Re: [RE-wrenches] Anyone Able To Contact SWWP? --update--

[Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems]

Update: SWWP also kept the Whisper 100. The 200 and 500 were sold off to 
Luminous India http://www.luminousrenewable.com/. I am told there are some 
problems with quality coming from them.


Larry Crutcher
Starlight Solar Power Systems



On Feb 6, 2013, at 10:05 AM, Larry Crutcher, Starlight Solar Power Systems 
wrote:

Jeremy and All Wind Wrenches,

SWWP is going through some shake-up in the company. People have been laid off. 
They have sold off the Air products to Primus Windpower. 
http://www.primuswindpower.com/ Contact Ken Kotalik (formerly of SWWP) at 
928-607-7034.

They still have the SkyStream but I heard of the other sell offs but I don't 
have all the facts yet. 

Larry Crutcher
Starlight Solar Power Systems






On Feb 6, 2013, at 8:12 AM, Jeremy Rodriguez- All Solar Inc. wrote:

Has anyone been in touch with Southwest Windpower lately? We are trying to 
order a replacement part. No Luck. We have left numerous messages. 
Jeremy
All Solar
Sent via BlackBerry. Sorry for typos and shorthand!
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[RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[August Goers]

Hi Wrenches,



I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard
thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are
various lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or
walk them up a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the majority
of our competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder for
residential projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance of doing
this?



Best,





August

415.559.1525
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[RE-wrenches] Accessibility of Equipment on Roof was Are PV Systems Mechanical Equipment?

[Jason Szumlanski]

While I haven't completely convinced the latest inspector about PV not
being mechanical equipment, I'm running into another issue.

I decided to try out the new Midnite MNPV6-AC combiner for Enphase
circuits. Because there are overcurrent devices inside, the inspector now
insists that NEC 240.24(A) applies and that the enclosure must be readily
accessible, meaning you have to reach it without a ladder. That would seem
to make the MNPV6-AC as a roof mounted solution, or Soladeck combiner
boxes, or any other combiner box incorporating overcurrent protection,
pretty much useless on a pitched roof or flat roof without a permanent
access ladder or hatch.

I'm debating whether to go to battle on this one or just capitulate.

*Jason Szumlanski** *

*Fafco Solar*

*
*

P.S. To answer benn's question, there is no definition of 'mechanical,' but
it does define 'equipment,' and it's clear to me that PV does not fit the
description.

*
*



On Fri, Feb 1, 2013 at 7:58 PM, benn kilburn  wrote:

> Jason,
> Mechanical generally describes 'moving parts'. Is there something in the
> FBC definitions that would cut PV some slack based on this?
> Does it define 'mechanical'?
> Unless I guess in the case of adjustable or tracker arrays, which doesn't
> sound like your issue.
>
> benn
> Sent from a 'smart' phone, with touch screen keys. Please excuse shortcuts
> and typos.
>
> On 2013-01-31, at 1:44 PM, "Jason Szumlanski" 
> wrote:
>
> The Florida Building Code definitions of "equipment" and "appliances" in
> the Mechanical Code do not include solar arrays, yet some building
> officials insist on applying provisions of the mechanical code.
> Specifically, we get quite a few comments about mounting height above the
> roof and permanent access ladders and platforms. What is your experience in
> your state, and do you consider solar arrays to be "mechanical equipment."
>
> (If you have any ammo specific to FBC 2010 that I can use, I'd be happy to
> get your thoughts off-list).
>
> *Jason Szumlanski** *
>
> *Fafco Solar*
>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[Garrison Riegel]

It is not possible to maintain three points of contact at all times while
carrying a module up a ladder.  It is my understanding that if three-point
contact is not possible at all times, then a personal fall arrest system is
required.  This is not called out specifically in Subpart X
 , but if an injury or fatality were to result from carrying modules
up a ladder I think it would be difficult to avoid getting fined or sued.

 

We use a power ladder whenever possible.  It takes a while to set up, but is
OSHA compliant, can lift multiple modules at once, and saves wear and tear
on the crew. The only real issue is upfront cost, but this is cheap when
compared to the long term cost of a workman’s comp claim.

 

My 2¢

 

Garrison

 

Solar Service Inc

847-677-0950

 

 

From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of August Goers
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:44 PM
To: RE-wrenches
Subject: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

 

Hi Wrenches,

 

I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard
thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are various
lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or walk them up
a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the majority of our
competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder for residential
projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance of doing this?

 

Best,

 

 

August

415.559.1525

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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[Eric Youngren]

I agree that its impossible to maintain 3 points of contact on a ladder
while sliding a module up above you.   I've done it many times but I agree
that its probably not kosher according to OSHA.

This reminds me of a product idea I had with a friend who does canvas
sewing for boat covers and such.

How about this?:A heavy-duty canvas bag for carrying PV modules, with
backpack straps and D-rings in the corners?   With a module pack bag,
installers could climb a ladder with both hands while the module is
securely on their back,  Or it could also provide an easy way to tie on a
rope and haul them up, or secure them on a sloped roof before installation.
   How many installers would be interested in something like that??
 How much would you be willing to pay for it?

Eric
Solar Nexus International



On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Garrison Riegel <
garri...@solarserviceinc.com> wrote:

> It is not possible to maintain three points of contact at all times while
> carrying a module up a ladder.  It is my understanding that if three-point
> contact is not possible at all times, then a personal fall arrest system is
> required.  This is not called out specifically in Subpart 
> X,
> but if an injury or fatality were to result from carrying modules up a
> ladder I think it would be difficult to avoid getting fined or sued.
>
> ** **
>
> We use a power ladder whenever possible.  It takes a while to set up, but
> is OSHA compliant, can lift multiple modules at once, and saves wear and
> tear on the crew. The only real issue is upfront cost, but this is cheap
> when compared to the long term cost of a workman’s comp claim.
>
> ** **
>
> My 2¢
>
> ** **
>
> Garrison
>
> ** **
>
> Solar Service Inc
>
> 847-677-0950
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:
> re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *August Goers
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:44 PM
> *To:* RE-wrenches
> *Subject:* [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof
>
> ** **
>
> Hi Wrenches,
>
>  
>
> I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard
> thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are
> various lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or
> walk them up a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the majority
> of our competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder for
> residential projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance of doing
> this?
>
>  
>
> Best,
>
>  
>
>  
>
> August
>
> 415.559.1525
>
> ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[Michael Welch]

Hi gang. Home Power featured a simple, DIY module lift in Issue #143.
Contact me off list if you do not have access to the article and are
interested.
Eric Youngren wrote at 12:51 PM 2/7/2013:
 
I agree that its impossible to
maintain 3 points of contact on a ladder while sliding a module up above
you.   I've done it many times but I agree that its probably
not kosher according to OSHA.   
This reminds me of a product idea I had with a friend who does canvas
sewing for boat covers and such.    
How about this?:    A heavy-duty canvas bag for carrying
PV modules, with backpack straps and D-rings in the corners?  
With a module pack bag, installers could climb a ladder with both hands
while the module is securely on their back,  Or it could also
provide an easy way to tie on a rope and haul them up, or secure them on
a sloped roof before installation.    How many installers
would be interested in something like
that??  How much would you be willing to pay
for it?    
Eric
Solar Nexus International

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Garrison Riegel
<
garri...@solarserviceinc.com> wrote:



It is not possible to maintain three points of contact at all times
while carrying a module up a ladder.  It is my understanding that if
three-point contact is not possible at all times, then a personal fall
arrest system is required.  This is not called out specifically in

Subpart X, but if an injury or fatality were to result from carrying
modules up a ladder I think it would be difficult to avoid getting fined
or sued.

 

We use a power ladder whenever possible.  It takes a while to
set up, but is OSHA compliant, can lift multiple modules at once, and
saves wear and tear on the crew. The only real issue is upfront cost, but
this is cheap when compared to the long term cost of a workman’s comp
claim.

 

My 2¢

 

Garrison

 

Solar Service Inc

847-677-0950

 

 

From:

re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org
[
mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of
August Goers

Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:44 PM

To: RE-wrenches

Subject: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

 

Hi Wrenches,

 

I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good
hard thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are
various lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or
walk them up a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the
majority of our competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder
for residential projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance of
doing this?

 

Best,

 

 

August

415.559.1525

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase "AC Frequency out of Range"

[Kent Osterberg]

  
  
I see in your signal capture that the
  firing angle is earlier than mine so that it doesn't (always) go
  across the zero crossing. From what the utility system operator
  here has told me about their TWACS, the firing angle is adjustable
  from about 5 to 30 degrees before the zero crossing. Supposedly,
  they increase the firing angle to get a stronger signal from sites
  that are hard to reach.
  Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar, Inc.
www.bluemountainsolar.com

  On 2/7/2013 2:13 PM, Nick Soleil wrote:


  

  Hi Kent and Wrenches,

  
  Thanks for sharing that image.  We have some readings that we
  captured with a Hioki Power Quality Analyzer.
  

I have this as a PDF, and can send it to anyone who would like
to see this, but have also attached a .tiff file that meets the
file size requirements of the list.  Send an email to me
off-list if you'd like the PDF.

  

  
  

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Kent
  Osterberg 
  wrote:
  

  The Aclara
TWACS signal that knocks the
Enphase inverters off line is difficult to capture
because it only last a few seconds every time the meter
replies to a ping or data request. I did manage to
capture it using Zelscope
with a long recording time. The attached image shows a
pulse at the zero crossing of the ac waveform; some
crossings don't have a pulse  - I think that is a binary
zero and the pulse represents a one. The pulse does not
change the ac frequency and has only a negligible effect
on the rms ac voltage. However, the time between zero
crossings is not always 16.67 ms.

Messing with the zero crossing like that is an ugly
thing to do to the ac voltage. Many things other than
inverters can be messed up by this. It caused one of my
digital clocks to run fast. Our local utility has had
complaints about numerous other devices that it has
messed up. I've got some SunnyBoy systems with remote
monitoring that don't seem to be bothered by this
signal. The Enphase inverters do not tolerate it. I'm
glad to hear that Enphase is working on a fix and hope
that it is rolled out soon.
Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar, Inc.
www.bluemountainsolar.com

  

   On 2/5/2013 2:38 PM, Nick Soleil
wrote:
  

  
  

  

  

  Hi wrenches,

The frequency out of range issue is being
caused by some utility meter's communication
"ping".  This ping is actually affecting the
utility voltage and frequency, and can be
viewed with a power quality analyzer.  It is
highly likely that this is affecting a wide
variety of utility-interactive inverters,
but is only noticeable with the Enphase
systems; due to the high level of visibility
that our Enlighten monitoring and reporting
provides.
  
  
  

These changes required that the software undergo
a new certification process. We have completed
our CSA certification of the new software, and
are validating it's functionality before pushing
out the solution to our entire population of
microinverters.  We are in the process of beta
testing the software fix, and are hoping to have
this resolved in February.

  
  Thank you for your patience as we work to resolve
  this issue.

  
  On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at
9:24 AM, 
wrote:
Dave,
     It doesn't happen often, and the longest
 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase "AC Frequency out of Range"

[penobscotsolar]

Enphase engineers have contacted my client and will do a preliminary test
of the Enphase fix sometime next week to see if it is effective. They will
be using a Hioki PQA during the testing.  I applaud Enphase for staying on
this and even if this first fix needs some tweaking, I am confident they
will make it work.

Daryl DeJoy
NABCEP Certified PV installer
Penobscot Solar Design


> I see in your signal capture that the firing angle is earlier than mine
> so that it doesn't (always) go across the zero crossing. From what the
> utility system operator here has told me about their TWACS, the firing
> angle is adjustable from about 5 to 30 degrees before the zero crossing.
> Supposedly, they increase the firing angle to get a stronger signal from
> sites that are hard to reach.
>
> Kent Osterberg
> Blue Mountain Solar, Inc.
> www.bluemountainsolar.com
>
> On 2/7/2013 2:13 PM, Nick Soleil wrote:
>> Hi Kent and Wrenches,
>>
>> Thanks for sharing that image.  We have some readings that we captured
>> with a Hioki Power Quality Analyzer.
>>
>> I have this as a PDF, and can send it to anyone who would like to see
>> this, but have also attached a .tiff file that meets the file size
>> requirements of the list.  Send an email to me off-list if you'd like
>> the PDF.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Kent Osterberg > > wrote:
>>
>> The Aclara  TWACS
>>  signal
>> that knocks the Enphase inverters off line is difficult to capture
>> because it only last a few seconds every time the meter replies to
>> a ping or data request. I did manage to capture it using Zelscope
>>  with a long recording time. The
>> attached image shows a pulse at the zero crossing of the ac
>> waveform; some crossings don't have a pulse  - I think that is a
>> binary zero and the pulse represents a one. The pulse does not
>> change the ac frequency and has only a negligible effect on the
>> rms ac voltage. However, the time between zero crossings is not
>> always 16.67 ms.
>>
>> Messing with the zero crossing like that is an ugly thing to do to
>> the ac voltage. Many things other than inverters can be messed up
>> by this. It caused one of my digital clocks to run fast. Our local
>> utility has had complaints about numerous other devices that it
>> has messed up. I've got some SunnyBoy systems with remote
>> monitoring that don't seem to be bothered by this signal. The
>> Enphase inverters do not tolerate it. I'm glad to hear that
>> Enphase is working on a fix and hope that it is rolled out soon.
>>
>> Kent Osterberg
>> Blue Mountain Solar, Inc.
>> www.bluemountainsolar.com  
>>
>> On 2/5/2013 2:38 PM, Nick Soleil wrote:
>>> Hi wrenches,
>>>
>>> The frequency out of range issue is being caused by some utility
>>> meter's communication "ping".  This ping is actually affecting
>>> the utility voltage and frequency, and can be viewed with a power
>>> quality analyzer.  It is highly likely that this is affecting a
>>> wide variety of utility-interactive inverters, but is only
>>> noticeable with the Enphase systems; due to the high level of
>>> visibility that our Enlighten monitoring and reporting provides.
>>>
>>> These changes required that the software undergo a new
>>> certification process. We have completed our CSA certification of
>>> the new software, and are validating it's functionality before
>>> pushing out the solution to our entire population of
>>> microinverters.  We are in the process of beta testing the
>>> software fix, and are hoping to have this resolved in February.
>>>
>>> Thank you for your patience as we work to resolve this issue.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 9:24 AM, >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> Dave,
>>>It doesn't happen often, and the longest I've seen him
>>> stay "down" is
>>> about a half hour, but it seems to get progressively worse as
>>> time goes
>>> on for some reason (initially only the five minutes, but
>>> longer down
>>> times lately). This particular customer is difficult and
>>> picky, to
>>> boot. I hope yours is a bit kinder. Mine seems to think we
>>> did him an
>>> injustice of monumental proportions.
>>>We have had the utility out there logging events, meetings
>>> with the
>>> utility and another solar company in Maine to discuss all
>>> this, and
>>> have kept Enphase in the loop throughout. Enphase has
>>> responded in a
>>> responsible and reasonable manner throughout.
>>>If you want to discuss this with Enphase, call and ask for
>>> Bret. He's
>>> 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Accessibility of Equipment on Roof was Are PV Systems Mechanical Equipment?

[jay peltz]

I'm with your inspector on this.

I don't install fuses or breakers on roofs

jay

peltz power


On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

> While I haven't completely convinced the latest inspector about PV not being 
> mechanical equipment, I'm running into another issue. 
> 
> I decided to try out the new Midnite MNPV6-AC combiner for Enphase circuits. 
> Because there are overcurrent devices inside, the inspector now insists that 
> NEC 240.24(A) applies and that the enclosure must be readily accessible, 
> meaning you have to reach it without a ladder. That would seem to make the 
> MNPV6-AC as a roof mounted solution, or Soladeck combiner boxes, or any other 
> combiner box incorporating overcurrent protection, pretty much useless on a 
> pitched roof or flat roof without a permanent access ladder or hatch. 
> 
> I'm debating whether to go to battle on this one or just capitulate. 
> 
> Jason Szumlanski 
> Fafco Solar
> 
> P.S. To answer benn's question, there is no definition of 'mechanical,' but 
> it does define 'equipment,' and it's clear to me that PV does not fit the 
> description.
> mbers.re-wrenches.org
> 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Accessibility of Equipment on Roof was Are PV Systems Mechanical Equipment?

[Jason Szumlanski]

Jay,

I assume you mean pitched roofs, or not readily accessible flat roofs. This
particular project happens to be a flat commercial roof, but with no
permanent ladder or hatch. I really didn't have to use the MNPV6-AC's, but
it made sense in this case (excluding the access issue).

Looks like my options are to remove the combiners or install a permanent
access. Neither are fun options. Live and learn...

*Jason Szumlanski** *

*Fafco Solar*



On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:27 PM, jay peltz  wrote:

> I'm with your inspector on this.
>
> I don't install fuses or breakers on roofs
>
> jay
>
> peltz power
>
>
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:
>
> While I haven't completely convinced the latest inspector about PV not
> being mechanical equipment, I'm running into another issue.
>
> I decided to try out the new Midnite MNPV6-AC combiner for Enphase
> circuits. Because there are overcurrent devices inside, the inspector now
> insists that NEC 240.24(A) applies and that the enclosure must be readily
> accessible, meaning you have to reach it without a ladder. That would seem
> to make the MNPV6-AC as a roof mounted solution, or Soladeck combiner
> boxes, or any other combiner box incorporating overcurrent protection,
> pretty much useless on a pitched roof or flat roof without a permanent
> access ladder or hatch.
>
> I'm debating whether to go to battle on this one or just capitulate.
>
> *Jason Szumlanski** *
> *Fafco Solar*
> *
> *
> P.S. To answer benn's question, there is no definition of 'mechanical,'
> but it does define 'equipment,' and it's clear to me that PV does not fit
> the description.
> mbers.re-wrenches.org
>
>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Accessibility of Equipment on Roof was Are PV Systems Mechanical Equipment?

[Dan Fink]

Might be a good application for the Midnite Disconnecting Combiners, with
the control unit on the ground.

-- 
Dan Fink,
Executive Director;
Otherpower
Buckville Energy Consulting
Buckville Publications LLC
NABCEP / IREC accredited Continuing Education Providers
970.672.4342 (voicemail)

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

> Jay,
>
> I assume you mean pitched roofs, or not readily accessible flat roofs.
> This particular project happens to be a flat commercial roof, but with no
> permanent ladder or hatch. I really didn't have to use the MNPV6-AC's, but
> it made sense in this case (excluding the access issue).
>
> Looks like my options are to remove the combiners or install a permanent
> access. Neither are fun options. Live and learn...
>
> *Jason Szumlanski** *
>
> *Fafco Solar*
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:27 PM, jay peltz  wrote:
>
>> I'm with your inspector on this.
>>
>> I don't install fuses or breakers on roofs
>>
>> jay
>>
>> peltz power
>>
>>
>> On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:
>>
>> While I haven't completely convinced the latest inspector about PV not
>> being mechanical equipment, I'm running into another issue.
>>
>> I decided to try out the new Midnite MNPV6-AC combiner for Enphase
>> circuits. Because there are overcurrent devices inside, the inspector now
>> insists that NEC 240.24(A) applies and that the enclosure must be readily
>> accessible, meaning you have to reach it without a ladder. That would seem
>> to make the MNPV6-AC as a roof mounted solution, or Soladeck combiner
>> boxes, or any other combiner box incorporating overcurrent protection,
>> pretty much useless on a pitched roof or flat roof without a permanent
>> access ladder or hatch.
>>
>> I'm debating whether to go to battle on this one or just capitulate.
>>
>> *Jason Szumlanski** *
>> *Fafco Solar*
>> *
>> *
>> P.S. To answer benn's question, there is no definition of 'mechanical,'
>> but it does define 'equipment,' and it's clear to me that PV does not fit
>> the description.
>> mbers.re-wrenches.org
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> List sponsored by Home Power magazine
>>
>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
>>
>> Options & settings:
>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[August Goers]

Eric and Garrison -



Yea, I see your point. I was questioning the ladder method because walking
modules up the ladder seems to be the standard for roofs 2 stories or
higher. I thought maybe some folks had a different interpretation. I'm
particularly interested in seeing what Solar City is doing these days.



Eric, I like the big tote bag/backpack idea. I believe it's been discussed
on the wrenches list before so you might want to do a quick search. Schuco
used to sell a collector strap kit for solar thermal collectors but it was
designed more for hoisting. We just installed a 30 collector system with it
(not Schuco collectors though!) a few weeks ago.



Best,



August



*From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:
re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *Eric Youngren
*Sent:* Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:51 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof



I agree that its impossible to maintain 3 points of contact on a ladder
while sliding a module up above you.   I've done it many times but I agree
that its probably not kosher according to OSHA.



This reminds me of a product idea I had with a friend who does canvas
sewing for boat covers and such.



How about this?:A heavy-duty canvas bag for carrying PV modules, with
backpack straps and D-rings in the corners?   With a module pack bag,
installers could climb a ladder with both hands while the module is
securely on their back,  Or it could also provide an easy way to tie on a
rope and haul them up, or secure them on a sloped roof before installation.
   How many installers would be interested in something like that??
 How much would you be willing to pay for it?



Eric

Solar Nexus International





On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Garrison Riegel <
garri...@solarserviceinc.com> wrote:

It is not possible to maintain three points of contact at all times while
carrying a module up a ladder.  It is my understanding that if three-point
contact is not possible at all times, then a personal fall arrest system is
required.  This is not called out specifically in Subpart
X,
but if an injury or fatality were to result from carrying modules up a
ladder I think it would be difficult to avoid getting fined or sued.



We use a power ladder whenever possible.  It takes a while to set up, but
is OSHA compliant, can lift multiple modules at once, and saves wear and
tear on the crew. The only real issue is upfront cost, but this is cheap
when compared to the long term cost of a workman’s comp claim.



My 2¢



Garrison



Solar Service Inc

847-677-0950





*From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:
re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *August Goers
*Sent:* Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:44 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof



Hi Wrenches,



I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard
thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are
various lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, or
walk them up a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the majority
of our competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder for
residential projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance of doing
this?



Best,





August

415.559.1525


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Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

[Ray Walters]

Several types of lifts are available at rental yards.  We've used a hand 
crank type air conditioner lift to move 8 modules up at a time.  For 
anything over 10 modules, its really a good idea to use something 
besides a man on a ladder, especially with today's larger modules.


--
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified, Licensed Contractor
808 269-7491

On 2/7/2013 5:15 PM, August Goers wrote:


Eric and Garrison -

Yea, I see your point. I was questioning the ladder method because 
walking modules up the ladder seems to be the standard for roofs 2 
stories or higher. I thought maybe some folks had a different 
interpretation. I'm particularly interested in seeing what Solar City 
is doing these days.


Eric, I like the big tote bag/backpack idea. I believe it's been 
discussed on the wrenches list before so you might want to do a quick 
search. Schuco used to sell a collector strap kit for solar thermal 
collectors but it was designed more for hoisting. We just installed a 
30 collector system with it (not Schuco collectors though!) a few 
weeks ago.


Best,

August

*From:*re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
] *On Behalf Of 
*Eric Youngren

*Sent:* Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:51 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

I agree that its impossible to maintain 3 points of contact on a 
ladder while sliding a module up above you.   I've done it many times 
but I agree that its probably not kosher according to OSHA.


This reminds me of a product idea I had with a friend who does canvas 
sewing for boat covers and such.


How about this?:A heavy-duty canvas bag for carrying PV modules, 
with backpack straps and D-rings in the corners?   With a module pack 
bag, installers could climb a ladder with both hands while the module 
is securely on their back,  Or it could also provide an easy way to 
tie on a rope and haul them up, or secure them on a sloped roof before 
installation.How many installers would be interested in something 
like that??  How much would you be willing to pay for it?


Eric

Solar Nexus International

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 12:03 PM, Garrison Riegel 
mailto:garri...@solarserviceinc.com>> 
wrote:


It is not possible to maintain three points of contact at all times 
while carrying a module up a ladder. It is my understanding that if 
three-point contact is not possible at all times, then a personal fall 
arrest system is required.  This is not called out specifically in 
Subpart X 
, 
but if an injury or fatality were to result from carrying modules up a 
ladder I think it would be difficult to avoid getting fined or sued.


We use a power ladder whenever possible.  It takes a while to set up, 
but is OSHA compliant, can lift multiple modules at once, and saves 
wear and tear on the crew. The only real issue is upfront cost, but 
this is cheap when compared to the long term cost of a workman's comp 
claim.


My 2¢

Garrison

Solar Service Inc

847-677-0950 

*From:*re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
 
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org 
] *On Behalf Of 
*August Goers

*Sent:* Thursday, February 07, 2013 12:44 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* [RE-wrenches] getting PV modules up to the roof

Hi Wrenches,

I imagine that all of us working in rooftop PV have put some good hard 
thought on the best way to get the modules up to the roof. There are 
various lifts on the market, you can hoist them with ropes manually, 
or walk them up a ladder (sling them over your back). I find that the 
majority of our competition in the Bay Area walks panels up the ladder 
for residential projects. What is your feeling about OSHA compliance 
of doing this?


Best,

August

415.559.1525 




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Accessibility of Equipment on Roof was Are PV Systems Mechanical Equipment?

[jay peltz]

Hi Jason,

Is it possible to install them on the side of a building?
And Dan's suggestion for the remote midnite might be perfect.

jay


On Feb 7, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

> Jay,
> 
> I assume you mean pitched roofs, or not readily accessible flat roofs. This 
> particular project happens to be a flat commercial roof, but with no 
> permanent ladder or hatch. I really didn't have to use the MNPV6-AC's, but it 
> made sense in this case (excluding the access issue).
> 
> Looks like my options are to remove the combiners or install a permanent 
> access. Neither are fun options. Live and learn...
> 
> Jason Szumlanski 
> Fafco Solar
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:27 PM, jay peltz  wrote:
> I'm with your inspector on this.
> 
> I don't install fuses or breakers on roofs
> 
> jay
> 
> peltz power
> 
> 
> On Feb 7, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote:
> 
>> While I haven't completely convinced the latest inspector about PV not being 
>> mechanical equipment, I'm running into another issue. 
>> 
>> I decided to try out the new Midnite MNPV6-AC combiner for Enphase circuits. 
>> Because there are overcurrent devices inside, the inspector now insists that 
>> NEC 240.24(A) applies and that the enclosure must be readily accessible, 
>> meaning you have to reach it without a ladder. That would seem to make the 
>> MNPV6-AC as a roof mounted solution, or Soladeck combiner boxes, or any 
>> other combiner box incorporating overcurrent protection, pretty much useless 
>> on a pitched roof or flat roof without a permanent access ladder or hatch. 
>> 
>> I'm debating whether to go to battle on this one or just capitulate. 
>> 
>> Jason Szumlanski 
>> Fafco Solar
>> 
>> P.S. To answer benn's question, there is no definition of 'mechanical,' but 
>> it does define 'equipment,' and it's clear to me that PV does not fit the 
>> description.
>> mbers.re-wrenches.org
>> 
> 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Simplified permit process

[Andrew Truitt]

One more: the SunRun report on the impact of local permitting on the cost
of solar:

http://www.sunrunhome.com/solar-lease/cost-of-solar/local-permitting/?utm_source=Solar+Citizen%3A+Issue+2+-+2%2F1%2F13&utm_campaign=Solar+Citizen&utm_medium=email


I know these aren't short articles, but they are generally well-supported
and defensible documents that should bolster your argument.  I've been
working on this a little bit lately with Solar 3.0 so feel free to call me
to discuss.



For a brighter energy future,


Andrew Truitt
NABCEP Certified PV Installer™ (ID# 032407-66)

Principal
Truitt Renewable Energy Consulting, LLC

(202) 486-7507

LinkedIn Profile 

Company Website 
 <%28202%29%20486-7507>




"Don't get me wrong: I love nuclear energy! It's just that I prefer fusion
to fission. And it just so happens that there's an enormous fusion reactor
safely banked a few million miles from us. It delivers more than we could
ever use in just about 8 minutes. And it's wireless!"

~William McDonough






On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 11:21 PM, Andrew Truitt  wrote:

> Allan - Check out the Resources section on the Solar 3.0 Permitting page:
>
> http://solar30.org/toolbox/permitting/
>
>
> You might also want to check out the DOE's "Solar Powering Your Community"
> document:
>
> http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/pdfs/47692.pdf
>
>
> And this page has a decent graphic breaking down BOS soft costs:
>
> http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/sunshot/nonhardware_costs.html
>
>
> And if you want more info / help one of these guys (like the Arizona team
> or the Optiny team) might be interested:
>
> http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/sunshot/rooftop_challenge.html
>
>
>
> For a brighter energy future,
>
>
> Andrew Truitt
> NABCEP Certified PV Installer™ (ID# 032407-66)
>
> Principal
> Truitt Renewable Energy Consulting, LLC
>
> (202) 486-7507
>
> LinkedIn Profile 
>
> Company Website 
>  <%28202%29%20486-7507>
>
>
>
>
> "Don't get me wrong: I love nuclear energy! It's just that I prefer fusion
> to fission. And it just so happens that there's an enormous fusion reactor
> safely banked a few million miles from us. It delivers more than we could
> ever use in just about 8 minutes. And it's wireless!"
>
> ~William McDonough
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 6:17 PM, Allan Sindelar <
> al...@positiveenergysolar.com> wrote:
>
>>  A bill has been introduced in our 60-day state legislative session to
>> direct our statewide licensing agency to develop a consistent set of
>> permitting standards for PV systems. Like many states, we suffer a
>> confusing matrix of differing local standards, costs and requirements. I
>> would like to testify at a legislative committee hearing in favor of a
>> common standard.
>>
>> We have our own matrix spreadsheet, and we have the Solar ABCs' Expedited
>> Process as developed by Bill Brooks and others. What I'm looking for are
>> links to the best short, nontechnical and easily read articles about how
>> the permit process has become a large portion of the cost of all PV
>> systems, how it's holding back the adoption and growth of PV, how the Obama
>> administration has recognized this as one of the structural barriers to
>> more renewables adoption, and the like. The best I can find will get
>> printed out and given to the legislators.
>>
>> I have seen many of these articles, on Renewable Energy World and other
>> media, but have never saved them, of course. That's why I'm asking for this
>> assistance. Many of us are facing the same issues in our jurisdictions.
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Allan
>> --
>> *Allan Sindelar*
>> *al...@positiveenergysolar.com* 
>> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
>> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
>> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
>> Founder and Chief Technology Officer
>> *Positive Energy, Inc.*
>> 3209 Richards Lane (note new address)
>> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
>> *505 424-1112*
>> *www.positiveenergysolar.com* 
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>>
>> ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Simplified permit process

[Andrew Truitt]

Allan - Check out the Resources section on the Solar 3.0 Permitting page:

http://solar30.org/toolbox/permitting/


You might also want to check out the DOE's "Solar Powering Your Community"
document:

http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/pdfs/47692.pdf


And this page has a decent graphic breaking down BOS soft costs:

http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/sunshot/nonhardware_costs.html


And if you want more info / help one of these guys (like the Arizona team
or the Optiny team) might be interested:

http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/sunshot/rooftop_challenge.html



For a brighter energy future,


Andrew Truitt
NABCEP Certified PV Installer™ (ID# 032407-66)

Principal
Truitt Renewable Energy Consulting, LLC

(202) 486-7507

LinkedIn Profile 

Company Website 
 <%28202%29%20486-7507>




"Don't get me wrong: I love nuclear energy! It's just that I prefer fusion
to fission. And it just so happens that there's an enormous fusion reactor
safely banked a few million miles from us. It delivers more than we could
ever use in just about 8 minutes. And it's wireless!"

~William McDonough







On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 6:17 PM, Allan Sindelar <
al...@positiveenergysolar.com> wrote:

>  A bill has been introduced in our 60-day state legislative session to
> direct our statewide licensing agency to develop a consistent set of
> permitting standards for PV systems. Like many states, we suffer a
> confusing matrix of differing local standards, costs and requirements. I
> would like to testify at a legislative committee hearing in favor of a
> common standard.
>
> We have our own matrix spreadsheet, and we have the Solar ABCs' Expedited
> Process as developed by Bill Brooks and others. What I'm looking for are
> links to the best short, nontechnical and easily read articles about how
> the permit process has become a large portion of the cost of all PV
> systems, how it's holding back the adoption and growth of PV, how the Obama
> administration has recognized this as one of the structural barriers to
> more renewables adoption, and the like. The best I can find will get
> printed out and given to the legislators.
>
> I have seen many of these articles, on Renewable Energy World and other
> media, but have never saved them, of course. That's why I'm asking for this
> assistance. Many of us are facing the same issues in our jurisdictions.
>
> Thank you,
> Allan
> --
> *Allan Sindelar*
> *al...@positiveenergysolar.com* 
> NABCEP Certified Photovoltaic Installer
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder and Chief Technology Officer
> *Positive Energy, Inc.*
> 3209 Richards Lane (note new address)
> Santa Fe, New Mexico 87507
> *505 424-1112*
> *www.positiveenergysolar.com* 
>
> *
> *
>
>
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