[RBW] Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Ed Fausto]

After a long wait, I finally received my GBW with 27.5 x 2.6" Bontrager XR2 
tires.
Ever since I became a fan of Rivendell, I have been a fender convert mostly 
using SKS fenders.

Looking at the tire clearances of my GBW, it seems I do not have enough 
space to install fenders.

Anyone who has installed fenders with these hilly bikes?

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[RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

Well that's quite the fascinating list. So the Platypus (and Cheviot and 
Betty Foy) are Mixte Sports! But now we need a name for my custom which is 
sorta like the Rosco "Mountain Mixte", and I would include the Gus/Susie in 
there, too. They have dropped toptubes compared to a traditional diamond 
frame, but it's more in the range of modern mountain bikes if you imagined 
that those frames had taller seattubes holding shorter posts. I had a 
German ebike with a "mid-dropped" tube they called Low-Step, and Velo 
Orange has a Low Kicker now. But we need something cooler, and the more 
French and harder to spell the better. Your move, Philip!

Joe "yes, it's a trip-thru when I do it" Bernard

On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 11:40:12 PM UTC-8 Philip Williamson wrote:

> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
> not all frames are mixtes 
> .”
>
> To my eye, the Clem L design starts out as an “Anglais,” and kicks in a 
> little “col de cigne” at the seat tube, for style.
>
> Philip
> Santa Rosa, CA 
>
> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 8:07:56 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>
>> This is not correct. A mixte is not a step through. Because, at least 
>> without serious contortions for a normal person, you can't step through it. 
>> They are two separate designs. A mixte can more easily accomodate certain 
>> clothing choices, and with more clearance allow for sliding off the saddle 
>> for frequent stopping in city traffic. Can also be mounted similar to a 
>> step through if you lean it enough or step like a Rockette.
>>
>> Step throughs do not have the same triangulation found in a diamond 
>> frame, or even a mixte. (This is also why mixtes with twin, side by side 
>> skinny top tubes are often rather noodley in larger sizes and/or carrying 
>> loads.) Start using very light tubing on a step through, and you will start 
>> to introduce a bad kind of flex--especially if you want to carry a thing or 
>> two, which is part of the point of a Clem L, no? A loaded 59cm Clem L 
>> apparently verges on this unwanted flexing, according to reports out of 
>> Rivendell during the early days of the Clems.
>>
>> Even if you designed it using the same tubing as a Susie, by the time you 
>> add everything back on, you will hardly have made a difference in terms of 
>> ride response, other than to possibly introduce  unwanted flexing under 
>> load. Unlike peanut butter and chocolate, some combinations are just not 
>> meant to be; they are contradictory by their very nature. Learn to mount 
>> the Platypus like a regular diamond frame until you hit your 70s or 80s, or 
>> practice leaning it away from you before performing the step through. In 
>> any case, I suspect it's those big ole cowgirl boots causing the problem;^)
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:56:42 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Kai, 
>>>
>>> I think the whole mixte/step-through thing can get convoluted and 
>>> confusing because a lot of frames we nominally call mixtes apparently 
>>> aren't. I believe - I could be wrong - the only true mixte is the Platypus 
>>> frame style (also Purple Riv Ana's) where the dropped toptube meets a third 
>>> set of stays that travel all the way to the rear of the frame. Therefore 
>>> your Rosco Mixte and my Riv Custom Mixte are really step-throughs. But mine 
>>> is higher than the Platypus mixte and Clem L step-through so what the heck 
>>> do you call *that?*
>>>
>>> What I *think* Leah is asking is if there's ever been a Riv Custom 
>>> step-through with a really low toptube, and I can't remember one. But it 
>>> sure would be sweet, it could be done with a combination of lugs and fillet 
>>> joints just like mine got. Check out the pic and imagine my toptube was 
>>> dropped way lower, then did that nice Clemmy curve at the bottom to meet 
>>> the seattube with a fillet weld. Someone should order this! I'll bet it 
>>> would look great in Raspberry Metallic 😉
>>>
>>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 8:24:05 PM UTC-8 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Where does step through start? I consider my Rosco mountain a step 
 through, but I do need to lift my leg a bit. I think Clem L is lower, but 
 I've never swung a leg through one.
 -Kai

 On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:21:14 PM UTC-5 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn 
 NY wrote:

> There's a famous one in Seattle, it's purple. Maybe not step through 
> enough? Pretty step through though..
> -Kai
>
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:06:41 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>> You know I’m a Clem-lover, and mine took me through the worst days of 
>> my life this last year. It’s nearly perfect and has only one tiny flaw - 
>> it’s a bit heavy/overbuilt for a woman my size. I’m also a Platypus 
>> lover, 
>> and

[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Joe Bernard]

I have a Susie/Wolbis with 27.5 x 2.25 Thunder Burts. I have SKS P65 
fenders which I have test-fitted but not mounted and it looks like it'll 
work but it's close. The max tire for these frames is 2.8 and unfortunately 
I think you're going to have to drop down closer to what I'm using to get 
full fenders in that space, too. Another option is to get those half-fender 
things that mountain bikers use, PDW has some options there. 

Joe Bernard

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:14:58 AM UTC-8 Ed Fausto wrote:

> After a long wait, I finally received my GBW with 27.5 x 2.6" Bontrager 
> XR2 tires.
> Ever since I became a fan of Rivendell, I have been a fender convert 
> mostly using SKS fenders.
>
> Looking at the tire clearances of my GBW, it seems I do not have enough 
> space to install fenders.
>
> Anyone who has installed fenders with these hilly bikes?
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Ed Fausto]

Hi Joe,
Looks like its a choice between a 27.5 plus tire versus fender with smaller 
tires.
I will first try the half-fender you suggested.
Thanks.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:46:49 PM UTC+8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I have a Susie/Wolbis with 27.5 x 2.25 Thunder Burts. I have SKS P65 
> fenders which I have test-fitted but not mounted and it looks like it'll 
> work but it's close. The max tire for these frames is 2.8 and unfortunately 
> I think you're going to have to drop down closer to what I'm using to get 
> full fenders in that space, too. Another option is to get those half-fender 
> things that mountain bikers use, PDW has some options there. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:14:58 AM UTC-8 Ed Fausto wrote:
>
>> After a long wait, I finally received my GBW with 27.5 x 2.6" Bontrager 
>> XR2 tires.
>> Ever since I became a fan of Rivendell, I have been a fender convert 
>> mostly using SKS fenders.
>>
>> Looking at the tire clearances of my GBW, it seems I do not have enough 
>> space to install fenders.
>>
>> Anyone who has installed fenders with these hilly bikes?
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

You're on the wrong list advocating for French spelling, since RBW does not 
even spell derailleur correctly (that's mostly in tribute to SB).
I'm not going to argue what is a mixte vs. what is a step through. If you 
want to call your mixte a step through (do people who claim this even have 
a mixte?) by all means, knock yourself out. Over the history of the many 
variations of bicycle frames, certain ones have stuck and been referred to 
in certain ways. If you want to cancel that, oh well.

To the matter of construction, if you go to the Rivendell page for brakes, 
you will read this:
*Don't go to the Hof Brau if you're a vegan, and don't shop for disc brakes 
here. *

And you might want to add, don't shop there for the lightest bicycles, 
custom or not. It's just not their thing, it doesn't jive with how they see 
the best use of bicycles. Striving for light weight as even a secondary 
goal is against the all purpose utility of a Rivendell. (I also suspect 
Grant was put off a bit by the tendency of some MB-0 bikes to not hold up 
well under hard use. But that is total conjecture and speculation.)

Here is another Rivendell quote, from the Susie/Wolbis description:
*The frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.*

So now put on racks, fenders, lights, bags, snacks, water bottle. Are you 
going to be able to toss around one more easily than the other.? Will you 
notice the difference taking it off a car rack? Let me tell you that the 
Susie is no gossamer lightweight. These are Rivendells. They are Rivendell 
Hillibikes. It's all relative. This is OS tubing and it is not thinwall. 

Yeah, there are custom builders who will build you a beautiful lightweight 
mixte. Bryan of Royal H. Cycles in Boston built one to Lovely 
Bicycle/Veloria/Constance's specs a decade ago.  (It was for sale for a 
long time on ebay, but whatever her motivation for selling, she certainly 
loved it initially. From her blog: *It is freakishly light, and 
luxuriously, almost abnormally comfortable while at the same time being 
faster and more responsive than any upright bicycle I have ridden before. 
It is more responsive than the vintage mixte, "Marianne," I used to own, 
which I had complained was "twitchy". * )But that is a mixte, not a step 
through. I'm not sure how many builders would be willing or able to tackle 
a step-through. I don't know if they could bend lightweight tubing into the 
necessary shapes. Even if they could, I suspect they would decline due to 
potential for not such a great ride as discussed above.

Mark in Beacon currently with four mixtes, the best step through in the 
world (*El Clem* of course), and a SusieSwoop.
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:20:59 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Well that's quite the fascinating list. So the Platypus (and Cheviot and 
> Betty Foy) are Mixte Sports! But now we need a name for my custom which is 
> sorta like the Rosco "Mountain Mixte", and I would include the Gus/Susie in 
> there, too. They have dropped toptubes compared to a traditional diamond 
> frame, but it's more in the range of modern mountain bikes if you imagined 
> that those frames had taller seattubes holding shorter posts. I had a 
> German ebike with a "mid-dropped" tube they called Low-Step, and Velo 
> Orange has a Low Kicker now. But we need something cooler, and the more 
> French and harder to spell the better. Your move, Philip!
>
> Joe "yes, it's a trip-thru when I do it" Bernard
>
> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 11:40:12 PM UTC-8 Philip Williamson wrote:
>
>> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
>> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
>> not all frames are mixtes 
>> 
>> .”
>>
>> To my eye, the Clem L design starts out as an “Anglais,” and kicks in a 
>> little “col de cigne” at the seat tube, for style.
>>
>> Philip
>> Santa Rosa, CA 
>>
>> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 8:07:56 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>> This is not correct. A mixte is not a step through. Because, at least 
>>> without serious contortions for a normal person, you can't step through it. 
>>> They are two separate designs. A mixte can more easily accomodate certain 
>>> clothing choices, and with more clearance allow for sliding off the saddle 
>>> for frequent stopping in city traffic. Can also be mounted similar to a 
>>> step through if you lean it enough or step like a Rockette.
>>>
>>> Step throughs do not have the same triangulation found in a diamond 
>>> frame, or even a mixte. (This is also why mixtes with twin, side by side 
>>> skinny top tubes are often rather noodley in larger sizes and/or carrying 
>>> loads.) Start using very light tubing on a step through, and you will start 
>>> to introduce a bad kind of flex--especially if you want to carry a thing or 
>>> two, which is part of the point of a Clem L, no? A loaded 59cm Clem L 
>>> appa

[RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

I also have a Berceau mixte. Awaiting a complete redo this spring, 
including paint. Using Philip's rating system, definitely this one would be 
Hot.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:00:30 AM UTC-5 Mark Roland wrote:

> You're on the wrong list advocating for French spelling, since RBW does 
> not even spell derailleur correctly (that's mostly in tribute to SB).
> I'm not going to argue what is a mixte vs. what is a step through. If you 
> want to call your mixte a step through (do people who claim this even have 
> a mixte?) by all means, knock yourself out. Over the history of the many 
> variations of bicycle frames, certain ones have stuck and been referred to 
> in certain ways. If you want to cancel that, oh well.
>
> To the matter of construction, if you go to the Rivendell page for brakes, 
> you will read this:
> *Don't go to the Hof Brau if you're a vegan, and don't shop for disc 
> brakes here. *
>
> And you might want to add, don't shop there for the lightest bicycles, 
> custom or not. It's just not their thing, it doesn't jive with how they see 
> the best use of bicycles. Striving for light weight as even a secondary 
> goal is against the all purpose utility of a Rivendell. (I also suspect 
> Grant was put off a bit by the tendency of some MB-0 bikes to not hold up 
> well under hard use. But that is total conjecture and speculation.)
>
> Here is another Rivendell quote, from the Susie/Wolbis description:
> *The frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.*
>
> So now put on racks, fenders, lights, bags, snacks, water bottle. Are you 
> going to be able to toss around one more easily than the other.? Will you 
> notice the difference taking it off a car rack? Let me tell you that the 
> Susie is no gossamer lightweight. These are Rivendells. They are Rivendell 
> Hillibikes. It's all relative. This is OS tubing and it is not thinwall. 
>
> Yeah, there are custom builders who will build you a beautiful lightweight 
> mixte. Bryan of Royal H. Cycles in Boston built one to Lovely 
> Bicycle/Veloria/Constance's specs a decade ago.  (It was for sale for a 
> long time on ebay, but whatever her motivation for selling, she certainly 
> loved it initially. From her blog: *It is freakishly light, and 
> luxuriously, almost abnormally comfortable while at the same time being 
> faster and more responsive than any upright bicycle I have ridden before. 
> It is more responsive than the vintage mixte, "Marianne," I used to own, 
> which I had complained was "twitchy". * )But that is a mixte, not a step 
> through. I'm not sure how many builders would be willing or able to tackle 
> a step-through. I don't know if they could bend lightweight tubing into the 
> necessary shapes. Even if they could, I suspect they would decline due to 
> potential for not such a great ride as discussed above.
>
> Mark in Beacon currently with four mixtes, the best step through in the 
> world (*El Clem* of course), and a SusieSwoop.
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:20:59 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Well that's quite the fascinating list. So the Platypus (and Cheviot and 
>> Betty Foy) are Mixte Sports! But now we need a name for my custom which is 
>> sorta like the Rosco "Mountain Mixte", and I would include the Gus/Susie in 
>> there, too. They have dropped toptubes compared to a traditional diamond 
>> frame, but it's more in the range of modern mountain bikes if you imagined 
>> that those frames had taller seattubes holding shorter posts. I had a 
>> German ebike with a "mid-dropped" tube they called Low-Step, and Velo 
>> Orange has a Low Kicker now. But we need something cooler, and the more 
>> French and harder to spell the better. Your move, Philip!
>>
>> Joe "yes, it's a trip-thru when I do it" Bernard
>>
>> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 11:40:12 PM UTC-8 Philip Williamson wrote:
>>
>>> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
>>> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
>>> not all frames are mixtes 
>>> 
>>> .”
>>>
>>> To my eye, the Clem L design starts out as an “Anglais,” and kicks in a 
>>> little “col de cigne” at the seat tube, for style.
>>>
>>> Philip
>>> Santa Rosa, CA 
>>>
>>> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 8:07:56 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>>
 This is not correct. A mixte is not a step through. Because, at least 
 without serious contortions for a normal person, you can't step through 
 it. 
 They are two separate designs. A mixte can more easily accomodate certain 
 clothing choices, and with more clearance allow for sliding off the saddle 
 for frequent stopping in city traffic. Can also be mounted similar to a 
 step through if you lean it enough or step like a Rockette.

 Step throughs do not have the same triangulation found in a diamond 
 frame, or even a mixte. (This is also why mixte

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA]

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> …
> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my boys 
> were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill stood 
> between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike with 
> gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every day, 
> while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 inch 
> Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no thought 
> into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced here. That 
> day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill and beat us 
> all from that day forward. 
>
> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
> It’s easy and it’s fun. …
>

You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't 
really make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a 
bike ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I 
can't usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I 
have to shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch 
and pass men on road bikes because you're on a Platypus can't really be 
supported by physics, if indeed weight is the only differentiator. I also 
suspect you may be severely underestimating the concept of placebos and 
that extra 100 watts a new bike can bring. :)

I'm fortunate enough to have too many bikes, from lightweight, mostly 
carbon+titanium wonders that'll probably float away with a strong breeze, 
to my stout Atlantis that weighs more than my Wilbury (here's the mixte 
reference for relevance!) because it has front-rear racks, full stainless 
fenders, basket, dynamo lights, and a heavy Abus lock on it full-time. 
Anyway, on longish climbs (e.g., Kings Mountain or Old La Honda, which 
averages almost 8% for 3-4 miles), when I'm just tooling along with friends 
and not trying to make PR, I can't tell the difference between my 
lightweight wonder and my moderately heavy 24lb randonneur (Riv custom, 
also with fenders, dynamo light, front rack, etc), based on a clock; that's 
almost a 10 lb "penalty" I can't feel if I'm not actively looking for it. 
Come to think of it, on leisure rides, I've intentionally taken my 
super-duty Atlantis because it can carry all sorts of goodies for the 
post-ride snacking, and I wasn't penalized or regretful of the decision.

What I have found to really impact the "feel" of the bike, in terms of 
responsiveness and subjective "lightness", is the tire. On the same exact 
bikes, having supple, better rolling tires such as the Rene Herse tires can 
make a night-day difference, compared to lesser tires such as the Schwalbe 
Kojak or even the evergreen Pasela. I haven't really measured the objective 
differences with a stopwatch, but I wouldn't ride those tires on fun rides, 
just from the feel alone. In fact, I've gone so far as to switch over all 
my bikes to nice rolling tires, predominantly RH tires, Pari-Motos, Hetre 
Extra Leger, Challenge Paris-Roubaix, and ThunderBurts, much to my wallet's 
"amusement". I've also managed to convince skeptical friends to try, and 
they too found that perhaps buying tires at stupid prices isn't such a 
crazy idea after all.

Another factor I've been trying to reconcile is what Jan Heine refers to as 
"planing". I'm not sure I accept his explanation fully, but I have bikes 
that ride noticeably better than others, and 1. it has almost nothing to do 
with its weight (the aforementioned Riv custom randonneur is fantastically 
"lively"), and 2. it is only somewhat correlated to its expected frame 
flexibility (my flexiest bike isn't the best to ride). Again, no stopwatch 
verification, so I'm taking from subjective feel.

I do understand the need to have a light bike for portage though. A friend 
of small stature often complains about having to lug her bike up stairs, 
but the activity of cycling isn't lugging bicycles up and down stairs (or 
onto or off bike racks).

Anyway, just my $0.02. Try the nicer tires. Maybe you'll beat the men on 
road bikes up Killer Hill just the same. And even expensive Rene Herse 
tires are cheaper than a new custom frame+fork (and if you don't like the 
tires, you can sell it slightly used for not much loss).

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

Agree and agree. A number of folks, including me, have mentioned tires as a 
much bigger factor than weight in these threads. I went so far as to put RH 
Switchback Hill (the Extra Lite version!) on my Clem L.  I assume the frame 
and fork may be heavier than my Susie, and the overall bike certainly is, 
what with Dyno lighting, racks, panniers, and fenders. But as I reported, 
the Susie currently has Teravail Honchos vs. the Switchbacks, and obviously 
no contest. (My wallet, unlike yours, is not what I would call amused. But 
it does not begrudge the expense.)

However, I think the difference in ride that BBDD is perceiving is more 
than placebo. I think, along with tires, the design of the frame and the 
rider setup and the larger wheels will all contribute to a different feel. 
Any *significant* increase in speed for a given wattage output might be 
debatable, but in terms of perception, a real thing. It's partly why it can 
be hard to convince ex-racers that a 38mm tire pumped to 60 psi rolls as 
fast as a 25mm pumped to 90 psi -- the body is conditioned to perceive the 
harsher ride as faster.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-5 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, 
CA wrote:

> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> …
>>
> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. …
>>
>
> You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't 
> really make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a 
> bike ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I 
> can't usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I 
> have to shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch 
> and pass men on road bikes because you're on a Platypus can't really be 
> supported by physics, if indeed weight is the only differentiator. I also 
> suspect you may be severely underestimating the concept of placebos and 
> that extra 100 watts a new bike can bring. :)
>
> I'm fortunate enough to have too many bikes, from lightweight, mostly 
> carbon+titanium wonders that'll probably float away with a strong breeze, 
> to my stout Atlantis that weighs more than my Wilbury (here's the mixte 
> reference for relevance!) because it has front-rear racks, full stainless 
> fenders, basket, dynamo lights, and a heavy Abus lock on it full-time. 
> Anyway, on longish climbs (e.g., Kings Mountain or Old La Honda, which 
> averages almost 8% for 3-4 miles), when I'm just tooling along with friends 
> and not trying to make PR, I can't tell the difference between my 
> lightweight wonder and my moderately heavy 24lb randonneur (Riv custom, 
> also with fenders, dynamo light, front rack, etc), based on a clock; that's 
> almost a 10 lb "penalty" I can't feel if I'm not actively looking for it. 
> Come to think of it, on leisure rides, I've intentionally taken my 
> super-duty Atlantis because it can carry all sorts of goodies for the 
> post-ride snacking, and I wasn't penalized or regretful of the decision.
>
> What I have found to really impact the "feel" of the bike, in terms of 
> responsiveness and subjective "lightness", is the tire. On the same exact 
> bikes, having supple, better rolling tires such as the Rene Herse tires can 
> make a night-day difference, compared to lesser tires such as the Schwalbe 
> Kojak or even the evergreen Pasela. I haven't really measured the objective 
> differences with a stopwatch, but I wouldn't ride those tires on fun rides, 
> just from the feel alone. In fact, I've gone so far as to switch over all 
> my bikes to nice rolling tires, predominantly RH tires, Pari-Motos, Hetre 
> Extra Leger, Challenge Paris-Roubaix, and ThunderBurts, much to my wallet's 
> "amusement". I've also managed to convince skeptical frie

[RBW] Re: Not a Riv but...

[Zac Terrones]

Love it! Where'd you get the cork grips? Been waiting for the ones riv 
carries to come back in stock but it's been a while. Also, agreed on that 
grey, so good!

On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 9:21:29 AM UTC-8 philipr...@gmail.com wrote:

> After;
>
> [image: PXL_20210124_165847266.jpg]
>
> [image: PXL_20210124_165535577.jpg]
>
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:20:45 AM UTC-6 Philip Barrett wrote:
>
>> ...certainly inspired by one! 
>>
>> $160 buy from Craigslist. Before;
>>
>> [image: PXL_20210110_235059925.jpg]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Not a Riv but...

[Philip Barrett]

Thanks - the grips are from Velo Orange, they did OK out of this build;

https://velo-orange.com/collections/grips-wraps/products/cork-grips

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:50:10 AM UTC-6 zac.te...@gmail.com wrote:

> Love it! Where'd you get the cork grips? Been waiting for the ones riv 
> carries to come back in stock but it's been a while. Also, agreed on that 
> grey, so good!
>
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 9:21:29 AM UTC-8 philipr...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> After;
>>
>> [image: PXL_20210124_165847266.jpg]
>>
>> [image: PXL_20210124_165535577.jpg]
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:20:45 AM UTC-6 Philip Barrett wrote:
>>
>>> ...certainly inspired by one! 
>>>
>>> $160 buy from Craigslist. Before;
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20210110_235059925.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Not a Riv but...

[JohnS]

Nice! Night and day difference.

FWIW, advice from the list is to use bolt cutters to trim the fender stays 
to length.

JohnS

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:50:10 PM UTC-5 zac.te...@gmail.com wrote:

> Love it! Where'd you get the cork grips? Been waiting for the ones riv 
> carries to come back in stock but it's been a while. Also, agreed on that 
> grey, so good!
>
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 9:21:29 AM UTC-8 philipr...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> After;
>>
>> [image: PXL_20210124_165847266.jpg]
>>
>> [image: PXL_20210124_165535577.jpg]
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:20:45 AM UTC-6 Philip Barrett wrote:
>>
>>> ...certainly inspired by one! 
>>>
>>> $160 buy from Craigslist. Before;
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20210110_235059925.jpg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Not a Riv but...

[Philip Barrett]

Thanks - it's in the plan but I want to get a few miles in before making 
"final & irreversible" adjustments.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:06:22 PM UTC-6 JohnS wrote:

> Nice! Night and day difference.
>
> FWIW, advice from the list is to use bolt cutters to trim the fender stays 
> to length.
>
> JohnS
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:50:10 PM UTC-5 zac.te...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Love it! Where'd you get the cork grips? Been waiting for the ones riv 
>> carries to come back in stock but it's been a while. Also, agreed on that 
>> grey, so good!
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 9:21:29 AM UTC-8 philipr...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> After;
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20210124_165847266.jpg]
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20210124_165535577.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:20:45 AM UTC-6 Philip Barrett wrote:
>>>
 ...certainly inspired by one! 

 $160 buy from Craigslist. Before;

 [image: PXL_20210110_235059925.jpg]






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[RBW] Brooks B17S, Carradice Saddebag, Nitto M12 Rack

[Jared Wilson]

Hello all

Clearing out some stuff that's been collecting dust

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1_qBhTNhYF5Owona15TEo9vax5MkhyF5L?usp=sharing

Brooks B17s, honey color, ~100 miles, not even broken in yet. Has some 
spots where rain cover stuck and left some residual from the liner, some 
discoloration in rear and one small scuff. 
$110 shipped

Carradice saddlebag, don't know what model it is but the dimensions are 
~13"x7"x7"
$80 shipped

Nitto M12 rack, used, needs brake post studs, otherwise in good usable 
condition.
$50 shipped

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[RBW] Re: DIY adding struts to stiffen a flexible rack

[Mathissu]

Clever!  Well done.


On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 1:31:37 PM UTC-5 Clark Fitzgerald wrote:

> Solution
>
> I cut down some Wald basket supports to attach to the low rider pannier 
> mounts and clamp to the outermost part of the rack. Cut them to size, 
> hammer them flat at the end, drill the holes, and clean them up with a file 
> or grinder. I've also used flat aluminum from the hardware store.
>
> [image: IMG_1868.JPG]
>
> This photo shows the triangulation that comes from the new outer struts. 
> The original struts are just outside the brake arms.
> [image: IMG_1869.JPG]
> Top view also shows the outward support.
> [image: IMG_1873.JPG]
> In this view of the basket you can see where I cut out some of the wires 
> to make space for the clamps, and the tombstone of the rack. My goal was to 
> position the basket as close to the head tube as possible for better 
> handling.
> [image: IMG_1874.JPG]
> The result is rock solid, it's a night and day difference from the 
> original. You could probably use a similar technique to repair a broken 
> rack.
> [image: IMG_1876.JPG]
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: To My Platypus People!

[Jared Wilson]

I heard rumors of early February, holidays got the supply chain running a 
bit slow.

On Wednesday, January 20, 2021 at 4:28:15 PM UTC-8 Roberta wrote:

> I"m disappointed, but not surprised.  I'm hoping to get mine Mermaid Blue 
> by springtime in the east, and if I love it as much as BBDD, it will be my 
> retirement bike.
>
> I'm working out the last details with Analog Cycles this week, so they can 
> start ordering parts.  The plan is already-anodized pops of blue wherever 
> we can (dyno light, nipples, caps, perhaps ring bolts, head spacers, 
> whatever I can get).  Parts will be mostly silver.  1x11 drive train.  
> Tubeless with Gravel King tires (I forget model).  I bought a pair of Losco 
> bars from Joe and if they don't rise high enough for me, then I have 
> Albatross.
>
> If we work it right, parts and frame will get there around the same time 
> in Vermont.  
>
> I'm looking forward to hearing what you're planning and to see the built 
> up bikes!
>
> Roberta
>
> On Wednesday, January 20, 2021 at 6:35:52 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>> I saw the February Platypus ETA and I was so disappointed. Gosh, do you 
>> think will get them before Valentine’s Day?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jan 20, 2021, at 1:44 PM, Chris in NZ  wrote:
>>
>> From Will’s email on the 19 December:
>>
>>
>> “We'll get the container of Sams and Platypus in late January, but 
>> they'll be up on the site early February.”
>>
>> I think the website has just been updated to show when they’ll be 
>> available to order.
>>
>> On Thursday, January 21, 2021 at 6:18:26 AM UTC+13 Tom Wyland wrote:
>>
>>> So the website has been updated for Feb '21 now. Anyone heard about 
>>> timing? 
>>
>> -- 
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>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Anything / Cargo Cage mounted to seat stays or fork braze-ons?

[brizbarn]

thanks for the insights.  the one-bolt style for anything cage seems safe 
if the straps stabilize it from swinging.  i like that tumbleweed rack too. 
 didn't know it existed before.  a silver version would be nice.

On Monday, January 11, 2021 at 8:45:12 AM UTC-8 John O'shea wrote:

> I've not tried on a rivendell but I have successfully mounted Salsa Brand 
> Anything HD Cages on two seperate bikes using only a lowrider bolt. the 
> design of those particular cages allow the cage to brace the fork with just 
> one bolt in a manner that doesn't allow the cage to wiggle. I've done 
> gravel and singletrack touring using this method and it hasn't failed. I 
> would say maybe not to carry your kettle bell collection this way however.
>
> Hope this helps,
> John O'shea
> Lexington, KY
> [image: PXL_20210109_203022653.PORTRAIT.jpg][image: 
> MVIMG_20200719_092018.jpg]
> On Monday, January 11, 2021 at 11:30:33 AM UTC-5 Collin A wrote:
>
>> Hey,
>>
>> The front mounts won't work thanks to the spacing. The rear will be 
>> tricky because the seat stays aren't in line with the bolt faces (i.e. 
>> eyelets are perpendicular to the center-line of the frame, but are about 
>> 1-3 cm laterally offset)...spacing isn't also perfectly set, and you have 
>> to deal with m5 and m6 bolts.
>>
>> You might be able to get something to work by using the b-rad cage 
>> adapters from wolftooth (the really long ones). Another option is to use 
>> those king cage USB adapters for the seat stay and bolt one of the cage 
>> holes to it, either way, not a particularly elegant solution, and neither 
>> of these are recommended for the fork I believe...
>>
>> Also, look at this rack if you are trying to find the 3-pack mounts and 
>> still be light-ish (I think 500-ish grams?). You also get a saddle bag 
>> carrier!   http://www.tumbleweed.cc/store/t-rack  
>>
>> In summary, it'd be a lot of work, and you are probably best with using 
>> bags with minimal supports like the caradice , etc. if you want to reduce 
>> the dead weight on your frame.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Collin in Sacramento
>>
>> On Sunday, January 10, 2021 at 10:39:44 PM UTC-8 brizbarn wrote:
>>
>>> Has anyone ever bolted an anything style cage to their Riv seat stay or 
>>> fork rack mounts? With four rack mounts on frames like the Appaloosa, 
>>> Atlantis, and Hillborne, I wonder if it's possible to bolt on an anything 
>>> cage.  Could be an alternative to running a traditional rack if the spacing 
>>> is correct. Photoshopped mock-up picture attached of what I'm talking 
>>> about. 
>>>
>>> [image: appaloosaorangedrivesideframe_anything.jpg]
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Leah Peterson Takes A Stand

[Doug H.]

I like my Bike Hand stand but it's my first so no point of reference with 
other stands. I agree it is a pain to work on a bike on the ground. The 
Bike Hand isn't great at rotating the position of the bike but it holds a 
heavy bike well.
Doug

On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 10:04:27 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Ok, that got your attention. 
>
> I’m not actually taking a stand so much as BUYING a stand. I have had it 
> with trying to work on a bike on its kickstand. Tonight I tried to put 
> sealant in my tire and the tire deflated and my Clementine tipped over. 
> Hopping mad...that would be an apt description of me in the garage tonight. 
> I’m sick and tired of wrecking my back and fed up with the awkwardness of 
> working on a bike that is always threatening to tip over. I’m taking a 
> stand against not having a stand.
>
> I know Rivendell sells a stand but last I checked, it is sold out and also 
> $$$. Is there anything that makes their stand worth waiting for? 
>
> I don’t have many preferences, save two: I don’t want something that takes 
> up a bunch of room, and I want the clamp to be on the seat post. (Not the 
> frame.)
>
> You’re the best!
> Leah
>
>
>

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[RBW] Wanted: 58cm Hunqapillar

[johnny....@gmail.com]

Hello,
I'm ISO a 58cm Hunqapillar frameset. Any condition is fine. I badly need a 
new project and hoping someone here can hook me up with my first Riv bike. 
Email me if you have a way to make my day johnny.burrell at gmail

Thanks

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Re: [RBW] Mb-1 closest modern riv relative

[Ian Terry]

That is a very beautiful bike, Daniel. 

On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 3:31:48 PM UTC-5 Daniel M wrote:

> [image: 511274B5-03E0-4ADD-8A84-14EF17677E1C.jpeg]
> Not my primary ride but every time I take it out I marvel at what a good 
> road AND trail bike it is. It's gonna get upgraded to V-brakes and 
> wide-range 2x, plus fenders and dyno, before too long.
>
> Daniel M
> Berkeley, CA
> On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 10:34:32 AM UTC-8 tommc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> MB1
>> [image: IMG_20200905_143247899_HDR.jpg][image: 
>> IMG_20200905_143302905_HDR.jpg]
>>
>> On Saturday, January 16, 2021 at 8:22:13 AM UTC-7 Pete B wrote:
>>
>>> I'm curious how a Hunqapillar compares to the MB-1 and its 
>>> contemporaries.
>>>
>>> I've had a Trek 950 with Albatross bars since 2011, after following 
>>> advice in the RR to Riv-ify a old MTB frame. I toyed with the idea of 
>>> replacing the 950 with a Hunq several years ago, but it rides nicely. I 
>>> purchased a Rosco Bubbe road instead. I'm glad I did. With horizontal 
>>> dropouts and clearance for 700x50, the Bubbe is even more versatile, I 
>>> think, than the Trek. Still, I've always enjoyed putting Riv parts on the 
>>> 950 and I recently re-built it with Silver 2 thumbshifters, a Riv chainring 
>>> guard and a Nitto HiRiser stem. I would've preferred the Wavie bar but it 
>>> was sold out, so I found a similar Nitto riser bar. A little more backsweep 
>>> would be nice, but I'm still getting used to it. I'm not a mountain biker, 
>>> but my intention is to take it out on nearby beginner trails, and finally 
>>> learn how to lift the front wheel over obstacles, lol.
>>>
>>> Pete
>>> Arlington, VA
>>>
>>> [image: Trek_950_2021.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Monday, January 11, 2021 at 2:43:00 PM UTC-5 philipr...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Old = Sold :)

 On Monday, January 11, 2021 at 1:36:44 PM UTC-6 Philip Barrett wrote:

> Thanks...that one is old but I'm working on a couple more, here's a 
> sneak "before" preview of something I found this weekend for $160;
>
> [image: PXL_20210110_235059925.jpg]
>
> On Monday, January 11, 2021 at 11:28:07 AM UTC-6 Sam Perez wrote:
>
>> Beautiful build 
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 5:58 AM Philip Barrett  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Until 2 weeks ago I was still riding mine. Finally let it go via 
>>> ebay.
>>>
>>> [image: PXL_20201220_204049405.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Sunday, January 10, 2021 at 5:17:14 AM UTC-6 Eric Daume wrote:
>>>
 A lightweight, low stack mountain bike? Nothing at Riv is like this 
 anymore.

 On Sun, Jan 10, 2021 at 1:18 AM Sam Perez  
 wrote:

> Hi all,
> What is the closest modern riv relative to the bridgestone MB-1?  
> And is anyone still riding them? Feel free to share pics! 
>
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> 
> .
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Any Susie owners out there?

[Benjamin Park]

Hi all, my first post here!

I am close to pulling the trigger on a Susie, but am not finding many 
descriptions of how it rides, handles, etc.  What should I expect?  How is 
the acceleration?  I am looking for something for 50% single track and 50% 
gravel roads, and an occasional short bikepacking trip.  I ride a rigid MTB 
currently so the lack of front suspension won't be a shock (get it?), but 
still am looking to smooth out some of the bumps.  How is it to ride with 
swept back bars on technical single track? 

Thanks a lot for the thoughts!!

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[iamkeith]

For what it's worth, as a tangentially-related comment:  I traded my Clem H 
for a Susie and, despite me being over the stated weight limit and having a 
lower and effectively longer top tube and despite having theoretically 
lighter tubing, the Susie feels torsionally stiffer than the Clem H.  I'm 
not sure if it might have something to do with the fillet joints or the 
shorter chainstays or what, but the formula for predicting frame stiffness 
seems to be a bit vague.  I WILL say that my new wheels are much stiffer 
and that probably helps.  A combination of a flexy frame and wheels could 
make my Clem shudder and feel noodly at times, so a good set of wheels 
built around wide rims is probably appropriate for any frame that you'd 
expect to be flexy.

On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 1:53:47 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Yes there's always the factor of Grant recommending being fine with the 
> production frames - he's famous for talking people out of the more 
> expensive option if he feels it's not really necessary - but there no 
> substitute for imposing your own max weight figure on a custom. A Susie-ed 
> version of the Clem L brought down to an even lower max weight than the 
> original Susie number could, I think, be done and be an amazing bike. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 12:07:32 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> I’m fairly certain this is what Grant would say if I asked him to make 
>> such a bike - the Clem L isn’t that much heavier, stick with that. 
>>
>> I would guess you could shave off a couple of pounds of frame weight, 
>> which I believe I would notice. I don’t know how light you could make the 
>> bike, but I wish I could make the Clem a *bit* easier to work with. The XL 
>> wheelbase and stout tubing make it quite the workout to lift up on the 
>> stand. And the bike doesn’t exactly fly up the hills. But, it is supremely 
>> comfortable, and I think, beautiful. I can only imagine how a custom 
>> version would be even more wonderful.
>>
>> I remembered Laing’s cargo-type Rivendell. He has Keven’s rejected 
>> custom; it’s a step-through with integrated rack, so I guess we know of ONE 
>> step-through custom.
>>
>> It’s hard for me to believe a lighter step-through would be too flex; 
>> hasn’t Europe ridden such bikes for a million years? Are they all overbuilt 
>> tanks with nothing lightweight in the mix at all?
>>
>> What an interesting and fun topic! Thanks for chiming in!
>> Leah
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Jan 25, 2021, at 8:08 AM, Mark Roland  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> This is not correct. A mixte is not a step through. Because, at least 
>> without serious contortions for a normal person, you can't step through it. 
>> They are two separate designs. A mixte can more easily accomodate certain 
>> clothing choices, and with more clearance allow for sliding off the saddle 
>> for frequent stopping in city traffic. Can also be mounted similar to a 
>> step through if you lean it enough or step like a Rockette.
>>
>> Step throughs do not have the same triangulation found in a diamond 
>> frame, or even a mixte. (This is also why mixtes with twin, side by side 
>> skinny top tubes are often rather noodley in larger sizes and/or carrying 
>> loads.) Start using very light tubing on a step through, and you will start 
>> to introduce a bad kind of flex--especially if you want to carry a thing or 
>> two, which is part of the point of a Clem L, no? A loaded 59cm Clem L 
>> apparently verges on this unwanted flexing, according to reports out of 
>> Rivendell during the early days of the Clems.
>>
>> Even if you designed it using the same tubing as a Susie, by the time you 
>> add everything back on, you will hardly have made a difference in terms of 
>> ride response, other than to possibly introduce  unwanted flexing under 
>> load. Unlike peanut butter and chocolate, some combinations are just not 
>> meant to be; they are contradictory by their very nature. Learn to mount 
>> the Platypus like a regular diamond frame until you hit your 70s or 80s, or 
>> practice leaning it away from you before performing the step through. In 
>> any case, I suspect it's those big ole cowgirl boots causing the problem;^)
>>
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 11:56:42 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Kai, 
>>>
>>> I think the whole mixte/step-through thing can get convoluted and 
>>> confusing because a lot of frames we nominally call mixtes apparently 
>>> aren't. I believe - I could be wrong - the only true mixte is the Platypus 
>>> frame style (also Purple Riv Ana's) where the dropped toptube meets a third 
>>> set of stays that travel all the way to the rear of the frame. Therefore 
>>> your Rosco Mixte and my Riv Custom Mixte are really step-throughs. But mine 
>>> is higher than the Platypus mixte and Clem L step-through so what the heck 
>>> do you call *that?*
>>>
>>> What I *think* Leah is asking is if there's ever been a Riv Custom 
>>> step-through

[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[iamkeith]

Ed,  I have 2.8 tires on wide (34i) rims on my 56/700c Susie and am trying 
to figure out fenders too.   I just tried a set of SKS Bluemel 75s in case 
this experience helps:

There is plenty of frame clearance, even with a good gap to the tire.  As 
seems to be the case with many Rivendells, the tightest spot was at the 
bottom of the fork crown - not at the seat tube or chainstays or braces, as 
you'd expect with other bikes.   I don't think I would have even needed to 
notch the rear for chain clearance, but that's a function of bottom bracket 
spindle length so YMMV.  However, I did have interference at the cantilever 
straddle wire.   (I used cantis instead of v brakes specifically because I 
wanted to run big tires and fenders, which wouldn't fit under V-brakes.)  

I could solve this and make these fenders work by raising the straddle wire 
a tiny bit, but I'm reluctant to becasue I think I have them adjusted 
pretty well for power.  Or I could notch the edge of the fender to allow 
the cable to cut through, but that seems dangerous.   A different canti arm 
profile might help too.  (I'm using the Dia Compe 980.) I was going to try 
an extra-wide straddle-wire hanger - which would proably solve it - but I 
kind of decided that the black fenders don't look so good on the bike.   If 
you have a different color scheme than me though and don't mind black, this 
may be a pretty good solution.  They're nice looking and nicely-made 
fenders - just not like the silver SKS that I'm accustomed to.

My next step is going to be to try the Simworks/Honjo Flat 80 fender, but 
they're super expensive so I need to make as many measurements as possible 
first.  The advantage of using aluminum will be that I can deform them to 
fit the fork crown better than plastic ones, where the critical clearance 
point would otherwise be as noted above.

Last option will be to use some Planet Bike 60mm fenders, even though those 
wouldn't provide full coverage.

Boils down to a lot of trial and error unfortunately, but I can at least 
confirm that it will be possible in one way or another.   I'm going to put 
the Bluemel 75 fenders on another bike soon but haven't yet, in case you'd 
like me to take some photos of it mocked up.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:45:11 AM UTC-7 Ed Fausto wrote:

> Hi Joe,
> Looks like its a choice between a 27.5 plus tire versus fender with 
> smaller tires.
> I will first try the half-fender you suggested.
> Thanks.
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:46:49 PM UTC+8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I have a Susie/Wolbis with 27.5 x 2.25 Thunder Burts. I have SKS P65 
>> fenders which I have test-fitted but not mounted and it looks like it'll 
>> work but it's close. The max tire for these frames is 2.8 and unfortunately 
>> I think you're going to have to drop down closer to what I'm using to get 
>> full fenders in that space, too. Another option is to get those half-fender 
>> things that mountain bikers use, PDW has some options there. 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:14:58 AM UTC-8 Ed Fausto wrote:
>>
>>> After a long wait, I finally received my GBW with 27.5 x 2.6" Bontrager 
>>> XR2 tires.
>>> Ever since I became a fan of Rivendell, I have been a fender convert 
>>> mostly using SKS fenders.
>>>
>>> Looking at the tire clearances of my GBW, it seems I do not have enough 
>>> space to install fenders.
>>>
>>> Anyone who has installed fenders with these hilly bikes?
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tell me about your super-wide drops

[Will Boericke]

I am quite fond of the Ritchey Venturemax I have on my CaadX - just the 
right amount of drop and flare, with long drops with plenty of hand 
real-estate.  What Bars lead me to believe that Midges were similar, which 
is true of flare, but to my mind, they need more length in the drops.  I am 
using them happily and find that stem height was the key to making that 
work out.  I have not tried a set of ultra-wide drops and probably won't 
because I'm cheap.

On Friday, January 8, 2021 at 4:02:33 PM UTC-5 Gabriel Bruguier wrote:

>  Another angle of the 112 that better illustrates the wide drop glory.
>
>

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[RBW] WTT - RonsBikes Fabs Chest - black waxed (S) for olive waxed (S)

[Danzem]

I have a new size small Fabs Chest bag in black waxed canvas with the tan 
straps ("black n tan") It's been literally used one time for a cruise 
around the neighborhood.

I am looking for a small in the olive waxed canvas if anyone is interested 
to trade. Thanks!

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Matthew Williams]

Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:

Clem Smith Jr.
52cm
$900
Tuscon, AZ
https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html

Clem Smith Jr.
59cm
$900
Petaluma, CA
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html

Sam Hillborne
60cm
$1623
Petaluma, CA
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html

A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
47.5cm
$1990
Surrey, BC (Canada)
https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html





On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking to 
> move one. I don't care what color it is. 
> Robert Blunt
> Pennington, NJ
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Leah Peterson]

Good response, and lots to think about here. 

I do want to clarify that I am *not* thinking of getting a custom step-through. 
I only wondered if someone had, and if it was lighter than the Clems, and 
therefore felt faster. I can think only of Keven’s custom, and that one is NOT 
light, with its integrated rack and all. Despite it feeling slow/heavy to me, I 
really do have affection for my Clem. 

I certainly can’t argue with physics, if they are as you interpret them. The 
thing is, I *do* feel the difference between having my 32 oz Hydroflask on my 
bars or not. I *do* notice when I’m carrying less weight on my bike. How to 
explain that? So, then I wonder what the difference is between you and me - 
because these things are unnoticeable to you. I hope we hear from some other 
women besides me, because that is the obvious and biggest difference between 
you and me.  

My Clementine was my only bike until Thanksgiving, so everything I did on a 
bike, I did on THAT bike. Hauling, pleasure riding, trying set records, running 
errands, calorie burners...the Clementine does them all. But it is not FAST. 
And why can’t it be, if weight is not the problem? It has an expensive and 
light wheelset with Gravel King slicks, so maybe not the $$$ RH tires, but 
still good, right? 

Alright, I’m getting lost in my own thoughts over here...what hope do you have 
of deciphering?! But I really appreciate the conversation and exploration. I 
just want to understand.
Leah

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 8:36 AM, Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA 
>  wrote:
> 
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>> …
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying to 
>> chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my boys were 
>> little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill stood between 
>> it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike with gears. A 
>> Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every day, while my 
>> 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 inch 
>> Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no thought 
>> into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced here. That 
>> day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill and beat us 
>> all from that day forward. 
>> 
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. …
> 
> You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't really 
> make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a bike 
> ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I can't 
> usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I have to 
> shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch and pass 
> men on road bikes because you're on a Platypus can't really be supported by 
> physics, if indeed weight is the only differentiator. I also suspect you may 
> be severely underestimating the concept of placebos and that extra 100 watts 
> a new bike can bring. :)
> 
> I'm fortunate enough to have too many bikes, from lightweight, mostly 
> carbon+titanium wonders that'll probably float away with a strong breeze, to 
> my stout Atlantis that weighs more than my Wilbury (here's the mixte 
> reference for relevance!) because it has front-rear racks, full stainless 
> fenders, basket, dynamo lights, and a heavy Abus lock on it full-time. 
> Anyway, on longish climbs (e.g., Kings Mountain or Old La Honda, which 
> averages almost 8% for 3-4 miles), when I'm just tooling along with friends 
> and not trying to make PR, I can't tell the difference between my lightweight 
> wonder and my moderately heavy 24lb randonneur (Riv custom, also with 
> fenders, dynamo light, front rack, etc), based on a clock; that's almost a 10 
> lb "penalty" I can't feel if I'm not actively looking for it. Come to think 
> of it, on leisure rides, I've intentionally taken my super-duty Atlantis 
> because it can carry all sorts of goodies for the post-ride snacking, and I 
> wasn't penalized or regretful of the decision.
> 
> What I have found to really impact the "feel" of the bike, in terms of 
> responsiveness and subjective "lightness", is the tire. On the same exact 
> bikes, having supple, better rolling tires such as the Rene Herse tires can 
> make a night-day difference, compared to lesser tires such as the Schwalbe 
> Kojak or even the evergreen Pasela. I haven't really measured the objective 
> 

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Linda G]

Leah,
Wasn't your Betty Foy a little lighter than the Platypus? How did that 
feel for speed? I was considering a Platypus until I saw that the 
chainstays were going to be longer than the Cheviot. The top tube is 
already longer than I need since I'm happy with handlebars than only curve 
back slightly. So all of that adds weight I don't need. The Rivendell 
philosophy considers weight to be unimportant. I get it. Their main 
customer base is men and with 2/3 of the population being overweight or 
obese they have to design for people who are significantly larger, heavier 
and stronger than I am. I love the aesthetics and quality of their frames 
as well as their business philosophy. I like my Roadini but I don't want a 
bike that's any heavier and I'm pretty sure the frame could be lighter and 
still be safe and functional for me.
A lightweight step-through frame would be a design challenge. I like 
the step-through idea since it feels safer on a crowded MUP such as I have 
near me. I have thought that when I feel a need to switch to that type of 
frame I will get a Bike Friday which has low step-over.
As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method: 
left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over 
while in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over a 
diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until 
recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress 
on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely 
step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too 
much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the 
right idea with a single "top tube"
Linda 

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> 2 Thoughts:
>
> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had no 
> idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>
> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte 
> (mixte sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for 
> the mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect 
> combination of their colors.
>
> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit. 
>  But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
> personal information! 😂 
>
> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I lift 
> weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me up in a 
> bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about the best 
> physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected the engine.
>
> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my boys 
> were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill stood 
> between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike with 
> gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every day, 
> while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 inch 
> Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no thought 
> into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced here. That 
> day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill and beat us 
> all from that day forward. 
>
> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
> It’s easy and it’s fun. 
>
> Those two bikes now have the same accessories (bags, phone mounts, 
> aluminum Boscos, metal fenders, rear racks, dyno) save one thing - the Clem 
> has a basket rack with a Wald. And yet, the Clem is just so much heavier. I 
> know it when I carry either bike over the median that intersects my bike 
> path. I know it when I pedal up Killer Hill. I know it when I lift the 
> bikes onto my vehicle bike rack. And every single time I think, “I wonder 
> what it would be like to have this Clem in a light-weight version.”
>
> Leah
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 25, 2021, at 11:40 PM, Philip Williamson  
> wrote:
>
> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
> not all frames are mixtes 
> 

[RBW] 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Tim Baldwin]

I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping to 
be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With touring in 
mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right now. 
I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 would 
give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t, which 
I don't use, and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my trip. 
With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range of 21 to 100 gear 
inches, which seems perfect to me. After seeing the high demand for bike 
parts in 2020, what do Riv riders predict for future availability of 9 
speed parts? I found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for 
sale on ebay, do I stock up now?

Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've mostly 
used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go up to 10 
speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I 
mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm using a 
Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 speed work. 
However there's something about the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 
speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.

Tim B in Chicago

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

Thank you Matthew,
I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting until
the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki they are
looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for the whole
bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and get it
anyway.
Best,
Rob

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 52cm
> $900
> Tuscon, AZ
>
> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 59cm
> $900
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>
> Sam Hillborne
> 60cm
> $1623
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>
> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
> 47.5cm
> $1990
> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>
> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking
> to move one. I don't care what color it is.
> Robert Blunt
> Pennington, NJ
>
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> 
> .
>
>
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> .
>

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Matthew Williams]

I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:

54cm
$2600
North Smithfield, RI
https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html



On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Thank you Matthew,
> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting until 
> the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki they are 
> looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for the whole 
> bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and get it 
> anyway.
> Best,
> Rob
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams 
>  wrote:
> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
> 
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 52cm
> $900
> Tuscon, AZ
> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
> 
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 59cm
> $900
> Petaluma, CA
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
> 
> Sam Hillborne
> 60cm
> $1623
> Petaluma, CA
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
> 
> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
> 47.5cm
> $1990
> Surrey, BC (Canada)
> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
> 
>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking to 
>> move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>> Robert Blunt
>> Pennington, NJ
>> 
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> 
> 
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[RBW] Re: FS AHH 47.5cm near Vancouver BC

[Mike Packard]

I'm completely fascinated by that handlebar. It appears to have adjustable 
sweep angle for each side?? And--more importantly--looks like a moose when 
you stare down at it.

🤯

Mike

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:41:47 AM UTC-6 ericf3 wrote:

>
> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>
> No affiliation.
>
> EricF
> Vancouver
>
> [image: image.png]
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Leah Peterson]

Linda, YES, THIS. There is a major physical difference between men and women. 
I’m so glad to hear your perspective. You are so right; Rivendell has to design 
safe bikes for people of all sizes and both sexes. But heavier/stouter may not 
serve women or lighter people as well. 

I’ve mentioned that I love to work out; I’m in good shape. My husband is a suit 
and does only light exercise; he is thin, but not fit. We have 2 boys and 
sometimes the boys and I will take my husband on and wrestle, and he wins every 
time. Doesn’t matter how fit I am or how out of shape he is...I lose every 
time. That might be the difference with the bikes, too. What is a physical 
hurdle for me is not for a man? It’s a working theory I have but may not be 
able to prove.

I don’t know if the Betty was lighter than the Platy. The Platy feels plenty 
light to me, and also NOT long. I know the chainstays are longer (“a hair 
longer” per RBW) than the Cheviot but they don’t feel excessive to me, at all. 
How fast was the Betty...well, I could take on the roadies on Killer Hill and 
often win. I’ve never accomplished that on the Clem. I know I shouldn’t push 
you towards a Platy if you don’t really see it suiting you, but it’s so good 
that I hope you get one anyway. 😬

Thanks for the info on the mounting techniques - I didn’t realize your way 
would put stress on a frame, either. But, it’ a Riv and you’re light, I’m sure 
it can take it. I know what you mean about mounting your mixte; I feel that, 
too. It’s my only complaint about my bike. The step-throughs are just 
fantastic. But heavy.
Leah

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:12 AM, Linda G  wrote:
> 
> Leah,
> Wasn't your Betty Foy a little lighter than the Platypus? How did that 
> feel for speed? I was considering a Platypus until I saw that the chainstays 
> were going to be longer than the Cheviot. The top tube is already longer than 
> I need since I'm happy with handlebars than only curve back slightly. So all 
> of that adds weight I don't need. The Rivendell philosophy considers weight 
> to be unimportant. I get it. Their main customer base is men and with 2/3 of 
> the population being overweight or obese they have to design for people who 
> are significantly larger, heavier and stronger than I am. I love the 
> aesthetics and quality of their frames as well as their business philosophy. 
> I like my Roadini but I don't want a bike that's any heavier and I'm pretty 
> sure the frame could be lighter and still be safe and functional for me.
> A lightweight step-through frame would be a design challenge. I like the 
> step-through idea since it feels safer on a crowded MUP such as I have near 
> me. I have thought that when I feel a need to switch to that type of frame I 
> will get a Bike Friday which has low step-over.
> As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method: 
> left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over while 
> in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over a 
> diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until 
> recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress 
> on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely 
> step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too 
> much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the right 
> idea with a single "top tube"
> Linda 
> 
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>> 2 Thoughts:
>> 
>> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had no 
>> idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>> 
>> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte (mixte 
>> sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for the 
>> mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect combination 
>> of their colors.
>> 
>> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
>> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
>> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit.  
>> But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
>> personal information! 😂 
>> 
>> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I lift 
>> weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me up in a 
>> bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about the best 
>> physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected the engine.
>> 
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying to 
>> chase roadies up Killer

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

*Disclaimer: I promised myself I wouldn't come back to this thread and get 
into a debate about lightness but I'm Joe Bernard, world reknown for not 
knowing when to shut up! So here goes..

In this very specific case of a very light and strong rider who's already 
got that motor in tip-top shape, the weight of the frame is going to 
matter. Swapping out to custom wheels and better (and tubeless) tires isn't 
in the offing because that's already been done to these bikes. Does this 
mean Riv production frames are too heavy? Of course not, it just means 
they're built to a standard the average buyer can ride without snapping in 
half. Which brings us to the Custom Clem idea, which - this is the part 
where I start repeating myself and drive y'all crazy - I wouldn't approach 
as "Hey can you make me a superlight frame?" It's simply a matter of having 
a frame designed around the rider's height and weight, plus expected level 
of poundage to be carried in bags. This is how my bike was built and while 
it's certainly not a superlight as I'm not a superlight rider, it's lighter 
than any production Riv I've ever owned (and I've owned a bunch). Noticably 
out of the box and noticably built up and ridden. 

As the old adage goes, less weight costs more money. A custom frame is more 
expensive than a production frame and one of the luxuries you pay for is it 
can be built to a max weight limit I and most of the dudes in this thread 
probably couldn't ride. Because it's custom and not for us! I think this 
bike would be spectacular. 

Joe "for the love of Pete is he still talking?" Bernard 

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 8:36:22 AM UTC-8 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA 
wrote:

> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> …
>>
> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. …
>>
>
> You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't 
> really make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a 
> bike ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I 
> can't usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I 
> have to shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch 
> and pass men on road bikes because you're on a Platypus can't really be 
> supported by physics, if indeed weight is the only differentiator. I also 
> suspect you may be severely underestimating the concept of placebos and 
> that extra 100 watts a new bike can bring. :)
>
> I'm fortunate enough to have too many bikes, from lightweight, mostly 
> carbon+titanium wonders that'll probably float away with a strong breeze, 
> to my stout Atlantis that weighs more than my Wilbury (here's the mixte 
> reference for relevance!) because it has front-rear racks, full stainless 
> fenders, basket, dynamo lights, and a heavy Abus lock on it full-time. 
> Anyway, on longish climbs (e.g., Kings Mountain or Old La Honda, which 
> averages almost 8% for 3-4 miles), when I'm just tooling along with friends 
> and not trying to make PR, I can't tell the difference between my 
> lightweight wonder and my moderately heavy 24lb randonneur (Riv custom, 
> also with fenders, dynamo light, front rack, etc), based on a clock; that's 
> almost a 10 lb "penalty" I can't feel if I'm not actively looking for it. 
> Come to think of it, on leisure rides, I've intentionally taken my 
> super-duty Atlantis because it can carry all sorts of goodies for the 
> post-ride snacking, and I wasn't penalized or regretful of the decision.
>
> What I have found to really impact the "feel" of the bike, in terms of 
> responsiveness and subjective "lightness", is the tire. On the same exact 
> bikes, having supple, better rolling tires such as the Rene Herse tires can 
> make a night-day difference, compare

Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

That is the one.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>
> 54cm
> $2600
> North Smithfield, RI
>
> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>
>
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
> Thank you Matthew,
> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting
> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki
> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for
> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and
> get it anyway.
> Best,
> Rob
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 52cm
>> $900
>> Tuscon, AZ
>>
>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 59cm
>> $900
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>
>> Sam Hillborne
>> 60cm
>> $1623
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>
>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>> 47.5cm
>> $1990
>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>
>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking
>> to move one. I don't care what color it is.
>> Robert Blunt
>> Pennington, NJ
>>
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>> .
>>
>>
>>
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>>
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Re: [RBW] 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Steve Palincsar]

On 1/26/21 2:12 PM, Tim Baldwin wrote:


I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm 
hoping to be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. 
With touring in mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather 
hard to find right now.



I found several googling for it:

Amazon has it here: 
https://www.amazon.com/CASSETTE-SPROCKET-CS-HG400-9-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36-PRE-ASSEMBLED/dp/B00LGLYYRM/ref=asc_df_B00LGLYYRM/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312125954623&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5662877163246329831&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9008192&hvtargid=pla-443012453261&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=63589537658&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=312125954623&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5662877163246329831&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9008192&hvtargid=pla-443012453261


Probikesupply: 
https://www.probikesupply.com/products/shimano-hg400-9-speed-12-36t-cassette?variant=44015144789¤cy=USD&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=google+shopping


Lordgun: 
https://www.lordgun.com/shimano-alivio-cs-hg400-9-9s-cassette?option=16148&destination=USA¤cy=USD




Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've 
mostly used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go 
up to 10 speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on 
ebay I mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm 
using a Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 
speed work. However there's something about the ease of setup and 
maintenance of 9 speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.



The only thing "wrong" with the 12-36 is it's kind of heavy.


--
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia
USA

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[RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[lconley]

Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old 9-speed 
Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider than the 9-speed. I 
just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12 tooth 1st position cog in place of 
the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub 
for my Gus Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5 
tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the hub flange

Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:

>
> I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping to 
> be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With touring in 
> mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right now. 
> I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 would 
> give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t, which 
> I don't use, and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my trip. 
> With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range of 21 to 100 gear 
> inches, which seems perfect to me. After seeing the high demand for bike 
> parts in 2020, what do Riv riders predict for future availability of 9 
> speed parts? I found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for 
> sale on ebay, do I stock up now?
>
> Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've mostly 
> used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go up to 10 
> speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I 
> mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm using a 
> Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 speed work. 
> However there's something about the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 
> speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.
>
> Tim B in Chicago
>

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

It's sort of keeping me up at night to be honest. If I could sell my 55
soma grand randonneur quickly, it would help.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:36 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> That is the one.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>
>> 54cm
>> $2600
>> North Smithfield, RI
>>
>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting
>> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki
>> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for
>> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and
>> get it anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
>> matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 52cm
>>> $900
>>> Tuscon, AZ
>>>
>>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 59cm
>>> $900
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>>
>>> Sam Hillborne
>>> 60cm
>>> $1623
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>>
>>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>>> 47.5cm
>>> $1990
>>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>>
>>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
>>> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>
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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Collin A]

Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world to 
buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier lugs)...

Collin in Sacramento

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:

> That is the one. 
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams  
> wrote:
>
>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>
>> 54cm
>> $2600
>> North Smithfield, RI
>>
>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting 
>> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki 
>> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for 
>> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and 
>> get it anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 52cm
>>> $900
>>> Tuscon, AZ
>>>
>>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 59cm
>>> $900
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>>
>>> Sam Hillborne
>>> 60cm
>>> $1623
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>>
>>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>>> 47.5cm
>>> $1990
>>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>>
>>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is 
>>> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:

> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world to
> buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier lugs)...
>
> Collin in Sacramento
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>
>> That is the one.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>>
>>> 54cm
>>> $2600
>>> North Smithfield, RI
>>>
>>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>>
>>> Thank you Matthew,
>>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting
>>> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki
>>> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for
>>> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and
>>> get it anyway.
>>> Best,
>>> Rob
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:

 Clem Smith Jr.
 52cm
 $900
 Tuscon, AZ

 https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html

 Clem Smith Jr.
 59cm
 $900
 Petaluma, CA

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html

 Sam Hillborne
 60cm
 $1623
 Petaluma, CA

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html

 A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
 47.5cm
 $1990
 Surrey, BC (Canada)

 https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html





 On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

 Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
 looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
 Robert Blunt
 Pennington, NJ

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>>>
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>>> 
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>>>
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
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> 

Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it is
referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both his
bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger


On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>
>> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world
>> to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier
>> lugs)...
>>
>> Collin in Sacramento
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>
>>> That is the one.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:

 54cm
 $2600
 North Smithfield, RI

 https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html



 On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

 Thank you Matthew,
 I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting
 until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki
 they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for
 the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and
 get it anyway.
 Best,
 Rob

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams 
 wrote:

> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 52cm
> $900
> Tuscon, AZ
>
> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 59cm
> $900
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>
> Sam Hillborne
> 60cm
> $1623
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>
> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
> 47.5cm
> $1990
> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>
> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
> Robert Blunt
> Pennington, NJ
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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> 
> .
>
>
>
> --
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

Of course while I was laboriously typing my latest manifesto Linda and Leah 
covered it all more succinctly and with more flair. Oy! Anyway I stand by 
my redundant comments. Repeatedly! 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:08 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> *Disclaimer: I promised myself I wouldn't come back to this thread and get 
> into a debate about lightness but I'm Joe Bernard, world reknown for not 
> knowing when to shut up! So here goes..
>
> In this very specific case of a very light and strong rider who's already 
> got that motor in tip-top shape, the weight of the frame is going to 
> matter. Swapping out to custom wheels and better (and tubeless) tires isn't 
> in the offing because that's already been done to these bikes. Does this 
> mean Riv production frames are too heavy? Of course not, it just means 
> they're built to a standard the average buyer can ride without snapping in 
> half. Which brings us to the Custom Clem idea, which - this is the part 
> where I start repeating myself and drive y'all crazy - I wouldn't approach 
> as "Hey can you make me a superlight frame?" It's simply a matter of having 
> a frame designed around the rider's height and weight, plus expected level 
> of poundage to be carried in bags. This is how my bike was built and while 
> it's certainly not a superlight as I'm not a superlight rider, it's lighter 
> than any production Riv I've ever owned (and I've owned a bunch). Noticably 
> out of the box and noticably built up and ridden. 
>
> As the old adage goes, less weight costs more money. A custom frame is 
> more expensive than a production frame and one of the luxuries you pay for 
> is it can be built to a max weight limit I and most of the dudes in this 
> thread probably couldn't ride. Because it's custom and not for us! I think 
> this bike would be spectacular. 
>
> Joe "for the love of Pete is he still talking?" Bernard 
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 8:36:22 AM UTC-8 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, 
> CA wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> …
>>>
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>>
>>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on 
>>> road bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to 
>>> pedal even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer 
>>> Hill. It’s easy and it’s fun. …
>>>
>>
>> You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't 
>> really make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a 
>> bike ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I 
>> can't usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I 
>> have to shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch 
>> and pass men on road bikes because you're on a Platypus can't really be 
>> supported by physics, if indeed weight is the only differentiator. I also 
>> suspect you may be severely underestimating the concept of placebos and 
>> that extra 100 watts a new bike can bring. :)
>>
>> I'm fortunate enough to have too many bikes, from lightweight, mostly 
>> carbon+titanium wonders that'll probably float away with a strong breeze, 
>> to my stout Atlantis that weighs more than my Wilbury (here's the mixte 
>> reference for relevance!) because it has front-rear racks, full stainless 
>> fenders, basket, dynamo lights, and a heavy Abus lock on it full-time. 
>> Anyway, on longish climbs (e.g., Kings Mountain or Old La Honda, which 
>> averages almost 8% for 3-4 miles), when I'm just tooling along with friends 
>> and not trying to make PR, I can't tell the difference between my 
>> lightweight wonder and my moderately heavy 24lb randonneur (Riv custom, 
>> also with fenders, dynamo light, front rack, etc), based on a clock; that's 
>> almost a 10 lb "penalty" I can't feel if I'm not actively looking for it. 
>> Come to think of it, on leisure rides, I've intentionally taken my 
>> super-duty Atlantis because it can carry all sorts o

Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Collin A]

Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any issues. 
Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:

> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it is 
> referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both his 
> bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
>> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>>
>>> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world 
>>> to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier 
>>> lugs)...
>>>
>>> Collin in Sacramento
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>>
 That is the one. 

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams  
 wrote:

> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>
> 54cm
> $2600
> North Smithfield, RI
>
> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>
>
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
> Thank you Matthew,
> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting 
> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki 
> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is 
> for 
> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet 
> and 
> get it anyway.
> Best,
> Rob
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 52cm
>> $900
>> Tuscon, AZ
>>
>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 59cm
>> $900
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>
>> Sam Hillborne
>> 60cm
>> $1623
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>
>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>> 47.5cm
>> $1990
>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>
>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is 
>> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>> Robert Blunt
>> Pennington, NJ
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 
>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
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>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7264102E-D4D5-4558-B704-74060DA71B36%40gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>
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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Matthew Williams]

The ad is still active so I just emailed him and cc'd you. 

Hopefully he'll respond to both of us; if he only replies to me I'll forward 
his contact information to you.



On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:52 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it is 
> referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both his 
> bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world to 
> buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier lugs)...
> 
> Collin in Sacramento
> 
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
> That is the one. 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams  
> wrote:
> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
> 
> 54cm
> $2600
> North Smithfield, RI
> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
> 
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting until 
>> the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki they are 
>> looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for the whole 
>> bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and get it 
>> anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>> 
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams  
>> wrote:
>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>> 
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 52cm
>> $900
>> Tuscon, AZ
>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>> 
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 59cm
>> $900
>> Petaluma, CA
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>> 
>> Sam Hillborne
>> 60cm
>> $1623
>> Petaluma, CA
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>> 
>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>> 47.5cm
>> $1990
>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking 
>>> to move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com.
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7264102E-D4D5-4558-B704-74060DA71B36%40gmail.com.
>> 
>> -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> 
> 
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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A  wrote:

> Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any
> issues. Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>
>> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it is
>> referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both his
>> bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>>>
 Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world
 to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier
 lugs)...

 Collin in Sacramento

 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:

> That is the one.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>
>> 54cm
>> $2600
>> North Smithfield, RI
>>
>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting
>> until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki
>> they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is 
>> for
>> the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet 
>> and
>> get it anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
>> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 52cm
>>> $900
>>> Tuscon, AZ
>>>
>>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 59cm
>>> $900
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>>
>>> Sam Hillborne
>>> 60cm
>>> $1623
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>>
>>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>>> 47.5cm
>>> $1990
>>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>>
>>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
>>> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7264102E-D4D5-4558-B704-74060DA71B36%40gmail.com
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx-kZPj8QhRCFs1DQ%3DOqKcCwEThAi9KcvnqJ7R-NqLixSQ%40mail.gmail.com
>> 
>> .
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because yo

Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

I just tried again. I will see if it works this time.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:04 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A  wrote:
>
>> Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any
>> issues. Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>
>>> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it
>>> is referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both
>>> his bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>>
 Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:

> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the
> world to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier
> lugs)...
>
> Collin in Sacramento
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>
>> That is the one.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
>> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>>
>>> 54cm
>>> $2600
>>> North Smithfield, RI
>>>
>>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thank you Matthew,
>>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be
>>> waiting until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a
>>> saluki they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas 
>>> it
>>> is for the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the
>>> bullet and get it anyway.
>>> Best,
>>> Rob
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
>>> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:

 Clem Smith Jr.
 52cm
 $900
 Tuscon, AZ

 https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html

 Clem Smith Jr.
 59cm
 $900
 Petaluma, CA

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html

 Sam Hillborne
 60cm
 $1623
 Petaluma, CA

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html

 A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
 47.5cm
 $1990
 Surrey, BC (Canada)

 https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html





 On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt 
 wrote:

 Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
 looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
 Robert Blunt
 Pennington, NJ

 --
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
 Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
 send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
 To view this discussion on the web visit
 https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
 
 .



 --
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
 Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
 send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
 To view this discussion on the web visit
 https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7264102E-D4D5-4558-B704-74060DA71B36%40gmail.com
 
 .

>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx-kZPj8QhRCFs1DQ%3DOqKcCwEThAi9KcvnqJ7R-NqLixSQ%40mail.gmail.com
>>>

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

You are missing the other half of the argument.  There is a reason 
virtually every step through out there runs the gamut from beefy to tank 
like: the design of a step through frame does not lend itself to being 
created from a lightweight tube set. I don't think many frame builders 
would be eager to take it on, even for a relatively lighter rider, though 
one who most definitely puts out power above her weight class, another 
consideration. I don't think Rivendell would do it as a custom. I could of 
course be wrong. One last time, there is a reason the basic safety bicycle 
ended up as a diamond frame, ie, two triangles. Go away from that and you 
need to start beefing up your tubing. This is why you see the designs of 
the true step throughs above with one or two tubes connecting the two tubes 
running from head tube to seat tube.  A mixte is essentially the same 
physical structure as a diamond with a very sloped top tube. Which is why 
you can't step through it. Make it low enough to step through, and you lose 
the remaining strength of the triangle and need to compensate somewhere 
else.

Sure, Rivendells get criticized by lots of people for being "overbuilt." 
Many (even/especially overweight men) would say that even of Leah's 
Platypus. But of all the bikes in the Riv lineup to attempt to put on a 
diet, the Clem L is not the one to pick. *Vive la difference.*

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:36:08 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> *Disclaimer: I promised myself I wouldn't come back to this thread and get 
> into a debate about lightness but I'm Joe Bernard, world reknown for not 
> knowing when to shut up! So here goes..
>
> In this very specific case of a very light and strong rider who's already 
> got that motor in tip-top shape, the weight of the frame is going to 
> matter. Swapping out to custom wheels and better (and tubeless) tires isn't 
> in the offing because that's already been done to these bikes. Does this 
> mean Riv production frames are too heavy? Of course not, it just means 
> they're built to a standard the average buyer can ride without snapping in 
> half. Which brings us to the Custom Clem idea, which - this is the part 
> where I start repeating myself and drive y'all crazy - I wouldn't approach 
> as "Hey can you make me a superlight frame?" It's simply a matter of having 
> a frame designed around the rider's height and weight, plus expected level 
> of poundage to be carried in bags. This is how my bike was built and while 
> it's certainly not a superlight as I'm not a superlight rider, it's lighter 
> than any production Riv I've ever owned (and I've owned a bunch). Noticably 
> out of the box and noticably built up and ridden. 
>
> As the old adage goes, less weight costs more money. A custom frame is 
> more expensive than a production frame and one of the luxuries you pay for 
> is it can be built to a max weight limit I and most of the dudes in this 
> thread probably couldn't ride. Because it's custom and not for us! I think 
> this bike would be spectacular. 
>
> Joe "for the love of Pete is he still talking?" Bernard 
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 8:36:22 AM UTC-8 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, 
> CA wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> …
>>>
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>>
>>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on 
>>> road bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to 
>>> pedal even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer 
>>> Hill. It’s easy and it’s fun. …
>>>
>>
>> You can't argue against physics. A couple of pound here or there won't 
>> really make a big difference on most rides, especially if you're just on a 
>> bike ride. A full water bottle is about 1.5 pounds, for example, and I 
>> can't usually tell if my two water bottles are full or empty on rides (I 
>> have to shake them). Thus, your comment about suddenly being able to catch 
>> and pass men on road bikes because you're o

Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

Seems to have gone through, no bounce back message this time.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:07 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> I just tried again. I will see if it works this time.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:04 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
>> Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A  wrote:
>>
>>> Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any
>>> issues. Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>>
 But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it
 is referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both
 his bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger


 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>
>> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the
>> world to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with 
>> pointier
>> lugs)...
>>
>> Collin in Sacramento
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>
>>> That is the one.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
>>> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:

 54cm
 $2600
 North Smithfield, RI

 https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html



 On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt 
 wrote:

 Thank you Matthew,
 I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be
 waiting until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has 
 a
 saluki they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it 
 alas it
 is for the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the
 bullet and get it anyway.
 Best,
 Rob

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
 matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 52cm
> $900
> Tuscon, AZ
>
> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>
> Clem Smith Jr.
> 59cm
> $900
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>
> Sam Hillborne
> 60cm
> $1623
> Petaluma, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>
> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
> 47.5cm
> $1990
> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>
> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt 
> wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
> Robert Blunt
> Pennington, NJ
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
> 
> .
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7264102E-D4D5-4558-B704-74060DA71B36%40gmail.com
> 
> .
>

 --
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 To unsubscribe from this group and stop re

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Leah Peterson]

Yes, we might be missing that part. I don’t know about step-throughs in history 
- I’ve only had the Clementine, so I didn’t know they tend to be beefy. 

But then, what of the Susie? That’s not a diamond frame. It’s got that swoopy 
top tube that must make it less strong than the diamond frame and Rivendell 
says to get it if you are of a certain weight. If weight doesn’t matter, then 
why offer the Susie?

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 12:12 PM, Mark Roland  wrote:
> 
> 
> You are missing the other half of the argument.  There is a reason virtually 
> every step through out there runs the gamut from beefy to tank like: the 
> design of a step through frame does not lend itself to being created from a 
> lightweight tube set. I don't think many frame builders would be eager to 
> take it on, even for a relatively lighter rider, though one who most 
> definitely puts out power above her weight class, another consideration. I 
> don't think Rivendell would do it as a custom. I could of course be wrong. 
> One last time, there is a reason the basic safety bicycle ended up as a 
> diamond frame, ie, two triangles. Go away from that and you need to start 
> beefing up your tubing. This is why you see the designs of the true step 
> throughs above with one or two tubes connecting the two tubes running from 
> head tube to seat tube.  A mixte is essentially the same physical structure 
> as a diamond with a very sloped top tube. Which is why you can't step through 
> it. Make it low enough to step through, and you lose the remaining strength 
> of the triangle and need to compensate somewhere else.
> 
> Sure, Rivendells get criticized by lots of people for being "overbuilt." Many 
> (even/especially overweight men) would say that even of Leah's Platypus. But 
> of all the bikes in the Riv lineup to attempt to put on a diet, the Clem L is 
> not the one to pick. Vive la difference.
> 
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:36:08 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>> *Disclaimer: I promised myself I wouldn't come back to this thread and get 
>> into a debate about lightness but I'm Joe Bernard, world reknown for not 
>> knowing when to shut up! So here goes..
>> 
>> In this very specific case of a very light and strong rider who's already 
>> got that motor in tip-top shape, the weight of the frame is going to matter. 
>> Swapping out to custom wheels and better (and tubeless) tires isn't in the 
>> offing because that's already been done to these bikes. Does this mean Riv 
>> production frames are too heavy? Of course not, it just means they're built 
>> to a standard the average buyer can ride without snapping in half. Which 
>> brings us to the Custom Clem idea, which - this is the part where I start 
>> repeating myself and drive y'all crazy - I wouldn't approach as "Hey can you 
>> make me a superlight frame?" It's simply a matter of having a frame designed 
>> around the rider's height and weight, plus expected level of poundage to be 
>> carried in bags. This is how my bike was built and while it's certainly not 
>> a superlight as I'm not a superlight rider, it's lighter than any production 
>> Riv I've ever owned (and I've owned a bunch). Noticably out of the box and 
>> noticably built up and ridden. 
>> 
>> As the old adage goes, less weight costs more money. A custom frame is more 
>> expensive than a production frame and one of the luxuries you pay for is it 
>> can be built to a max weight limit I and most of the dudes in this thread 
>> probably couldn't ride. Because it's custom and not for us! I think this 
>> bike would be spectacular. 
>> 
>> Joe "for the love of Pete is he still talking?" Bernard 
>> 
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 8:36:22 AM UTC-8 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA 
>>> wrote:
 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
 wrote:
 …
>>> 
 So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
 nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
 wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, 
 and it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up 
 trying to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When 
 my boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
 stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
 with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
 day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
 inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
 thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
 here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
 and beat us all from that day forward. 
 
>>> 
 When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
 bikes all the time now, Bosco bars

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Paul Clifton]

On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 2:07:32 PM UTC-6 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

>
> It’s hard for me to believe a lighter step-through would be too flex ...
>

I think the flex Mark mentioned may be similar to the flex they had to 
engineer out of the baby bike - a rotation around the axis from front to 
back of the bike, a twisting. They did that using an downtube that was 
ovalized in different directions at the top and bottom of the tube, which I 
think the Platypus also has, but I haven't confirmed that. Since that's in 
Grant's head now, and because he seems to like a bike design challenge, I 
would really be interested in his perspective on this. Maybe he wouldn't 
think it's worth actually doing, but he might have some interesting 
thoughts on what it would take.

Paul in AR

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Robert Blunt]

Matthew Williams, do let me know if he writes you back. Pretty much my
dream bike since I stupidly sold my 56 Bleriot ten years ago or so. Worst
move I ever made.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:14 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Seems to have gone through, no bounce back message this time.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:07 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
>> I just tried again. I will see if it works this time.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:04 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>>> Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any
 issues. Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?

 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:

> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it
> is referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both
> his bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt 
> wrote:
>
>> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>>
>>> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the
>>> world to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with 
>>> pointier
>>> lugs)...
>>>
>>> Collin in Sacramento
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>>
 That is the one.

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
 matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>
> 54cm
> $2600
> North Smithfield, RI
>
> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>
>
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt 
> wrote:
>
> Thank you Matthew,
> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be
> waiting until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone 
> has a
> saluki they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it 
> alas it
> is for the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite 
> the
> bullet and get it anyway.
> Best,
> Rob
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 52cm
>> $900
>> Tuscon, AZ
>>
>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 59cm
>> $900
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>
>> Sam Hillborne
>> 60cm
>> $1623
>> Petaluma, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>
>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>> 47.5cm
>> $1990
>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>
>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is
>> looking to move one. I don't care what color it is.
>> Robert Blunt
>> Pennington, NJ
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
>> 
>> .
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[lconley]

As of now, I own 6 Rivendells with "lower top tubes", (1) Betty Foy (60cm - 
700C), (2) Clementine (52cm - 650B), (3) Rosco Bubbe Medium Mountain Mixte 
650B, (4) Rosco Baby (650B), (5) "Keven's Bike" - Cargo Bike (650B), and 
(6) Gus Boots Willsen (Large - 700c). I have been trying to create the 
perfect city/commuter bike. At 64 and overweight, I can still swing the leg 
over, but it is getting more awkward.
The Gus Boots Willsen doesn't really belong in this group - the lower top 
tube is really just for extra crotch clearance during a fast dismount - I 
never considered it for a commuter.
The Betty Foy has been claimed by my wife - she loves the hearts in the 
cut-outs and I am really too heavy for it.
My daughter just had a baby, so the Rosco Baby is going to be gone for a 
while, but I really like the length of the bike - I have short legs and a 
long torso.
Only two are what I would consider Step-Throughs - the Clementine and the 
Rosco Baby.
I was hoping the Keven's Cargo bike would be a step-though, but not for me, 
maybe for someone with a taller PBH. it does have plenty of stand-over 
clearance for waiting at lights though. I am currently adjusting the squeal 
out of the V-brakes. Still needs lighting and fenders installed to be 
complete, but it is rideable.
I have Wald baskets on the Clementine (Rivendell's large) - and Keven's 
Cargo (Wald 157 Giant Delivery). The Wald baskets are very, very heavy. I 
have to wonder what Leah's Clem would ride like sans the basket and front 
rack.
The first of these purchased was the Clementine, but I was never in love 
with it, but it is a step through and it is looking better over time. I had 
Bosco-Mooses on it, it would probably be better with Wavies on it for me.
I have yet to complete and ride the Medium Mountain Mixte.


Laing
Delray Beach FL


>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Paul Clifton]

I can't tell from the picture, but I was talking about the tube that 
connects the top tube to the bottom bracket. I think one of the early 
drawing of the platypus showed it though.

On the baby bike, the tube is an oval near the head tube and near the 
bottom bracket, but it is circular in the middle. The plane of the 
ovalization changes, so if you look straight on from the side of the bike, 
the tube looks bigger near the head tube and skinnier at the bottom 
bracket. But if you look straight down from the top of the bike, the tube 
looks fatter near the bottom bracket and skinnier near the head tube.

I can't even draw it with a pencil to show you because my lines aren't 
good, and it's barely perceptible in photos. I've been trying to capture it.

So like, if you have a playdough snake laying on a table. Smash it against 
the table near the head and pinch it near the tail. The head gets flat in 
one direction. The tail gets flat 90 degrees. Now imagine doing that with a 
metal tube.

Paul

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:37:05 PM UTC-6 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> This?
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 12:32 PM, Paul Clifton  wrote:
>
> 
>
> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 2:07:32 PM UTC-6 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>>
>> It’s hard for me to believe a lighter step-through would be too flex ...
>>
>
> I think the flex Mark mentioned may be similar to the flex they had to 
> engineer out of the baby bike - a rotation around the axis from front to 
> back of the bike, a twisting. They did that using an downtube that was 
> ovalized in different directions at the top and bottom of the tube, which I 
> think the Platypus also has, but I haven't confirmed that. Since that's in 
> Grant's head now, and because he seems to like a bike design challenge, I 
> would really be interested in his perspective on this. Maybe he wouldn't 
> think it's worth actually doing, but he might have some interesting 
> thoughts on what it would take.
>
> Paul in AR
>
> -- 
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/vA47Guyb6pQ/unsubscribe
> .
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Tim Baldwin]

Steve, thanks for the links. I guess I meant hard to find in that I went to 
my LBS who did not have any in stock and could not find any currently 
available through distributors. I figure this low supply is due to the 
surge in sales last year but curious if it could be the beginning of the 
industry phasing out of 9 and lower speed parts moving forward. I'm fine 
ordering some things online (mostly through Riv or other small 
manufacturers that sell directly) but I do prefer supporting local shops.

I could also swap chain rings but the crankset is new and my current 
cassette is older. Seems easier to swap the cassette. And I'm quite happy 
with the current steps in my gearing.

Laing, I could fit 11 speed on my new wheel I'm building with a new model 
MI5 hub. I have used (and still have in my bin) a SRAM NX 11 speed 
cassette/derailleur before. I found the gear range lacking as it is 1x 
only. I also tried the Microshift Advent 9 speed. That one I did not like 
steps between gears as much. I guess after trying some of the newer stuff, 
I'm having trouble seeing the appeal. I can get the gear range I'm looking 
for with a 2x9. The 1x systems seem to either give up range or are 
ridiculously expensive. There's also something about 9 speed looking 
"right" to me on a Rivendell.

My main concern is getting parts in the future. I helped out at my LBS over 
the summer because they were so busy. This will most likely be another busy 
year for bike shops. I think I'll order a handful of cassettes to tide me 
over for a while. I hope that as manufacturers catch up with resupplying 
parts they continue to make "outdated" 9, 8 and 7 speed stuff. There are 
certainly a greater number of options for cassettes when going to 10 and 
above.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:39:29 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:

> Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old 9-speed 
> Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider than the 9-speed. I 
> just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12 tooth 1st position cog in place of 
> the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub 
> for my Gus Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5 
> tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the hub flange
>
> Laing
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>>
>> I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping 
>> to be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With touring 
>> in mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right 
>> now. I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 
>> would give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t, 
>> which I don't use, and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my 
>> trip. With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range of 21 to 100 
>> gear inches, which seems perfect to me. After seeing the high demand for 
>> bike parts in 2020, what do Riv riders predict for future availability of 9 
>> speed parts? I found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for 
>> sale on ebay, do I stock up now?
>>
>> Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've mostly 
>> used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go up to 10 
>> speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I 
>> mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm using a 
>> Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 speed work. 
>> However there's something about the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 
>> speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.
>>
>> Tim B in Chicago
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[lconley]

Shimano makes 11-34, 11-36, 11-40 11 speed mountain cassettes. The 11-34 
and 11-36 are pretty pricey though.

Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:44:04 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:

> Steve, thanks for the links. I guess I meant hard to find in that I went 
> to my LBS who did not have any in stock and could not find any currently 
> available through distributors. I figure this low supply is due to the 
> surge in sales last year but curious if it could be the beginning of the 
> industry phasing out of 9 and lower speed parts moving forward. I'm fine 
> ordering some things online (mostly through Riv or other small 
> manufacturers that sell directly) but I do prefer supporting local shops.
>
> I could also swap chain rings but the crankset is new and my current 
> cassette is older. Seems easier to swap the cassette. And I'm quite happy 
> with the current steps in my gearing.
>
> Laing, I could fit 11 speed on my new wheel I'm building with a new model 
> MI5 hub. I have used (and still have in my bin) a SRAM NX 11 speed 
> cassette/derailleur before. I found the gear range lacking as it is 1x 
> only. I also tried the Microshift Advent 9 speed. That one I did not like 
> steps between gears as much. I guess after trying some of the newer stuff, 
> I'm having trouble seeing the appeal. I can get the gear range I'm looking 
> for with a 2x9. The 1x systems seem to either give up range or are 
> ridiculously expensive. There's also something about 9 speed looking 
> "right" to me on a Rivendell.
>
> My main concern is getting parts in the future. I helped out at my LBS 
> over the summer because they were so busy. This will most likely be another 
> busy year for bike shops. I think I'll order a handful of cassettes to tide 
> me over for a while. I hope that as manufacturers catch up with resupplying 
> parts they continue to make "outdated" 9, 8 and 7 speed stuff. There are 
> certainly a greater number of options for cassettes when going to 10 and 
> above.
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:39:29 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>
>> Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old 9-speed 
>> Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider than the 9-speed. I 
>> just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12 tooth 1st position cog in place of 
>> the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub 
>> for my Gus Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5 
>> tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the hub flange
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping 
>>> to be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With touring 
>>> in mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right 
>>> now. I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 
>>> would give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t, 
>>> which I don't use, and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my 
>>> trip. With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range of 21 to 100 
>>> gear inches, which seems perfect to me. After seeing the high demand for 
>>> bike parts in 2020, what do Riv riders predict for future availability of 9 
>>> speed parts? I found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for 
>>> sale on ebay, do I stock up now?
>>>
>>> Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've 
>>> mostly used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go up to 
>>> 10 speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I 
>>> mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm using a 
>>> Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 speed work. 
>>> However there's something about the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 
>>> speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.
>>>
>>> Tim B in Chicago
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Matthew Williams]

He just wrote me back! I forwarded the email to you.

On Jan 26, 2021, at 1:06 PM, Robert Blunt  wrote:

> Matthew Williams, do let me know if he writes you back. Pretty much my dream 
> bike since I stupidly sold my 56 Bleriot ten years ago or so. Worst move I 
> ever made.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:14 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
> Seems to have gone through, no bounce back message this time.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:07 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
> I just tried again. I will see if it works this time.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:04 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
> Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A  wrote:
> Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any issues. 
> Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?
> 
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if it is 
> referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling both his 
> bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the trigger
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
> Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the world to 
> buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with pointier lugs)...
> 
> Collin in Sacramento
> 
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
> That is the one. 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams  
> wrote:
> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
> 
> 54cm
> $2600
> North Smithfield, RI
> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
> 
> 
> 
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
> 
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be waiting until 
>> the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone has a saluki they are 
>> looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it alas it is for the whole 
>> bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite the bullet and get it 
>> anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>> 
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams  
>> wrote:
>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>> 
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 52cm
>> $900
>> Tuscon, AZ
>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>> 
>> Clem Smith Jr.
>> 59cm
>> $900
>> Petaluma, CA
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>> 
>> Sam Hillborne
>> 60cm
>> $1623
>> Petaluma, CA
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>> 
>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>> 47.5cm
>> $1990
>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone is looking 
>>> to move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> 
>> 
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[RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Joe Bernard]

There's always Microshift. They make some way-wide-range Shimano compatible 
9-speeders for the Advent group and seem determined to keep feeding the 
markets the Big S is neglecting. 


On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:55:03 PM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> Shimano makes 11-34, 11-36, 11-40 11 speed mountain cassettes. The 11-34 
> and 11-36 are pretty pricey though.
>
> Laing
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:44:04 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> Steve, thanks for the links. I guess I meant hard to find in that I went 
>> to my LBS who did not have any in stock and could not find any currently 
>> available through distributors. I figure this low supply is due to the 
>> surge in sales last year but curious if it could be the beginning of the 
>> industry phasing out of 9 and lower speed parts moving forward. I'm fine 
>> ordering some things online (mostly through Riv or other small 
>> manufacturers that sell directly) but I do prefer supporting local shops.
>>
>> I could also swap chain rings but the crankset is new and my current 
>> cassette is older. Seems easier to swap the cassette. And I'm quite happy 
>> with the current steps in my gearing.
>>
>> Laing, I could fit 11 speed on my new wheel I'm building with a new model 
>> MI5 hub. I have used (and still have in my bin) a SRAM NX 11 speed 
>> cassette/derailleur before. I found the gear range lacking as it is 1x 
>> only. I also tried the Microshift Advent 9 speed. That one I did not like 
>> steps between gears as much. I guess after trying some of the newer stuff, 
>> I'm having trouble seeing the appeal. I can get the gear range I'm looking 
>> for with a 2x9. The 1x systems seem to either give up range or are 
>> ridiculously expensive. There's also something about 9 speed looking 
>> "right" to me on a Rivendell.
>>
>> My main concern is getting parts in the future. I helped out at my LBS 
>> over the summer because they were so busy. This will most likely be another 
>> busy year for bike shops. I think I'll order a handful of cassettes to tide 
>> me over for a while. I hope that as manufacturers catch up with resupplying 
>> parts they continue to make "outdated" 9, 8 and 7 speed stuff. There are 
>> certainly a greater number of options for cassettes when going to 10 and 
>> above.
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:39:29 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old 9-speed 
>>> Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider than the 9-speed. I 
>>> just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12 tooth 1st position cog in place of 
>>> the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub 
>>> for my Gus Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5 
>>> tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the hub flange
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>>>

 I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping 
 to be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With 
 touring 
 in mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right 
 now. I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 
 would give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t, 
 which I don't use, and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my 
 trip. With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range of 21 to 
 100 
 gear inches, which seems perfect to me. After seeing the high demand for 
 bike parts in 2020, what do Riv riders predict for future availability of 
 9 
 speed parts? I found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for 
 sale on ebay, do I stock up now?

 Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a difference? I've 
 mostly used cheaper cassettes but wondering if would make sense to go up 
 to 
 10 speed to take advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I 
 mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum. I'm using a 
 Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I could make 10 speed work. 
 However there's something about the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 
 speed shifting that makes me want to stay in that world.

 Tim B in Chicago

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Steve Palincsar]

For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny microdrive 
chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as 
unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket 
(and for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 
1st position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very 
top end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.



On 1/26/21 4:55 PM, lconley wrote:
Shimano makes 11-34, 11-36, 11-40 11 speed mountain cassettes. The 
11-34 and 11-36 are pretty pricey though.


Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:44:04 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:

Steve, thanks for the links. I guess I meant hard to find in that
I went to my LBS who did not have any in stock and could not find
any currently available through distributors. I figure this low
supply is due to the surge in sales last year but curious if it
could be the beginning of the industry phasing out of 9 and lower
speed parts moving forward. I'm fine ordering some things online
(mostly through Riv or other small manufacturers that sell
directly) but I do prefer supporting local shops.

I could also swap chain rings but the crankset is new and my
current cassette is older. Seems easier to swap the cassette. And
I'm quite happy with the current steps in my gearing.

Laing, I could fit 11 speed on my new wheel I'm building with a
new model MI5 hub. I have used (and still have in my bin) a SRAM
NX 11 speed cassette/derailleur before. I found the gear range
lacking as it is 1x only. I also tried the Microshift Advent 9
speed. That one I did not like steps between gears as much. I
guess after trying some of the newer stuff, I'm having trouble
seeing the appeal. I can get the gear range I'm looking for with a
2x9. The 1x systems seem to either give up range or are
ridiculously expensive. There's also something about 9 speed
looking "right" to me on a Rivendell.

My main concern is getting parts in the future. I helped out at my
LBS over the summer because they were so busy. This will most
likely be another busy year for bike shops. I think I'll order a
handful of cassettes to tide me over for a while. I hope that as
manufacturers catch up with resupplying parts they continue to
make "outdated" 9, 8 and 7 speed stuff. There are certainly a
greater number of options for cassettes when going to 10 and above.

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:39:29 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:

Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old
9-speed Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider
than the 9-speed. I just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12
tooth 1st position cog in place of the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed
cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub for my Gus
Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5
tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the
hub flange

Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin
wrote:


I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my
Atlantis. I'm hoping to be able to do a tour this year
after staying local in 2020. With touring in mind, I'd
like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find
right now. I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat
Chicago. The 12-36 would give me the same ratios for my
normal riding but get rid of the 11t, which I don't use,
and would give me a 36t, which I foresee using on my trip.
With the VO 46/30 crank I'm using, this gives me a range
of 21 to 100 gear inches, which seems perfect to me. After
seeing the high demand for bike parts in 2020, what do Riv
riders predict for future availability of 9 speed parts? I
found someone with a stash of 12-36 9 speed cassettes for
sale on ebay, do I stock up now?

Also, how much does cassette price/quality make a
difference? I've mostly used cheaper cassettes but
wondering if would make sense to go up to 10 speed to take
advantage of fancier cassettes. The cassette on ebay I
mentioned is Alivio so on the lower end of the spectrum.
I'm using a Suntour thumb shifter in friction so I think I
could make 10 speed work. However there's something about
the ease of setup and maintenance of 9 speed shifting that
makes me want to stay in that world.

Tim B in Chicago

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[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Ed Fausto]

Hi iamkeith!
Please do take some photos and keep us updated on your fender experiments.
Yes, you are correct.  The fork crown has the tightest clearance.  When I 
had my Gus built by Rivendell I did not anticipated the potential fender 
issue and had V brakes installed with its straddle wire close to the tires.

With the Dia Compe 980, do you have to deflate your tires a lot to remove 
the wheel set?
On Wednesday, January 27, 2021 at 2:55:44 AM UTC+8 iamkeith wrote:

> Ed,  I have 2.8 tires on wide (34i) rims on my 56/700c Susie and am trying 
> to figure out fenders too.   I just tried a set of SKS Bluemel 75s in case 
> this experience helps:
>
> There is plenty of frame clearance, even with a good gap to the tire.  As 
> seems to be the case with many Rivendells, the tightest spot was at the 
> bottom of the fork crown - not at the seat tube or chainstays or braces, as 
> you'd expect with other bikes.   I don't think I would have even needed to 
> notch the rear for chain clearance, but that's a function of bottom bracket 
> spindle length so YMMV.  However, I did have interference at the cantilever 
> straddle wire.   (I used cantis instead of v brakes specifically because I 
> wanted to run big tires and fenders, which wouldn't fit under V-brakes.)  
>
> I could solve this and make these fenders work by raising the straddle 
> wire a tiny bit, but I'm reluctant to becasue I think I have them adjusted 
> pretty well for power.  Or I could notch the edge of the fender to allow 
> the cable to cut through, but that seems dangerous.   A different canti arm 
> profile might help too.  (I'm using the Dia Compe 980.) I was going to try 
> an extra-wide straddle-wire hanger - which would proably solve it - but I 
> kind of decided that the black fenders don't look so good on the bike.   If 
> you have a different color scheme than me though and don't mind black, this 
> may be a pretty good solution.  They're nice looking and nicely-made 
> fenders - just not like the silver SKS that I'm accustomed to.
>
> My next step is going to be to try the Simworks/Honjo Flat 80 fender, but 
> they're super expensive so I need to make as many measurements as possible 
> first.  The advantage of using aluminum will be that I can deform them to 
> fit the fork crown better than plastic ones, where the critical clearance 
> point would otherwise be as noted above.
>
> Last option will be to use some Planet Bike 60mm fenders, even though 
> those wouldn't provide full coverage.
>
> Boils down to a lot of trial and error unfortunately, but I can at least 
> confirm that it will be possible in one way or another.   I'm going to put 
> the Bluemel 75 fenders on another bike soon but haven't yet, in case you'd 
> like me to take some photos of it mocked up.
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:45:11 AM UTC-7 Ed Fausto wrote:
>
>> Hi Joe,
>> Looks like its a choice between a 27.5 plus tire versus fender with 
>> smaller tires.
>> I will first try the half-fender you suggested.
>> Thanks.
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:46:49 PM UTC+8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> I have a Susie/Wolbis with 27.5 x 2.25 Thunder Burts. I have SKS P65 
>>> fenders which I have test-fitted but not mounted and it looks like it'll 
>>> work but it's close. The max tire for these frames is 2.8 and unfortunately 
>>> I think you're going to have to drop down closer to what I'm using to get 
>>> full fenders in that space, too. Another option is to get those half-fender 
>>> things that mountain bikers use, PDW has some options there. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 12:14:58 AM UTC-8 Ed Fausto wrote:
>>>
 After a long wait, I finally received my GBW with 27.5 x 2.6" Bontrager 
 XR2 tires.
 Ever since I became a fan of Rivendell, I have been a fender convert 
 mostly using SKS fenders.

 Looking at the tire clearances of my GBW, it seems I do not have enough 
 space to install fenders.

 Anyone who has installed fenders with these hilly bikes?



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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Homer

[Joe Bernard]

Go get that bike! There's a surprising dearth of these pre-MIT Homers on 
the used market, especially in the smaller sizes. Buy it, keep it, ride it! 

PS. But make sure you fit it. Old 54cm AHH is a very different size from 
the current MIT model. It won't fit like your 56cm Bleriot. 

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:06:33 PM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:

> Matthew Williams, do let me know if he writes you back. Pretty much my 
> dream bike since I stupidly sold my 56 Bleriot ten years ago or so. Worst 
> move I ever made.
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:14 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>
>> Seems to have gone through, no bounce back message this time.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:07 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>
>>> I just tried again. I will see if it works this time.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:04 PM Robert Blunt  wrote:
>>>
 Or he blocked me somehow. No idea.

 On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 3:01 PM Collin A  wrote:

> Hm, I just tried going through the CL email and didn't run into any 
> issues. Maybe the listing was updated and the old link got broken?
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:52:43 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt wrote:
>
>> But now it saying that the IP address is blocked. I have no idea if 
>> it is referring to mine or his. He had said that he was possibly selling 
>> both his bikes this weekend, so maybe he did. I should have pulled the 
>> trigger
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:47 PM Robert Blunt  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah. I just send the owner an email. Can't help it anymore.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:42 PM Collin A  wrote:
>>>
 Not that you are asking, but I say go for it! It's better for the 
 world to buy used things rather than new (plus a special one with 
 pointier 
 lugs)...

 Collin in Sacramento

 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Robert Blunt 
 wrote:

> That is the one. 
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:23 PM Matthew Williams <
> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm assuming you've seen/are referring to this AHH/Saluki:
>>
>> 54cm
>> $2600
>> North Smithfield, RI
>>
>> https://providence.craigslist.org/bik/d/north-smithfield-rivendell-ahh-saluki/7247645759.html
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 11:15 AM, Robert Blunt  
>> wrote:
>>
>> Thank you Matthew,
>> I have seen these listing but am beginning to think I will be 
>> waiting until the new Homers come in in late Spring unless someone 
>> has a 
>> saluki they are looking to move. I have found a good saluki but it 
>> alas it 
>> is for the whole bike and a bit on the high side. I might just bite 
>> the 
>> bullet and get it anyway.
>> Best,
>> Rob
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 2:12 PM Matthew Williams <
>> matthewwil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Robert, here are some not-quite-but-almost options:
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 52cm
>>> $900
>>> Tuscon, AZ
>>>
>>> https://tucson.craigslist.org/bik/d/tucson-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-bicycle/7256052597.html
>>>
>>> Clem Smith Jr.
>>> 59cm
>>> $900
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-59cm/7265900990.html
>>>
>>> Sam Hillborne
>>> 60cm
>>> $1623
>>> Petaluma, CA
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/petaluma-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7265901728.html
>>>
>>> A. Homer Hilsen (complete bike)
>>> 47.5cm
>>> $1990
>>> Surrey, BC (Canada)
>>>
>>> https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/bik/d/surrey-rivendell-bicycle-works/7267691022.html
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 23, 2021, at 11:00 AM, Robert Blunt  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello everyone. I am looking for a 54 Homer frameset if anyone 
>>> is looking to move one. I don't care what color it is. 
>>> Robert Blunt
>>> Pennington, NJ
>>>
>>> -- 
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>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGTQPx9S8DFKLPEzEFo6Y4F6zN3anGazNVjz7oQeBv3LNoakdA%40mail.gmail.com
>>>  
>>> 

Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[aeroperf]

I’ve tried SRAM 11-32, Shimano HG300 11-32, HG400 11-34 & 12-36, all 
9-speed, and HG500 11-34 10-speed on my Sam, all run by Microshift flat bar 
9-speed shifters.  The 10-speed was run in friction mode, and was a bit of 
a stretch (literally) but do-able.  I've had no difficulty finding 9-speed 
equipment.

What is this quality issue of which you speak?  Except for the SRAM, which 
came on the bike from Riv and shifted just fine, they are all HyperGlide.  
So they have the equivalent shifting geometry (ramps and contouring).  What 
you get for more money is essentially a few grams lighter weight.  I only 
tried the different cassettes to check out different gearing ratios with my 
46-36-26 front end and had no problems with any of them.
I will note that the 9-speed cassettes would take a 7, 8, 9, or 10 speed 
chain, but the 10-speed really wanted a 10-speed chain.

>From someone who tours on pavement, dirt, and sand, don’t knock Alivio 
cassettes too badly.  they are reportedly better shifting than Acera and 
Altus, and reasonably bullet-proof.  Your real money should be put into the 
derailleur, though.
You might even be able to go to your LBS and just order a replacement ring 
to customize your gearing.  
https://si.shimano.com/pdfs/ev/EV-CS-HG400-9-3680A.pdf




On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:

> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny microdrive 
> chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as 
> unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket (and 
> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>
>
> On 1/26/21 4:55 PM, lconley wrote:
>
> Shimano makes 11-34, 11-36, 11-40 11 speed mountain cassettes. The 11-34 
> and 11-36 are pretty pricey though. 
>
> Laing
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:44:04 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> Steve, thanks for the links. I guess I meant hard to find in that I went 
>> to my LBS who did not have any in stock and could not find any currently 
>> available through distributors. I figure this low supply is due to the 
>> surge in sales last year but curious if it could be the beginning of the 
>> industry phasing out of 9 and lower speed parts moving forward. I'm fine 
>> ordering some things online (mostly through Riv or other small 
>> manufacturers that sell directly) but I do prefer supporting local shops.
>>
>> I could also swap chain rings but the crankset is new and my current 
>> cassette is older. Seems easier to swap the cassette. And I'm quite happy 
>> with the current steps in my gearing.
>>
>> Laing, I could fit 11 speed on my new wheel I'm building with a new model 
>> MI5 hub. I have used (and still have in my bin) a SRAM NX 11 speed 
>> cassette/derailleur before. I found the gear range lacking as it is 1x 
>> only. I also tried the Microshift Advent 9 speed. That one I did not like 
>> steps between gears as much. I guess after trying some of the newer stuff, 
>> I'm having trouble seeing the appeal. I can get the gear range I'm looking 
>> for with a 2x9. The 1x systems seem to either give up range or are 
>> ridiculously expensive. There's also something about 9 speed looking 
>> "right" to me on a Rivendell.
>>
>> My main concern is getting parts in the future. I helped out at my LBS 
>> over the summer because they were so busy. This will most likely be another 
>> busy year for bike shops. I think I'll order a handful of cassettes to tide 
>> me over for a while. I hope that as manufacturers catch up with resupplying 
>> parts they continue to make "outdated" 9, 8 and 7 speed stuff. There are 
>> certainly a greater number of options for cassettes when going to 10 and 
>> above.
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 1:39:29 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> Note that new Shimano 11-speed mountain cassettes fit on old 9-speed 
>>> Shimano style hubs - the 11 speed is only 0.05mm wider than the 9-speed. I 
>>> just put a 12-46 (I used a Shimano 12 tooth 1st position cog in place of 
>>> the 11 tooth cog) 11-speed cassette on my old Phil Wood 9-speed touring hub 
>>> for my Gus Boots Willsen. Fits beautifully - chain even clears the 29x2.5 
>>> tire by 4mm. The inner large cogs kind of cantilever over the hub flange 
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:51 PM UTC-5 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>>>

 I'm currently looking for 9 speed cassettes for my Atlantis. I'm hoping 
 to be able to do a tour this year after staying local in 2020. With 
 touring 
 in mind, I'd like 12-36 but it seems those are rather hard to find right 
 now. I currently have 11-32, but I'm riding in flat Chicago. The 12-36 
 would give me the same ratios for my normal riding but get rid of the 11t

Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[lconley]

There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9 speed. and a 13-38 8 
speed for that matter.

Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano 14-34 7 speed 
FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued an updated model within the last 
year) with a twist grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts 
obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think. But I do of course 
have a brand new in the box 12-36 Shimano 9 speed just in case

Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:

> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny microdrive 
> chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as 
> unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket (and 
> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Paul Clifton]

Yep, that shows it. A vertical oval near the head tube, transitioning to a 
sideways oval as it gets towards that bottom bracket.
Does the Platypus do that?

Paul

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:31:53 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:

> This?
> [image: Rosco_Baby-52_1600x (2).jpg]
> Laing
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:26:05 PM UTC-5 Paul Clifton wrote:
>
>> I can't tell from the picture, but I was talking about the tube that 
>> connects the top tube to the bottom bracket. I think one of the early 
>> drawing of the platypus showed it though.
>>
>> On the baby bike, the tube is an oval near the head tube and near the 
>> bottom bracket, but it is circular in the middle. The plane of the 
>> ovalization changes, so if you look straight on from the side of the bike, 
>> the tube looks bigger near the head tube and skinnier at the bottom 
>> bracket. But if you look straight down from the top of the bike, the tube 
>> looks fatter near the bottom bracket and skinnier near the head tube.
>>
>> I can't even draw it with a pencil to show you because my lines aren't 
>> good, and it's barely perceptible in photos. I've been trying to capture it.
>>
>> So like, if you have a playdough snake laying on a table. Smash it 
>> against the table near the head and pinch it near the tail. The head gets 
>> flat in one direction. The tail gets flat 90 degrees. Now imagine doing 
>> that with a metal tube.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

No ovalization at the headtube based on Platy pics I can find, there's a 
lug there. Which is one of the cool things about TIG and fillet joints, the 
builder can mess about with the tube all they want without having to find 
or shape a lug for it. 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:22:38 PM UTC-8 Paul Clifton wrote:

> Yep, that shows it. A vertical oval near the head tube, transitioning to a 
> sideways oval as it gets towards that bottom bracket.
> Does the Platypus do that?
>
> Paul
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:31:53 PM UTC-6 lconley wrote:
>
>> This?
>> [image: Rosco_Baby-52_1600x (2).jpg]
>> Laing
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:26:05 PM UTC-5 Paul Clifton wrote:
>>
>>> I can't tell from the picture, but I was talking about the tube that 
>>> connects the top tube to the bottom bracket. I think one of the early 
>>> drawing of the platypus showed it though.
>>>
>>> On the baby bike, the tube is an oval near the head tube and near the 
>>> bottom bracket, but it is circular in the middle. The plane of the 
>>> ovalization changes, so if you look straight on from the side of the bike, 
>>> the tube looks bigger near the head tube and skinnier at the bottom 
>>> bracket. But if you look straight down from the top of the bike, the tube 
>>> looks fatter near the bottom bracket and skinnier near the head tube.
>>>
>>> I can't even draw it with a pencil to show you because my lines aren't 
>>> good, and it's barely perceptible in photos. I've been trying to capture it.
>>>
>>> So like, if you have a playdough snake laying on a table. Smash it 
>>> against the table near the head and pinch it near the tail. The head gets 
>>> flat in one direction. The tail gets flat 90 degrees. Now imagine doing 
>>> that with a metal tube.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>



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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Roberta]

" As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method: 
left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over 
while in motion. "

Linda,

That is the way I get on and I never knew I was doing it "wrong"  either.  
Nowadays, though, I get a bit more nervous about falling if I don't get the 
speed and balance just right when mounting.  I'm getting a mixte (not a 
step thru)--a Platypus.  It will be easier to tilt the bike and go over the 
top tube than what I sometimes do now--tip the bike to over an even higher 
top tube. 

Roberta

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:37 PM UTC-5 Linda G wrote:

> Leah,
> Wasn't your Betty Foy a little lighter than the Platypus? How did that 
> feel for speed? I was considering a Platypus until I saw that the 
> chainstays were going to be longer than the Cheviot. The top tube is 
> already longer than I need since I'm happy with handlebars than only curve 
> back slightly. So all of that adds weight I don't need. The Rivendell 
> philosophy considers weight to be unimportant. I get it. Their main 
> customer base is men and with 2/3 of the population being overweight or 
> obese they have to design for people who are significantly larger, heavier 
> and stronger than I am. I love the aesthetics and quality of their frames 
> as well as their business philosophy. I like my Roadini but I don't want a 
> bike that's any heavier and I'm pretty sure the frame could be lighter and 
> still be safe and functional for me.
> A lightweight step-through frame would be a design challenge. I like 
> the step-through idea since it feels safer on a crowded MUP such as I have 
> near me. I have thought that when I feel a need to switch to that type of 
> frame I will get a Bike Friday which has low step-over.
> As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" 
> method: left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg 
> over while in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over 
> a diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until 
> recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress 
> on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely 
> step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too 
> much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the 
> right idea with a single "top tube"
> Linda 
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> 2 Thoughts:
>>
>> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had 
>> no idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>>
>> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte 
>> (mixte sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for 
>> the mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect 
>> combination of their colors.
>>
>> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
>> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
>> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit. 
>>  But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
>> personal information! 😂 
>>
>> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I 
>> lift weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me 
>> up in a bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about 
>> the best physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected 
>> the engine.
>>
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>> here. That day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill 
>> and beat us all from that day forward. 
>>
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. 
>>
>> Those two bikes now have the same accessories (bags, phone mounts, 
>> aluminum Boscos, metal fenders, rear racks, dyno) save one t

Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[David Person]

Lots of options for 12-36 9-speed on eBay.  I think the main difference in 
quality and price has to do with weight.  Lower 'quality' cassette is going 
to weigh more.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=12%2036%20Cassette%209&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-156598-662049-2&mkcid=2&keyword=12%2036%20cassette%209&crlp=473230128454_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-301632702719&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=9031172&poi=&abcId=9110001&cmpgn=11204157517&sitelnk=&adgroupid=112375772800&network=g&matchtype=p&gclid=Cj0KCQiAmL-ABhDFARIsAKywVaf1sHfO0IWrIYCFiNSAxz56TKp9WSp0ixiZDk38-pRhRPnZMgJBrbMaAh5XEALw_wcB



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:19:18 PM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9 speed. and a 13-38 8 
> speed for that matter.
>
> Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano 14-34 7 speed 
> FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued an updated model within the last 
> year) with a twist grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts 
> obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think. But I do of course 
> have a brand new in the box 12-36 Shimano 9 speed just in case
>
> Laing
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny microdrive 
>> chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as 
>> unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
>> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket (and 
>> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
>> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
>> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

I don't think I could do that 'ride the left pedal and swing over' thing 
without crashing every time. I lean the bike way over towards me and put my 
right foot on the right pedal in about the 2:00 position, then push off to 
vertical as my left foot rises to that pedal. It works the same on all 
frames but is certainly easier with a low toptube. 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:38:28 PM UTC-8 Roberta wrote:

> " As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method: 
> left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over 
> while in motion. "
>
> Linda,
>
> That is the way I get on and I never knew I was doing it "wrong"  either.  
> Nowadays, though, I get a bit more nervous about falling if I don't get the 
> speed and balance just right when mounting.  I'm getting a mixte (not a 
> step thru)--a Platypus.  It will be easier to tilt the bike and go over the 
> top tube than what I sometimes do now--tip the bike to over an even higher 
> top tube. 
>
> Roberta
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:12:37 PM UTC-5 Linda G wrote:
>
>> Leah,
>> Wasn't your Betty Foy a little lighter than the Platypus? How did 
>> that feel for speed? I was considering a Platypus until I saw that the 
>> chainstays were going to be longer than the Cheviot. The top tube is 
>> already longer than I need since I'm happy with handlebars than only curve 
>> back slightly. So all of that adds weight I don't need. The Rivendell 
>> philosophy considers weight to be unimportant. I get it. Their main 
>> customer base is men and with 2/3 of the population being overweight or 
>> obese they have to design for people who are significantly larger, heavier 
>> and stronger than I am. I love the aesthetics and quality of their frames 
>> as well as their business philosophy. I like my Roadini but I don't want a 
>> bike that's any heavier and I'm pretty sure the frame could be lighter and 
>> still be safe and functional for me.
>> A lightweight step-through frame would be a design challenge. I like 
>> the step-through idea since it feels safer on a crowded MUP such as I have 
>> near me. I have thought that when I feel a need to switch to that type of 
>> frame I will get a Bike Friday which has low step-over.
>> As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" 
>> method: left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg 
>> over while in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over 
>> a diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until 
>> recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress 
>> on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely 
>> step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too 
>> much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the 
>> right idea with a single "top tube"
>> Linda 
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:25 AM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 2 Thoughts:
>>>
>>> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had 
>>> no idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>>>
>>> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte 
>>> (mixte sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for 
>>> the mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect 
>>> combination of their colors.
>>>
>>> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
>>> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
>>> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit. 
>>>  But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
>>> personal information! 😂 
>>>
>>> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I 
>>> lift weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me 
>>> up in a bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about 
>>> the best physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected 
>>> the engine.
>>>
>>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying 
>>> to chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my 
>>> boys were little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill 
>>> stood between it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike 
>>> with gears. A Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every 
>>> day, while my 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 
>>> inch Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no 
>>> thought into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced 
>>> here. Tha

Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Paul Clifton]

Cool! Thanks for the video! I wonder what the ovalization at the seat tube 
is for. My guess is also twisting. I think it's a really cool feature, and 
I suspect it expands the possibilities for step through frames.

Paul

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Philip Williamson]

If you aren’t messing up your wheels, my understanding is that “cowgirl”
style is fine.

If you lean the bike WAY over with all your weight on one pedal, maybe
you’ll need to true your wheels more often? Good wheels (in the context of
this list) probably can handle it with overhead to spare. Cheap wheels go
out of true anyway, so there’s no real control for the experiment.

Now I want to try the “flying cowboy,” instead of just straddling the bike
and pushing off with the left pedal, which a eems pretty style-less. I do
sometimes do the “gentleman’s step-off” on the fixed-gear, where the bike
doesn’t stop, and you go from riding to walking seamlessly. It seems like
the bike has to lean just as much for that maneuver, and I’ve never had
problems.

Philip
Santa Rosa, CA

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:38 PM Roberta  wrote:

> " As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method:
> left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over
> while in motion. "
>
> Linda,
>
> That is the way I get on and I never knew I was doing it "wrong"  either.
> Nowadays, though, I get a bit more nervous about falling if I don't get the
> speed and balance just right when mounting.  I'm getting a mixte (not a
> step thru)--a Platypus.  It will be easier to tilt the bike and go over the
> top tube than what I sometimes do now--tip the bike to over an even higher
> top tube.
>
> Roberta
>
> On
>
>> As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl"
>> method: left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg
>> over while in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over
>> a diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until
>> recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress
>> on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely
>> step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too
>> much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the
>> right idea with a single "top tube"
>> Linda
>>
>



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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

Hmm, my bad, I should have hopped on my bike before posting. Not 2:00, the 
right pedal is straight down at 6:00 and I kinda coast with my foot there 
as the left foot pushes off the ground. Or something, this word picture 
probably makes no sense to anyone but me. 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:18:45 PM UTC-8 Philip Williamson wrote:

> If you aren’t messing up your wheels, my understanding is that “cowgirl” 
> style is fine. 
>
> If you lean the bike WAY over with all your weight on one pedal, maybe 
> you’ll need to true your wheels more often? Good wheels (in the context of 
> this list) probably can handle it with overhead to spare. Cheap wheels go 
> out of true anyway, so there’s no real control for the experiment. 
>
> Now I want to try the “flying cowboy,” instead of just straddling the bike 
> and pushing off with the left pedal, which a eems pretty style-less. I do 
> sometimes do the “gentleman’s step-off” on the fixed-gear, where the bike 
> doesn’t stop, and you go from riding to walking seamlessly. It seems like 
> the bike has to lean just as much for that maneuver, and I’ve never had 
> problems. 
>
> Philip
> Santa Rosa, CA 
>
> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 2:38 PM Roberta  wrote:
>
>> " As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" method: 
>> left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg over 
>> while in motion. "
>>
>> Linda,
>>
>> That is the way I get on and I never knew I was doing it "wrong"  
>> either.  Nowadays, though, I get a bit more nervous about falling if I 
>> don't get the speed and balance just right when mounting.  I'm getting a 
>> mixte (not a step thru)--a Platypus.  It will be easier to tilt the bike 
>> and go over the top tube than what I sometimes do now--tip the bike to over 
>> an even higher top tube. 
>>
>> Roberta
>>
>> On
>>
>>> As far as getting on/off bikes I have always used the "cowgirl" 
>>> method: left foot on left pedal, push off with right foot and swing my leg 
>>> over while in motion. I have never had the flexibility to swing my leg over 
>>> a diamond-frame bike with my left foot on the ground. I had no idea until 
>>> recently that my mounting method is "wrong" because it puts sideways stress 
>>> on the frame. I have a true mixte frame, Velo Orange, and can just barely 
>>> step over. That frame has the traditional double "top tube" and there's too 
>>> much flex if I'm carrying a load or riding on gravel. Rivendell has the 
>>> right idea with a single "top tube"
>>> Linda 
>>>
>>
> 
>
>
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> 
>> .
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Paul Brodek]

In general the fancier cassettes are primarily lighter, usually by using 
multi-cog carriers, while SRAM's highest-end cassettes are almost entirely 
one-piece affairs. The difference in weight can be substantial, almost 
1/2lb going from a 11-36t SRAM 1050>1090 (10spd), but the $/gram cost gets 
high, and the weight saved compared to the overall weight of a loaded 
touring bike + rider is pretty insubstantial.

Paul Brodek
Hillsdale, NJ USA

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:50:49 PM UTC-5 David Person wrote:

> Lots of options for 12-36 9-speed on eBay.  I think the main difference in 
> quality and price has to do with weight.  Lower 'quality' cassette is going 
> to weigh more.
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=12%2036%20Cassette%209&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-156598-662049-2&mkcid=2&keyword=12%2036%20cassette%209&crlp=473230128454_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-301632702719&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=9031172&poi=&abcId=9110001&cmpgn=11204157517&sitelnk=&adgroupid=112375772800&network=g&matchtype=p&gclid=Cj0KCQiAmL-ABhDFARIsAKywVaf1sHfO0IWrIYCFiNSAxz56TKp9WSp0ixiZDk38-pRhRPnZMgJBrbMaAh5XEALw_wcB
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:19:18 PM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>
>> There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9 speed. and a 13-38 8 
>> speed for that matter.
>>
>> Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano 14-34 7 speed 
>> FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued an updated model within the last 
>> year) with a twist grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts 
>> obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think. But I do of course 
>> have a brand new in the box 12-36 Shimano 9 speed just in case
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>
>>> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny microdrive 
>>> chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as 
>>> unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
>>> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket (and 
>>> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
>>> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
>>> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

 BBDD wrote:...*what of the Susie? That’s not a diamond frame. It’s got 
that swoopy top tube that must make it less strong than the diamond frame 
and Rivendell says to get it if you are of a certain weight. If weight 
doesn’t matter, then why offer the Susie? *

The top tube of the Susie meets the seat tube at a much higher point than 
the top tube of the Clem L.  It's much more equivalent to a  compact frame  
(sloped tt), not nearly a step through. Two things. First, they were 
apparently conservative regarding the recommended weight. That leads people 
to believe its some kind of super light tubing--165lbs?! Then they revised 
it up. Not sure what it is now--180?

Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter bicycle came 
from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. Why offer it 
if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this case, the 
Gus has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still some 
Susies available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you can get 
a green Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really special, a 
raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will quote the 
quote from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time:
* The frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  
(Emphasis Rivendell's).* 

I suspect the "lightweight" Susie is still safely within Riv parameters, 
but there will be folks that like the idea of a trimmed down frameset just 
because (me included, since I already own a Clem L. Also they had no more 
Gus in the Large, and I wanted it to be as different as possible from my 
Medium El Clem. Because other than that and a few details and the fact that 
the Gus/Susie has the beautiful fillet brazed joint, I am pretty sure if 
the bikes were set up as identical as possible, and there was some way I 
could ride without opening my eyes, I would have a hard time telling 
whether I was on my Susie or El Clem. Certainly doubt I could distinguish 
between a Gus and a Susie any more than random chance.

Carrying weight on handlebars or in saddlebags, yes you notice the 
weight--as a balance/handling shift (unless you are talking about a full 
touring load). You can distribute the bags to achieve more balance, but 
with a full 30-pound touring load, yeah, you'll notice that going up a hill 
for sure.



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:19:10 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Yes, we might be missing that part. I don’t know about step-throughs in 
> history - I’ve only had the Clementine, so I didn’t know they tend to be 
> beefy. 
>
> But then, what of the Susie? That’s not a diamond frame. It’s got that 
> swoopy top tube that must make it less strong than the diamond frame and 
> Rivendell says to get it if you are of a certain weight. If weight doesn’t 
> matter, then why offer the Susie?
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 12:12 PM, Mark Roland  wrote:
>
> 
>
> You are missing the other half of the argument.  There is a reason 
> virtually every step through out there runs the gamut from beefy to tank 
> like: the design of a step through frame does not lend itself to being 
> created from a lightweight tube set. I don't think many frame builders 
> would be eager to take it on, even for a relatively lighter rider, though 
> one who most definitely puts out power above her weight class, another 
> consideration. I don't think Rivendell would do it as a custom. I could of 
> course be wrong. One last time, there is a reason the basic safety bicycle 
> ended up as a diamond frame, ie, two triangles. Go away from that and you 
> need to start beefing up your tubing. This is why you see the designs of 
> the true step throughs above with one or two tubes connecting the two tubes 
> running from head tube to seat tube.  A mixte is essentially the same 
> physical structure as a diamond with a very sloped top tube. Which is why 
> you can't step through it. Make it low enough to step through, and you lose 
> the remaining strength of the triangle and need to compensate somewhere 
> else.
>
> Sure, Rivendells get criticized by lots of people for being "overbuilt." 
> Many (even/especially overweight men) would say that even of Leah's 
> Platypus. But of all the bikes in the Riv lineup to attempt to put on a 
> diet, the Clem L is not the one to pick. *Vive la difference.*
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:36:08 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> *Disclaimer: I promised myself I wouldn't come back to this thread and 
>> get into a debate about lightness but I'm Joe Bernard, world reknown for 
>> not knowing when to shut up! So here goes..
>>
>> In this very specific case of a very light and strong rider who's already 
>> got that motor in tip-top shape, the weight of the frame is going to 
>> matter. Swapping out to custom wheels and better (and tubeless) tires isn't 
>> in the offing because that's already been done to these bikes. Doe

[RBW] Wool Not-Too-Tights Rivendell Sells

[J Schwartz]

Anyone know of a U.S. source for the wool leggings Riv sells on their site?
I suspect they may be the only importer for that brand?
They are currently out.  If anyone has a pair that are lightly worn and not 
shrunk, I may be interested (size M)
Thank you 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Leah Peterson]

Mark said, “Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter bicycle 
came from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. Why offer 
it if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this case, the Gus 
has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still some Susies 
available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you can get a green 
Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really special, a raspberry. 
Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will quote the quote from 
Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time: The frames are only about 
12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  (Emphasis Rivendell's).”

I think those Susies sat because:
1. Riv underestimated the weight limit, and there aren’t a lot of men under 165 
pounds. 
2. Most men would rather ride the masculine-monikered Gus than the 
feminine-monikered Susie. I would also guess most of the Gus/Susie buyers are 
men.

Things change, even at Rivendell. Remember when it was all lugs, only lugs, 
never not lugs? I’m encouraged that the staff sees the value in cutting some 
frame weight where it can be done. Paul mused that the ovalization at the seat 
tube might expand possibilities for future step through frames. Does that hint 
that a Susie version of a Clem L could be done?

I can hope.

In fun,
Leah

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 4:13 PM, Mark Roland  wrote:
> 
> Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter bicycle came from 
> some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. Why offer it if 
> weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this case, the Gus has 
> been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still some Susies 
> available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you can get a green 
> Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really special, a 
> raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will quote the quote 
> from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time: The frames are only 
> about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  (Emphasis Rivendell's).

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[RBW] Re: FS: Carradice, nice, cheap

[Joe Bernard]

SOLD



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:17:37 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I could've sworn I already sold this last year. Unknown model, medium-ish 
> size, longflap, I added those long straps, $50 shipped, get this outta my 
> apartment! 
>
> Holler for more pics and measuring and whatnot. Or just grab it cheap 
> hurry do it now. 
>
> Joe Bernard 
> Novato CA. 
>

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[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Joe Bernard]

Interesting. Based on what I see on my Susie this shouldn't work, but my 
tires are knobbier so that will make a difference. Nice job!



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:56:23 PM UTC-8 iamkeith wrote:

> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:54:08 PM UTC-7 iamkeith wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:51:48 PM UTC-7 iamkeith wrote:
>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Mark Roland]

Elliptical tubing has been around for some time. It is not going to change 
the fact that a step through has limited triangulation. The Susie is a much 
different design than the Clem L. It does not hint that a lightweight Clem 
L should be coming soon. (In fact, the tubing specs on first Clems were 
even beefier than the current iteration. I will be surprised if it goes any 
lighter.

In fun, would you seriously upgrade to a new Clem L if it were ten ounces 
lighter than your current bike (can't be twelve, 'cause you got the two 
extra tubes joining the putative top tube to the down tube). You know what 
weighs ten ounces? My phone, and my watch. Your new wheels took off a lot 
more than that, apparently that still hasn't changed anything drastically. 
I really thought you were going to set the Platypus up differently, no  
fenders, no racks. This would do two things. It would make your "light" 
bike even lighter, and it would give you a built in reasons never to ignore 
your Clem L, when you need to go grocery shopping in the pouring rain. If 
it were me, I would strip down the Platypus and get some Rene Herse Barlow 
Pass Extra Lite tires and sign up for a local race or two. Just for fun.
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:05 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Mark said, “Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter 
> bicycle came from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. 
> Why offer it if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this 
> case, the Gus has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still 
> some Susies available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you 
> can get a green Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really 
> special, a raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will 
> quote the quote from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time:* The 
> frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  
> (Emphasis Rivendell's).”*
>
> I think those Susies sat because:
> 1. Riv underestimated the weight limit, and there aren’t a lot of men 
> under 165 pounds. 
> 2. Most men would rather ride the masculine-monikered Gus than the 
> feminine-monikered Susie. I would also guess most of the Gus/Susie buyers 
> are men.
>
> Things change, even at Rivendell. Remember when it was all lugs, only 
> lugs, never not lugs? I’m encouraged that the staff sees the value in 
> cutting some frame weight where it can be done. Paul mused that the 
> ovalization at the seat tube might expand possibilities for future step 
> through frames. Does that hint that a Susie version of a Clem L could be 
> done?
>
> I can hope.
>
> In fun,
> Leah
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 26, 2021, at 4:13 PM, Mark Roland  wrote:
>
> Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter bicycle came 
> from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. Why offer it 
> if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this case, the 
> Gus has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still some 
> Susies available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you can get 
> a green Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really special, a 
> raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will quote the 
> quote from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time:* The 
> frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  
> (Emphasis Rivendell's).*
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Fender for Gus Boots Willsen

[Ed Fausto]

Dear iamkeith,

Thanks for providing those pictures :-)
Looks like your Susie fork has better tire clearance than my 51 GUS.  :-(
I will try to get some measurement when I get home tonight but based on my 
visual estimate, the fork of my 51 GUS has only around 5-8mm clearance from 
the top of the tire.
Looks like the Susie forks has more clearance than Gus forks unless my 27.5 
x 2.6 tires are unusually taller compared to other 27.5 plus tires.

Regards,
Ed Fausto

On Wednesday, January 27, 2021 at 8:56:23 AM UTC+8 iamkeith wrote:

> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:54:08 PM UTC-7 iamkeith wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:51:48 PM UTC-7 iamkeith wrote:
>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Vintage Levers with New Brakes?

[Matthew Williams]

One of my levers failed so I just replaced it with a spare. At some point I'll 
probably upgrade to a set of Pauls or an equivalent.

Thanks very much for the information and the offer, Joe!




On Jan 24, 2021, at 2:57 PM, Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Nope, you need long-pulls. You can have these for shipping (should be less 
> than $10) if you just need something that works for cheap. Tektro with the 
> graphics wearing off and lean-against-the-fence rub on the ends, but all 
> there and good. Adjustable for pull ratio, too, but will come to you set up 
> for v-brakes. 
> 
> Joe Bernard
> Marin County CA. 
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 2:26:23 PM UTC-8 Matthew Williams wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Will these vintage levers work with a modern pair of Tektro 
> V-brakes/linear-pull brakes?
> 
> 
> 
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> <20210124_145331.jpg>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Joe Bernard]

The question pertains to having a lighter step-through with the toptube as 
low as the Clem L. The answer is yes, it can be done if you're a very light 
person and order a custom frame with the low max weight you can get away 
with. I think it would be a neat bike. 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:39:11 PM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:

> Elliptical tubing has been around for some time. It is not going to change 
> the fact that a step through has limited triangulation. The Susie is a much 
> different design than the Clem L. It does not hint that a lightweight Clem 
> L should be coming soon. (In fact, the tubing specs on first Clems were 
> even beefier than the current iteration. I will be surprised if it goes any 
> lighter.
>
> In fun, would you seriously upgrade to a new Clem L if it were ten ounces 
> lighter than your current bike (can't be twelve, 'cause you got the two 
> extra tubes joining the putative top tube to the down tube). You know what 
> weighs ten ounces? My phone, and my watch. Your new wheels took off a lot 
> more than that, apparently that still hasn't changed anything drastically. 
> I really thought you were going to set the Platypus up differently, no  
> fenders, no racks. This would do two things. It would make your "light" 
> bike even lighter, and it would give you a built in reasons never to ignore 
> your Clem L, when you need to go grocery shopping in the pouring rain. If 
> it were me, I would strip down the Platypus and get some Rene Herse Barlow 
> Pass Extra Lite tires and sign up for a local race or two. Just for fun.
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:50:05 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> Mark said, “Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter 
>> bicycle came from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. 
>> Why offer it if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this 
>> case, the Gus has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still 
>> some Susies available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you 
>> can get a green Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really 
>> special, a raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will 
>> quote the quote from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time:* 
>> The 
>> frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  
>> (Emphasis Rivendell's).”*
>>
>> I think those Susies sat because:
>> 1. Riv underestimated the weight limit, and there aren’t a lot of men 
>> under 165 pounds. 
>> 2. Most men would rather ride the masculine-monikered Gus than the 
>> feminine-monikered Susie. I would also guess most of the Gus/Susie buyers 
>> are men.
>>
>> Things change, even at Rivendell. Remember when it was all lugs, only 
>> lugs, never not lugs? I’m encouraged that the staff sees the value in 
>> cutting some frame weight where it can be done. Paul mused that the 
>> ovalization at the seat tube might expand possibilities for future step 
>> through frames. Does that hint that a Susie version of a Clem L could be 
>> done?
>>
>> I can hope.
>>
>> In fun,
>> Leah
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 4:13 PM, Mark Roland  wrote:
>>
>> Second, I recall reading that the impetus to make a lighter bicycle came 
>> from some of the employees, and they made their case to Grant. Why offer it 
>> if weight doesn't matter? That is a good question, and in this case, the 
>> Gus has been sold out since very quickly, whereas there are still some 
>> Susies available. In reality, it is offered for the same reason you can get 
>> a green Riv or a blue one or an orange one. Or if you are really special, a 
>> raspberry. Rivendell has a rep for very sturdy bikes. I will quote the 
>> quote from Rivendell's description of the Susie one more time:* The 
>> frames are only about 12oz less, and there is NO ride difference.  
>> (Emphasis Rivendell's).*
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Has anyone ever made a Rivendell custom step-through?

[Leah Peterson]

Oh, wouldn’t we, Annie! I’ve only gotten a little ways in, but I had to come 
back here and tell you thanks for the delight. ♥️

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 5:50 PM, anniebikes  wrote:
> 
> 
> Leah, have you ever seen the options in Europe for step through bikes? I wish 
> we could have the opportunity to try all of them. Wouldn't we have fun!
> https://www.cyclingabout.com/a-complete-list-of-womens-touring-bikes-step-through-mixte/
>  
> 
> 
>> On Tue, Jan 26, 2021, 10:50 AM Leah Peterson  wrote:
>> 2 Thoughts:
>> 
>> First Thought: Philip, fascinating! Thanks for posting that link; I had no 
>> idea there were so many variations of dropped tube bikes.
>> 
>> Yes, I did see Sumehra’s bike years ago. It was her pink custom mixte (mixte 
>> sport?!) and Cyclofiend’s red Glorius that kicked off my desire for the 
>> mixte I finally have in raspberry metallic, which is the perfect combination 
>> of their colors.
>> 
>> Second Thought: I don’t have the guts to call and ask Grant about a 
>> lightweight Clem L. Others will say that a pound or two doesn’t really make 
>> that much difference, and I should focus on the engine and get more fit.  
>> But I have to disagree. I’m happy to back it up with limited, biased 
>> personal information! 😂 
>> 
>> The engine, aka, me: I work out every day, and hard. I’m 39. I run. I lift 
>> weights. I do core. I ride every day. My husband likes to lift me up in a 
>> bear hug and say, “You’re like a biscuit. Solid.” This is about the best 
>> physical condition I ever expect to be in. I have not neglected the engine.
>> 
>> So, what about bike weight? I spent 2020 trying to log 3,000 miles, and 
>> nearly all of those miles were on my big, blue Clementine. I bought new 
>> wheels and a tubeless tire set up and it noticeably lightened the bike, and 
>> it helped with the hills. But even so, I was never fast; I gave up trying to 
>> chase roadies up Killer Hill because I never caught them. When my boys were 
>> little and we began to bike to their new school (Killer Hill stood between 
>> it and us) I got my littler son, a 1st grader, a new bike with gears. A 
>> Giant in neon yellow. He was demoralized by that hill every day, while my 
>> 4th grade son had no trouble. One day I realized that the 24 inch 
>> Specialized was lighter than the 20 inch Giant. Ugh. I had put no thought 
>> into the weight of the bike - possibly because I was influenced here. That 
>> day, I bought an Islabike and my little boy danced up the hill and beat us 
>> all from that day forward. 
>> 
>> When the Platy came, magically, I was quick. I catch and pass men on road 
>> bikes all the time now, Bosco bars and all. My bike feels too easy to pedal 
>> even in its hardest gear. It’s not a workout for me, even up Killer Hill. 
>> It’s easy and it’s fun. 
>> 
>> Those two bikes now have the same accessories (bags, phone mounts, aluminum 
>> Boscos, metal fenders, rear racks, dyno) save one thing - the Clem has a 
>> basket rack with a Wald. And yet, the Clem is just so much heavier. I know 
>> it when I carry either bike over the median that intersects my bike path. I 
>> know it when I pedal up Killer Hill. I know it when I lift the bikes onto my 
>> vehicle bike rack. And every single time I think, “I wonder what it would be 
>> like to have this Clem in a light-weight version.”
>> 
>> Leah
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
 On Jan 25, 2021, at 11:40 PM, Philip Williamson 
  wrote:
 
>>> I have only ever heard mixtes referred to as a kind of step-through 
>>> bicycle, not as separate concepts. “All mixtes are step-through frames, but 
>>> not all frames are mixtes.”
>>> 
>>> To my eye, the Clem L design starts out as an “Anglais,” and kicks in a 
>>> little “col de cigne” at the seat tube, for style.
>>> 
>>> Philip
>>> Santa Rosa, CA 
>>> 
 On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 8:07:56 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
 This is not correct. A mixte is not a step through. Because, at least 
 without serious contortions for a normal person, you can't step through 
 it. They are two separate designs. A mixte can more easily accomodate 
 certain clothing choices, and with more clearance allow for sliding off 
 the saddle for frequent stopping in city traffic. Can also be mounted 
 similar to a step through if you lean it enough or step like a Rockette.
 
 Step throughs do not have the same triangulation found in a diamond frame, 
 or even a mixte. (This is also why mixtes with twin, side by side skinny 
 top tubes are often rather noodley in larger sizes and/or carrying loads.) 
 Start using very light tubing on a step through, and you will start to 
 introduce a bad kind of flex--especially if you want to carry a thing or 
 two, which is part of the point of a Clem L, no? A loaded 59cm Clem L 
 apparently verges on this unwanted flexing, according to reports out of 
 Rivendell during the early days of the Clems.
 

Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Tim Baldwin]

Steve, I agree starting cassettes with a 12 tooth cog makes more sense for 
most riders.
Aeroperf and Paul, thanks for that feedback. It wasn't my intention to 
knock Alivio.I swapped the Deore brakes on my Atlantis for Paul Motolites 
with Paul levers over the summer. I would say that was a definite upgrade 
in terms of feel and performance. I was curious if going high end on 
cassette would make a similar difference in terms of feel/performance. It 
sounds like spending money on the rear derailleur would make more of a 
difference. The pricier cassette would only be lighter. 
Laing, it sounds like this is more of a problem with parts being harder to 
get after a booming year. Like I said I was only basing this on my LBS, who 
in past years was able to get most any part within a day or two, saying 
many 9 speed cassettes (including the 12-36) were back-ordered.
Joe, the Analog has some very tempting stuff. Not sure if I could get 
myself to spend that much on a cassette and then ride it through winter!

Tim B in Chicago
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 6:08:09 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Don't even play, get yerself a 12-speed Garbaruk cassette from Analog for 
> about $250. It comes in colors! 👍
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:52:53 PM UTC-8 Paul Brodek wrote:
>
>> In general the fancier cassettes are primarily lighter, usually by using 
>> multi-cog carriers, while SRAM's highest-end cassettes are almost entirely 
>> one-piece affairs. The difference in weight can be substantial, almost 
>> 1/2lb going from a 11-36t SRAM 1050>1090 (10spd), but the $/gram cost gets 
>> high, and the weight saved compared to the overall weight of a loaded 
>> touring bike + rider is pretty insubstantial.
>>
>> Paul Brodek
>> Hillsdale, NJ USA
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:50:49 PM UTC-5 David Person wrote:
>>
>>> Lots of options for 12-36 9-speed on eBay.  I think the main difference 
>>> in quality and price has to do with weight.  Lower 'quality' cassette is 
>>> going to weigh more.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=12%2036%20Cassette%209&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-156598-662049-2&mkcid=2&keyword=12%2036%20cassette%209&crlp=473230128454_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-301632702719&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=9031172&poi=&abcId=9110001&cmpgn=11204157517&sitelnk=&adgroupid=112375772800&network=g&matchtype=p&gclid=Cj0KCQiAmL-ABhDFARIsAKywVaf1sHfO0IWrIYCFiNSAxz56TKp9WSp0ixiZDk38-pRhRPnZMgJBrbMaAh5XEALw_wcB
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:19:18 PM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>>>
 There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9 speed. and a 13-38 8 
 speed for that matter.

 Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano 14-34 7 speed 
 FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued an updated model within the last 
 year) with a twist grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts 
 obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think. But I do of course 
 have a brand new in the box 12-36 Shimano 9 speed just in case

 Laing

 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:

> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny 
> microdrive chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because it's 
> not as unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket 
> (and 
> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Stolen 58cm Grey/Bean Rivendell Hunqapillar Frameset (San Francisco Bay Area)

[Eric G@rs]

That is terrible. Sorry to hear it. Did you happen to get the serial number 
to match in case it is found? Also, you could try posting on Bike Index SF 
  or other services like 
Craigslist. Hopefully it will turn up. 

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:38:49 PM UTC-8 Jan O. wrote:

> Hi everyone, 
>
> My 58cm Grey/Bean Rivendell Hunqapillar frameset was stolen in the San 
> Francisco Bay Area this past week.
>
> I finally found this frame after a 2+ year search but it was stolen before 
> I even had a chance to build it… Please be on the lookout for it. 
>
> Thank you.
>
> Jan
>
> [image: 58Hunqapillar.jpg]
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Joe Bernard]

Haha, I don't think I could ever pay that kinda cash for a cassette either. 
But it sure is pretty! 



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 7:16:04 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:

> Steve, I agree starting cassettes with a 12 tooth cog makes more sense for 
> most riders.
> Aeroperf and Paul, thanks for that feedback. It wasn't my intention to 
> knock Alivio.I swapped the Deore brakes on my Atlantis for Paul Motolites 
> with Paul levers over the summer. I would say that was a definite upgrade 
> in terms of feel and performance. I was curious if going high end on 
> cassette would make a similar difference in terms of feel/performance. It 
> sounds like spending money on the rear derailleur would make more of a 
> difference. The pricier cassette would only be lighter. 
> Laing, it sounds like this is more of a problem with parts being harder to 
> get after a booming year. Like I said I was only basing this on my LBS, who 
> in past years was able to get most any part within a day or two, saying 
> many 9 speed cassettes (including the 12-36) were back-ordered.
> Joe, the Analog has some very tempting stuff. Not sure if I could get 
> myself to spend that much on a cassette and then ride it through winter!
>
> Tim B in Chicago
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 6:08:09 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Don't even play, get yerself a 12-speed Garbaruk cassette from Analog for 
>> about $250. It comes in colors! 👍
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:52:53 PM UTC-8 Paul Brodek wrote:
>>
>>> In general the fancier cassettes are primarily lighter, usually by using 
>>> multi-cog carriers, while SRAM's highest-end cassettes are almost entirely 
>>> one-piece affairs. The difference in weight can be substantial, almost 
>>> 1/2lb going from a 11-36t SRAM 1050>1090 (10spd), but the $/gram cost gets 
>>> high, and the weight saved compared to the overall weight of a loaded 
>>> touring bike + rider is pretty insubstantial.
>>>
>>> Paul Brodek
>>> Hillsdale, NJ USA
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:50:49 PM UTC-5 David Person wrote:
>>>
 Lots of options for 12-36 9-speed on eBay.  I think the main difference 
 in quality and price has to do with weight.  Lower 'quality' cassette is 
 going to weigh more.


 https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=12%2036%20Cassette%209&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-156598-662049-2&mkcid=2&keyword=12%2036%20cassette%209&crlp=473230128454_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-301632702719&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=9031172&poi=&abcId=9110001&cmpgn=11204157517&sitelnk=&adgroupid=112375772800&network=g&matchtype=p&gclid=Cj0KCQiAmL-ABhDFARIsAKywVaf1sHfO0IWrIYCFiNSAxz56TKp9WSp0ixiZDk38-pRhRPnZMgJBrbMaAh5XEALw_wcB



 On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:19:18 PM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9 speed. and a 13-38 8 
> speed for that matter.
>
> Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano 14-34 7 speed 
> FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued an updated model within the last 
> year) with a twist grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts 
> obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think. But I do of course 
> have a brand new in the box 12-36 Shimano 9 speed just in case
>
> Laing
>
> On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>> For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels, and not tiny 
>> microdrive chain rings) 12 is a better 1st position than 11 (because 
>> it's 
>> not as unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36, it can easily be 
>> customized into a 13-36 simply by replacing the 1st position sprocket 
>> (and 
>> for most road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger, a 13T 1st 
>> position gives you a more usable top gear than a 12, and at the very top 
>> end a 1 tooth gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: 9 Speed Cassette Availability

[Steve Palincsar]

On 1/26/21 10:16 PM, Tim Baldwin wrote:
Steve, I agree starting cassettes with a 12 tooth cog makes more sense 
for most riders.
Aeroperf and Paul, thanks for that feedback. It wasn't my intention to 
knock Alivio.I swapped the Deore brakes on my Atlantis for Paul 
Motolites with Paul levers over the summer. I would say that was a 
definite upgrade in terms of feel and performance. I was curious if 
going high end on cassette would make a similar difference in terms of 
feel/performance. It sounds like spending money on the rear derailleur 
would make more of a difference. The pricier cassette would only be 
lighter.


Well, some of the really high end cassettes look a lot sexier too, but 
how often do you get a chance to actually take a good look at a 
cassette?   In terms of longevity, sometimes the cheaper ones have an 
edge, if the high end ones use titanium sprockets for lightness, as has 
been done in the past.  Those don't last very long.



Laing, it sounds like this is more of a problem with parts being 
harder to get after a booming year. Like I said I was only basing this 
on my LBS, who in past years was able to get most any part within a 
day or two, saying many 9 speed cassettes (including the 12-36) were 
back-ordered.



There have been supply chain disruptions with all kinds of products, 
even in areas (like toilet paper) where there wasn't an unanticipated 
bike boom on top of a pandemic.


Seriously, those Shimano 12-36 cassettes are perfectly fine. Easier to 
install and remove than some of the higher end ones, because aside from 
the 1st position sprocket it's all one hunk of metal.  The 12-27 has two 
or maybe three sets of sprockets mounted on spiders, plus some loose 
sprockets and loose spacers and takes a lot longer to R&R.



Joe, the Analog has some very tempting stuff. Not sure if I could get 
myself to spend that much on a cassette and then ride it through winter!


Tim B in Chicago
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 6:08:09 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:

Don't even play, get yerself a 12-speed Garbaruk cassette from
Analog for about $250. It comes in colors! 👍

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 3:52:53 PM UTC-8 Paul Brodek wrote:

In general the fancier cassettes are primarily lighter,
usually by using multi-cog carriers, while SRAM's highest-end
cassettes are almost entirely one-piece affairs. The
difference in weight can be substantial, almost 1/2lb going
from a 11-36t SRAM 1050>1090 (10spd), but the $/gram cost gets
high, and the weight saved compared to the overall weight of a
loaded touring bike + rider is pretty insubstantial.

Paul Brodek
Hillsdale, NJ USA

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:50:49 PM UTC-5 David Person
wrote:

Lots of options for 12-36 9-speed on eBay.  I think the
main difference in quality and price has to do with
weight.  Lower 'quality' cassette is going to weigh more.


https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=12%2036%20Cassette%209&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-156598-662049-2&mkcid=2&keyword=12%2036%20cassette%209&crlp=473230128454_&MT_ID=&geo_id=&rlsatarget=kwd-301632702719&adpos=&device=c&mktype=&loc=9031172&poi=&abcId=9110001&cmpgn=11204157517&sitelnk=&adgroupid=112375772800&network=g&matchtype=p&gclid=Cj0KCQiAmL-ABhDFARIsAKywVaf1sHfO0IWrIYCFiNSAxz56TKp9WSp0ixiZDk38-pRhRPnZMgJBrbMaAh5XEALw_wcB



On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:19:18 PM UTC-8 lconley
wrote:

There is also IRD, who makes a 12-30 and a12-34 9
speed. and a 13-38 8 speed for that matter.

Note that I just built a bike with a brand new Shimano
14-34 7 speed FREEWHEEL (Shimano actually just issued
an updated model within the last year) with a twist
grip indexing a Shimano Altus M310 derailleur. Parts
obsolescence is not as much of a worry as some think.
But I do of course have a brand new in the box 12-36
Shimano 9 speed just in case

Laing

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 5:03:26 PM UTC-5 Steve
Palincsar wrote:

For most road drivetrains (i.e., not 26" wheels,
and not tiny microdrive chain rings) 12 is a
better 1st position than 11 (because it's not as
unreasonably high) and in the case of the 12-36,
it can easily be customized into a 13-36 simply by
replacing the 1st position sprocket (and for most
road drive trains with 48T chain rings or larger,
a 13T 1st position gives you a more usable top
gear than a 12, and at the very top end a 1 tooth
gap is nicer than a 2 tooth gap).  In my opinion.


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Re: [RBW] Stolen 58cm Grey/Bean Rivendell Hunqapillar Frameset (San Francisco Bay Area)

[Matthew Williams]

Aw jeez, that's terrible. I'm sorry, Jan.

I'm in Berkeley so I'll watch for it--where in the Bay Area was it stolen? 



On Jan 26, 2021, at 3:38 PM, Jan O.  wrote:

> Hi everyone, 
> 
> My 58cm Grey/Bean Rivendell Hunqapillar frameset was stolen in the San 
> Francisco Bay Area this past week.
> 
> I finally found this frame after a 2+ year search but it was stolen before I 
> even had a chance to build it… Please be on the lookout for it. 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Jan
> 
> <58Hunqapillar.jpg>
> 
> 
> -- 
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/7230a32a-1b34-4c55-9fe6-d1c3384f378bn%40googlegroups.com.
> <58Hunqapillar.jpg>

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[RBW] Stolen 58cm Grey/Bean Rivendell Hunqapillar Frameset (San Francisco Bay Area)

[Jan O.]

Eric: Thanks for the advice. Regarding the serial #, I'm working on it with 
the previous owner and Rivendell.

Matthew: The frame was being stored temporarily in the East Bay not too far 
from Berkley.

Thank you.
Jan

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[RBW] Re: Wool Not-Too-Tights Rivendell Sells

[Mike Godwin]

I recently got a "pair?" of Smartwool  Men's Merino Sport Fleece Wind 
Tights|Smartwool® 

  
but I see they are made in Vietnam.
Nice though. I'm going to sew some 330d cordura on the butt so the wool 
does not get worn out from contact with the saddle.
Mike SLO CA
 

On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 4:41:41 PM UTC-8 J Schwartz wrote:

> Anyone know of a U.S. source for the wool leggings Riv sells on their site?
> I suspect they may be the only importer for that brand?
> They are currently out.  If anyone has a pair that are lightly worn and 
> not shrunk, I may be interested (size M)
> Thank you 
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Bikes on eBay, CraigsLIst, and Other Sites

[Mike Godwin]

Hi Brian
I had a 61 cm with the hourglass brazeons mid-seatstay. I was told 
Waterford made, about 2015. I could be all wrong about that.
Mike SLO CA

On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 9:16:00 AM UTC-8 brianr...@gmail.com wrote:

> Toyo Atlantis
> 53cm
> $2175
> Whitefish, Montana
> The owner has had it for 12 years. They're very nice :)
> ebay listing  
> 
> https://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/2944840/
> [image: s-l1600.png]
>
> Joe Appaloosa
> 51
> Santa Fe, New Mexico
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rivendell-Joe-Appaloosa-w-BB-and-headset-BRAND-NEW-size-51-650b-Hillibike/274650105958?hash=item3ff26c0866:g:tJQAAOSwSF1gA7KB
> [image: s-l1600.jpg]
>
> Also, anybody have any leads on a 51cm Atlantis, with the hourglass 
> eyelets on the seatstay and fork, like this one (picture below)? Does 
> anyone know what year these were made? Or who they were made by?
> [image: 78844116_482684465936163_922017135019438_n.jpg]
> On Tuesday, December 29, 2020 at 7:04:35 AM UTC-5 Mark Roland wrote:
>
>> Definitely cool, but even with basketballs included, a little pricey for 
>> what you get, and I suspect the Bike Tinkerer would prefer to do the 
>> tinkering.  I have a Crust fork, but have gone from no donor bike to trying 
>> to decide which donor bike. Hopefully an early 2021 project.  And yeah, I 
>> suspect Grant & Co. are fans of the Crust cargo forks. I think Blue Lug did 
>> a RivenCrust on Instagram a while back, can't remember what donor model. 
>> Fan Say.
>>
>> On Monday, December 28, 2020 at 5:20:38 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Not a Riv but has a Bosco Bar and Crust cargo fork and it's just cool! 
>>> In Santa Rosa, CA. where Bike Tinker should go buy it. 
>>>
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/bik/d/santa-rosa-schwinn-hurricane-cargo-bike/7253169368.html
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, July 8, 2020 at 4:11:41 PM UTC-7 Matthew Williams wrote:
>>>
 This thread is for Rivendells you've found on eBay, CraigsList, and 
 sites beyond: bikes in which you think someone here might be interested. 
 This thread isn't for posting ads to your own ad, it's just so people who 
 are searching or interested have a place to look, like, "Hey, check this 
 out!" Here are a few, from today's searches:

 61cm Roadini
 https://www.ebay.com/itm/283940882590

 58cm Quickbeam

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/pinole-rivendell-quickbeam-58/7154380920.html

 52cm Clementine

 https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/bik/d/richardson-rivendell-clementine/7130894748.html

 65cm Redwood

 https://bellingham.craigslist.org/bik/d/bellingham-rivendell-redwood/7153843392.html

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: Bikes on eBay, CraigsLIst, and Other Sites

[Mike Godwin]

And Joe's Legolas in the background.
Mike SLO CA


On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 2:53:21 PM UTC-8 Jim M. wrote:

> I have an 89 pbh and am 6' 1". My 59 Legolas fit great. You can see how 
> much seatpost I had showing here:
> [image: 6773347072_3155c76616_c.jpg]
>
> jim m
> walnut creek, ca
> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 11:52:02 AM UTC-8 Tirebiter ATX wrote:
>
>> Thanks for getting back to me. I agree. 61 cm is preferred based on what 
>> I know about it. A really sweet bike.  
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 11:48 AM Eric G@rs  wrote:
>>
>>> Depends on how you like your bike to fit and whether you think GP's 
>>> sizing method works for you, I suppose. According to the Riv sizing method, 
>>> 61cm may be more appropriate for your PBH. My PBH is 85.5 and while the 
>>> standover is fine, the reach is a little too far for me.
>>> On Monday, January 25, 2021 at 7:32:23 AM UTC-8 Tirebiter ATX wrote:
>>>
 Hi
 Do you think the 59cm frame size is good fit for 89PBH?
 Thanks!

 On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 12:47 AM Eric G@rs  wrote:

> That is mine. It is listed at $1600 to cover the listing cost. Will 
> sell for $1400 + shipping to anyone here that is interested. 
>
> Eric
> Menlo Park
>
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021 at 7:50:20 PM UTC-8 Jason D wrote:
>
>> A nice looking Roadeo frameset on eBay - 
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/353364415765
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 19, 2021 at 1:24:26 PM UTC-5 Matt Beecher wrote:
>>
>>> There is a 52cm Betty across the hall on the IBOB list.  I have no 
>>> affiliation with the seller.  
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Matt  in Oswego, IL
>>>
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> 
> .
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>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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