Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery based hydrogen incidents

[Randy Brooks]

Fellow Wrenches,

I'm aware of one incident of an exploding battery.  I helped a friend install 
two solar powered remote controlled gate openers on his ranch.  These systems 
came with two small PV modules (5W each) and no charge controller.  A 100 amp 
hour battery was recommended.  During the winter, one gate went unused for an 
extended period.  The systems are located at 7,000' in Colorado that has cold, 
sunny winters.  When my friend tried to use the gate opener in the spring, and 
it didn't work, he opened the battery container and found the deep cycle, 
flooded lead acid battery had exploded.  We immediately installed small charge 
controllers and the problem has not reoccured.  I no longer accept the 
rule-of-thumb that a small PV module will not overcharge a large battery.  No 
matter how small, every PV system gets a charge controller.

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Dec 15, 2010, at 10:13 AM, Dana wrote:

> I am not advocating for no box or vent as the corrosion factor is high 
> without box and vent.
> Just if and how many incidents have occurred.
>  
> Dana Orzel
> Great Solar Works, Inc
> E - d...@solarwork.com
> V - 970.626.5253
> F - 970.626.4140
> C - 970.209.4076
> web - www.solarwork.com
>  
> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"
> Do not ever belive anything, but seriously trust through action.
>  
> From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
> [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Kent Osterberg
> Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 10:21 AM
> To: RE-wrenches
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery based hydrogen incidents
>  
> Sounds like, in general, that the off-grid industry has been fortunate to not 
> have hydrogen explosions.  That's good.  No explosions here either.  But one 
> shouldn't take that as evidence that it couldn't happen.  I don't believe 
> this is a circumstance where it is better to be lucky than good.  That's why 
> I recommend doing the calculations.
> 
> Kent Osterberg
> Blue Mountain Solar
> 
> 
>  
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[RE-wrenches] Generator for off grid

[Randy Brooks]

Fellow Wrenches,

What generator manufacturer are you currently recommending for off grid use?  A 
Kohler 18RES (LP, 3,600 rpm, air cooled) a customer installed last year has 
already failed after 370 hours of use during 6 months of construction and 
winter occupancy.  It consumed enough oil to cause the low oil shutoff to 
activate, and the generator controller board is fried.  The owner is still 
negotiating with Kohler, but Kohler has said they will not support any of their 
generators used off grid.

The owner is looking at a Cummins Onan 20 kW GGMA (LP, 1,800 rpm, liquid 
cooled).

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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[RE-wrenches] Off grid generator

[Randy Brooks]

Wrenches,

Thanks for the responses, on and off list, to my earlier question about what 
off grid generator you recommend.

The Cummins Onan 20 kW GGMA (LP, 1,800 rpm, liquid cooled) we're considering 
also has an optional coolant heater (120vAC, 1,500 watt) that the manual 
recommends be used any time the coolant gets below 70°F (yikes, talk about a 
phantom load!)  Has anyone used the Onan 20 kW in a cold climate?  Was it 
necessary to use the coolant heater to insure reliable starting?  I'm thinking 
that as long as we keep the starting battery charged with a small PV module, 
and use the appropriate antifreeze mix, we shouldn't have any problem with 
winter starting.  

Thanks again for the benefit of your collective experience!

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] collector leaks (was Stiebel Eltron SHW Collector condensation issue)

[Randy Brooks]

Wrenches,

Several years ago I stopped recommending solar hot water systems with 
pressurized collector loops, because of problems with leaks and the need to 
test and replace glycol solution every 3 to 5 years.  I now recommend drainback 
systems from AET Solar (www.aetsolar.com) that use a collector loop that is at 
or near atmospheric pressure, and use water as a collector fluid.  This places 
a lot less strain on the collector loop plumbing.  No problems since.

Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jun 21, 2011, at 10:03 AM, Solar Energy Solutions wrote:

> After 25 years of installing solar thermal panels, we have come to the 
> unfortunate conclusion that they all suck.  We have had out of the box 
> failures on all panels we have used... and we are a very, very, very small 
> company.   We pressurize our solar thermal systems to 60-80 psi and let them 
> sit for 3 days.  If they hold that pressure... like a ROCK, we complete the 
> install.  What we find, as often as not, is some little piddly leak somewhere 
> in the loop.  Micro holes are not an uncommon encounter in panels.  So, we 
> then have to wrestle the solar thermal manufacturer into first believing 
> their "infallible" product is leaking , "out of the box"  and then pay, out 
> of OUR pocket the substantial labor costs for its replacement.  So far as I 
> can tell, all solar thermal manufacturers warranty their panels for 10 years. 
>  But, they only cover $100.oo in labor costs to replace a defective product.  
> This does not begin to cover our labor costs.  Consequently, I have started 
> down the road, (without success so far) of demanding solar thermal 
> manufactures to stand behind their products with a 5 year $500.00 Labor 
> warranty.  I have talked to a ton of solar thermal manufacturers and  they 
> all say the same thing.  "Our panels are the best.   Our failure rate is less 
> then 2%.  We warranty them for 10 years, but we only pay $100.00 labor to 
> replace those that are defective out of the box."  I can't even get the 
> evacuated tube guys to stand behind their product with a decent labor 
> warranty!
>  
> Perhaps if more than one solar Bozo stands up and  says, "Enough, we want a 
> panel with a 5 year $500.00 labor warranty".  A manufacturer might see the 
> competitive edge of being the first to do so.
>  
> Sincerely, 
>  
>  
> Andrew Koyaanisqatsi
> President
> Solar Energy Solutions, Inc.
> Since 1987,
> Moving Portland and Beyond
> to an Environmentally Sustainable Future.
> 503-238-4502
> www.solarenergyoregon.com
>  
> "Better one's House too little one day
> than too big all the Year after."
> 
> From: August Goers 
> To: RE-wrenches 
> Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 7:19 AM
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Stiebel Eltron SHW Collector condensation issue
> 
> Hi David -
>  
> Doesn't sound fun. We experienced a similar problem with a 10-collector 
> system with Schuco Slim-Vs about 3 years ago. The collectors had lots of 
> condensation build up in them, especially during the rainy season. Schuco 
> stepped up and gave us new 2nd generation collectors under warranty. The new 
> collectors do not have the condensation problem. Apparently they redesigned 
> the ventilation method. Generally speaking I like the Schuco product although 
> now we're noticing a browning effect occurring near the in inlet and outlet 
> pipes on the absorber plate on Slim Vs installed a few years ago. I have yet 
> to deal with this issue.
>  
> It sounds like Stiebel is still working out their design. You'll probably 
> want to make sure that they have it fully figured out before replacing the 
> old collectors under warranty otherwise you might have the same problem!
>  
> Good luck with it.
>  
> Best, August
>  
> From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
> [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Dave Palumbo
> Sent: Monday, June 20, 2011 12:58 PM
> To: 'RE-wrenches'
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Stiebel Eltron SHW Collector condensation issue
>  
> SHW Wrenches,
>  
> Our first experience with SHW flat plate collectors with a condensation issue 
> on the inside of the collectors’ glass cover. The system has two Stiebel 
> Eltron Sol 25 collectors (88” x 48” each) with a 82 gallon single heat 
> exchanger insulated tank in the basement of the home, with a SOM 6 solar loop 
> controller. System installed fall of 2008.
>  
> Condensation problem was first noticed by homeowner late last December. The 
> collectors’ manufacturer, Stiebel Eltron, instruct

Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Watering Systems

[Randy Brooks]

Wayne,

If you use an automatic battery watering system, make sure it is  
intended to be used on the make and model of battery you have.  If  
not, it may underfill or overfill battery cells.


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On May 6, 2009, at 8:20 AM, Drake Chamberlin wrote:


Try The Solar Biz.

At 08:48 AM 5/6/2009, you wrote:

Has anyone found a reliable battery watering system?

Wayne Irwin, President
Pure Energy Solar International Inc.
State Licensed Solar Contractor
License # CVC56695
wa...@pureenergysolar.net
http://pureenergysolar.net
352 377-6527 Office





Date: Mon, 4 May 2009 20:42:03 -0700
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
From: will...@millersolar.com
Subject: [RE-wrenches] PV Fire

Friends:

This just in.  Apparently a commercial PV installation caught fire  
in California's Country Music Capital.  We posted a report on our  
web site at http://millersolar.com/practices/Safety/ 
safety_data.html   Click on Target PV Fire.  This is a 6 MB pdf.



William Miller

Please note new e-mail address and domain:

William Miller
Miller Solar
Voice :805-438-5600 Fax: 805-438-4607
email: will...@millersolar.com
http://millersolar.com
License No. C-10-773985


Hotmail® has a new way to see what's up with your friends. Check  
it out.

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Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric
OH License 44810
CO License 3773
NABCEP Certified PV Installer
Office - 740-448-7328
Mobile - 740-856-9648

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Re: [RE-wrenches] FW: Backup Generators

[Randy Brooks]

Allan,

Does the Honda have a "eco-throttle" setting that throttles back  
under light load?  If so, turn it off so the inverter sees full  
voltage and frequency and can sync with no other loads on.


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:24 PM, Allan Sindelar wrote:


Wrenches,

This man wrote me about a generator/inverter compatibility problem  
he’s having. I haven’t heard of it before. I suspect it’s more than  
just a simple voltage-frequency issue, but I haven’t heard of this  
or experienced it. Any ideas?


Thank you, Allan Sindelar



In the Spring of 08, I purchased a Honda EU6500is generator as a  
back-up to my off grid solar system.  The Honda was to replace my  
Yamaha YG6600DE generator which worked fine with my Trace SW4024  
inverter.  However the new Honda inverter-generator seemed to have  
problems working with my Trace inverter.  If I had a load running,  
such as my 110 V well pump, it would handle that load and the  
excess power from the generator was used to charge the batteries  
through the Trace 4024.  But once the well pump shut off, the Honda  
generator and the Trace didn’t seem to like to work together.  The  
Trace inverter stopped allowing the incoming power to be used to  
continue to charge the batteries by disconnecting AC2 power  
(generator) from coming into the SW4024.  After replacing the Honda  
with the old Yamaha generator, everything worked fine again,  
including charging the batteries without another load on the inverter.


As a result of the above, my question is:  Have you experienced  
similar incompatibility with inverter-generators and inverters such  
as my Trace SW4024?If so, do you have any suggestions that will  
allow me to use my Honda EU6500is with my Trace 4024?  Calls to  
Xantrex and Honda on this issue did not provide any useful  
information.


Thank you, Michael



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[RE-wrenches] Trace non-volatile memory after market

[Randy Brooks]

Wrenches,

A while back I recall hearing about an after market add on to provide  
non-volatile memory for Trace inverter settings.  I haven't been able  
to locate such a product.  Anyone know of one, or have experience  
with one?


Also, a customer with one SW4024 inverter is interested in adding  
another, but I don't see them for sale new anymore.  Anyone know a  
source?  Would a new XW4024 work with the existing SW4024?


Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace non-volatile memory after market

[Randy Brooks]

Jay,

Perfect!  Thanks!

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jul 16, 2009, at 9:53 PM, jay peltz wrote:


HI Randy,

Go to http://www.righthandeng.com/
They got them.

jay

peltz power
On Jul 16, 2009, at 8:44 PM, Randy Brooks wrote:


Wrenches,

A while back I recall hearing about an after market add on to  
provide non-volatile memory for Trace inverter settings.  I  
haven't been able to locate such a product.  Anyone know of one,  
or have experience with one?


Also, a customer with one SW4024 inverter is interested in adding  
another, but I don't see them for sale new anymore.  Anyone know a  
source?  Would a new XW4024 work with the existing SW4024?


Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Trace non-volatile memory after market

[Randy Brooks]

Matt,

Thanks!

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jul 17, 2009, at 9:09 AM, Matt Tritt wrote:


Randy,

The SW series isn't compatible with the XW series, but DC Power has  
four new SW 4024s in stock.


Matt T

Randy Brooks wrote:


Wrenches,

A while back I recall hearing about an after market add on to  
provide non-volatile memory for Trace inverter settings.  I  
haven't been able to locate such a product.  Anyone know of one,  
or have experience with one?


Also, a customer with one SW4024 inverter is interested in adding  
another, but I don't see them for sale new anymore.  Anyone know a  
source?  Would a new XW4024 work with the existing SW4024?


Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com


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Re: [RE-wrenches] DC-DC converter for Sun Frost

[Randy Brooks]

Allan,

We used a Solar Converters DC/DC converter on a similar system (48v)  
at a vacation cabin.  The owner turns off the breaker in the power  
shed to reduce phantom loads from the converter when he's gone, and  
the frig is left turned off.  We ran 48v to the frig and installed  
the converter on top of the frig.  This eliminates 12v line lose from  
the power shed.  Works great.


take care,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Oct 6, 2009, at 10:04 PM, Allan Sindelar wrote:


Wrenches,

Simple question, I know: what has worked well as a 24V – 12V DC-DC  
step-down converter for a Sun Frost? I am doing a design to  
completely rebuild/replace an early-90s off-grid 12V system with a  
new system at 24V. The only DC load is a Sun Frost. I think it’s an  
RF16, so dual-compressor. I know of at least three converters:  
Solar Converters; BZ Products; ICT; and I’m sure there are many  
more. What has worked well, with minimal ghost load?




Thank you,



Allan Sindelar

al...@positiveenergysolar.com

NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer

EE98J Journeyman Electrician

Positive Energy, Inc.

3201 Calle Marie

Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507

505 424-1112

www.PositiveEnergySolar.com



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[RE-wrenches] Shell Solar RV20 PV charge controller

[Randy Brooks]

Fellow Wrenches,

Does anyone have a manual for an old Shell Solar RV20 PV charge  
controller?  Or know where I can get a copy.  I searched the web  
without success.  I'd like to know if the charge settings are  
adjustable for sealed batteries.


Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Shell Solar RV20 PV charge controller

[Randy Brooks]

Thanks to all who replied.  Priceless information!  What a great  
resource RE Wrenches is!


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Oct 13, 2009, at 1:49 PM, Mick Abraham wrote:

Hi, I believe Shell was using a private label version of the SCI  
controller, "Mark 20".  Take a look at this page:


http://www.specialtyconcepts.com/1to16.html

and search out Mark 22 and see if it looks familiar. I see the amp  
rating is 22 now but otherwise should be the same.


Happy hunting...

Mick Abraham, Proprietor
www.abrahamsolar.com

Voice: 970-731-4675


On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 1:59 PM, Randy Brooks  
 wrote:

Fellow Wrenches,

Does anyone have a manual for an old Shell Solar RV20 PV charge  
controller?  Or know where I can get a copy.  I searched the web  
without success.  I'd like to know if the charge settings are  
adjustable for sealed batteries.


Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Sync problem

[Randy Brooks]

Drake,

Is the Eco Throttle turned off?  If it's on, the generator is waiting  
for a load to come up to voltage, and the inverter is waiting for  
voltage to connect...


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Oct 29, 2009, at 4:25 PM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote:


Hello Wrenches,

I was under the impression that he Honda EU series of inverter  
generators

could synchronize with the grid tie VFX inverters. I tried to do this
today with a 2000 EU, and the inverter would not accept the power. The
generator has low hours on it.

Does anyone know why the two won't sync? Are others having success  
with
this combination?  Has anyone else had this problem?  Does the  
generator

have any settings?

Thank you,

Drake

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Automatic Watering

[Randy Brooks]

I agree with Ray.  We used a battery filling system once and had the  
same problems with leaks, cells over filled and under filled.  We  
took it out and will never use a battery filling system again.  If a  
customer is not willing, or around enough, to do proper flooded  
battery maintenance, we recommend sealed batteries.


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Dec 9, 2009, at 7:06 PM, R Ray Walters wrote:

I have to highly recommend against Battery FIlling Systems. After 3  
years trying to make their products work, we are pulling all  
watering systems out, and offering full refunds.
Some of the caps leaked at only 1 psi of pressure, some overfilled  
the batteries causing acid spills, and the worst: some caps never  
filled at all, leaving some cells under filled.
Repeated calls to their main contact Rob Source at Battery Filling  
Systems have gone unanswered.
We're back to manual filling as we just haven't found anything  
reliable enough to deal with this extremely important task.
Of 10 service call backs, 8 were problems with BFS products. (and  
we only made a couple of bucks per cell in the first place)

Please avoid this product like the plague!

R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




On Dec 9, 2009, at 7:14 PM, Joel Davidson wrote:


Wrenches,

We installed 48 each IBE 1-85N-15 cells (24 in series in 2 Direct  
Power & Water battery boxes). We do not want to use Hydrocaps.  
Your suggestions for an automatic watering system would be most  
appreciated. Thanks in advance.


Happy Holidays.
Joel Davidson
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Polycrystal PV modules with clear backer sheet: Who builds 'em?

[Randy Brooks]

Mick,

Silicon Energy (www.silicon-energy.com, Arlington, WA) sells PV  
modules with a glass back sheet that are see through.  They are  
heavier and pricey, but have a unique module design and mounting system.


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 4, 2010, at 12:15 PM, Mick Abraham wrote:


Hi, Mechanics~

I like the Sanyo bifacial PV modules for several reasons but I  
guess the biggest reason (for me) is the way they transmit light  
between the cells...due to the clear backer sheet. This seems dandy  
for carports, picnic shelters, etc.


The $/watt for the Sanyo bifacials affects the payback math,  
however, so:


Does anyone build non-exotic polycrystal (or non-exotic single  
crystal) modules with a clear backer sheet so part of the sunlight  
will come through? Reply to me off list or on-list.


Thanks,

Mick Abraham, Proprietor
www.abrahamsolar.com

Voice: 970-731-4675
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Peel-n-stick Uni-Solar: were these ever made in 5' length?

[Randy Brooks]

Mark,

There was a 4' 7 1/2"  Uni-Solar PVL-31 module (6v nominal, 31 watt,  
I have one for a demo) but Uni-Solar is now making only longer  
modules.  You can get Uni-Solar PVL modules from SunWize or DC  
Power.  The PVL-68 (9' 4 1/2" long) is 12v nominal (23.1v Voc) and  
would work for 12v battery charging.


take care,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 20, 2010, at 9:02 AM, Mick Abraham wrote:


Greetings~

A customer says he previously bought some of those peel-n-stick Uni- 
Solar laminates--as for standing seam metal roofing--but only 5'  
long. The customer says these were 6 volt nominal and he used them  
for 12v battery charging in series pairs.


...and he wants some more and wants me to find them. So far as I  
can tell there never was such a short length version and the whole  
peel-n-stick product line seems to be no more. Is that right?


Any List members who could supply this product could contact me off  
list. OR: answers & info about what happened to this Uni-Solar  
product line would be appreciated, OR:


Alternate suggestions would be welcomed. The client has a slightly  
curved surface about 5' by 6'...on a boat. I saw something from ICP  
called Sunsei on the West Marine website but that's the closest I  
came and none of my wholesale suppliers are connected for that  
product line.


Jolliness,

Mick Abraham, Proprietor
www.abrahamsolar.com

Voice: 970-731-4675
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback Grid Problems

[Randy Brooks]

Ray,

Is the inverter in a ventilated space?  We had a similar problem with  
older OutBacks in an unventilated shed.  OutBack sent us upgraded  
inverters and we vented the shed and have had no problems since.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 30, 2010, at 11:54 AM, R Ray Walters wrote:

I considered that there could be something happening due to the  
grid, as this guy is way out on the end of the line going into his  
own utility transformer.
But then the inverter should show a fault light, and it should try  
back again, once the grid voltage drops.
Instead it initiates a full charge cycle and will not connect till  
the next day.


R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




On Mar 30, 2010, at 10:57 AM, Brian Teitelbaum wrote:


HI Ray,

Have you checked the grid voltage to see if there is variation  
during the day which would be enough to kick the inverters out of  
connection?


Brian Teitelbaum
AEE Solar



-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re- 
wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of R Ray Walters

Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:43 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Outback Grid Problems

We currently have a Grid Tie system with a pair of Outback  
inverters that are regularly dropping out of sell mode, and  
letting the arrays spend all day charging the battery bank.
It seems to do this several times a week, and the customer is  
losing substantial production, and gassing the batteries too much.
It will reset itself the next day, or the customer resets it by  
turning off the inverters manually.
The system is 24 v, with an old array of 1800 watts running  
through 2 FM60s, and a new array of 2800 watts running through  
another pair of FM60s.
The battery bank is HUP about 4100 Ah @ 24 v (3 strings of 1375 Ah  
each) Big battery, I know, but the customer is an electrical  
engineer, who wanted maximum storage capacity.


Outback tech support has not resolved the issue, and this has  
turned into several service calls, and customer frustration.
We've tried running the controllers through the HUB, and also  
independently, and that doesn't make a difference.
I have numerous Outback GT installs dating back to 2003, and have  
never had a problem like this.

Any help or advice would as always be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance fellow Wrenches,

R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback Grid Problems

[Randy Brooks]

Ray,

The only fault warning we got was the batteries (a 48v, 1,000 amp hr  
HuP) were boiling and using a lot of water, and expected power  
production was down.  OutBack said this problem was corrected with  
new software.  The system was installed in 11/2005 and the inverters  
replaced in spring 2006.  If your inverters are newer, it should not  
be a problem, but it might be worth discussing with OutBack.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 31, 2010, at 10:48 AM, R Ray Walters wrote:

Ventilated, but small enclosure. Definitely a possibility to  
consider. What fault warnings were you getting?


Thanks,

R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




On Mar 30, 2010, at 5:58 PM, Randy Brooks wrote:


Ray,

Is the inverter in a ventilated space?  We had a similar problem  
with older OutBacks in an unventilated shed.  OutBack sent us  
upgraded inverters and we vented the shed and have had no problems  
since.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 30, 2010, at 11:54 AM, R Ray Walters wrote:

I considered that there could be something happening due to the  
grid, as this guy is way out on the end of the line going into  
his own utility transformer.
But then the inverter should show a fault light, and it should  
try back again, once the grid voltage drops.
Instead it initiates a full charge cycle and will not connect  
till the next day.


R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




On Mar 30, 2010, at 10:57 AM, Brian Teitelbaum wrote:


HI Ray,

Have you checked the grid voltage to see if there is variation  
during the day which would be enough to kick the inverters out  
of connection?


Brian Teitelbaum
AEE Solar



-Original Message-
From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re- 
wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of R Ray Walters

Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:43 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Outback Grid Problems

We currently have a Grid Tie system with a pair of Outback  
inverters that are regularly dropping out of sell mode, and  
letting the arrays spend all day charging the battery bank.
It seems to do this several times a week, and the customer is  
losing substantial production, and gassing the batteries too much.
It will reset itself the next day, or the customer resets it by  
turning off the inverters manually.
The system is 24 v, with an old array of 1800 watts running  
through 2 FM60s, and a new array of 2800 watts running through  
another pair of FM60s.
The battery bank is HUP about 4100 Ah @ 24 v (3 strings of 1375  
Ah each) Big battery, I know, but the customer is an electrical  
engineer, who wanted maximum storage capacity.


Outback tech support has not resolved the issue, and this has  
turned into several service calls, and customer frustration.
We've tried running the controllers through the HUB, and also  
independently, and that doesn't make a difference.
I have numerous Outback GT installs dating back to 2003, and  
have never had a problem like this.

Any help or advice would as always be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance fellow Wrenches,

R. Walters
r...@solarray.com
Solar Engineer




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Grid-tie hydro

[Randy Brooks]

Mark,

PowerSpout, from New Zealand, (www.powerspout.com) makes a grid tie  
version of their turbine that includes a dump load water heater at  
the inverter and uses an SMA grid tie inverter.  Worth checking into.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Apr 22, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Mark Dickson wrote:


Hello Wrenches,

Got one for you. . .

We have a customer that has great potential for a micro-hydro  
system and already has the grid on his property.  The obvious way  
to tie the turbine unit in would be to go back through batteries  
and a GVFX or XW.  In trying to eliminate the batteries and the  
inefficiencies I want to look at using a battery-less grid-tie  
inverter.  I am assuming that I could use a small inverter such as  
the PVP 1100 and high-voltage Stream Engine.  The problem I am  
trying to work around is how to divert the ~240DC output of the  
turbine, if and when the grid goes down.  Would this be as simple a  
placing a relay on the AC side of the inverter and having it switch  
on/off a large diversion load?


For the diversion load I was thinking I could just series up a set  
of water heater elements to get to the necessary voltage.




Has anybody accomplished this before?  Jay?  Are there any other  
elegant solutions for this?




Has anybody successfully used a WindyBoy with hydro?



Best regards,



Mark Dickson,

NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer ™

Oasis Montana Inc.



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Grid-tie hydro

[Randy Brooks]

Oops, the dump load water heater is at the turbine, not the  
inverter.  :)


Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Apr 22, 2010, at 4:37 PM, Randy Brooks wrote:


Mark,

PowerSpout, from New Zealand, (www.powerspout.com) makes a grid tie  
version of their turbine that includes a dump load water heater at  
the inverter and uses an SMA grid tie inverter.  Worth checking into.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Apr 22, 2010, at 11:04 AM, Mark Dickson wrote:


Hello Wrenches,

Got one for you. . .

We have a customer that has great potential for a micro-hydro  
system and already has the grid on his property.  The obvious way  
to tie the turbine unit in would be to go back through batteries  
and a GVFX or XW.  In trying to eliminate the batteries and the  
inefficiencies I want to look at using a battery-less grid-tie  
inverter.  I am assuming that I could use a small inverter such as  
the PVP 1100 and high-voltage Stream Engine.  The problem I am  
trying to work around is how to divert the ~240DC output of the  
turbine, if and when the grid goes down.  Would this be as simple  
a placing a relay on the AC side of the inverter and having it  
switch on/off a large diversion load?


For the diversion load I was thinking I could just series up a set  
of water heater elements to get to the necessary voltage.




Has anybody accomplished this before?  Jay?  Are there any other  
elegant solutions for this?




Has anybody successfully used a WindyBoy with hydro?



Best regards,



Mark Dickson,

NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer ™

Oasis Montana Inc.



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[RE-wrenches] Northern Nevada installer

[Randy Brooks]

Fellow Wrenches,

Is there a PV installer in northern Nevada (Gardnerville area) that someone 
could give me contact info for?  My sister lives nearby and is interested in a 
grid tie PV system.

Thanks!

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] SWH - mixing valves

[Randy Brooks]

Kelly,

Although I'm no plumber, I think there is a difference between "mixing valves" 
and "anti-scald valves".  I believe mixing valves don't change with water 
temperature, so it's hard to get consistent water temperature at the faucet 
with varying solar hot water temperature.  I believe anti-scald valves adjust 
cold water input with hot water temperature to prevent an unsafe temperature at 
the faucet.  I'd talk it over with your plumber.

take care,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

> 
> On May 19, 2010, at 2:14 AM, Kelly Keilwitz, Whidbey Sun & Wind wrote:
> 
>> Thermal wrenches,
>> I'm having an ongoing issue with mixing valves in my own system not keeping 
>> a steady mix domestic HW temperature as the tank temperature varies with 
>> solar heating. If I set it for (say) 122˚F mix when the tank is 135˚, it 
>> seems to hold that differential at all tank temps - i.e. when the tank is 
>> hotter the mix is too hot (sometimes dangerously so), and when colder the 
>> mix is too cold for a comfortable shower. Thus, I need to change the setting 
>> all the time.
>> 
>> I'm now using a Honeywell valve with a 90˚ - 145˚ range. This is a 
>> replacement for a valve with a wider range that acted the same way. Any 
>> ideas,  suggestions for better valves, or?
>> 
>> This has me wondering how many of our SWH customers are experiencing a 
>> similar thing, but just aren't bothered enough to say anything. We seem to 
>> have encountered many plumbing situations where the mixing valve allowed 
>> weird backflow or siphoning situations to mess with system operation, 
>> especially with HW recirculation. I thought I had all such causes eliminated 
>> on my system, but maybe not.
>> 
>> Thanks for sharing your experience with such matters.
>> -Kelly
>> 
>> Kelly Keilwitz, P.E.
>> Whidbey Sun & Wind
>> Renewable Energy Systems
>> ke...@whidbeysunwind.com
>> 360-678-7131
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] solar hot water penetration flashing

[Randy Brooks]

I saw a "Retrofit (Wrap-Around) Dektite" flashing in a recent Dynamic Fastener 
catalog just before reading this post.  It looks like it would work for 
replacing a flashing around a continuous pipe.

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jun 9, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Bill Loesch wrote:

> The coolie caps are really just regular (oversized) caps which have been 
> punched out to snugly accommodate the pipe to be sealed. Tom Lane's book, 
> Solar Hot Water Systems, Lessons Learned ..., addresses this sealing method 
> and many more. AET Solar in Jacksonville, FL stocks this item as well as 
> almost anything solar thermal you could want.
>  
> One solution for exposed rubber or (more precisely) the filler bushing seal 
> on the combination metal / flexible insert seal Oatey style flashings is 
> paint. One meticulous homeowner had done that on his '80's vintage system and 
> the flexibility of the seal was just like new. He identified it as latex 
> paint. I would want to be very sure that whatever I used on that flexible 
> material was compatible for many many years since unlike a typical plumbing 
> flashing which can be relatively easily replaced by simply inserting the seal 
> over the end of the vent, the loop of pipe, common with SDHW does not allow 
> that luxury.
>  
> Bill Loesch
> Solar 1 - Saint Louis Solar
> - Original Message -
> From: Nik Ponzio
> To: RE-wrenches
> Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 10:05 AM
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] solar hot water penetration flashing
> 
> This is an on-going problem, apparently. We were getting the coolie cap 
> fittings from EFI but they got out of the solar business recently.
> 
> Does anyone have a source for these now?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> 
> --
> Nicholas Ponzio
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
> 
> Building Energy
> 1570 South Brownell Road
> Williston, VT 05495
> t: 802-859-3384 x15
> f: 802-658-3982
> c: 802-365-1973
> www.BuildingEnergyVT.com
> 
> 
> On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 9:24 PM, Karl Schwingel  
> wrote:
> I use similar boots, and design the penetration so the insulation and wrap ( 
> we use aluminum) nearly cover the whole boot by the time you're all done.  
> you're left with about 1/2" of boot showing all the way around. 
> where can I get the coolie cap style brazed copper flashings?
> 
> karl
> 
> Todd Cory wrote:
> I use accordion style rubber boots. These are typically attached to the 
> roofing with a bead of silicone underneath and gasketed metal roofing screws 
> on top. These are made for all kinds of metal roof penetrations and I have 
> even seen them used for 6" metalbestos stove flues. One note of caution, the 
> orange "high temperature" ones are (I think) rated only to 180 degrees F. so 
> you want to make sure the SHW fluid never exceeds this. Also in time, like 
> any rubber flashing on a roof the rubber will deteriorate from UV. I build a 
> show shed over my system's plumbing which shades it so hopefully this will 
> not be in issue in ~20 years.
> 
> Todd
> 
> 
> 
> 
> troy Harvey wrote:
> Any thoughts on how to flash a copper pipe roof penetration on a metal roof. 
> The brazed copper flashing we typically use would cause corrosion with the 
> steel roof I'm afraid. WHat have others used in this situation?
> 
> Troy Harvey
> -
> Heliocentric
> 801-453-9434
> tahar...@heliocentric.org <mailto:tahar...@heliocentric.org>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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>  
> 
> -- 
> Karl Schwingel
> NABCEP Certified Solar Thermal Installer
> NorthWind Renewable Energy LLC
> 
> PO Box 723 Stevens Point, WI 54481
> k...@northwindre.com
> Cell: 715 209 0446
> Fax : 715 952 4501
> 
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> This e-mail message is confidential, is intended only for the named
> recipient(s) above, and may contain information that is privileged or
> exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this
> message in error, or are not a named recipient(s), you 

[RE-wrenches] Lithium batteries for Polaris Ranger EV

[Randy Brooks]

Jay,

I saw your post on RE-Wrenches, asking about a source for lithium batteries for 
the Polaris Ranger EV utility vehicle.  I’m friends with a Polaris Ranger EV 
owner who recently converted his to lithium.  His contact info is:

Jack Anderson
jma...@prodigy.net <mailto:jma...@prodigy.net>
509-784-1747

Jack can provide you details. 

I helped range test the lithium version.  Very nice.

take care,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Chelan, WA
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com <mailto:ra...@brookssolar.com>


From: jay peltz mailto:jay.pe...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Lithium batteries for Polaris
Date: May 26, 2015 at 7:05:58 PM PDT
To: RE-wrenches mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>>
Reply-To: RE-wrenches mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>>
 
Hi All, 
 
I've got a call about lithium batteries for the battery powered polaris EV 
ranger. 
I've looked but can't find any.  
 
Anybody know of a supplier for this?
 
Sorry in advance if this is supposed to go to marketing.
 
jay
 
peltz power


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Randy Brooks]

I second Jay.  If one string is significantly lower, I’d check each module in 
the string.  Could be a bad module.

Randy

> On May 31, 2015, at 1:23 PM, jay peltz  wrote:
> 
> HI Luke,
> 
> To add here.  I'm unclear if you have measured each string or the whole array 
> at 71v.  
> I would check each string for voc/isc.  
> 
> And then if they are consistent, I agree that putting 2 strings in series 
> with a new controller might help out.  
> You can try it with the MX-60 as you are at only 142v. If it works better 
> then a new higher voltage CC would be required for winter higher voc.
> 
> Let us know what you find out.
> 
> jay
> 
> 
> On 5/31/2015 11:55 AM, Luke Christy wrote:
>> Hello Off-Grid Wrenches,
>> 
>> I recently made a periodic maintenance visit to a residential off-grid 
>> system I take care of here in Southern CO, and discovered an interesting 
>> problem. 
>> 
>> This system has an array of 48x Uni-Solar PVL-68 laminate modules applied 
>> directly to standing-seam metal roofing. 
>> 
>> The data logging on the controller (Outback MX-60) indicated that the system 
>> was having trouble completing a charge cycle and going to float. Initially I 
>> assumed was due to heavy electrical use by the occupants (renters). After a 
>> little checking, I noticed that the module string voltage was only about 
>> 0.5V above the battery voltage! 
>> This was a cool late morning, with full sun, and the array was charging 
>> almost 2kW at 54.5V. The module strings were running at 55V. I've noticed 
>> the module voltage being lower than I'd like before, but it has never been 
>> this low. I suspect this is the real reason the system hasn't been able to 
>> complete a charge cycle.
>> 
>> By removing the loads I was able to get an open-circuit voltage of 71V, but 
>> that still seems pretty low. 
>> 
>> Has anyone else experienced a voltage degradation issue with the Uni-Solar 
>> laminate? What was the expected annual voltage degradation for this 
>> technology? 
>> 
>> These modules do have some age on them. The system was installed about 15 
>> years ago (by a competent installer who is now retired). The system was 
>> installed before MPPT controllers were common, so I assume the modules are 
>> wired in strings of 4 for 48V nominal. 
>> 
>> Any experiences or opinions are appreciated.
>> Thanks in advance. 
>> 
>> -Luke
>> 
>> 
>> Luke Christy
>> 
>>   
> 
> Jay Peltz
> Peltz Power
> jay.pe...@gmail.com 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PVWatts

[Randy Brooks]

The new version just worked for me.  Maybe they fixed it.  I liked v1 but it 
looks like it’s history now.  My bookmark goes only to the new version, which 
seems fine.  I use a MacBook Pro (OS X 10.10.3, and Safari 8.0.6).

Randy

> On Jun 3, 2015, at 9:06 PM, Brian Mehalic  wrote:
> 
> Same deal, multiple computers and browsers, no luck, and no reply to an email 
> about it either. 
> 
> Brian
> 
> On Jun 3, 2015, at 11:02 PM, Gary Willett  > wrote:
> 
>> You're not alone. I tried several times today and it's not working for me 
>> either. I sent a Tweet on #PVWATTS but no response there either. 
>> 
>> Gary Willett
>> Icarus Engineering LLC 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone 5s
>> 
>> On Jun 3, 2015, at 10:56 PM, Kristopher Schmid > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Anyone else notice that the PVWatts website is not working or do i have a 
>>> personal (computer) problem.  I sent feedback to no avail and there is 
>>> nothing on their twitter account about an issue.  When i enter a location, 
>>> it tells me to enter a different location and says that it's loading the 
>>> map, but never does.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Shine On!
>>> 
>>> Kris Schmid
>>> Legacy Solar, LLC
>>> 864 Clam Falls Trail
>>> Frederic, WI 54837
>>> www.legacysolar.com 
>>> 715-653-4295
>>> NABCEP Certified PV Installer
>>> Licensed Wisconsin Master Electrician
>>> BSEE
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Request for Gennie Recommendation

[Randy Brooks]

Allan,

Check out Cummins/Onan units too.  

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jan 9, 2012, at 7:59 PM, Allan Sindelar wrote:

> Wrenches:
> We have cautiously agreed to take on a substantial upgrade and rehabilitation 
> of a poorly designed 48V off-grid system. Our upgrade will include a 
> substantial array addition, battery replacement, and charge controller/safety 
> disconnect replacement. But the immediate need is for a generator. The 6 year 
> old system has worn out two Onan residential standby generators; the second 
> one just now (at winter solstice) has failed completely.
> 
> We expect to keep the two SW5548 inverters. The site is at 7,800' elevation. 
> The fuel must be LP. The customer is willing to pay for a high-quality unit. 
> We expect only to specify or recommend the unit, but not resell it, so 
> there's no profit motivation involved; we just want the best solution..
> 
> I am looking for recommendations of a low-speed, liquid-cooled, commercial- 
> or industrial-grade LP generator, of at least 12kW and preferably around 
> 15kW, with a good reputation for long-term reliability, and that is not 
> designed for home standby use (with phantom-load heaters and controls). It 
> will be located outdoors, so must have a weather enclosure.
> 
> I occasionally am asked to answer this same question by Home Power readers, 
> who assume I know the answer because I wrote a primer on generators for HP 
> awhile back. Truth is, I don't have any good recommendations in this size 
> range, and I'm really hoping that some of you experienced off-grid Wrenches 
> who have done larger systems can help here.
> 
> Thank you,
> Allan
> -- 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@positiveenergysolar.com
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Positive Energy, Inc.
> 3201 Calle Marie
> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
> 505 424-1112
> www.positiveenergysolar.com
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Direct PV-EV charging: possible?

[Randy Brooks]

Allan,

As a EV enthusiast, and RE Wrench, I've also thought of, and fielded questions 
about, direct PV charging an EV. 

- The first issue that usually causes me to not pursue this is getting the most 
power production from the PV array each day.  If the EV is not there, the PV 
array output is not being used.  But it sounds like your customer will have the 
array grid tied when the EV is not present, so PV output is maximized, and 
he/she wants to be able to switch to direct EV charging when the EV is present.

- So the next issue is having an array wired that could both power a grid tie 
inverter, and charge a 300 vDC EV battery pack.  If the grid tie inverter is a 
600v string inverter, and the battery pack charge controller is a high voltage 
string charge controller like the Xantrex 600v PV charge controller, then the 
array could be wired to satisfy both uses.

- The next issue is if the Xantrex 600v PV charge controller be set high enough 
to control charge to a 300v battery pack.  Maybe Xantrex could custom make one 
that could do this, and be adjusted for various battery types.

- If the charge controller can be found, then a manual transfer switch could be 
used to shift array output from the grid tie inverter to the car PV charge 
controller, and back, as desired.

How's that sound?  :)

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Aug 23, 2012, at 6:50 AM, Allan Sindelar wrote:

> Wrenches,
> We have a customer who has built several EVs, and wants to eventually develop 
> a business around them here. A few years ago we installed a GT system on his 
> home. He has now moved and wants to install a system on his new home as well. 
> This time, he'd like to develop a means by which to charge his EV directly 
> from his array, avoiding the inefficiencies of inverting to the grid and then 
> running a grid-based charger. 
> 
> I know of no way to do this, but then, I'm a veggiehead (drive an old 
> Mercedes on waste fryer oil), not an EV aficionado. I suspect that there are 
> folks out there trying to do this, as it's a logical objective. Can anyone 
> suggest products, links, or websites for this customer to explore?
> 
> Here are his notes about this effort:
> ...this is essentially the idea. to use the EV as rolling battery backup to 
> dual-purpose the investment in battery. The second plus is avoiding loss from 
> two inversions dc-ac-dc, the third being relatively high-amp charge without 
> buying another charger! and dual purposing the inverter to avoid cost of 
> high-amp inverter only used for emergencies for a backup. 
> 
> The tech details of EV battery packs that are going to make this a challenge 
> is the high voltage. The DIY pack running DC are going to be 120, 144, 156vDC 
> nominal most commonly. Guys running AC motors and OEMs might run much 
> higher closer to 300v. 
> 
> The charge controller or voltage limit switch needs to be user settable and 
> fairly accurate (+/- 1 volt). The DIY people usually use a 'finish' voltage 
> of 3.65volts / cell being 'done'. So for a 120v nominal system I would want 
> to set the DC charge to come up to 139v and either shut down right then, or 
> if it COULD just hold at 139v until amps drop or a specified time, that would 
> be even better. 
> 
> I am planning to do a grid-tie system at my new house, and yes, the intent is 
> to 'stub-in' capability to both quick-charge the pack direct from the DC side 
> of PV if possible, AND use the car pack as night-time/emergency backup just 
> to show its possible 
> 
> My little car has 12kWhr on board, one I'm working on right now will have 
> 20kWhr onboard.
> Thank you in advance for any assistance.
> Allan
> -- 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@positiveenergysolar.com
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder and Chief Technology Officer
> Positive Energy, Inc.
> 3209 Richards Lane (note new address)
> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
> 505 424-1112
> www.positiveenergysolar.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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[RE-wrenches] Power Panel hybrid PV/thermal

[Randy Brooks]

Fellow Wrenches,

Has anyone worked with or seen first hand the Power Panel hybrid PV/thermal 
module?  www.powerpanel.com

Thanks,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] generator suggestions

[Randy Brooks]

Todd,

We don't sell or install generators, but the only one I recommend for permanent 
installations is the Cummins/Onan, 1,800 rpm, propane fueled.  All others have 
failed early.

Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Jan 29, 2013, at 7:39 PM, toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote:

> wrenches,
> 
> i am working on a design for an off grid camp. they need a new generator as 
> the one they have is a total pos.
> i am interested in suggestions for a commercial grade, 10 to 15 kW propane 
> fueled unit. are kohler and onan still the best thing going or am i living in 
> the past?
> thanks,
> 
> todd
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Finest Planet WebMail.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Finest Planet WebMail.
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Electric car chargers

[Randy Brooks]

William,

I found this on Wikipedia:
Level   Original definition[195]Coulomb Technologies' definition[196]   
Connectors
Level 1 AC energy to the vehicle's on-board charger; from the most common U.S. 
grounded household receptacle, commonly referred to as a 120 volt outlet.   
 120 V AC; 16 A (= 1.92 kW)  SAE J1772 (16.8 kW),
NEMA 5-15
Level 2 AC energy to the vehicle's on-board charger;208 - 240 volt, single 
phase. The maximum current specified is 32 amps (continuous) with a branch 
circuit breaker rated at 40 amps. Maximum continuous input power is specified 
as 7.68 kW (= 240V x 32A*). 208-240 V AC;
12 A - 80 A (= 2.5 - 19.2 kW)   SAE J1772 (16.8 kW),
IEC 62196 (44 kW),
Magne Charge (Obsolete),
Avcon,
IEC 60309 16 A (3.8 kW)
IEC 62198-2 Type2 same as VDE-AR-E 2623-2-2, also known as the Mennekes 
connector (43.5 kW)IEC 62198-2 Type3 also known as Scame
Level 3 DC energy from an off-board charger; there is no minimum energy 
requirement but the maximum current specified is 400 amps and 240 kW continuous 
power supplied. very high voltages (300-600 V DC); very high currents (hundreds 
of Amperes) Magne Charge (Obsolete)
CHΛdeMO (62.5 kW), SAE J1772 Combo, IEC 62196 Mennekes Combo
.* or potentially 208V x 37A, out of the strict specification but within 
circuit breaker and connector/cable power limits. Alternatively, this voltage 
would impose a lower power rating of 6.7 kW at 32A.

Is this what you're looking for?  My Nissan Leaf came with a Level 1 adapter 
cord to plug into any standard 120v outlet.  I installed a Level 2 charger in 
my garage, 240v/30 amp.  The car also has a Level 3 charging port that I've 
used several times at public Level 3 charging stations.

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Feb 22, 2013, at 4:29 PM, William Miller  wrote:

> Friends:
> 
> I would not bother this group with a question I could easily answer for 
> myself with a little research.  I thought I could find the answer to this 
> question on line but it has been very elusive:
> 
> Does anyone know the ratings for the available high power electric car 
> charger?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> 
> William Miller
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Miller Solar
> Voice :805-438-5600
> email: will...@millersolar.com
> http://millersolar.com
> License No. C-10-773985
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] bad battery = system overvoltage = dead inverter

[Randy Brooks]

Has anyone tried using a battery management system (BMS) like those used on 
electric vehicle battery banks?  Here is an example:
http://www.manzanitamicro.com/products?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=87&category_id=22

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 15, 2013, at 8:05 PM, Dan Fink  wrote:

> This has been happening all too frequently here. We live in a big area
> of off grid homes, dozens of systems.
> Lost a customers Trace 2624 this morning; One L-16 in older 24v bank
> opened internally. PV array/MPPT control zorched inverter as soon as
> the sun came up. First indication of problems last nite when customer
> hit microwave to warm up dinner and inverter went crazy. This morning
> the bad battery showed 3.2v (yes, I would expect 2 or 4 also) the rest
> the usual 6+v. Turned on PV array, bad battery immediately up to 11v
> (yes, 6v L16).
> 
> Somebody needs to build a "battery condom" with big stacked diodes on
> a big heat sink or some such solution. A voltage brick wall for system
> charging inputs. MPPT PV controllers do NOT protect a inverter from
> input overvoltage if all or part of the battery bank disappears! And
> last year we saw a nice battery box fire and zorched inverters due to
> similar -- dual 48v L16 strings, one cell failed and opened, other
> string dumped everything into the bad one, smoke and flames. Parallel
> fusing would have stopped that..but not stopped the loss of dual
> stacked XW inverters from PV overvoltage.
> 
> Or am I missing something here?
> 
> Dan Fink,
> Executive Director;
> Otherpower
> Buckville Energy Consulting
> Buckville Publications LLC
> NABCEP / IREC accredited Continuing Education Providers
> 970.672.4342
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Auto Gen on Outback

[Randy Brooks]

Drake,

If the generator has a two wire auto start/stop, then a relay connected to the 
master FX AUX output, that opens and closes the auto start circuit, has worked 
reliably for us on a number of systems.  No need for a GSCM.

Just be sure all the FX charger settings, and MATE AGS settings are as desired. 
 In particular, be sure the DC GENSET is set to "NO", and the VDC GENSTOP is 
set to a high value that will never be reached during normal generator charging 
(the default is high enough).  The VDC GENSTOP will turn off the generator even 
if DC GENSET is set to "NO".  If the value is too low, the normal FX charging 
cycle will be interrupted prematurely.

Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Mar 27, 2013, at 12:51 PM, Drake  
wrote:

> Hello Wrenches,
> 
> We are adding a Generac EcoGen to an existing Outback VFX 3648 system.  It 
> was the recommendations from those of you on this list who have installed 
> them that led to this choice. Your testimonials are very much appreciated.
> 
> I've read, on this list, that people have had issues with FX family inverters 
> starting and stopping generators reliably. The plan was to go with the 
> Atkinson GSCM and a separate voltage controlled relay.  It appears that if 
> the system is 48 volts, it is necessary to center tap the battery bank for a 
> 24 volt feed to the GSCM. This I don't want to do.
> 
> Is it still agreed that the FX inverters are not reliable for starting and 
> stopping generators? 
> 
> Has anyone used a GSCM on a 48 volt system without problems?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Drake 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Drake Chamberlin
> Athens Electric LLC
> OH License 44810
> CO License 3773
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer
> 740-448-7328
> http://athens-electric.com/ 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters

[Randy Brooks]

Have you used a gaus meter 
(http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1365882645&sr=8-2&keywords=gaus+meter)
 to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places?  Might put it in 
perspective.

Randy

On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory  wrote:

> wrenches...
> 
> put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their 
> grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching 
> frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas 
> on how to mitigate it?
> 
> thanks,
> 
> todd
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Re: [RE-wrenches] trouble shooting system with Sun Tie

[Randy Brooks]

Dana,

I thought Xantrex recalled all the ST1500s and replaced them with  
XR2500s.  Mine was, years ago.  You might check with them about this.


Good luck,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Sep 11, 2008, at 3:23 PM, Dana Brandt wrote:


Hi all,

I was called out this week to trouble shoot a system I didn't install.
It's a five year old 1.44kW system with the following: Sun Tie ST 1500
inverter and 12 Astro Power modules. It only produced 634kWh last
year. With our sun here, the shading, orientation, equipment, etc. it
should have produced around 1123kWh.

I've heard a lot about Sun Tie failures, but don't know the details.
What are the common failure modes? Is it likely that a failure of the
Sun Tie would leave it operating, but only producing half what it
should?

When I showed up the system was producing 950W on a relatively sunny
day - seemed pretty reasonable. After restarting the inverter it only
produced around 150W. Is the MPPT very, very slow to find that sweet
spot, or what was going on there?

The system is comprised of three strings of 4 modules each. When I was
there all three strings were producing about the same current, so that
leads me to believe it's not a module failure.

To make things more fun, the modules were installed at two different
orientations. One string is at 38d slope, 30d east of true south,
while the other two are at 36d slope, 75k east of true south. This
certainly has a detrimental impact on the performance, but it doesn't
seem to me that it could account for all of that energy loss.

Thoughts?

Thanks a lot!

Dana

--
Dana Brandt
Ecotech Energy Systems, LLC
www.ecotechenergy.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
360.510.0433
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[RE-wrenches] XL.1 grid tie

[Randy Brooks]

Kurt,

I had a Bergey Xl.1 grid tied through an OutBack GFX2524 for a couple  
years as a demo project at my home/office.  It worked fine.  I did  
not keep track of production because I had it on a 40' tower in a  
poor wind site.  I've since sold the turbine and inverter.  I'm still  
looking for a small replacement demo turbine that I'm comfortable  
recommending to customers.


take care,

Randy Brooks
Brooks Solar, Inc.
Solar Power for People
140 Columbia View
Chelan, WA  98816
509-682-9646
ra...@brookssolar.com
www.BrooksSolar.com

On Dec 23, 2008, at 8:26 AM, Kurt Albershardt wrote:



--On Monday, December 22, 2008 6:23 PM -0500 Roy Butler winds-energy.com> wrote:


In a nutshell.this unit is not ready for prime time yet. Lots  
of bugs and glitches.

Not to mention much lower than expected energy production.


--On Monday, December 22, 2008 5:13 PM -0700 Louis Woofenden  
 wrote:


We've installed a couple of Skystream units here in southern  
Arizona. We know the tilt-up tower works quite well--we've had to  
bring each unit down 2-3 times for various problems with  
electronics. Added to this was SWWP's extremely poor customer  
service. They took several days to even call us back, didn't send  
promised parts, etc. Of course, these two installation sites are  
one and two hours from our shop. We had one customer who was just  
about ready to throw the unit in the back of his truck,

and drive it the five hours up to Flagstaff.


It looks slick, the installation was no problem, but if it doesn't  
work reliably, none of that really matters, in my opinion. I was  
hoping SWWP would get this one right, but I don't think it's there  
yet.


Given the long and well documented SWWP history, I was afraid of this.

Has anyone successfully coupled a Bergey Xl.1 to a grid-tie?   
Anything else to recommend in the 1-5 kW range?



thanks...











Might have something to do with those little fence posts they call  
towers ;-)


And that Smart foundation only works on towers 60' or less.
Too short for most sites and not a good height for energy  
production anyway.


Believe me.most of us would love to see plug and play/ modular  
tower

and turbine systems but there's no such beast yet!

Best advice..take a wait and see approach.

Roy Butler
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
NYSERDA eligible PV & wind installer Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC
8902 Route 46
Arkport, NY 14807
607-324-9747

www.four-winds-energy.com
www.nationalsolarsupply.com

Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, a  
large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.





Kurt Albershardt wrote:
Anyone have realworld experience with the SWWP Skystream 3.7 they  
can

share?

The AnemErgonics foundation kit looks fairly well thought out.






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--
Kurt Albershardt
Eastern Sierra Energy Engineering
Reno, NV
775-853-1800
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