Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Sinkholes refinement

[marc marc]

Hello,

Am 2017-11-14 20:31, schrieb Yuri Astrakhan:
>> Perhaps it should be altered after the voting? 

Don't change the content of the proposal page once the vote has started.
Fix the "typo" on the pages of the keys.

Regards,
Marc
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] tower types, cooling towers etc.

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

There's another similar issue: communication towers.

There are basically 2 kind of communication towers, one a subclass of
man_made=tower, the other man_made=communications_tower
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man%20made=communications%20tower

According to the above wiki page, in opposition to the man_made=tower page,
the communication towers which have "to be climbed on the outside", should
get the man_made=tower tag and subtag.

What shall we do, change the definition of man_made=communications_tower or
the definition of man_made=tower?

We have two almost equal tags, which should mean different things (wouldn't
it make more sense to have different names, or more explicit names for the
avoidance of confusion?):
A. man_made=communications_tower

B. man_made=tower
tower:type=communication_tower

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

[Tagging] RFC: emergency=dry_riser_inlet

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

I'm formally asking for comments on the dry riser inlet proposal:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Dry_riser_inlet

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2017-11-10 16:13 GMT+01:00 José G Moya Y. :

> How do you map this situation:
> You can enter with wheelchair to Pacifico Metro Station metro line 1.
> You can enter with wheelchair to Pacifico Metro Station line 6.
> You can't go with wheelchair from line 6 to line 1 (or vice versa) without
> paying
> your metro fee again. To do so, you have to go by foot.
> (This is a common accesibility problem on old metro stations in Madrid).
>


IMHO you should try to solve it on a political/administrative level, rather
than map this particular shortcoming in OSM.
They should introduce a rule that if you are in a wheelchair, do claim you
came from the other line and can show a valid ticket, they should let you
in without requiring a second ticket. There might also be a right to do so
(e.g. antidiscrimination law,
maybe metro transport conditions).


Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] winter tyres

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2017-11-09 21:12 GMT+01:00 Michal Fabík :

> On 1.11.2017 11:50, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
>
> Hi, sorry for the long pause.
> Ok, following Warin's suggestion:
>
> > https://www.sicurauto.it/upload/news_/8684/img/2038-cartelli
> sperimentali-pneumatici-invernali.png
> motor_vehicle:conditional=winter_equipment @ (Nov 15-Apr 15)
>
> > http://www.rmastri.it/plugins/image_gallery/images/gallery/8
> 194ca9513d72ed09adb11f0f3af.jpg
> motor_vehicle:conditional=yes @ winter_equipment
>
> or
>
> motor_vehicle:conditional=winter_equipment @ winter
>
> (Not sure if the sign implies all the time or within a time span defined
> by law.)
>
> > https://www.avd.de/fileadmin/content/Bilder/Unterseiten/Rech
> t/Content/Verkehrszeichen-268.png
>
> motor_vehicle:conditional=yes @ snow_chains
> motor_vehicle:conditional=snow_chains @ winter



I believe the question remains whether "winter_equipment" is sufficient or
if we want to distinguish. e.g. between winter tyres and snow chains or
spikes. There might also be different regulations for different kind of
vehicle, e.g. hgv, motorbikes, ...
(E.g. in Germany, you will generally have to use winter tyres (at the
moment still also M+S, but AFAIK they are currently changing this) in the
winter, but there are signs that make snow chains obligatory for the
road.). Wikipedia has a summary page in German about the situation in
different countries:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winterausr%C3%BCstung_(Stra%C3%9Fenverkehr)

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] tower types, cooling towers etc.

[marc marc]

Le 16. 11. 17 à 13:05, Martin Koppenhoefer a écrit :
> B. man_made=tower

I like the idea to have all tower in a main tag (it allow a mapper to 
map it as a tower and after refine it depending of the use)

 > tower:type=communication_tower

I dislike the "no-meaning" type suffix.
Type could be the use, the scope, the shape, ...
It should be better to find a better word

Regards,
Marc
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

[Tagging] information=board multiple

[e.rossini73]

Hi if I have  1 board with on a side wildlife informations(so 
board_type=widlife) and on the other side there is geology informations (so 
board_type=geology) how can I correctly tag it?

solution 1
- board_type=wildlife;geology

solution 2
- 2 different nodes but how can I preserve the information that in reality the 
board is 1 and not 2? there’s a kind of relation type to tag this?

Even more complicated the case where on a side of the same board there’s a map 
(so information=map) and on the other side there is geology informations 
(board_type=geology), how can I correctly tag it?

Thanks very much.

--enrico

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] tower types, cooling towers, etc.

[Mark Bradley]

> Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2017 14:39:56 +

> From: marc marc <  
> marc_marc_...@hotmail.com>

> To: "  tagging@openstreetmap.org" < 
>  tagging@openstreetmap.org>

> Subject: Re: [Tagging] tower types, cooling towers etc.

> 

> Le 16. 11. 17 à 13:05, Martin Koppenhoefer a écrit :

> > B. man_made=tower

> 

> I like the idea to have all tower in a main tag (it allow a mapper to

> map it as a tower and after refine it depending of the use)

> 

>  > tower:type=communication_tower

> 

> I dislike the "no-meaning" type suffix.

> Type could be the use, the scope, the shape, ...

> It should be better to find a better word

> 

> Regards,

> Marc

> 

> --

 

 

I also like the idea of having all towers under one tag, for the same reason as 
marc marc.

 

I would also like to point out that tower:type=communication_tower is 
redundant.  Tower:type=communication is sufficient.

 

Mark

 

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] tower types, cooling towers, etc.

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2017-11-16 17:57 GMT+01:00 Mark Bradley :

> I also like the idea of having all towers under one tag, for the same
> reason as marc marc.
>

can you expand, which kind of "all towers" you mean here. Is this including
light towers, water towers, power towers, bell towers, air traffic control
towers, cooling towers, drop towers? Are you going by the name? E.g.
there's the tower of London, but it is tagged as a castle currently, would
you suggest to retag it as tower?

http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/370870741



> I would also like to point out that tower:type=communication_tower is
> redundant.  Tower:type=communication is sufficient.
>
>
they are describing (physically) very different features, that only have
the same or similar function from a specific abstract point of view (radio
communication, actually broadcast = oneway communication). As they are both
only about radio communication, I find the name generally not well chosen.

Cheers,
Martin
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[Mark Wagner]

On Thu, 16 Nov 2017 13:23:47 +0100
Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:

> IMHO you should try to solve it on a political/administrative level,
> rather than map this particular shortcoming in OSM.

One of the things I like about OSM is that it maps the world as it is,
not the world as the map-maker wishes it was.  I've spent enough time
trying to follow hiking trails that a park manager wished they had the
funds to build, or being side-tracked by logging roads they wished
didn't exist to really appreciate a reality-based map.

If you can't go from Line 1 to Line 6 in a wheelchair without paying,
*map it*.  Sure, a policy change would be ideal, but until it's
changed, map things as they are, not as you wish they were.

-- 
Mark

___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[José G Moya Y .]

Just to clarify the situation:
I'm sure you can press the intercom button, wait for response, and get the
door opened without having to buy another ticket. But the question is you
are not making disabled people autonomous if you make them follow such slow
process.

There are other weird situations in Spain, such as the regional/short range
terminal of Atocha Station, Madrid, having the 50% of its scalators in
maintenance mode since September, without a notice suggesting people go to
the alternative doors on floor -1 to access the working scalators.


El 16/11/2017 20:25, "Mark Wagner"  escribió:

> On Thu, 16 Nov 2017 13:23:47 +0100
> Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:
>
> > IMHO you should try to solve it on a political/administrative level,
> > rather than map this particular shortcoming in OSM.
>
> One of the things I like about OSM is that it maps the world as it is,
> not the world as the map-maker wishes it was.  I've spent enough time
> trying to follow hiking trails that a park manager wished they had the
> funds to build, or being side-tracked by logging roads they wished
> didn't exist to really appreciate a reality-based map.
>
> If you can't go from Line 1 to Line 6 in a wheelchair without paying,
> *map it*.  Sure, a policy change would be ideal, but until it's
> changed, map things as they are, not as you wish they were.
>
> --
> Mark
>
> ___
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] information=board multiple

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 16. Nov 2017, at 16:14, e.rossini73  wrote:
> 
> - 2 different nodes but how can I preserve the information that in reality 
> the board is 1 and not 2? there’s a kind of relation type to tag this?


my personal choice would probably be not to map the fact that the two boards 
are just 2 sides of one physical board. You could invent a relation for this. 
You could also map the board as a way (with height, min_height, thickness) or 
as a polygon (with height and min_height). You could map the kind of printing 
procedure, the number of colors, or how the board is attached, the material of 
the support, etc. There are a lot of things you could map but don’t. IMHO the 
relation to combine those two boards is one of them ;-)


cheers,
Martin 
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

[Tagging] name on city_limit traffic sign and guidepost

[marc marc]

Hello,

On the french speaking mailing, a mapper think that the name of 
traffic_sign=city_limit or on a guidpost it not really a name.
it's the name of a feature (a city, a forest, a peak) that is nearby of 
the sign itself.
what do you think about ?
should a better keyname be used ?

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:traffic_sign%3Dcity_limit
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:information%3Dguidepost

Regards,
Marc
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

sent from a phone

> On 16. Nov 2017, at 23:17, José G Moya Y.  wrote:
> 
> Just to clarify the situation:
> I'm sure you can press the intercom button, wait for response, and get the 
> door opened without having to buy another ticket. But the question is you are 
> not making disabled people autonomous if you make them follow such slow 
> process.


even if there’s not an issue in the specific case, it shows that there’s a 
shortcoming in osm for the mapping of closed systems: we don’t typically map 
the border / gates / inside-outside. Sometimes you might be able to cross a 
station without needing to enter the inner area, sometimes you can’t. It would 
be interesting to be more detailed with regard to turnstiles / barriers inside 
the stations, and agreed tagging for inside the system (similarly in airports 
after the security check), I agree 

cheers,
Martin 
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[marc marc]

On 16. Nov 2017, at 23:17, José G Moya Y.  wrote:
>> you can press the intercom button, wait for response, and get the door 
>> opened without having to buy another ticket

wheelchair=limited
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - Metro Mapping

[José G Moya Y .]

Thanks for the suggestion, Marc.

Martin, I don't think authorities welcome a detailed map of inner areas in
stations/airports. They will show a security concern.
Yours,
José.


El 17/11/2017 0:27, "marc marc"  escribió:

> On 16. Nov 2017, at 23:17, José G Moya Y.  wrote:
> >> you can press the intercom button, wait for response, and get the door
> opened without having to buy another ticket
>
> wheelchair=limited
> ___
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>
___
Tagging mailing list
Tagging@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging