Re: [Tagging] Tagging shared campuses: landuse=school?

[althio]

> for the shared name of several schools I would suggest the group
relation. Just add the schools as members and add the shared name to the
relation.
-1
I prefer an area if there is contiguous grounds (this is a simple
representation, with geographical information, close to reality, and does
not involve relation).
Or a 'site' relation if elements are dispersed.

> I think the school amenity may also be linked to its grounds via a
relation, but [...].
-1, no need for relation, spatial data gives that information already.
As you say:

 > The association of school with campus can be deduced from the amenity
point/way lying inside the landuse area.
+1000. Keep it simple. And spatial. Not over-relational.

> When schools share campus make it a large amenity=school area without any
name and amenity=school + name nodes for the schools.
This seems very wrong to me.
This goes against 1 feature, 1 element.
It would prevent basic operations like counting the schools in a city.

-- althio
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Cédric Mélac]

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which concentrates crops from 
farms around before selling at best prices.
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Richard Welty]

On 4/5/19 11:19 AM, Cédric Mélac wrote:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
> Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which concentrates
> crops from farms around before selling at best prices.

these are commonly called Elevators in the US. i don't know what british
usage is.

note that there are also bin sites, which don't have the market/sales
aspect but are places where bins may be found, sometimes in large
number, for storage.

in the US, elevators may be straight up commercial, or may be coops.
don't know if that is worth capturing or not.

-- 
rwe...@averillpark.net
 Averill Park Networking - GIS & IT Consulting
 OpenStreetMap - PostgreSQL - Linux
 Java - Web Applications - Search

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Cédric Mélac]

Yes, this is exactly that ! I didn't know how it was called in English.
Thank you a lot for your fast answer ! I think I should change the tag name for 
"industrial=grain_elevator" according to the English Wikipedia page : 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grain_elevator


De : Richard Welty 
Envoyé : vendredi 5 avril 2019 15:29
À : tagging@openstreetmap.org
Objet : Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

On 4/5/19 11:19 AM, Cédric Mélac wrote:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
> Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which concentrates
> crops from farms around before selling at best prices.

these are commonly called Elevators in the US. i don't know what british
usage is.

note that there are also bin sites, which don't have the market/sales
aspect but are places where bins may be found, sometimes in large
number, for storage.

in the US, elevators may be straight up commercial, or may be coops.
don't know if that is worth capturing or not.

--
rwe...@averillpark.net
 Averill Park Networking - GIS & IT Consulting
 OpenStreetMap - PostgreSQL - Linux
 Java - Web Applications - Search

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Paul Allen]

On Fri, 5 Apr 2019 at 16:51, Cédric Mélac  wrote:

> Yes, this is exactly that ! I didn't know how it was called in English.
> Thank you a lot for your fast answer ! I think I should change the tag
> name for "industrial=grain_elevator" according to the English Wikipedia
> page :
>

What is meant by "grain elevator" depends which flavour of English you
speak, according to
that Wikipedia page.

In Australia, it is just the lifting mechanism and tower containing it,
whilst the individual
grain containers are silos or wheat bins or receival points.  In Canada it
can be a place where
grain is sold into the global distribution system.  In the US it can mean
the lifting mechanism
or the whole storage facility consisting of many silos.  I can't find what
it means in British
English.  However, OSM generally uses British English.

I'd suggest industrial=grain_storage (no need for the centre) as being
unambiguous in most
dialects of English.  Unless somebody knows what these things are called in
the UK.  But
a quick google search seems to show that "grain storage" is used by some of
them.

-- 
Paul
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Horse mounting steps

[marc marc]

Hello,

Le 27.03.19 à 00:07, Warin a écrit :
> horse=mounting_block 7
<...>
> horse=mounting_block is not good ... horse=* is used  
> for access restrictions.

Only 3 users, message send to 2 of them.

Le 28.08.2018, Andy Townsend a écrit :
> the ones I've mapped

any arg why you have used the horse=*access key ?

I'm also in favor of man_made=mounting_block

Regards,
Marc
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Philip Barnes]

On Friday, 5 April 2019, Richard Welty wrote:
> On 4/5/19 11:19 AM, Cédric Mélac wrote:
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
> > Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which concentrates
> > crops from farms around before selling at best prices.
> 
> these are commonly called Elevators in the US. i don't know what british
> usage is.

British usage is silo.

They are in my experience, I live in a rural area, found on individual farms 
rather than in any facility. Farms will tend to store grain themselves. 

Farming around here, certainly arable, is on an industrial scale. I imagine 
these are associated with  co-operatives and relatively small farms.

But to be sure next time I have a pint with a farmer I will ask the question. 

Phil (trigpoint)

-- 
Sent from my Sailfish device
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

Am Fr., 5. Apr. 2019 um 18:12 Uhr schrieb Paul Allen :

> On Fri, 5 Apr 2019 at 16:51, Cédric Mélac  wrote:
>
> I'd suggest industrial=grain_storage (no need for the centre) as being
> unambiguous in most
> dialects of English.  Unless somebody knows what these things are called
> in the UK.  But
> a quick google search seems to show that "grain storage" is used by some
> of them.
>


I believe the key "industrial" is mainly used for the subtype of industrial
landuse. From the description I got the impression this tag would be about
a feature, i.e. it would be better in a feature key, for example "man_made".

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Mark Wagner]

On Fri, 5 Apr 2019 16:38:56 +
Philip Barnes  wrote:

> On Friday, 5 April 2019, Richard Welty wrote:
> > On 4/5/19 11:19 AM, Cédric Mélac wrote:  
> > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
> > > Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which
> > > concentrates crops from farms around before selling at best
> > > prices.  
> > 
> > these are commonly called Elevators in the US. i don't know what
> > british usage is.  
> 
> British usage is silo.
> 
> They are in my experience, I live in a rural area, found on
> individual farms rather than in any facility. Farms will tend to
> store grain themselves. 
> 
> Farming around here, certainly arable, is on an industrial scale. I
> imagine these are associated with  co-operatives and relatively small
> farms.
> 

American English grain elevator:
https://www.google.com/maps/@47.7591426,-118.5290499,3a,74.6y,153.92h,101.32t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sSQUMNc9VimuAS_gMyyJmog!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1

American English silo (a small one, and probably not used for storing
grain. Places that have standalone silos tend not to be places that
have Google StreetView):
https://www.google.com/maps/@47.0046952,-117.3503996,3a,28.2y,217.27h,89.9t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sthnyTWcsvnaxCW6uM7Xe_w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

-- 
Mark

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal -- RFC -- service=irregular

[Markus]

Hi Michael,

thanks for your feedback!

I see that the proposed tag service=irregular is too confusing. My
primary intention is to tag the function of these "diversion tracks",
not how often they are used (though this is a consequence of their
function). These tram, metro and light-rail tracks i have in mind
don't belong to the main tracks, but are almost exclusively used for
diversions, such as when a main track is blocked by a defective
railcar or in case of an accident or road works. They are also
relatively short (only a few 100 m).

I found out that these tracks are called "Dienstgleise" in the
German-speaking part of Switzerland, which literally means "service
tracks". Does anyone know how these tracks are called in English? I
was thinking of changing the tag to service=reserve, but then found
out that a "reserved tracks" is a term used for tracks on ground
exclusively for trams (opposed to street-running tracks). What about
service=auxiliary or service=diversion?

Route relations don't really help (e.g. for renderers to de-emphasise
these tracks), because the absence of a route relation on a track
doesn't necessarily mean that it is a diversion track; it could also
be that no route relations have been mapped yet. Besides, a tag on the
rail is more stable (i.e. gets less frequently broken) than a route
relation.

Best regards

Markus

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Tagging shared campuses: landuse=school?

[Markus]

Hi Jeroen, hi all,

I'd welcome a tag for land used for educational purposes. (In my
opinion, landuse=school is too specific.) This would help for places
with multiple educational institutions (e.g. schools, colleges and/or
kindergartens) sharing sports fields, gymnasia, school yards or even
buildings, where overlapping amenity=school/kindergarten/college areas
were too difficult or impossible to map.

There is a minor thing, but i think that the landuse=* value should
rather be educational (adjective) instead of education (noun). This
makes more sense and fits better to other landuse=* values like
residential, industrial or commercial.

Best regards


Markus

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[marc marc]

Le 05.04.19 à 18:42, Martin Koppenhoefer a écrit :
> I believe the key "industrial" is mainly used for the subtype of 
> industrial landuse. From the description I got the impression this tag 
> would be about a feature, i.e. it would be better in a feature key, for 
> example "man_made".

trading and storage is an industrial activity ?
imho it's a tertiary activity.

as stated on the french-speaking forum, there is also confusion about 
what the tag describes. landuse only describes the use of the land. if 
the purpose is to inform the offices or store of a grain trader, it is 
rather the office or shop tags that are appropriate. the shop is 
sometime separated from the storage place.
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Warin]

On 06/04/19 03:38, Philip Barnes wrote:

On Friday, 5 April 2019, Richard Welty wrote:

On 4/5/19 11:19 AM, Cédric Mélac wrote:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Grain_Storage_Centre
Defintion: A large site with many silos and barns which concentrates
crops from farms around before selling at best prices.

these are commonly called Elevators in the US. i don't know what british
usage is.

British usage is silo.

They are in my experience, I live in a rural area, found on individual farms 
rather than in any facility. Farms will tend to store grain themselves.

Farming around here, certainly arable, is on an industrial scale. I imagine 
these are associated with  co-operatives and relatively small farms.

But to be sure next time I have a pint with a farmer I will ask the question.


For me the 'elevator' is only the mechanism that raises the grain to a height 
were it is feed into the silo.
The commercial sites in Australia have a weigh bridge and incoming grain is 
assessed for moisture and contaminates before being accepted ..
if too moist it is refused.. if it is close they go park in the sun to dry for 
a few hours...
the weigh bridge is used to asses the amount of grain. So there is more than an 
elevator/silos ...
The big ones are off farm usually located on a train line for transport.
A recent development is painting the outside of the silos...
https://www.visitvictoria.com/regions/grampians/things-to-do/art-theatre-and-culture/silo-art-trail

The whole area ? .. well landuse is what I'd use. lauduse=agricultural?


___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Paul Allen]

On Sat, 6 Apr 2019 at 00:14, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> The whole area ? .. well landuse is what I'd use. lauduse=agricultural?
>

I'd say landuse=agricultural applies strictly to farms.  Growing crops,
raising animals,
that sort of thing.  A grain storage facility is stretching things a lot.
If you go with that
then you could call a business selling tractors landuse=agricultural.

Having thought about it, a case could be made for landuse=depot +
depot=grain_storage
or something along those lines.  That's stretching things too, since the
wiki definition is
very slanted towards vehicles, but English usage of depot means a storage
facility of
any kind.  The wiki mentions that landuse=depot can be used for warehouses,
and
silos are just special types of warehouse (if you squint when you look at
them).

Or maybe just landuse=commercial, since the place exists for the purpose of
buying and
selling grain, storage is just a side-effect of doing that.

-- 
Paul
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

On Sat, 6 Apr 2019 at 09:58, Paul Allen  wrote:

>
> Having thought about it, a case could be made for landuse=depot +
> depot=grain_storage
>

That's not a bad thought


> Or maybe just landuse=commercial, since the place exists for the purpose
> of buying and
> selling grain, storage is just a side-effect of doing that.
>

I can see where you're coming from, but I don't think so, as there's no
money changing hands on site, they're just tallying up to say x number of
tons received

Thanks

Graeme
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Grain Storage Centre

[Warin]

On 06/04/19 16:36, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:



On Sat, 6 Apr 2019 at 09:58, Paul Allen > wrote:



Having thought about it, a case could be made for landuse=depot +
depot=grain_storage


That's not a bad thought

Or maybe just landuse=commercial, since the place exists for the
purpose of buying and
selling grain, storage is just a side-effect of doing that.


I can see where you're coming from, but I don't think so, as there's 
no money changing hands on site, they're just tallying up to say x 
number of tons received




Buying and selling these days may not see 'money' change hands .. all 
done through the banks.
In Africa most people pay using their phones - no 'money', even the 
'poor' use cell phones as they prevent theft of 'money'. The cell phones 
are cheap.
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging