem
>   end PopStart

This is what I am currently having to do but am not too worried yet as I 
believe in the “Getting it working, getting it working correctly, getting 
working quickly approach”.

> I hope that's helpful.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Kind regards

Peter



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Re: Delete the first entry of an array.

[Peter W A Wood]

Thanks Kay

> On 25 Mar 2016, at 17:22, Kay C Lan  wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 3:33 PM, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
> 
>>  delete pList[“numbers”] 1 ## Is this 
>> the correct syntax?
> 
> No. Shouldn't it be:
> 
> delete variable pList["number"][1]
> 
> At least that works for me, although in your case I think, if I
> understand it correctly, I'd tackle the problem by: (suedo-code)
> 
> repeat with x = 2 to the number of keys in firstArray
>  put firstArray[x] into secondArray[x - 1]
> end repeat
> put secondArray into firstArray


I do something like this at the moment. I was trying to see if there was an 
easier/quicker way.

Kind regards

Peter
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[ANN} LiveCode List Processor - Version 1

[Peter W A Wood]

I have found time to complete version 1 of my LiveCode List Processor. You can 
find it at https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-ListProcessor

Many of you may be wondering why I bothered to write it when LiveCode’s 
built-in list processing (of delimited strings) is very good. The main reason 
is that LiveCode’s lists lack a memory. You can’t process a couple of items at 
the top of a list, go and do some thing else and then start processing the 
third item in the list. Well not easily. The List Processor does have a memory 
and you can move forwards and backwards along a list. The current position is 
even remembered when the list is saved.

A simple example of its use would be if you wanted to use some colours in turn. 
First you would make a list:

put LP.makeList(“red:green:blue:pink:purple:brown:black:”, “:”) into 
myColours

When you wanted to get the next colour, you would simply get the next item in 
the list:

put LP.next(myColours) into nextColour  #nextColour would be set to 
“green"

You can get the next colour

put LP.next(myColours) into nextColour  #nextColour would be set to 
“blue"

You can save the list

put LP.save(myColours, myURL) into tTemp 
# tTemp 
would be a binary copy of the list

You can load the list from the URL and get the next colour

put LP.load(myURL) into myColours
put LP.next(myColours) into nextColour  #nextColour would be set to 
“pink”

I suspect the number of uses of these lists with a memory is quite wide. I plan 
to use it to store data that I previously held in a set of cards. You can 
navigate through the list in a similar way to how you would navigate through 
cards. One small difference is that the lists don’t automatically cycle around 
from the last to first items as LiveCode cards do. (It would be easy to add 
that to the List Processor though).

When I was developing the List Processor, I wrote the tests using LiveCode 
MiniTest -https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest

The is some simple documentation on the Github page.

When writing the List Processor, I concentrated on getting it working correctly 
rather than speed. I’m sure that big improvements could be made and I would 
welcome comments and suggestions.

Regards

Peter


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Re: [ANN} LiveCode List Processor - Version 1

[Peter W A Wood]

Mark 
> On 26 Mar 2016, at 23:13, Mark Wieder  wrote:
> 
> On 03/25/2016 11:21 PM, Peter W A Wood wrote:
>> I have found time to complete version 1 of my LiveCode List Processor. You 
>> can find it at https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-ListProcessor
> 
> Nicely done.

Thanks.

> The save and load functions aren't there, though.

In the sense that they are totally missing or you feel they are insufficient? 

Regards

Peter
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Re: Nelly the Elephant

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

> On 30 Apr 2016, at 19:47, RM  wrote:
> 
> soes anyone know of a desktop programs (Win/Lin/Mac) to calculate surrogate 
> pairs?

Dorry I don’t so of a desktop program … but this webpage should work offline as 
long as you don’t refresh the page - 
http://www.russellcottrell.com/greek/utilities/SurrogatePairCalculator.htm 


Peter
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Re: Nelly the Elephant

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond 

> On 30 Apr 2016, at 20:15, RM  wrote:
> 
> Thanks; I've been using that one for some time.
> 
> Now I'm trying to work out the underlying Maths . . .
> 
> Richmond.
> 

Perhaps the algorithm on this page will help - 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTF-16 

Peter
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Peter W A Wood]

Monte

I think that you have missed out one way to contribute that would be very 
valuable to both the community and LiveCode. That is writing automatically 
runnable tests. There is an automated test suite but it is kept under lock and 
key by LiveCode so that community members cannot contribute by submitting 
meaningful tests.

I built my own simple testing framework 
(https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest 
) and have a handful of tests 
(https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-Tests 
). (If you run 
the tests, you will see that some of them fail.).

A set of community developed automated tests would be a great resource that 
could be grown over time.

Regards

Peter

> On 4 May 2016, at 12:47, Monte Goulding  wrote:

> There are many ways we can get involved with the development of the platform. 
> All of these have been done by contributors since going open source although 
> I doubt this is a complete list:
> - C/C++/Objective-C/Java
>   - Contribute to the engine code by fixing bugs or adding features
>   - Contribute to the externals that come with LiveCode
>   - Contribute to or implement your own externals and release under a FOSS 
> license
> - LiveCode Builder
>   - Contribute to widgets and libraries that come with LiveCode
>   - Contribute to or implement your own widgets and libraries and release 
> under a FOSS license
> - LiveCode Script
>   - Contribute to the script only stack portions of the IDE (most of the code 
> in LC8)
>   - Contribute to or implement script libraries, frameworks and custom 
> controls and release under a FOSS license
> - Documentation
>   - Edit the dictionary entries and guides
>   - Create new guides and contribute
>   - Create learning resources and release under a FOSS license
>   - Answer questions on stackoverflow, the lists and forums, facebook etc
> - Testing
>   - Write good quality bug reports
>   - Find old reports, test in the latest version and comment with your results
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Peter W A Wood]

Monte

> On 4 May 2016, at 13:20, Monte Goulding  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On 4 May 2016, at 3:12 PM, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>> 
>> I think that you have missed out one way to contribute that would be very 
>> valuable to both the community and LiveCode. That is writing automatically 
>> runnable tests.
> 
> I did miss that!
> 
>> There is an automated test suite but it is kept under lock and key by 
>> LiveCode so that community members cannot contribute by submitting 
>> meaningful tests.
> 
> Actually this is not true. The tests and test runners are on GitHub and 
> therefore contributable (probably not a word???):
> - IDE https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/tree/develop/tests (this is 
> - LCB, LCS https://github.com/livecode/livecode/tree/develop/tests

And I missed them! It’s been some time since I last looked though.

Regards

Peter
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Re: Getting text into a Livecode field

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

The screenshot you displays has the Text Styling tab visible. Did you try 
clicking on the little house icon ?

Reagards

Peter


> On 8 May 2016, at 15:44, RM  wrote:
> 
> More: http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=27232
> 
> R.
> 
> On 7.05.2016 21:38, RM wrote:
>> So, I was mucking around trying to reduplicate/solve John Patten's
>> problem with Arrow Keys in Livecode 8 (I reduplicated them: 
>> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=27225),
>> and thought I'd do what I usually do: enter some text in a field and do a 
>> quick "import snapshot"
>> to get a label on the stack.
>> 
>> So, I set up a new textField, and could find NO place in the Properties 
>> palette where I could enter
>> the text; when I tried to enter it via 'browse' in the textField itself that 
>> also failed.
>> 
>> Livecode 64 bit Linux.
>> 
>> Richmond.
> 
> 
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Re: Getting text into a Livecode field

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

> Thanks for that, although a single line 'thing' does
> not "Do for me" what the previous field did.
> 
> R.

Having to type titles of buttons and text of labels and fields of GUI objects 
into a contents property in a separate window is this issue to me. I find it 
counter intuitive. Every time I use the IDE, I have to remember to open the 
property editor to change the title of a button. It seems a little throwback to 
years gone by.

Regards

Peter



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Re: Daft "text Editor" question

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

> On 18 May 2016, at 18:03, RM  wrote:
> 
> Does anyone know of a word-processing type program that can open .rev and 
> .livecode
> files so that one can see ALL the scripts of ALL the objects in one long 
> document?

You can open them and read the scripts in BBEdit under OS X. I would imagine 
that the free version, TextWrangler, would be able to do the same.

I was also able to open them in Gedit on Ubuntu but Gedit complained about some 
of the “binary” data not being correctly encoded UTF-8. Again I could see the 
scripts.

> This may sound a bit daft, but I am considering "refactoring" the code-base 
> for my Devawriter Pro
> from pre version 7 to post version 7, and this will involve very many changes 
> in about 4 million
> lines of code, and, farnkly, I should like to automate that process as much 
> as possible.

That is a lot of code !!!

Regards

Peter
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Re: LC8 - Stumbling into JSON

[Peter W A Wood]

Mark 

> On 14 Jun 2016, at 07:19, Mark Wieder  wrote:
> 
> And just FYI, for comparison the xml translation of that would be
> 
> 
>  
>18.75
>kg/m@2
>  
>  
>2
>75
>  
> 
> 

Wouldn’t an XML purist come up with the following, making it much more time 
consuming to process?


 
   18.75
 
 
   2
   75
 


Regards

Peter



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Re: Practical TDD in LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Richard

> On 5 Nov 2016, at 01:51, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> One of many interesting discussions in our local LC User Group meeting last 
> night was from a relative newcomer who asked about TDD support.
> 
> I was able to tell him we have an assert command, and that many developers 
> have a wide range of ad hoc test harnesses in use.
> 
> But what I couldn't point him to is a single harness framework in our 
> community suitable for broad use.
> 
> Is there one?

People’s opinion of what is needed for TDD differs widely. The so called xUnit 
testing frameworks are generally quite basic (test specification, assertions 
and test runners) but suffice for many people. They typically cannot be easily 
used to test GUI code. Other testing frameworks, it seems especially in the 
JavaScript world, extend much farther with test doubles, code coverage, and 
testing user interfaces via the browser.

I have published a simple test framework, Mini-Test. It can be used to test 
both LiveCode handlers and GUI interfaces. (This is latter is a credit to 
LiveCode’s features not me). It is rooted in MiniTest, the testing framework 
included with Ruby. It does not include test doubles, code coverage or 
performance testing.

LiveCode, the company, has a test framework but, personally, I found it too 
complicated for my own use. I felt something written wholly in LiveCode would 
be easier to handle.

If you want to take a look: https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest


> If not, what would it look like?
> 
> How granularly should we write tests?  How much value is there if the writing 
> of a test takes longer than writing the thing being tested? Should we write a 
> second test for when a handler in our core business logic is integrated into 
> a GUI, where the varieties of things that can happen with input and events is 
> much broader?  Should a good harness simulate GUI events?  If so, how to make 
> sure they attempt sufficient erroneous inputs to ensure the scope of our 
> error handling?  How do we chain tests into a comprehensive automated "Test 
> All"?
> 
> So many questions...
> 
> How do we make one good test harness that answers them all, at least 
> reasonably well?

I feel that the LiveCode engine makes it extremely easy to write a test 
framework that will do all of the above. It just needs a little thought, such 
as designing a set of commands to automate user input simulation, and a little 
work.

Regards

Peter
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Re: Installing LiveCode Server on a Microsoft Azure Bitnami LAMP stack

[Peter W A Wood]

Dave

> On 24 Nov 2016, at 19:46, Dave Kilroy  wrote:
> 
> Hi all
> 
> I’ve contracted a smashing guy with great server experience but who is new to 
> LiveCode install LiveCode Server on a Microsoft Azure Bitnami LAMP stack for 
> me - and it’s great working with someone who knows what they’re doing
> 
> However we’re stuck - could you clever people have a look at this thread 
> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=28354&p=148772#p148772 
>  and 
> pass on your suggestions as to how to get it working?
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> Dave
> 

It might be the Apache is being fussy about the lack of a trailing “/“ in the 
Script Alias or giving the name of an executable when a directory is required.

These are the relevant parts of the config I use happily with Apache 2.4:
 
ScriptAlias /livecode-cgi/ "/Users/peter/Sites/LiveCodeServer/“


AllowOverride None
Options +ExecCGI
Require all granted


AddHandler lcscript .lc
Action lcscript /livecode-cgi/livecode-server

Hope this helps.

Peter


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1001 Things to do with LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Even though there hasn’t been a new entry for a long time, there are still 
between 50 and 100 visits to the 1001 Things to do with LiveCode site everyday.

After a long hiatus, I have posted a new entry today featuring a client/server 
calendaring and time recording application. 

I’m sure that many of you have developed lots of interesting apps in LiveCode 
since the KickStarter campaign. Your apps deserve a few moments in the 
spotlight, why not send me some brief details, a screenshot or two and I’ll do 
the rest.

Peter
http://livecode1001.blogspot.com 
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Re: Setting the Unicode text of a field from JSON converted to array

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 10 Nov 2014, at 13:06, Brahmanathaswami  wrote:
> 
> i tried that already:
> 
> case "original_script"
> set the unicodetext of field "lyrics" to uniencode(tContent, "utf8")
> break
> 
> but still get garble
> 
> 
> ??
> 
> 
> 
> ?? 555
> 
>  555
> 
> ? 555
> [snip]

You need to process the JSON data before putting it into a string. As far as I 
know,LiveCode recognises “\u0ba9” as a string containing 6 characters. You need 
to process that to change it to the single character numToCodepoint(0x0ba9) or 
it’s preLiveCode 7 alternative. (The \, u, 0, b, a, and 9 will be UTF-8 encoded 
though.)


That is unless mergJSON “de-escapes" the JSON for you.

Regards

Peter


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Re: Setting the Unicode text of a field from JSON converted to array

[Peter W A Wood]

These are JSON escaped characters.  /r is the return (U+10) character. /n is 
the newline character (U+13). It would probably be easiest to replace them with 
the LiveCode return and linefeed characters.

Peter


> On 11 Nov 2014, at 13:49, Brahmanathaswami  wrote:
> 
> Can someone enlighten me on the
> 
> /r/n/r/n
> 
> that appear in the unicode string that is being delivered (by a PHP database 
> access lib/api that we post to from this desktop app)
> 
> These are obviously two new lines, the break between verses of the song... 
> but how do they mix and match with the unicode? Understood somehow as 
> "low-level" unicode? If I unescape the whole string... (remove all the 
> slashes) I think I need to leave this in... right?
> 
>> On 10 Nov 2014, at 10:26 pm, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>> 
>>>> That is unless mergJSON “de-escapes" the JSON for you.
>> 
>> It should but Brahmanathaswami wasn't using it. mergJSON handles UTF8 though 
>> so there's no need to have all the escapes. The only char it doesn't like is 
>> null.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> 
>> Monte
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Re: Livecode Server on Dreamhost fails in Ubuntu upgrade

[Peter W A Wood]

Stephen 

Do you know if Dreamhost upgraded to a newer version of Apache when they went 
to 64-bit. The .htaccess directives syntax may have changed.

Peter

> On 11 Nov 2014, at 14:37, stephen barncard  
> wrote:
> 
> So the 64 bit version of Livecode Server works now, on my Livecode only
> sites.
> 
> I'm still having problems with having PHP and LIVECODE being available at
> the same time with DH on Ubuntu.
> 
> surely there must be some way to get old htaccess directives to work to
> retain the PHP.
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 12:07 AM, stephen barncard <
> stephenrevoluti...@barncard.com> wrote:
> 
>> This htaccess file used to allow both php and livecode to co-exist:
>> 
>> Options +ExecCGI FollowSymLinks
>> AddHandler livecode-script .lc .irev
>> AddHandler php5-script php htm html
>> DirectoryIndex index.irev index.lc index.html index.php dir.irev
>> video.irev audio.irev gallery.irev
>> Action livecode-script /cgi-bin/livecode-server/livecode-community-server
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> *--*
> *Stephen Barncard - San Francisco Ca. USA - Deeds Not Words*
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Re: Running Apache Under Yosemite

[Peter W A Wood]

Hello Gregory

I had to modify my httpd.conf file when I moved from Mavericks to Yosemite 
because, if I remember correctly, Apple upgraded Apache from version 2.2 to 
2.4. The httpd syntax is a little different in the newer Apache.

These are the LiveCode Server entries from my Yosemite httpd.conf file:


ScriptAlias /livecode-cgi/ "/LiveCodeServer/"


/LiveCodeServer/">
Options +ExecCGI



AddHandler lcscript .lc
Action lcscript /livecode-cgi/livecode-server


Where  should be the full file path to the directory in which the 
LiveCodeServer is installed.

Hope this helps.

Peter

> On 19 Nov 2014, at 03:14, Gregory Lypny  wrote:
> 
> Hello everyone,
> 
> I have been happily running LiveCode server under Mavericks and am soon going 
> to upgrade to Yosemite. Can I continue to use the same modified httpd.conf 
> file that worked under Mavericks?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Gregory
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Re: Unicode menu and script characters changing unexpectedly

[Peter W A Wood]

Graham

It may be that that whilst string data processed by our LiveCode scripts and 
handlers is Unicode that is not the case with UI objects. I think that there is 
a chance that LiveCode is still using native encoding (Windows Code Page on 
Windows, ISO-8859-1 on Linux and the truly venerable MacRoman on OS X). 

I’m not sure how to check but would imagine many people on the list do.

Regards

Peter

> On 20 Nov 2014, at 19:23, Graham Samuel  wrote:
> 
> I’ve got a strange problem that (so far) I haven’t been able to reduce to a 
> simple recipe.
> 
> I’m using a few Unicode characters in some menus in a cross-platform app (I 
> mean special characters that don't appear on a Windows keyboard - I do 
> realise that everything in LC is Unicode now). In this instance I’m using LC 
> 7.0.1 rc-2 on a Mac with Yosemite simulating a PC using Windows 7 with 
> Parallels.
> 
> I have a menu script in an Edit menu that looks for menu items in the usual 
> way, using a switch statement. As an example, one of the items is the square 
> root sign, whose Unicode encoding is 0x221A. The item reads
> 
> Insert √
> 
> [I hope the last character - the square root sign - comes across in this 
> email]. Initially, I got the square root character via the IDE, by executing
> 
>  put numToCodePoint(0x221A)
> 
> in the Message Box and copying it, so I know I've got the real character and 
> not one that looks that the same but is part of the special non-standard Mac 
> set, or a glyph derived from html. 
> 
> I pasted this character into the menu item and in the corresponding script, 
> and I could see both strings quite clearly. However, when I save my stack, 
> quit from LC, go back in and look at it again, the square root character has 
> disappeared, BOTH in the script and in the menu item, to be replaced by '?' 
> or sometimes a character whose Unicode encoding turns out to be 24. This is 
> very odd, and pretty repeatable: however when I try to reproduce the problem 
> in a very simple stack with one card and one menu bar, things look fine and 
> the issue doesn't show up.
> 
> I just found out that if I recreate this menu item and corresponding script 
> on a Mac with LC 7.0.1 rc-2, it looks OK there, but if I open the SAME FILE 
> in Windows 7, the characters have already been changed. So it looks as if LC 
> 7 is not allowing Unicode to 'just work' across platforms, but it is not at 
> all a straightforward issue. For example, I have some ordinary text in fields 
> in my app containing the square root character, and they don't go through 
> this transformation - curiouser and curiouser...
> 
> Obviously I am struggling to get something to show the mother ship, and to 
> work out if there is anything my code could have done to cause this (seems 
> unlikely, since I don't execute any of my own scripts before seeing the 
> anomaly) - but meanwhile, can anyone shed any light on this?
> 
> TIA
> 
> Graham
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Re: LC Script in PHP File

[Peter W A Wood]

You should be able to use file_get_contents in PHP to do what you want. Though 
it will take longer to get the results from LiveCode than it would from PHP.

Here is an example:

PHP file:




Testing Getting Results From Website



  http://localhost/webtest.lc');
echo($livecode_returned);
  ?>




LiveCode file:
 "" then
  put "Peter" into tName
   else
  put "World" into tName
   end if
put header "Content-Type: text/html"
put ""
put ""
put "My LiveCode Server Test Page"
put ""
put ""
put "My LiveCode Server Test Page"
put "Hello" && tName && "from LiveCode Server"
put "The date is" && the internet date & ""
put "" & the second char of "12345" & ""
put ""
put ""
?>

Results:
My LiveCode Server Test Page

Hello World from LiveCode Server

The date is Sun, 23 Nov 2014 14:27:24 +0800

2

Hope this helps.

Peter

> On 23 Nov 2014, at 13:29, Nakia Brewer  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I am in the process of putting a web app together using the UserFrosting 
> system as a starting point.
> I am slowly getting the hang of the framework and am now wishing to start 
> using LC Server to do some backend crunching to render the pages. (Im not 
> picking up PHP as fast as I hoped!)
> 
> The UserFrosting system bases all of its page contents in PHP Files by design.
> 
> For example the index file is index.php
> 
> My question is, am I able to call LC functions from within a PHP file?
> 
> For example, in the below page (which is a PHP file)
> Red content...
> 
>  /*

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Re: LC Script in PHP File

[Peter W A Wood]

Richard 

As Simon mentioned, “calling” a LiveCode function by running a cgi script will 
be slower than a simple function call. Running a very simple LiveCode cgi 
script takes a few hundred milliseconds. A function call will take a few 
milliseconds.

On my machine, which has a solid-state drive, I ran two simple test scripts:

The PHP script took 76 milliseconds
The PHP script which “calls" LiveCode took 261 milliseconds

I have PHP installed as an Apache module so running a PHP script will always be 
faster than running a LiveCode script. The performance of LiveCode and PHP 
would be the same if either PHP was being run in the same fashion as LiveCode 
(i.e. using CGI) or there was a LiveCode Apache Module.

I suspect this makes little difference to shared hosting user as I understand 
that many shared hosts do not run PHP as an Apache module. It will make a 
difference to people running on dedicated servers (virtual or physical).

Also LiveCode server users are also disadvantaged compared with PHP users as 
there is no FastCGI version of LiveCode that can be run in connection with 
nginx.

Regards

Peeter
 
> On 24 Nov 2014, at 01:45, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> Peter W A Wood wrote:
> > You should be able to use file_get_contents in PHP to do what you
> > want. Though it will take longer to get the results from LiveCode
> > than it would from PHP.
> 
> Why would that be?
> 
> In general (and pre-7.0) LC used to perform roughly on par with PHP. Where 
> has it fallen down on the job?
> 
> Given the role of memory and performance for scaling, if we want to see LC 
> Server taken seriously as a professional server tool we need to identify and 
> eliminate any significant performance difference between it and PHP.
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin
> Fourth World Systems
> Software Design and Development for Desktop, Mobile, and Web
> 
> ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com
> 
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Comparison of Speed of LiveCode with PHP

[Peter W A Wood]

In a previous email Richard Gaskin, the LiveCode Community Manager, wrote 
"Given the role of memory and performance for scaling, if we want to see LC 
Server taken seriously as a professional server tool we need to identify and 
eliminate any significant performance difference between it and PHP.”

I thought that it would be worth spending a little time to compare the speed of 
LiveCode against the speed of PHP. I came up with a test based loosely on Carl 
Sassenrath’s Rebol Speed Script ( http://www.rebol.com/cgi-bin/blog.r?view=0506 
). I have found it a useful base for writing comparative scripts (either 
comparing languages on a single machine or comparing machines using a single 
language). It is far from perfect in a multi-tasking environment but I believe 
provides decent comparative data.

I have attached two scripts, speedtest.lc and speedtest.php. I’m sure that both 
could be improved significantly and welcome such improvements. The results of 
running the two scripts on my machine, LiveCode 7.0.0-rc-3 and PHP 5.5.14 are:

Schulz:LiveCodeServer peter$ ./speedtest.lc
LiveCode Speed Test Started
The CPU test took: 2851 ms
The Memory test took:   3656 ms
The File System test took:  1975 ms
LiveCode Speed Test Finished

Schulz:LiveCodeServer peter$ ./speedtest.php
PHP Speed Test Started
The CPU test took:  3921 ms
The Memory test took:   1200 ms
The File System test took:  666 ms
PHP Speed Test Finished

So it seems the LiveCode has the edge on PHP when it comes to calculations but 
not on memory access or file access. 

The memory test relies on using arrays, I'm not sure if that is the best way to 
test memory access.

Regards

Peter

Speedtest.lc

#!livecode   

if the platform = "MacOS" then
  set the outputLineEndings to "lf"
end if

put "LiveCode Speed Test Started" & return

##cpu test
put the millisecs into tStart   
repeat with i = 1 to 1000
  put sqrt(exp(i)) into tTemp
end repeat
put the millisecs into tEnd
put "The CPU test took:" && tEnd - tStart && "ms" & return

##Memory Access
put the millisecs into tStart   
repeat with i = 1 to 100
  put random(255) into tMem[i]
end repeat
put the millisecs into tEnd
put "The Memory test took: " && tEnd - tStart && "ms" & return

##Filesystem
open file "test.tmp"
put the millisecs into tStart   
repeat with i = 1 to 10
  write "This is a test of the write speed" && random(255) to file "test.tmp"
  read from file "test.tmp" for 1 line
end repeat
put the millisecs into tEnd
put "The File System test took:" && tEnd - tStart && "ms" & return
delete file "test.tmp"

##Finish
put "LiveCode Speed Test Finished" & return

Speedtest.php

#!/usr/bin/php





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Re: LC Server on DreamHost?

[Peter W A Wood]

Stephen

Some time ago, I ran some tests to measure the comparative startup times of 
PHP, LiveCode and HTML on On-rev. The two scripts are simple:

Livecode
I've started" 
?>

PHP
I've started" 
?>

HTML
I've started

Trying these simple pages should give a good indication if the startup time of 
LiveCode is the problem on Dreamhost.

Regards

Peter

PS I used a ruby script running on the server to access the three pages to 
reduce the effect of network delays on the response times.


> On 24 Nov 2014, at 11:55, stephen barncard  
> wrote:
> 
> would you consider this script to be comparative to the "complexity" of
> phpInfo() ?
> 
> anyway I don't think the slowdown I'm seeing at Dreamhost would be caught
> in this benchmark. Once LC is loaded, it  quite speedy. But on the
> server it has to restart for every page load.
> 
> my livecode test script was basically the same as yoursexcept I use the
> .irev suffix on the file.
> 
>  -- NEW UNIVERSAL VERSION 2014
> 
> put $_SERVER[SERVER_NAME] into sSiteName
> put $_SERVER[SERVER_ADDR] into sSiteADDR
> put $_SERVER[REMOTE_ADDR] into sRemoteADDR
> put \
> "" && sSiteName  && "" && \
> "" && sSiteADDR  && \
> " " && "(your IP:" && sRemoteADDR &&
> ")" &\
> "" && \
> "" &\
> "SERVER TEST  |  " && \
> "server: Livecode" &&  "|" && \
> "OS:" && the platform &&  "|" && \
> "Engine:" && the version && ""   into sComposedTitle
> ?>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> body {
> background-color:#F9E8D2;
> color:#33;
> font-family: "Lucida Grande", Lucida, Verdana, sans-serif;
> }
> fieldset {
> background-color:#33;
> color:black;
> text-align:center;
> }
> h1{
> color:#FDD017;
> }
> h2{
> color:#C79F8A;
> }
> h3{
> color:orange;
> }
> h4{
> color:#EE;
> }
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  command outputRow pLabel, pValue
> ?>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  end outputRow
> ?>
> 
> 
>  put sComposedTitle ?>
> 
> 
> Server Globals
> 
> 
> 
>  repeat for each key tKey in $_SERVER
> outputRow tKey, $_SERVER[tKey]
> end repeat
> ?>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *--*
> *Stephen Barncard - San Francisco Ca. USA - Deeds Not Words*
> 
> On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 11:32 PM, Phil Davis  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 11/22/14 10:23 AM, Warren Samples wrote:
>> 
>>> On 11/21/2014 01:56 PM, Phil Davis wrote:
>>> 
 I'm glad it isn't just me:
 http://quality.runrev.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13983
 
 Phil Davis
 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Phil,
>>> 
>>> Your desktop utility shows a difference of about 8 to 10 times using your
>>> URLs and about 4 times using mine when run under 6.6.2. Opening the URLs in
>>> a browser continues to show a significant difference, but it's hard to
>>> quantify. Could you put a timer in the scripts themselves?
>>> 
>> 
>> New URLs:
>> http://ctrainweb.com/test3.lc
>> http://support.nweta.com/test3.lc
>> 
>> Very interesting! The scripts run quite speedily on both servers.
>> 
>> Also, it seems probable from how they display in the utility and the
>>> browser that the scripts are not quite identical, with the one at <
>>> http://ctrainweb.com/test2.lc> not converting 'CR' to '' as does
>>> (apparently) the other one. However doubtful it might be that this has
>>> serious impact, it would be best ensure they are identical.
>>> 
>> 
>> Done. Here is the 'test3.lc' script:
>> --- start ---
>> > put the long seconds into tStart
>> put tStart into tStart2
>> put "LC version" && the version & CR & "SYSTEM VERSION"  && the
>> systemVersion & CR & the time & CR after tOutput
>> repeat with x = 1 to 3
>>put x & CR after tOutput
>> end repeat
>> put CR
>> put the keys of $_SERVER into tList
>> sort lines of tList
>> repeat for each line tKey in tList
>>if $_SERVER[tKey] is an array
>>then put "[" & tKey & "]" & CR after tOutput
>>else put tKey && "=" && $_SERVER[tKey] & CR after tOutput
>> end repeat
>> replace CR with "" in tOutput
>> put the long seconds - tStart && "secs"
>> put tOutput
>> put the long seconds - tStart2 && "secs"
>> ?>
>> --- end ---
>> 
>> Phil
>> 
>> 
>>> Warren
>>> 
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>>> 
>> --
>> Phil Davis
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Please vi

Re: LC Server on DreamHost?

[Peter W A Wood]

Stephen

> On 24 Nov 2014, at 13:28, stephen barncard  
> wrote:
> 
> On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 8:17 PM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> Some time ago, I ran some tests to measure the comparative startup times
>> of PHP, LiveCode and HTML on On-rev. The two scripts are simple:
>> 
>>Livecode
>>I've started"
>> ?>
>> 
>>PHP
>>I've started"
>> ?>
>> 
>>HTML
>>I've started
>> 
> 
> I don't see Livecode being called here in any way. ???

Oops. I copy and pasted the wrong file. The LiveCode version was:

I've started" ?>


> And I don't use On-Rev.  I believe On-Rev alters Apache.

I don’t know. On-rev does not have mod_php installed so PHP runs as a cgi 
script. If I remember correctly, the last tests that I ran showed that LiveCode 
and PHP loaded in very similar times. These results suggest that LiveCode was 
running as a cgi on On-Rev.

> My comment was regarding using the htaccess cgi methods on Dreamhost,
> livecode vs PHP.

I shared the web pages/scripts as a means of finding out if the issue with 
LiveCode on Dreamhost is during the time LiveCode is loading. There are an easy 
way to roughly compare the load times of HTML, PHP and LiveCode on any host.

Regards

Peter
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Re: LC Script in PHP File

[Peter W A Wood]

Simon

FastCGI support would be excellent from my point of view as it would allow 
LiveCode to be run behind a web server acting as a load balancer.

Regards

Peter

> On 24 Nov 2014, at 21:34, Simon Smith  wrote:
> 
> Would supporting Fast CGI not be a better way forward?
> 
> On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 7:56 AM, Monte Goulding > wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 24 Nov 2014, at 3:29 pm, Richard Gaskin 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> What would it take to make an Apache module for LiveCode?
>> 
>> 
>> Apache modules themselves don't look all that complicated. As far as LC
>> goes as long as you don't support threaded mpms it should be largely a
>> matter of handling the request and setting the globals up then passing
>> headers and output via the module api rather than stdout.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> 
>> Monte
>> 
>> --
>> M E R Goulding
>> Software development services
>> Bespoke application development for vertical markets
>> 
>> mergExt - There's an external for that!
>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> *Simon Smith*
> *seo, online marketing, web development*
> 
> w. http://www.simonsmith.co
> m. +27 83 306 7862
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Re: Comparison of Speed of LiveCode with PHP

[Peter W A Wood]

Geoff

Thanks for your input.

I think you are correct that the memory access comparison isn’t fair. I don’t 
have time right now but I’ll try to come up with a better comparison. 

I’m not convinced that the file comparison is fair. If LiveCode is appending 
the data to the file rather than overwriting the existing data then it is at a 
disadvantage. I’ll look a little deeper into this aspect too, once I get the 
time.

Regards

Peter

> On 24 Nov 2014, at 23:31, Geoff Canyon  wrote:
> 
> My PHP is weak, but if the memory access test is a regular array, then
> comparing it to a livecode array is somewhat apples and oranges, since LC
> is really a hash. But on the other hand, there's no way to do a simple
> array in LC, so it's not like you can do better.
> 
> For the file access test, your test is pretty much apples to apples, but it
> would be interesting to compare it to URL access: build the whole string
> and write it out, then read the whole thing in and split it. That wouldn't
> be a fair comparison, but it would be interesting.
> 
> gc
> 


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Re: Comparison of Speed of LiveCode with PHP

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Andre

I agree with your comments on the appropriateness of the tests. I’ll give some 
thought to incorporating more I/O based tests.

Do you think that having FastCGI support so that LiveCode could be run behind a 
load balancing server would be an improvement from a scalability point of view.

Regards

Peter

> On 24 Nov 2014, at 23:42, Andre Garzia  wrote:
> 
> Hi Peter,
> 
> Thanks for your testing!
> 
> I think we're approaching this performance issue wrong. Most webapps will
> be I/O bound and not CPU bound. Calculations are not the most common thing
> going on but I/O in the sense of reading and writing from database and
> files are. Also the only way to deal with structured data in memory in a
> straight forward way is LiveCode multilevel arrays but there is no built-in
> way to serialize these arrays for consumption outside of LiveCode. For
> example, a common thing these days is to have your client-side HTML5 code
> calling back your server-side code for more information which is normally
> presented in JSON but LiveCode has no built-in function for JSON encoding
> and decoding, so both operations happen in pure transcript (or whatever
> they are calling it these days) which will make it really slow.
> 
> If we want LiveCode to have better performance we need ways to improve I/O.
> Things that would be good and have a real impact out of the box:
> 
> - JSON and XML encode and decode functions in the engine.
> - Non-blocking DB routines
> 
> 
> A different issue is scalability. Right now, LiveCode Server works in CGI
> mode which is very straight forward but it is not the most scalable thing
> under the sun. When I say scale, I am not saying things such as serving
> 5.000 users. Serving a couple thousand users is easy. I am saying serving
> some hundred thousand users with complex server side logic, afterall doing
> 100.000 hello worlds is easy.
> 
> PHP is going thru lots of revolutions in the form of the Facebook
> initiatives such as "hack" (new PHP variation), that VM they created and
> the little compiler they created which I forgot the name. The PHP
> developers are also pushing PHPNG and other gizmos. Even current generation
> PHP is not usually server with CGI technology.
> 
> Ruby, Node, Python, Clojure, Java, none are served with CGI. Most of them
> could be used as CGI but no one is using them this way. CGI is easy but it
> is not scalable. Imagine that if you were serving 10.000 concurrent
> requests on your little server farm, you're have a collection of 10.000
> LiveCode server processes between your servers.
> 
> What we need is something like Python WSGI or a non-blocking engine such as
> Node. Then we could with a simple pool of couple LiveCode engine instances
> serve a lot of people.
> 
> On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 1:33 AM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> In a previous email Richard Gaskin, the LiveCode Community Manager, wrote
>> "Given the role of memory and performance for scaling, if we want to see LC
>> Server taken seriously as a professional server tool we need to identify
>> and eliminate any significant performance difference between it and PHP.”
>> 
>> I thought that it would be worth spending a little time to compare the
>> speed of LiveCode against the speed of PHP. I came up with a test based
>> loosely on Carl Sassenrath’s Rebol Speed Script (
>> http://www.rebol.com/cgi-bin/blog.r?view=0506 ). I have found it a useful
>> base for writing comparative scripts (either comparing languages on a
>> single machine or comparing machines using a single language). It is far
>> from perfect in a multi-tasking environment but I believe provides decent
>> comparative data.
>> 
>> I have attached two scripts, speedtest.lc and speedtest.php. I’m sure
>> that both could be improved significantly and welcome such improvements.
>> The results of running the two scripts on my machine, LiveCode 7.0.0-rc-3
>> and PHP 5.5.14 are:
>> 
>> Schulz:LiveCodeServer peter$ ./speedtest.lc
>> LiveCode Speed Test Started
>> The CPU test took: 2851 ms
>> The Memory test took:   3656 ms
>> The File System test took:  1975 ms
>> LiveCode Speed Test Finished
>> 
>> Schulz:LiveCodeServer peter$ ./speedtest.php
>> PHP Speed Test Started
>> The CPU test took:  3921 ms
>> The Memory test took:   1200 ms
>> The File System test took:  666 ms
>> PHP Speed Test Finished
>> 
>> So it seems the LiveCode has the edge on PHP when it comes to calculations
>> but not on memory access or file access.
>> 
>> The memory test relies on using arrays, I'm not sure if that is the best
>

Re: LC Script in PHP File

[Peter W A Wood]

Thanks for the clarification Andre.

> On 25 Nov 2014, at 19:18, Andre Garzia  wrote:
> 
> Peter,
> 
> Most PHP installations will not allow file_get_contents() to be run on
> localhost to prevent infinite loops. I've been hurt by that before.
> 
> cheers
> 
> 
> On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 5:09 AM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> You should be able to use file_get_contents in PHP to do what you want.
>> Though it will take longer to get the results from LiveCode than it would
>> from PHP.
>> 
>> Here is an example:
>> 
>> PHP file:
>> 
>> 
>>
>>> content="text/html;charset=utf-8" />
>>Testing Getting Results From Website
>>
>>
>>
>>  >$livecode_returned = file_get_contents('
>> http://localhost/webtest.lc');
>>echo($livecode_returned);
>>  ?>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>> LiveCode file:
>> >if $_GET["name"] <> "" then
>>  put "Peter" into tName
>>   else
>>  put "World" into tName
>>   end if
>>put header "Content-Type: text/html"
>>put ""
>>put ""
>>put "My LiveCode Server Test Page"
>>put ""
>>put ""
>>put "My LiveCode Server Test Page"
>>put "Hello" && tName && "from LiveCode Server"
>>put "The date is" && the internet date & ""
>>put "" & the second char of "12345" & ""
>>put ""
>>put ""
>> ?>
>> 
>> Results:
>> My LiveCode Server Test Page
>> 
>> Hello World from LiveCode Server
>> 
>> The date is Sun, 23 Nov 2014 14:27:24 +0800
>> 
>> 2
>> 
>> Hope this helps.
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>>> On 23 Nov 2014, at 13:29, Nakia Brewer 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I am in the process of putting a web app together using the UserFrosting
>> system as a starting point.
>>> I am slowly getting the hang of the framework and am now wishing to
>> start using LC Server to do some backend crunching to render the pages. (Im
>> not picking up PHP as fast as I hoped!)
>>> 
>>> The UserFrosting system bases all of its page contents in PHP Files by
>> design.
>>> 
>>> For example the index file is index.php
>>> 
>>> My question is, am I able to call LC functions from within a PHP file?
>>> 
>>> For example, in the below page (which is a PHP file)
>>> Red content...
>>> 
>>> >> /*
>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> http://www.andregarzia.com -- All We Do Is Code.
> http://fon.nu -- minimalist url shortening service.
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Re: Can't Start LiveCode Server Under Yosemite

[Peter W A Wood]

It isn’t as easy to start Apache on Yosemite as it was on previous versions of 
OS X. The option has been removed from the Sharing Preferences panel.

You need to start Apache manually using the Terminal app from an admin user 
account.

This command will start Apache

sudo apachectl start

This command will re-start Apache if you have made any changes to the Apache 
configuration file

sudo apachectl restart

This command will stop Apache if you want to stop Apache

sudo apachectl stop


Once you have started Apache, it should automatically restart if you restart or 
power off / power on.

I hope this helps.

Peter

> On 1 Dec 2014, at 22:59, Simon Smith  wrote:
> 
> If it's saying that it cannot connect to the server, I would guess that
> apache is not running.
> 
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:45 PM, Gregory Lypny 
> wrote:
> 
>> Hello everyone,
>> 
>> I can’t seem to get LiveCode server working under Yosemite. I followed
>> Peter Wood’s suggestion and modified the httpd.conf file as follows, where
>> the path to LiveCode server is “Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables”.
>> 
>> 
>>ScriptAlias /livecode-cgi/
>> "Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables/"
>>
>> 
>>
>>Options +ExecCGI
>>
>> 
>>
>>AddHandler lcscript .lc
>>Action lcscript /livecode-cgi/livecode-server
>>
>> 
>> I have LiveCode server 5.0.2 installed.
>> 
>> When I enter localhost in Safari, I get an error message saying that
>> Safari cannot connect to the server.
>> 
>> Any advice would be most appreciated,
>> 
>> Gregory
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> 
> 
> 
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Re: Can't Start LiveCode Server Under Yosemite

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Gregory

The first think that I would check is whether Apache is actually running or 
not. This is how I checked on my machine, using the ps command:

Schulz:~ fatty$ sudo apachectl start
Schulz:~ fatty$ ps -U www
  PID TTY   TIME CMD
35439 ?? 0:00.00 /usr/sbin/httpd -D FOREGROUND
Schulz:~ fatty$ sudo apachectl stop
Schulz:~ fatty$ ps -U www
  PID TTY   TIME CMD
Schulz:~ fatty$ sudo apachectl start
Schulz:~ fatty$ ps -U www
  PID TTY   TIME CMD
35458 ?? 0:00.00 /usr/sbin/httpd -D FOREGROUND

The next thing I would check would be the Apache error log, which you you 
should be able to do with this command:

tail /private/var/log/apache2/error_log

Regards

Peter

> On 3 Dec 2014, at 09:21, Gregory Lypny  wrote:
> 
> Hi Peter,
> 
> Thanks for responding. I tried starting Apache with Terminal, using both 
> start and then restart. The command appears to have been accepted (see below) 
> but when I type localhost into Safari, I still get the message “Safari Can’t 
> Connect to the Server."
> 
> Last login: Tue Dec  2 19:58:59 on console
> Gregorys-iMac-2:~ gregory$ sudo apachectl restart
> Password:
> Gregorys-iMac-2:~ gregory$ sudo apachectl start
> /System/Library/LaunchDaemons/org.apache.httpd.plist: Operation already in 
> progress
> Gregorys-iMac-2:~ gregory$ 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Gregory

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Re: use-livecode Digest, Vol 135, Issue 3

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Gregory

I believe that you need to use absolute filepaths in the Apache configuration 
file rather than relative ones. So I think you will need to change

"Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables/“>

to

“/Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables/“> or

“/Users//Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables/“>

You will need to change the script-alias entry to match.

Hope this helps.

Peter


> On 3 Dec 2014, at 20:51, Gregory Lypny  wrote:
> 
> Hi Peter,
> 
> Thank you for the heads up on the ps command. I was able to get Apache 
> running with the original httpd.conf file. Apache does not run with the 
> httpd.conf file that I modified the way you suggested in your previous post 
> for LiveCode server. I must have entered something incorrectly or in the 
> wrong place.
> 
> 
> I added
> 
> 
>   Options +ExecCGI
> 
> 
> because the LiveCode server file is in the CGI-Executables folder.
> 
> 
> I then added
> 
> ScriptAlias /livecode-cgi/ "Library/WebServer/CGI-Executables/”
> 
> within the existing section that begins with  and ends 
> with 
> 
> 
> And finally, I added
> 
> AddHandler lcscript .lc
> Action lcscript /livecode-cgi/livecode-server
> 
> to the existing section that begins with  and ends with 
> 
> 
> I notice that in my old Mavericks httpd.conf file, the last two statements, 
> AddHandler and Action, appear in the section  "/Library/WebServer/Documents”> rather than .
> 
> Gregory


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Re: LC Server Unable To Retrieve File From DropBox?

[Peter W A Wood]

Scott and Jacque

I believe that LiveCodeServer includes a version of LibCurl and it looks likley 
to be the cause of the problem. I only have the latest RC version of LiveCode 
to hand so it may be worth trying my test script out of the version you are 
running.

I ran this script with LiveCodeServer:

#Start Code
#!livecode   

set the outputLineEndings to "lf"

put the Version & return

put "http:" && the number of words of URL "http://bbc.co.uk";
put return 

put "https:" && the number of words of URL "https://github.com";
put return
#End Code

and got this:

#Start Output
7.0.1-rc-4
http: 4407
https: 0
#End Output

I then ran the same code modified to run in the message box:

#Start Code
put the Version & return into tTemp

put "http:" && the number of words of URL "http://bbc.co.uk"; after tTemp
put return after tTemp

put "https:" && the number of words of URL "https://github.com"; after tTemp
put return after tTemp

put tTemp
#End Code

and got this:

#Start Output
7.0.1-rc-4
http: 4407
https: 1068
#End Output

If you can confirm this I will file a bug report.

Regards

Peter
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Re: LC Server Unable To Retrieve File From DropBox?

[Peter W A Wood]

I have submitted a bug report - Bug 14262 


Regards

Peter

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Time for another LiveCode Global Jam?

[Peter W A Wood]

This message is really for Richard Gaskin in his role as LiveCode Community 
Manager but I thought it would be useful (especially for Richard) to get other 
people’s feedback.

It may be just me but I have noticed two themes growing on the mailing lists. 
The first is the expression of dissatisfaction with the quality of LiveCode 7 
mainly from people who have a commercial licence (or subscription). The second 
is the number of people who are reluctant to move anything which needs to be 
relied upon to LiveCode 7 especially those whose livelihood (or part of it) is 
dependent on LiveCode. Both are completely understandable. 

I see this as quite a chicken and egg situation, people didn’t have the time to 
test LiveCode 7 pre-releases. Now when they give LiveCode 7 a  try, they come 
across issues that have a serious effect on them. This is turn makes them more 
reluctant to do further testing and hence further delays there intention to 
move to LiveCode 7.

Whilst I have no doubt that RunRev’s own testing could be much improved and it 
would be worth their investment of more time into testing, the reality seems to 
be that at this time they are relying on bug reports to improve the product 
quality.

Personally, I want to see LiveCode progress and, galling though it may seem to 
some, would prefer to put a little effort in to finding bugs rather than sit 
and wait.

Perhaps you would consider requesting that RunRev organise another Global Jam 
event where the community reports bug and the RunRev team fixes them. It might 
help to built a little more momentum in moving LiveCode forward.

Regards

Peter
http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com  






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Where are the tests hidden?

[Peter W A Wood]

If my memory serves me correctly, at some stage during the open sourcing of 
LiveCode it was stated that RunRev have some type of automated test suite. 
Earlier this year, I asked this question on the engine contributors forum:

“It will probably be a long time before I have the necessary knowledge to make 
changes to the engine. However, I'm pretty sure that I, and probably a lot more 
LiveCoders, could help write tests. I have an affinity for bugs, most of my 
code is full of them :-) The only thing is I can't find the tests. Where are 
they hidden?”

It would be good if we could submit tests to a central source and thereby 
improve the quality of LiveCode.

Any suggestions?

Regards

Peter



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Re: Sockets

[Peter W A Wood]

Hello Eric

I ran a very simple test using LiveCode 7.0.1 on OS X Yosemite and didn’t see 
the issue. It was a very simple test though.

My test had three buttons: open, list, close and one field: Report.

The three button scripts were:

open - open socket to "127.0.0.1:80"

close - close socket "127.0.0.1:80"

list - put the openSockets into Field "Report"

It worked as expected.

Regards

Peter

> On 23 Dec 2014, at 09:04, Eric Corbett  wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
> 
> I’m using LiveCode 7.0.1.
> 
> I have a port open and when I get the openSockets list, the port has an extra 
> character on the end like an ‘å’ or a double quote. I check to see if the 
> port is in the openSocket list so I don’t try to accept connections again, 
> but if I have wholeMatches set to true, it’s not returning true.
> 
> Can anyone confirm this before I submit a bug report?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> - Eric
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Re: Sockets

[Peter W A Wood]

When opening when starting a socket, I see the problem. This is the port number 
that was displayed "12345ر”

Regards

Peter

> On 23 Dec 2014, at 11:54, Eric Corbett  wrote:
> 
> Thanks Peter,
> 
> Try starting a server by doing 
> 
> accept connections on port 12345 with message "xxx"
> 
> Then list the openSockets. The open port 12345 will or might have an extra 
> character at the end. 
> 
> - Eric
> 
> 
> 
>> On Dec 22, 2014, at 17:35, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello Eric
>> 
>> I ran a very simple test using LiveCode 7.0.1 on OS X Yosemite and didn’t 
>> see the issue. It was a very simple test though.
>> 
>> My test had three buttons: open, list, close and one field: Report.
>> 
>> The three button scripts were:
>> 
>>   open - open socket to "127.0.0.1:80"
>> 
>>   close - close socket "127.0.0.1:80"
>> 
>>   list - put the openSockets into Field "Report"
>> 
>> It worked as expected.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>>> On 23 Dec 2014, at 09:04, Eric Corbett  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello all,
>>> 
>>> I’m using LiveCode 7.0.1.
>>> 
>>> I have a port open and when I get the openSockets list, the port has an 
>>> extra character on the end like an ‘å’ or a double quote. I check to see if 
>>> the port is in the openSocket list so I don’t try to accept connections 
>>> again, but if I have wholeMatches set to true, it’s not returning true.
>>> 
>>> Can anyone confirm this before I submit a bug report?
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> - Eric
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Code 2014 - Vote for LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

#code2014 is this year’s programming languages popularity poll. You can see the 
current results at http://www.code2014.com 

As I write this note, LiveCode doesn’t have a single vote. I am about to change 
that. You can vote by tweeting with the hashtag #code2014 and mentioning the 
languages you have used in 2014.

Why don’t you?

Regards

Peter
http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com 



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Re: Code 2014 - Vote for LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Colin

It says the list updates every 10 minutes on the website … but from last year I 
suspect that there may be some manual intervention to add a language to those 
listed.

Regards

Peter


> On 30 Dec 2014, at 07:44, Colin Holgate  wrote:
> 
> Seems to be a comma separated list of the languages you’ve done. Not sure how 
> long the page takes to update.
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Code 2014 - Vote for LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Devin

It’s probably because your tweets are private. We can’t see you tweets and I 
guess neither can #Code2014.

Regards

Peter


> On 30 Dec 2014, at 08:24, Devin Asay  wrote:
> 
> Odd that there are five tweets mentioned but the count on the chart is only 
> 4. I see Richard, Mike, myself, Colin and Peter.
> 


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Re: Code 2014 - Vote for LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

Well tweeted, well almost well tweeted. You vote hasn’t been counted yet 
although it does appear in the list of “votes” when you click on the LiveCode 
circle.

You tweeted Livecode. Had you tweeted LiveCode or livecode you vote would have 
been counted. I’ve made a request for Livecode to be treated as LiveCode (by 
submitting a pull request on Github). If it is accepted your vote will get 
automatically added to the total. I am very hopeful that the request will be 
accepted but we will need to wait until America goes to work to find out.

So that you can have a good rant about the software that counts the votes.  It 
was written in Ruby and seems to use case-sensitive comparison.

Regards

Peter
http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com <http://livecode1001.blogspot.com/> 

> On 31 Dec 2014, at 15:25, Richmond  wrote:
> 
> I, too, have been called a twit, and far worse, many times. I have, also 
> never tweeted, twittered or warbled; so it is obviously time to learn how to 
> do this.
> 
> Richmond.
> 
> On 31 Dec 2014, at 02:32, Bob Sneidar  wrote:
> 
>> Unfortunately I do not tweet. Or twitter for that matter. Although I *have* 
>> been called a twit on an indeterminate number of occasions. 
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Dec 29, 2014, at 15:34 , Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>>> 
>>> #code2014 is this year’s programming languages popularity poll. You can see 
>>> the current results at http://www.code2014.com <http://www.code2014.com/>
>>> 
>>> As I write this note, LiveCode doesn’t have a single vote. I am about to 
>>> change that. You can vote by tweeting with the hashtag #code2014 and 
>>> mentioning the languages you have used in 2014.
>>> 
>>> Why don’t you?
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> 
>>> Peter
>>> http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com <http://livecode1001.blogspot.com/>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Code 2014 - Vote for LiveCode

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

I am happy to report that I was wrong and the “voting machine” was case 
insensitive. Both your and Tom’s vote were counted.

Regards

Peter


> On 1 Jan 2015, at 00:01, Richmond  wrote:
> 
> On 31/12/14 18:00, Devin Asay wrote:
>> You can delete your tweet then retweet with the proper case. Whew! Too much 
>> rhyming in that sentence.
>> 
>> DNA
>> 
>> 
> Tom Bodine also tweeted "Livecode" . . . !
> 
> Richmond.
> 
> 
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Re: Membership disabled

[Peter W A Wood]

All of Craig’s messages to this list get directed to my Gmail spam folder and 
has been for a long time. A handful of other list messages also end up there. 
There were a couple from another AOL user today.

Regards
Peter

http://LiveCode1001/blogspot.com 


> On 1 Jan 2015, at 05:44, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> So here's a perfect example.  I never got Craig's email which is quoted in
> Jacque's reply.  This only happens with emails sent from either an AOL
> address or a Yahoo address to the How To list so it's definitely a
> Yahoo/AOL related problem.
> 
> I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of this but I'm told it's the
> result of an email checking protocol named DMARC.
> 
> I am going to try changing the address my list mails are sent to to my
> gMail address instead of my lcSQL address and see if that makes any
> difference.
> 
> 
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software 
> Home of lcStackBrowser  and
> SQLiteAdmin 
> 
> On Wed, Dec 31, 2014 at 12:44 PM, J. Landman Gay 
> wrote:
> 
>> On 12/31/2014 1:25 PM, dunb...@aol.com wrote:
>> 
>>> Jacque thought it might have to do with AOL, but you are not on that
>>> service.
>>> 
>> 
>> I still think it has to do with AOL, but the recipient doesn't need to be
>> on that service (my mailserver isn't.) It's that the sender is writing from
>> AOL and the recipient's server is rejecting those messages because AOL has
>> set some properties that the receiving server doesn't like.
>> 
>> Yahoo did the same thing apparently. I do know that some of your messages
>> never arrive here, but others do, so in my case it's spotty and not often
>> enough for me to get the bounce notice. My email client does put some of
>> your messages into my spam folder.
>> 
>> AOL and Yahoo have a history of spammer abuse, and it's likely that's why
>> they set up certain parameters and why the receiving servers are rejecting
>> so many of the those emails.
>> 
>> --
>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>> 
>> 
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Re: Membership disabled

[Peter W A Wood]

Thanks Peter. I’ll give that a try.

Peter 

> On 2 Jan 2015, at 01:17, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> Hi Peter,
> If you have a filter to recognize emails to the list, there's an option to
> "Never send it to spam".  Checking that ensures that the emails won't go
> into your spam folder. GMail still puts a little message at the top saying
> that it would have gone to spam if not for the filter.
> 
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com <http://www.lcsql.com/>>
> Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html 
> <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html>> and
> SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html 
> <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>>
> 
> On Wed, Dec 31, 2014 at 3:19 PM, Peter W A Wood  <mailto:peterwaw...@gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> 
>> All of Craig’s messages to this list get directed to my Gmail spam folder
>> and has been for a long time. A handful of other list messages also end up
>> there. There were a couple from another AOL user today.
>> 
>> Regards
>> Peter
>> 
>> http://LiveCode1001/blogspot.com <http://livecode1001/blogspot.com> 
>> <http://livecode1001/blogspot.com <http://livecode1001/blogspot.com>>
>> 
>> 
>>> On 1 Jan 2015, at 05:44, Peter Haworth  wrote:
>>> 
>>> So here's a perfect example.  I never got Craig's email which is quoted
>> in
>>> Jacque's reply.  This only happens with emails sent from either an AOL
>>> address or a Yahoo address to the How To list so it's definitely a
>>> Yahoo/AOL related problem.
>>> 
>>> I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of this but I'm told it's the
>>> result of an email checking protocol named DMARC.
>>> 
>>> I am going to try changing the address my list mails are sent to to my
>>> gMail address instead of my lcSQL address and see if that makes any
>>> difference.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Pete
>>> lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com>
>>> Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html> and
>>> SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Dec 31, 2014 at 12:44 PM, J. Landman Gay <
>> jac...@hyperactivesw.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 12/31/2014 1:25 PM, dunb...@aol.com wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Jacque thought it might have to do with AOL, but you are not on that
>>>>> service.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I still think it has to do with AOL, but the recipient doesn't need to
>> be
>>>> on that service (my mailserver isn't.) It's that the sender is writing
>> from
>>>> AOL and the recipient's server is rejecting those messages because AOL
>> has
>>>> set some properties that the receiving server doesn't like.
>>>> 
>>>> Yahoo did the same thing apparently. I do know that some of your
>> messages
>>>> never arrive here, but others do, so in my case it's spotty and not
>> often
>>>> enough for me to get the bounce notice. My email client does put some of
>>>> your messages into my spam folder.
>>>> 
>>>> AOL and Yahoo have a history of spammer abuse, and it's likely that's
>> why
>>>> they set up certain parameters and why the receiving servers are
>> rejecting
>>>> so many of the those emails.
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>>>> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> subscription preferences:
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Code 2014 - Apologies

[Peter W A Wood]

I am very embarrassed that I have asked people on this list to tweet for 
LiveCode to #Code2014. It seems as though somebody has arranged to have a vote 
for LiveCode to be re-tweeted by people who retweet promotions for all and 
sundry.

If you, like me, had voted in good faith for LiveCode please accept my 
apologies.

Regards

Peter
http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com 

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Re: Standalone on Raspberry Pi

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Kenji

As I understand the Linux option in the Standalone Settings creates a 
standalone for an Intel-based computer. At the moment, there isn’t an option to 
create a standalone for an ARM-based computer. 

There is a “community” supported version of LiveCode that runs on Raspberry Pi 
but that is the IDE. I haven’t tried it myself so I don’t know if you can build 
a Raspberry Pi standalone with it.

Regards

Peter
http://LiveCode1001.blogspot.com 



> On 3 Jan 2015, at 23:48, Kenji Kojima  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Did anybody make a standalone on Raspberry Pi?
> I made some test standalone of very simple stacks. 
> I changed the permissions of them. But they did not run on Raspberry Pi.
> I tried to run the standalone on Ubuntu. They worked. 
> What was the problem. 
> 
> Thanks,
> --
> Kenji Kojima / 小島健治
> http://www.kenjikojima.com/
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Standalone on Raspberry Pi

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Fraser

On Monday, 5 January 2015, Fraser Gordon  wrote:

> On 03/01/2015 23:46, Peter W A Wood wrote:
> > Hi Kenji
> >
> > As I understand the Linux option in the Standalone Settings creates a
> standalone for an Intel-based computer. At the moment, there isn’t an
> option to create a standalone for an ARM-based computer.
>
> What version and edition are you using? "Linux ARMv6" should appear as
> an option on the Linux pane of the 7.0 Community editions (alongside x86
> and x86-64).


I currently only have LiveCode 7.0.1 Commercial and LiveCode Server 7.0.1
Community edition installed on my machine. Having a current license it
previously seemed a little pointless to install both the Commercial and
Community Editions.

>

>
>
The RaspberryPi IDE supports building standalones for OSX, Windows and
> all editions of Linux (i.e everything but the mobile platforms).
>
> One thing to note is that there is no Linux equivalent of OSX "fat
> binaries" - the executables produced are processor-specific and you need
> to distribute separate files for each processor architecture you support.
>

Thanks for the extra information.

Regards

Peter
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Re: LiveCode Server on Yosemite - Changes to conf.httpd

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Gregory

If you wouldn’t mind sending me your apache con.httpd file off list. I’ll take 
a look for you and see if I can spot something.

Regards

Peter

> On 12 Jan 2015, at 06:28, Gregory Lypny  wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> I’ve tried, based on previous suggestions from list members, to make the 
> necessary changes to the conf.httpd file to get LiveCode Server working under 
> Yoesmite but nothing I do works. I have confirmed that Apache is running and 
> can get non-LC pages to display.
> 
> Be nice if the LiveCode team could chime in because the instructions at their 
> website for getting LiveCode Server up and running are out of date.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Gregory
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Re: Possible insanity, or is it LC 7.0.1?

[Peter W A Wood]

I experimented a little further and found that, on my set up, I got the same 
results as Roger.

I ran this in the multi-line message box:

put "version:" && the version & return into tReport
put "os:" && the platform & the systemVersion & return after tReport
put isNumber(1.884956) & return after tReport
put 1.884956 into tVar
put "Is tVar a number?" && isNumber(tVar) & return after tReport 
put 1.884956 into tVar
put tVar / 1 into tVar2
put "Is tVar a number?" && isNumber(tVar) & return after tReport
put "Is tVar2 a number?" &&  isNumber(tVar2) & return after tReport
put tReport

These are the results:
version: 7.0.1
os: MacOS10.10.1
true
Is tVar a number? true
Is tVar a number? false
Is tVar2 a number? false

It seems dividing the number was sufficient to stop it being one!

From playing in the message box, I noticed that dividing 1.12345 by 1 results 
in a number but dividing 1.123456 doesn’t. If I remove the last digit from 
Graham’s magic 1.884956, the multiline script works correctly. So it would seem 
the problem is related to the number of significant digits. (If I change the 
number to 1.884955, the multiline script still gives incorrect results.)

Regards

Peter

> On 15 Jan 2015, at 09:13, Kay C Lan  wrote:
> 
> On Thu, Jan 15, 2015 at 8:29 AM, Roger Guay  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> I get Paul's results when I do it Paul’s way, but I don’t get Graham’s
>> results when I do it his way via the message box!!
>> 
> 
> Same here and I'm on Mavericks. And just to confuse the matter even further:
> 
> put 1.884956 into tVar
> put isNumber(tVar)
> 
> put 1.884956 into tVar
> put (tVar + 0)
> 
> put value(1.884956+0)
> 
> All three work fine.
> 
> put 1.884956 into tVar
> put isNumber(tVar)
> put value(tVar + 0)
> 
> does not.
> 
> Graham, definitely one for you to log with the QCC.
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Re: Mac Menu Bar Apps

[Peter W A Wood]

Peter

If I remember correctly, Clarify installed into the Mac Menu Bar. 

I don’t know how though. I guess Trevor deVore knows.

Regards

Peter

> On 21 Jan 2015, at 02:35, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> Is it possible to put a Livecode app into the Mac Menu Bar?
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software 
> Home of lcStackBrowser  and
> SQLiteAdmin 
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Re: Livecode server + NGINX ?

[Peter W A Wood]

Pierre

Richard is correct that nginx does not support CGI. It will forward requests to 
an upstream server or a number of upstream servers. I support one application 
that has been running for a couple of years that forwards CGI requests to a 
second server. (The second server is Cheyenne from Softinnov with which you may 
be familiar).

I have also used nginx to distribute requests to a number of upstream servers 
when the upstream server could only process  one request at a time. In my case, 
I spread the load over four servers. This load balancing feature of nginx use a 
simple approach in the free version, I believe the “not free” version has more 
sophisticated load balancing.

Regards

Peter

> On 21 Jan 2015, at 08:09, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> Pierre Sahores wrote:
>> Did anyone know if Livecode Server can be set to use NGINX as its web server 
>> ?
> 
> My (admittedly limited) understanding is that NginX doesn't support CGI, only 
> FastCGI, so without threading LiveCode would seem a difficult fit for that 
> server environment.
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin
> Fourth World Systems
> Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
> 
> ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com
> 
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Re: Duplicate simultaneous calls to same handler

[Peter W A Wood]

Jacque

I believe that the engine can start processing the second call before the first 
is finished after I did a little experiment:

One card, button1, button2 and a field

Both buttons with this script:

on mouseUp
 oneOrTwo
end mouseUp

A card script with 

on oneOrTwo
put "one" & return after Field "Field"
wait 50 with messages
put "two" & return after Field "Field"
end oneOrTwo

Clicking on the buttons in quick succession gives one, one, two, two.

I found out that you don’t even need two buttons. Hitting one button twice 
quickly will give the same effect.

Regards

Peter

> On 23 Jan 2015, at 11:26, J. Landman Gay  wrote:
> 
> Suppose I have a long handler that includes a few "wait with messages" so 
> that users can continue interacting with the stack while it runs. The user 
> does something that calls the long handler while it is still running from a 
> previous instance. Assume there is no flag in the script to prevent that.
> 
> Does the engine queue the second call until the long handler finishes, and 
> then send the message from the second call (serial responses)?
> 
> Or does the engine run two instances of the long handler simultaneously? If 
> so, what happens to the values of the variables?
> 
> Or something else?
> 
> I've never allowed this to happen before but I find myself in a position 
> where simultaneous calls would be the best way to handle things.
> 
> -- 
> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
> 
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Re: Duplicate simultaneous calls to same handler

[Peter W A Wood]

I “improved” my script just to check that each time the handler is called it 
still gets its own local variables:

on oneOrTwo
   local tCount
   add 1 to tCount
   put "one" && tCount & return after Field "Field"
   wait 50 with messages
   put "two" && tCount & return after Field "Field"
end oneOrTwo

As you would expect, if you make tCount script local rather than handler local, 
it is “shared” between the “pseudo-simultaneously” running handlers.

Regards

Peter 


> On 23 Jan 2015, at 12:42, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
> 
> Jacque
> 
> I believe that the engine can start processing the second call before the 
> first is finished after I did a little experiment:
> 
>   One card, button1, button2 and a field
> 
>   Both buttons with this script:
> 
>   on mouseUp
>oneOrTwo
>   end mouseUp
> 
>   A card script with 
> 
>   on oneOrTwo
>   put "one" & return after Field "Field"
>   wait 50 with messages
>   put "two" & return after Field "Field"
>   end oneOrTwo
> 
> Clicking on the buttons in quick succession gives one, one, two, two.
> 
> I found out that you don’t even need two buttons. Hitting one button twice 
> quickly will give the same effect.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Peter
> 
>> On 23 Jan 2015, at 11:26, J. Landman Gay  wrote:
>> 
>> Suppose I have a long handler that includes a few "wait with messages" so 
>> that users can continue interacting with the stack while it runs. The user 
>> does something that calls the long handler while it is still running from a 
>> previous instance. Assume there is no flag in the script to prevent that.
>> 
>> Does the engine queue the second call until the long handler finishes, and 
>> then send the message from the second call (serial responses)?
>> 
>> Or does the engine run two instances of the long handler simultaneously? If 
>> so, what happens to the values of the variables?
>> 
>> Or something else?
>> 
>> I've never allowed this to happen before but I find myself in a position 
>> where simultaneous calls would be the best way to handle things.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>> 
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Re: Unicode

[Peter W A Wood]

Pete

LiveCode 7+ stores text data encoded according to UTF-16 so, as I understand, 
you will need to convert the UTF-8 encoded data using the textEncode function.

Regards

Peter


> On 26 Jan 2015, at 06:45, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> Is there a lesson/guide anywhere that shows how to use unicode in LC 7?
> 
> All I need to do is SELECT data from an UTF8 encoded SQLite
> database/display it in fields/datagrid and read input from fields/
> INSERT/UPDATE it to the database.
> 
> I've got things working using unicodeText/uniencode/unidecode in LC 6.6 but
> wondering how things work in 7.  Or even if it's worthwhile even using LC 7
> for something as simple as this.
> 
> The LC7 release notes document all the new properties/commands but don't
> have any examples for straightforward use.  Am I right in thinking that I
> don't need to use unicodeText/uniencode/unidecode in LC7 to do the above
> tasks?  Just simple put into field/put field into var is all I need?
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software 
> Home of lcStackBrowser  and
> SQLiteAdmin 
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Re: Unicode

[Peter W A Wood]

Pete

 I think the real coding advantage with Unicode in 7+ comes when processing 
text.

Personally, I think that it is safer to stick with UTF-8 encoding for external 
data as it is the only encoding format that you don’t need to worry about 
processor “endianness”. 

Regards

Peter

> On 26 Jan 2015, at 10:15, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> Thanks Peter.  If that's the case, I'm not seeing much in the way of a
> coding advantage over pre 7.0.  Sounds like using textEncode/textDecode
> instaed of uniencode/unidecode?
> 
> That does answer another question I had though which is what is needed if
> the database is UTF-16 encoded.  Sounds like nothing needs to be done.  I
> guess I'll have to set up some tests.
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com>
> Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html> and
> SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>
> 
> On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 5:08 PM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> Pete
>> 
>> LiveCode 7+ stores text data encoded according to UTF-16 so, as I
>> understand, you will need to convert the UTF-8 encoded data using the
>> textEncode function.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>> 
>>> On 26 Jan 2015, at 06:45, Peter Haworth  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Is there a lesson/guide anywhere that shows how to use unicode in LC 7?
>>> 
>>> All I need to do is SELECT data from an UTF8 encoded SQLite
>>> database/display it in fields/datagrid and read input from fields/
>>> INSERT/UPDATE it to the database.
>>> 
>>> I've got things working using unicodeText/uniencode/unidecode in LC 6.6
>> but
>>> wondering how things work in 7.  Or even if it's worthwhile even using
>> LC 7
>>> for something as simple as this.
>>> 
>>> The LC7 release notes document all the new properties/commands but don't
>>> have any examples for straightforward use.  Am I right in thinking that I
>>> don't need to use unicodeText/uniencode/unidecode in LC7 to do the above
>>> tasks?  Just simple put into field/put field into var is all I need?
>>> 
>>> Pete
>>> lcSQL Software <http://www.lcsql.com>
>>> Home of lcStackBrowser <http://www.lcsql.com/lcstackbrowser.html> and
>>> SQLiteAdmin <http://www.lcsql.com/sqliteadmin.html>
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Re: Precision and 'abs'

[Peter W A Wood]

Graham 

I think that it is a documentation error. As far as I know, LiveCode uses 
binary floating point numbers when performing arithmetic. Not all non-whole 
decimal numbers cannot be accurate represented in binary floating point 
numbers. I cannot see how just comparing the absolute value of the difference 
between two numbers will be any more accurate than comparing the numbers.

This problem isn’t by any means unique to LiveCode. Here is a Windows 
JavaScript example that shows the same behaviour:

var a = 1.0 + 2.0;
var b = 3.0;
if (a === b) {
  res = 'correct';
 }{
  res = 'incorrect'; 
 }
WScript.Echo('a === b ' + res);
if (Math.abs(a - b) === 0) {
  res = 'correct';
}{
  res = 'incorrect';
}
WScript.Echo('abs (a - b) === 0 ' + res);
 
It displays incorrect for both comparisons. (To run the script save it in a 
file with the extension .js and double-click on it - for Windows only)

The normal workaround in JavaScript is to perform all calculations using 
integers and then scaling the numbers down when you want to display them.

Regards

Peter

This is an enhancement request (Bug 9349) for LiveCode to use decimal floating 
point numbers in place of binary floating point numbers.


> On 4 Feb 2015, at 19:19, Graham Samuel  wrote:
> 
> I’m having some trouble comparing numbers with lots of decimal places - 
> numbers that ought to be equal are slightly unequal. In the LC Dictionary 
> entry for ‘numberFormat’ there’s a warning about this, and a suggested 
> solution:
> 
>> 
>> Note: Since LiveCode does not use decimal numbers for its internal 
>> calculations (for reasons of speed), the decimal representation of a number 
>> is sometimes slightly off the correct number. For example, 10^-1 is equal to 
>> 0.1, but is calculated (to eighteen decimal places) as 0.16. 
>> Because of this, setting the numberFormat to specify many decimal places 
>> after the decimal point may produce unexpected results in a statement that 
>> tests for an exact number. To prevent this, either avoid setting the 
>> numberFormat to a value more precise than you need, or use the abs function 
>> instead of the = operator to test equality:
>> 
>>  set the numberformat to ".##"
>>  put 10^-1 = 0.1 -- reports false because of the decimal error
>>  put abs((10^-1) - 0.1) = zero -- reports true
> 
> Well, this sounds good, but looking up the definition of 'abs', there is no 
> suggestion that taking the abs of a number will in any way alter its 
> precision, so what does this advice mean? I have done a test where two 
> numbers differ only after the tenth decimal place, but the test
> 
>  set the numberformat to "0.##"
>  put abs(aa-bb) = 0
> 
> returns false, so it didn't help.
> 
> Is this just a documentation bug, or is there something funny going on in the 
> LC7.0.2-rc-2?
> 
> Graham
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Scripted GUI Testing & launching engine from command line?

[Peter W A Wood]

I always thought that LiveCode would make it easy to write scripted tests of 
GUI applications as it is based on messages. In fact, I’m a little surprised 
that there doesn’t seem to be much use of scripted testing either by RunRev or 
the community. I started to experiment with a very simple test, it worked a 
treat.

I made a simple stack called GUI.livecode with Field1, Field2 and Button. The 
Button script copies the content of Field1 to Field 2.

I then made another stack, TestGUI.livecode, with a single Field “Report” and 
the following openStack handler:

on openStack
   local tFailed = 0
   local tPassed = 0
   show stack "GUI"
   hide me
   put "testing" into Field "Field1" of card "Main" of stack "GUI"
   send mouseUp to Button "Button" of card "Main" of stack "GUI"
   if "testing" = text of Field "Field2" of card "Main" of stack "GUI" then
  Add 1 to tPassed
   else
  Add 1 to tFailed
   end if
   put "Number of Tests:" && tPassed + tFailed & return into Field "Report"
   put "Tests Passed: " && tPassed & return after Field "Report"
   put "Tested Failed: " && tFailed & return after Field "Report"
   show me
end openStack

This worked as I expected giving me confidence that I am correct in believing 
that it is easy to write scripted GUI tests with LiveCode. Whilst it is good to 
be able to run such tests in the IDE, I personally would also like to run them 
from the command line. I did try using LiveCodeServer to launch the test using 
GO but, as I’m sure you all know, you can’t run GUI stacks from LiveCode Server.

I guess that I can build a standalone of the Test stack that I can launch from 
the command line but was hoping there is an easier way. Is there any way to 
launch the GUI engine from the command line and automatically run a stack?

Regards

Peter 
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[Almost OT] Interfacing with GNUCash

[Peter W A Wood]

Has anybody written a LiveCode script which posts transactions directly into 
the GNUCash accounting system (or similar)?

I know that GNUCash stores its data in SQLite so there is the option to write 
the data directly to the GNUCash database but I was wondering if anybody knows 
a better way.

Regards

Peter 



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Re: [Almost OT] Interfacing with GNUCash

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 3 Mar 2015, at 00:24, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> I haven't, but I'm curious: why GNUCash?

It is more than sufficient for me to keep my company accounts, it works well on 
Mac and the price can’t be beaten. I haven’t encountered any problems with it 
but my use of it is very basic.

Regards

Peter
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Re: [Almost OT] Interfacing with GNUCash

[Peter W A Wood]

Many thanks Mike.

You did better than I via Google. I found some reference to the C API but it 
seemed very vague. If it is a case of using the C API, I hope that we’ll be 
able to access it directly from LC 8 or 9.

Best regards

Peter


> On 3 Mar 2015, at 08:20, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
> Hmm, just read something that seems to indicate gnucash has a rest api.  If
> I can find a useful link I'll pop it in here.
> 
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 5:19 PM, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
>> I went looking for the API, and most of the pertinent sections are
>> non-links, in a list of links.  There IS some info on interfacing python,
>> and c also.  For now, unless you want to build an external, python is
>> probably the way to go, using shell calls from lc.
>> 
>> Google gnucash api and see if theres enough info there to get you started.
>> 
>> 
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Peter W A Wood 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 3 Mar 2015, at 00:24, Richard Gaskin 
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I haven't, but I'm curious: why GNUCash?
>>> 
>>> It is more than sufficient for me to keep my company accounts, it works
>>> well on Mac and the price can’t be beaten. I haven’t encountered any
>>> problems with it but my use of it is very basic.
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> 
>>> Peter
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Re: [Almost OT] Interfacing with GNUCash

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi again Mike.

I found this - 
https://github.com/loftx/gnucash-rest/blob/master/gnucash_core_c.py 
<https://github.com/loftx/gnucash-rest/blob/master/gnucash_core_c.py> - but it 
appears to have been abandoned. However, it might come in handy with working 
out how to use the C API>

Best regards

Peter

> On 3 Mar 2015, at 08:20, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
> Hmm, just read something that seems to indicate gnucash has a rest api.  If
> I can find a useful link I'll pop it in here.
> 
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 5:19 PM, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
>> I went looking for the API, and most of the pertinent sections are
>> non-links, in a list of links.  There IS some info on interfacing python,
>> and c also.  For now, unless you want to build an external, python is
>> probably the way to go, using shell calls from lc.
>> 
>> Google gnucash api and see if theres enough info there to get you started.
>> 
>> 
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 5:16 PM, Peter W A Wood 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 3 Mar 2015, at 00:24, Richard Gaskin 
>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I haven't, but I'm curious: why GNUCash?
>>> 
>>> It is more than sufficient for me to keep my company accounts, it works
>>> well on Mac and the price can’t be beaten. I haven’t encountered any
>>> problems with it but my use of it is very basic.
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> 
>>> Peter
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>> 
>> 
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Re: [OT] Invalid host address

[Peter W A Wood]

Jacque

I don’t know if this will help but I believe host can get converted to ::1 
under ipv6. I know that I used to have an issue on my OS X a few versions ago 
and had to use 127.0.0.1 instead of localhost in URLs.  

Regards

Peter

> On 3 Mar 2015, at 10:21, J. Landman Gay  wrote:
> 
> I'm not sure about the other users but the latest one is on OS X. Could this 
> affect Macs too?
> 
> On 3/2/2015 8:04 PM, Mike Bonner wrote:
>> OH, thought just occurred to me, based on something that happened in
>> another thread.  If they're on windows, and had a proxy set up at some
>> point, then the proxy was disabled.. The information about the proxy still
>> shows up greyed in the settings.  And it seems that LC decides the proxy is
>> still active even though it isn't.  The browser would work, because it
>> knows the proxy has been disabled.   The solution, is to clear the proxy
>> information from the settings, even though the proxy settings are
>> technically already disabled.
>> 
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 6:58 PM, Mike Bonner  wrote:
>> 
>>> The hosts file can be set up to provide specific name to ip address
>>> mappings.  99.9% of the time its not used, and if it is, its often a
>>> hijack. Along with the hijack thing, its also possible that a proxy has
>>> been set up unbeknownst to the user, and its munging something as it
>>> decides where they want to direct the user, rather than where the user
>>> actually wants to go.
>>> 
>>> Can you post some of the gibberish?
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 6:53 PM, J. Landman Gay 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
 Out of thousands of users, occasionally one can't connect and repeatedly
 gets an invalid host address error. What causes those? All users are
 sending to the same server at the same domain. Naturally they all say it's
 only our app and never happens in a browser.
 
 Everything I've found about it is mostly gibberish to me. Is this
 something to do with the hosts file on the computer? The latest report says
 it happens on different networks (home and school) so I assume it's
 specific to his machine.
 
 --
 Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
 HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
 
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>>> 
>>> 
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> 
> -- 
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> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
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Re: [OT] Invalid host address

[Peter W A Wood]

Jacque

Unfortunately, I’m probably almost as much out of my depth as you :-(

No, localhost shouldn’t matter if the app is trying to connect to a remote 
server. I don’t think that LiveCode needs to know about ipv6 either (or only at 
a very low level). My suggestion was based on ipv6 resolving localhost 
differently from ipv4.

Does the error message give the hostname that was considered to be an “invalid 
host address”?

Regards

Peter 


> On 3 Mar 2015, at 10:56, J. Landman Gay  wrote:
> 
> Thanks Peter, but I'm afraid you're speaking Greek to me. Would localhost 
> matter if the app is trying to connect to a remote server?
> 
> Does LC need to know about ipv6 or is that handled at the OS level? Sorry to 
> be so uninformed, I'm out of my depth here.
> 
> On 3/2/2015 8:42 PM, Peter W A Wood wrote:
>> Jacque
>> 
>> I don’t know if this will help but I believe host can get converted to ::1 
>> under ipv6. I know that I used to have an issue on my OS X a few versions 
>> ago and had to use 127.0.0.1 instead of localhost in URLs.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>>> On 3 Mar 2015, at 10:21, J. Landman Gay  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm not sure about the other users but the latest one is on OS X. Could 
>>> this affect Macs too?
>>> 
>>> On 3/2/2015 8:04 PM, Mike Bonner wrote:
>>>> OH, thought just occurred to me, based on something that happened in
>>>> another thread.  If they're on windows, and had a proxy set up at some
>>>> point, then the proxy was disabled.. The information about the proxy still
>>>> shows up greyed in the settings.  And it seems that LC decides the proxy is
>>>> still active even though it isn't.  The browser would work, because it
>>>> knows the proxy has been disabled.   The solution, is to clear the proxy
>>>> information from the settings, even though the proxy settings are
>>>> technically already disabled.
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 6:58 PM, Mike Bonner  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> The hosts file can be set up to provide specific name to ip address
>>>>> mappings.  99.9% of the time its not used, and if it is, its often a
>>>>> hijack. Along with the hijack thing, its also possible that a proxy has
>>>>> been set up unbeknownst to the user, and its munging something as it
>>>>> decides where they want to direct the user, rather than where the user
>>>>> actually wants to go.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Can you post some of the gibberish?
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 6:53 PM, J. Landman Gay 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Out of thousands of users, occasionally one can't connect and repeatedly
>>>>>> gets an invalid host address error. What causes those? All users are
>>>>>> sending to the same server at the same domain. Naturally they all say 
>>>>>> it's
>>>>>> only our app and never happens in a browser.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Everything I've found about it is mostly gibberish to me. Is this
>>>>>> something to do with the hosts file on the computer? The latest report 
>>>>>> says
>>>>>> it happens on different networks (home and school) so I assume it's
>>>>>> specific to his machine.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>>>>>> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>>>>> 
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>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
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>>> HyperActive Software

Re: on-rev urgent ticket system down?

[Peter W A Wood]

Paul

Have you tried submitting your emergency request via the on-rev website? I 
don’t know if it is any different from sending an email but it may be worth a 
try.

Just in case you don’t have the url - http://www.on-rev.com/support/contact-us/ 


Regards

Peter


> On 15 Mar 2015, at 06:41, Paul Kocsis  wrote:
> 
> Would anyone know if on-rev support 'urgent' system might be down?  I've
> sent 4 emails with the subject 'urgent' and have yet to hear from them.  I
> have indeed generally heard from them in an hour in the past, but no go for
> over 18 hours now.  Is there some other way to get them a message if their
> 'urgent' system is not functioning and they are not aware of that fact?
> (and yes, I am sending the 'urgent' email from my on-rev registered email
> address)
> 
> To those that may be on-rev customers and read this."no", the servers
> are not down, its just that my particular account has an issue that needs
> their immediate attention.I add this just so I don't freak out current
> on-rev customers
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Re: Livecode's math precision

[Peter W A Wood]

Mike

This explanation from Mark Waddingham confirms that numbers are held in IEEE 
754 format - http://quality.runrev.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9349

I’m pretty sure it is 64-bit. I tried multiplying a value of Pi with more 
significant digits than a 32 bit number can hold in the message box:

Code:
put format ("%.30g",3.14159265358979323846264338327950 * 1.0)

Result:
3.14159265358979311599796346854

Hope this helps

Peter


> On 18 Mar 2015, at 06:21, Michael Doub  wrote:
> 
> Can anyone point me to a reference  that discusses the precision of 
> livecode's math calculations?   Is it doing IEEE 754 64-bit floating point 
> under the covers?
> 
> Thanks
>   Mike
> 
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Re: API

[Peter W A Wood]

Richmond

I believe that Richard’s “providing OS API access” is a simplification, 
probably an over simplification, of “providing the ability to access the OS 
API”. As I understand, LiveCode Builder will allow us to write code which can 
directly call an OS API but, of course, we will need to define the OS API 
function in LiveCode Builder. 

I had a quick scan of the LiveCode Builder files in Github but didn’t see any 
examples so the facility may not even be in the current release .

Regards

Peter

> On 22 Mar 2015, at 22:57, Richmond  wrote:
> 
> Richard Gaskin stated elsewhere;
> 
> "LiveCode Builder is providing OS API access to us within our LiveCode 
> scripts."
> 
> Where is the documentation pertaining to this?
> 
> The inbuilt Documentation in LC 8 for the Livecode Builder comes up with 
> nothing after a search for 'API',
> 
> the online Documentation is currently taking a holiday.
> 
> Richmond.
> 
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Re: API

[Peter W A Wood]

Thanks, Peter

> On 23 Mar 2015, at 18:30, Peter TB Brett  wrote:
> 
> On 2015-03-22 22:59, Peter W A Wood wrote:
>> Richmond
>> I believe that Richard’s “providing OS API access” is a
>> simplification, probably an over simplification, of “providing the
>> ability to access the OS API”. As I understand, LiveCode Builder will
>> allow us to write code which can directly call an OS API but, of
>> course, we will need to define the OS API function in LiveCode
>> Builder.
>> I had a quick scan of the LiveCode Builder files in Github but didn’t
>> see any examples so the facility may not even be in the current
>> release .
> 
> https://github.com/runrev/livecode/blob/develop/tests/lcb/_testrunner.lcb#L44
> 
> It's in there.
> 
>  Peter
> 
> -- 
> Dr Peter Brett
> LiveCode Engine Development Team
> 
> 
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Fwd: Plain text library stacks

[Peter W A Wood]

I remember reading a message to the effect that one of the recent releases to 
the LiveCode engine included an enhancement to load “plain text” library 
stacks. I searched the forum and clicked relevant threads without being able to 
find the post that I remember.

Is it possible to load a Library stack in plan text format from another stack?

Thanks in advance.

Peter


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Re: Plain text library stacks

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Thierry

Thanks for the suggestion. Actually, I wasn’t thinking of Monte’s lcVCS. 

As I remember,  the post that I saw suggested you could create a library stack 
in a text editor and then load it into LiveCode. 

Kind regards

Peter



> On 23 Apr 2015, at 13:45, Thierry Douez  wrote:
> 
> Hi Peter,
> 
> Are you thinking of this:
> 
> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=18748&p=106514&hilit=monte+save+stack#p106514
> 
> 
> HTH,
> 
> Thierry
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> I remember reading a message to the effect that one of the recent releases 
>> to the LiveCode engine included an enhancement to load “plain text” library 
>> stacks. I searched the forum and clicked relevant threads without being able 
>> to find the post that I remember.
>> 
>> Is it possible to load a Library stack in plan text format from another 
>> stack?
>> 
>> Peter
> 
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Re: Plain text library stacks

[Peter W A Wood]

Many thanks, Mark.

> On 23 Apr 2015, at 15:59, Mark Waddingham  wrote:
> 
> On 2015-04-23 07:37, Peter W A Wood wrote:
>> Is it possible to load a Library stack in plan text format from another 
>> stack?
> 
> Yes - although we've not explicitly published details on the feature yet :)
> 
> However, if you want to play around with it then from the message box try:
> 
> create script only stack "MyLibraryStack"
> 
> Then
> 
> edit script of stack "MyLibraryStack"
> 
> You can save the stack in the normal way but the only thing it will save will 
> be the stack script - the file on disk is just a UTF-8 text file.
> 
> We've been using this to great effect in the IDE where a good number of 
> libraries and non-UI stacks are now script-only - the motivation being that 
> they work in version control just like a lower-level language source file.
> 
> In addition with 6.7.5-rc-1 and 7.0.5-rc-1 we've added the ability for the 
> behavior property to reference stacks - this has a nice synergy with script 
> only stacks. (Before anyone asks - there are no plans to extend behaviors to 
> any other object type at the moment, stack references were addable without a 
> file format change hence why its occurred).
> 
> I should point out that the script-only-stacks are 'caveat scriptor' in the 
> sense that the engine will only ever save the stack script when you save one, 
> it will not warn you if you've put anything else beyond a stack script on the 
> stack (whether it be custom properties or other objects), nor will it stop 
> you from making it have anything beyond a stack script.
> 
> Warmest Regards,
> 
> Mark.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com ~ http://www.livecode.com/
> LiveCode: Everyone can create apps
> 
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Re: Plain text library stacks

[Peter W A Wood]

Here is a very simple server script and a very simple “text” library script 
that show just what I was hoping.

The Library Script:
script "TextLib"
function TL.compare pFirst, pSecond
return pFirst = pSecond
end TL.compare

The Server Script:
#! 
#coding:utf-8 
set the outputLineEndings to "lf” 
set the outputTextEncoding to “utf8"
put the Version & return 
start using stack “/TextLib.livecode” 
dispatch function "TL.compare" to stack "TextLib" with "a", "b” 
put the result & return
dispatch function "TL.compare" to stack "TextLib" with "LiveCode", 
“LiveCode"
put the result & return

I created both scripts in a text editor (using UTF-8 encoding) rather than the 
IDE.

I think it’s great that LiveCode has given us this alternative way of working 
with script only stacks.

Peter 

> On 23 Apr 2015, at 20:47, David Bovill  wrote:
> 
> Great. I can now refactor all those libraries.


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Console container for put function?

[Peter W A Wood]

By experimenting, it seems that “putting” text into or after the message box 
container results in the test being output to the console (perhaps stdout, 
perhaps stderr).

Running this script under LiveCodeServer:
put "Hello" into message box
put " World" after message box 
put return

Displays this on the terminal:
$ ./test.lc
Hello World

Is there a more correct “container” than message box to use in with the put 
function to send text to the terminal in LiveCodeServer?

Regards

Peter
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Re: Console container for put function?

[Peter W A Wood]

Hi Mike

Thanks for your response. I should have explained why I was asking such a 
question.

I’m planning on writing some library functions for testing that can be called 
from either a GUI stack or a server script. When called from a GUI script it 
will display its results in a Field, when called from a server script it will 
displays its result in the console.

I’m trying to find a better way than:

if the environment is “server” then
put tResult
else
put tResult after Field tReport
end

Peter


> On 24 Apr 2015, at 11:54, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
> Just a straight put is the way to go. Don't think you can "put before"
> because it doesn't have direct control of the console terminal scroll and
> cursor position.
> SO to achieve the same thing you could..
> put "Hello "
> put "World"
> put return
> 
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 9:52 PM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> By experimenting, it seems that “putting” text into or after the message
>> box container results in the test being output to the console (perhaps
>> stdout, perhaps stderr).
>> 
>> Running this script under LiveCodeServer:
>>put "Hello" into message box
>>put " World" after message box
>>put return
>> 
>> Displays this on the terminal:
>>$ ./test.lc
>>Hello World
>> 
>> Is there a more correct “container” than message box to use in with the
>> put function to send text to the terminal in LiveCodeServer?
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Peter
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Re: Console container for put function?

[Peter W A Wood]

Thanks for the insight and suggestion, Richard. I’ve gone with the “MyPut” 
option for the moment.

Regards

Peter

> On 24 Apr 2015, at 23:22, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> Peter Wood wrote:
> 
> > I’m planning on writing some library functions for testing that can
> > be called from either a GUI stack or a server script. When called
> > from a GUI script it will display its results in a Field, when called
> > from a server script it will displays its result in the console.
> >
> > I’m trying to find a better way than:
> >
> > if the environment is “server” then
> > put tResult
> > else
> > put tResult after Field tReport
> > end
> 
> Two options come to mind, each with their own tradeoffs:
> 
> 1. Custom "put" handler
> You could use something like "MyPut" instead of "put", so the branching is in 
> just one place.  Easy to write, but difficult to accommodate since it would 
> mean changing every place you currently use "put".
> 
> 2. revMessageBoxRedirect
> That's a global property which is empty by default, and when empty "put" 
> output goes to stdOut when faceless and to a stack named "Message Box" when 
> in the IDE as you found.  But when set to the long ID of any object, that 
> object will then receive "msgChanged" messages for any puts which could be 
> handled however you like, such as displaying the msg string in a field in 
> your own stack.
> 
> The downside with the latter is that as long as the revMessageBoxRedirect is 
> not empty, you'll be responsible for handling all Message Box actions; that 
> is, you'll lose the IDE's Message Box as a place for output, for any and all 
> scripts that might otherwise "put" to it.
> 
> But if that's what you're looking for, revMessageBoxRedirect can be handy.  I 
> have a Message Box replacement that uses it and it's been a godsend.
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin
> Fourth World Systems
> Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
> 
> ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.coms
> 
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Sending crash reports to LiveCode?

[Peter W A Wood]

I was using LiveCode 8.0 with an unsaved stack on OS X when it crashed. I 
dutifully saved the crash log, completed a bug report and attached the crash 
log.

What I got back from LiveCode was a "form letter” that they couldn’t reproduce 
the crash and can I reproduce the crash and send any stack that demonstrates 
the issue. As a result this hasn’t been accepted as a bug.

Why do they need to reproduce the crash before accepting that there is a bug? 
Isn't the Apple crash report which shows that LiveCode crashed enough evidence 
of a bug? 

Peter


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Re: Console container for put function?

[Peter W A Wood]

Mark

> On 25 Apr 2015, at 12:53, Mark Wieder  wrote:
> 
> On 04/23/2015 11:09 PM, Peter W A Wood wrote:
> 
>> I’m trying to find a better way than:
>> 
>>  if the environment is “server” then
>>  put tResult
>>  else
>>  put tResult after Field tReport
>>  end
> 
> That's exactly how I deal with it, with the exception that I wrap it in a log 
> function. That way there's only one place in the stack that needs to check 
> the environment, and I can also put other conditions in the log file as needed
> 
> command log pMessage
>  if there_are_things_to_add_to_the_message ...
>  end if
>  if verboseMode ...
>if the environment is ...
>  put ...
>else
>  put ...
>end if
>  end if
> end log
> 
> log "I made it to function" && param(0)
> log "at this point the value of foo is" && foo
> 
> -- 
> Mark Wieder
> ahsoftw...@gmail.com <mailto:ahsoftw...@gmail.com>

Thanks for that suggestion, I’ve does something like that.

I’ve now worked out a way of doing it without having to test the environment 
each time that I want to call put by using dispatch. There is an additional 
function call in place of checking the environment though.

local tReporter   

command stackReporter pResult
put pResult & return after Field tReport
end stackReporter

command scriptReporter pResult
put pResult & return
end scriptReporter

command reportResult pResult
dispatch tReporter with pResult
end reportResult

if the environment is "server" then
put "scriptReporter" into tReporter 
else
put "stackReporter" into tReporter
### code to set tReport # # #
end if

reportResult "My Result”

Regards

Peter


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Re: Sending crash reports to LiveCode?

[Peter W A Wood]

Mark 

Thanks for taking the time to respond. particularly at the weekend.

I fully understand that the team doesn’t have time to spend “looking for 
needles in haystack”. My frustration comes from the perception that nobody has 
even looked at the crash report. (A perception created by the response to the 
bug report). If somebody had taken a couple of minutes at most to scan the 
crash report and then said “We took a quick look at the crash report but it 
didn’t give any real clue as to the cause of the crash.” followed by the 
understandable request to see if it can be reproduced. My perception would have 
been much different.

Kind regards

Peter

PS I will continue to submit crash reports.


> On 25 Apr 2015, at 19:59, Mark Waddingham  wrote:
> 
> By the way - please don't be discouraged from submitting crash reports even 
> if you can't reproduce them.
> 
> The more reports we get with the same stack trace (or a similar one) the more 
> information we have and thus the more likely we are to be able find the 
> cause. (Particularly if the same trace occurs from an apparantly different 
> set of circumstances).
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 25 Apr 2015, at 12:49, Mark Waddingham  wrote:
>> 
>> Yes - a crash report indicates the presence of a bug, however as such a 
>> report only contains a stack trace they generally do not contain enough 
>> information to diagnose the cause and thus fix the issue.
>> 
>> Context is always important when fixing bugs - particularly crashes as they 
>> can occur in a place in the code completely divorced from the actual cause.
>> 
>> Reproducibility is the key thing that helps us fix bugs quickly - without 
>> reproduceable test cases you are basically left with searching for a needle 
>> in a haystack which is rarely a useful use of time.
>> 
>> Our general view is that our time is better spent fixing reproduceable 
>> faults especially as in many cases non-reproduceable faults are a 
>> side-effect of one or more reproduceable ones (this is particular true of 
>> intermittant crashes).
>> 
>> The report won't be closed as not a bug if you or we can't reproduce it, 
>> just closed as cannot reproduce. Note that any information to do with the 
>> sequence of steps you performed before you get a crash is useful to help us 
>> attempt to reproduce issues such as this - sometimes the smallest details 
>> can contain the key piece of information.
>> 
>> Mark.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 25 Apr 2015, at 09:37, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I was using LiveCode 8.0 with an unsaved stack on OS X when it crashed. I 
>>> dutifully saved the crash log, completed a bug report and attached the 
>>> crash log.
>>> 
>>> What I got back from LiveCode was a "form letter” that they couldn’t 
>>> reproduce the crash and can I reproduce the crash and send any stack that 
>>> demonstrates the issue. As a result this hasn’t been accepted as a bug.
>>> 
>>> Why do they need to reproduce the crash before accepting that there is a 
>>> bug? Isn't the Apple crash report which shows that LiveCode crashed enough 
>>> evidence of a bug? 
>>> 
>>> Peter
>>> 
>>> 
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How to initialise a Library stack?

[Peter W A Wood]

Is there a reliable method to initialise a library stack before it is used? I 
tried adding preOpenStack and OpenStack handlers to the library stack but they 
don’t appear to work. (I was using LiveCode 8.0).

Regards

Peter


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Re: How to initialise a Library stack?

[Peter W A Wood]

Many thanks  Mike.

Regards

Peter

> On 29 Apr 2015, at 09:29, Mike Bonner  wrote:
> 
> when you start using a stack, the librarystack message is sent to the
> stack, so you could use that.
> 
> On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 7:23 PM, Peter W A Wood 
> wrote:
> 
>> Is there a reliable method to initialise a library stack before it is
>> used? I tried adding preOpenStack and OpenStack handlers to the library
>> stack but they don’t appear to work. (I was using LiveCode 8.0).
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Peter
>> 
>> 
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[ANN} - LiveCode MiniTest

[Peter W A Wood]

I have written a few automated test scripts to test elements of LiveCode. The 
testing commands and the tests were all in a single script. I’m now about to 
modernise a stack I use personally and want to develop a set of tests for it as 
I write it.

Rather than copy and paste the few testing commands into another script, I’ve 
pulled them together into a very simple toolkit for testing LiveCode stacks and 
scripts. I call in Mini Test. I thought it may be of some use to others so I’ve 
written some very basic documentation and published it on Github. It can be 
found at https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest 


Regards

Peter
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Plain text library stacks - BOM needed

[Peter W A Wood]

On 23 Apr 2015, at 15:59, Mark Waddingham  wrote:
> 
> You can save the stack in the normal way but the only thing it will save will 
> be the stack script - the file on disk is just a UTF-8 text file.

I’ve found that when LiveCode saves the stack script file, it adds a Byte Order 
Mark (BOM) to denote the file is UTF-8 encoded. If the BOM is not present when 
you start using such a library stack, the engine will treat it as being 
natively encoding. I have found that to be true with both the IDE and Server 
engines. So if you want to create script only stacks in an external editor make 
sure that the editor adds a BOM when you save the file.

If you write scripts to run with LiveCode Server that start with a shebang 
line, be aware that they do not work if there is a BOM present.

Regards

Peter


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Re: [ANN} - LiveCode MiniTest

[Peter W A Wood]

On 30 Apr 2015, at 16:35, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
> 
> I have written a few automated test scripts to test elements of LiveCode. The 
> testing commands and the tests were all in a single script. I’m now about to 
> modernise a stack I use personally and want to develop a set of tests for it 
> as I write it.
> 
> Rather than copy and paste the few testing commands into another script, I’ve 
> pulled them together into a very simple toolkit for testing LiveCode stacks 
> and scripts. I call in Mini Test. I thought it may be of some use to others 
> so I’ve written some very basic documentation and published it on Github. It 
> can be found at https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest 
> <https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest>
> 
> Regards
> 
> Peter

As examples of using LiveCode MiniTest, I’ve converted to Mini Test a few tests 
of LiveCode that I have written in the past to test features of LiveCode. I’ve 
published these tests on Github at 
https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-Tests 
<https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-Tests>

There is an example of a stack to run the tests in the IDE and another to run 
the tests with LiveCode Server. There are three test files which are run by 
both test runners, happily with identical results.

Regards

Peter
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Re: Unicode

[Peter W A Wood]

Are you sure that the two Greek words are actually the same? I don’t know Greek 
but from a quick scan of the Unicode docs, it seems that not all Greek letters 
have an uppercase equivalent. Google translate cannot find a Greek translation 
of PETER other than PETER which is clearly not equal to Google's lower case 
translation Πέτρος whatever caseSensitive is set to.

The Unicode Case Mapping FAQ’s may help to determine if the characters you used 
are actually the same character - http://unicode.org/faq/casemap_charprop.html

Regards

Peter


> On 6 May 2015, at 03:25, Peter Haworth  wrote:
> 
> I tried pasting from Google translate using my first name in lower and
> upper case, but I still get false,false.
> 
> The variable seems to be OSX vs Windows.
> 
> Maybe someone from RunRev will chime in on this.  If not, I'll probably
> enter a QCC report and see what they have to say.
> 
> Pete
> lcSQL Software 
> Home of lcStackBrowser  and
> SQLiteAdmin 
> 
> On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 11:16 AM, Paul Dupuis  wrote:
> 
>> On 5/5/2015 1:52 PM, Peter Haworth wrote:
>>> Interesting.  I wonder why my results are different.  I'm using LC 7.0.4
>>> and Yosemite. and get false,false no matter what caseSensitive is set to.
>>> 
>>> If I use US keyboard, everything works as expected.  It's only when
>> keying
>>> in Greek characters that I always get false,false.
>> 
>> I repeated the test where I pasted Greek (Γεια σας copied from Google
>> Translate) into the fields and the script behaves as expected, so it may
>> be a keyboard issue (seems weird)? Try pasting vs typing and see if that
>> also works for you.
>> 
>> My tests were all under Windows 8.1 US English with US keyboard
>> 
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Re: Kickstarter 2013 Revisited

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 11 May 2015, at 04:49, Geoff Canyon  wrote:
> 
> I'm curious -- what percentage of the apps in the iOS or Android app stores
> would you say require unicode? I'm familiar with the iOS US app store, not
> Android or any of the international versions. My impression is that in the
> US there are very few apps that use unicode.

Any app using emoticons or emoji or whatever they are called will be using 
Unicode.

Regards

Peter

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Re: HTML5 deployment is still in the far future.

[Peter W A Wood]

There are two different approaches to use LiveCode with webpages. Here are two 
very simple examples.

The first is by embedding LiveCode inside the HTML in the same way that you 
embed PHP:



My LiveCode Server Test Page


My LiveCode Server Test Page
Hello World! from LiveCode Server"
put "The date is " && the date & ""
?>



The second way is to run a script that generates all the html for the page:

 "" then
put $_POST["name"] into tName
else
put "World" into tName
end if
put header "Content-Type: text/html"
put ""
put ""
put "LiveCode Server Test Page"
put ""
put ""
put "My LiveCode Server Test Page"
put "Hello" && tName && "from LiveCode Server"
put "The date is" && the internet date & ""
put " The version is" && the Version & ""
put ""
put ""
?>

Regards

Peter

> On 12 May 2015, at 14:28, Pyyhtiä Christer  wrote:
> 
> Thank you for the comments.
> 
> The way i set the questions might have been confusing.
> 
> First, trying to search a good HTML5 & style sheet editor was not the point. 
> The point was to find out tools to simplify the creation process by having 
> some functions available, not to have an ultimate end product (created with 
> LC).  Tools, which one could have access to, to be able to massage 
> parameters, as we all want to have the end result as close as possible to 
> what we want.
> 
> Example 1.  If there is a function to help to put in place page header and 
> body, use one single change to change the font or style.
> 
> Example 2. To automatically pick out key phrases from the different pages and 
> see how Google predicts search clicks and impressions.
> 
> Example 3. To embed code to do object manipulation.
> 
> Btw, how do you embed .lc code in web page?
> 
> thx
> 
> Christer Pyyhtiä
> Skype:  christerp1
> chris...@mindcrea.com
> 
> 
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Re: on-rev trouble again?

[Peter W A Wood]

Jerry

My sites on Diesel seem to be loading. The Server Status page is reporting all 
okay.

Regards

Peter

> On 25 May 2015, at 09:23, Jerry Jensen  wrote:
> 
> My web pages aren't loading from Diesel. Also the Server Status page doesn't 
> load content, only title. Urgent support request sent. Here we go again?
> .Jerry
> 
> 
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Re: How do you handle the poor performance of LC 7?

[Peter W A Wood]

Richard 

> On 31 May 2015, at 07:07, Richard Gaskin  wrote:
> 
> If there are bugs that have been submitted but not acted on and are holding 
> up work without a workaround, let's identify those and get them resolved.
> 
> In addition to review of the current bug DB, Ben recently contacted a few 
> developers to solicit such a shortlist, and as Community Manager I'm happy to 
> add to that list with anything critical we can identify here.

I reported a bug - http://quality.runrev.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15173 
 - in the default version of 
LiveCode Server used on On-Rev on 8th April 2015. The bug stopped me using 
LiveCode to develop a small web app used by a client. I had to use Ruby 
instead. When the client asked, “What did you write it in?”. I answered “Ruby” 
not “LiveCode”. 

Nobody at LiveCode has bothered to review the bug report yet.

Peter


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Update on bug I reported on 8th April 2014 -15173

[Peter W A Wood]

Somebody at LiveCode has at last taken a look at the bug report that I 
submitted on 8th April 2014 thanks to Richard Gaskin’s intervention. They have 
marked it as a duplicate of a bug reported by David Williams on 17th October 
2011. Nobody at LiveCode has  responded to that bug either apart from noting 
that the bug that I reported is a duplicate of it.

I suppose it will be recorded as a bug fixed in less than two months.




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Re: Update on bug I reported on 8th April 2014 -15173

[Peter W A Wood]

> On 1 Jun 2015, at 21:46, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
> 
> Somebody at LiveCode has at last taken a look at the bug report that I 
> submitted on 8th April 2014 thanks to Richard Gaskin’s intervention. They 
> have marked it as a duplicate of a bug reported by David Williams on 17th 
> October 2011. Nobody at LiveCode has  responded to that bug either apart from 
> noting that the bug that I reported is a duplicate of it.

I am very happy to report that one of the development team was able to look 
into the bug late yesterday and has made a correction that is waiting to be 
built.





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List Navigation

[Peter W A Wood]

One of the features of LiveCode is its strong list processing capabilities. In 
some ways, LiveCode does such a good job of list processing that it is almost 
hidden. One thing that I’ve not found, but I’m hoping somebody on the list has, 
is list navigation.

What I’m looking for is something similar to Rebol’s next, back, tail and head 
functions. They work like this:

list: [1 2 3 4 5]; defines list with 5 elements

next list ; shows the “visible” list as [2 3 4 
5]

first next list   ; returns 2

list: tail list   ; changes the "visible” list to [] (empty)

back list ; changes the “visible” list to [5]

list: head list   ; returns “full visibility” to the list

Does anybody know of an equivalent in LiveCode?

Regards

Peter



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