Re: [mailop] Fwd: Validity (return path blocklist)

[Andy Smith via mailop]

Hi,

On Fri, Apr 04, 2025 at 11:29:58AM +1000, Simon Wilson via mailop wrote:
> as there was discussion back in November about Validity's usefulness
> on this list am posting it here too.

What bothers me more than Validity's decision to reduce their free
offering to 10k queries per month is the fact that I have so far
received three almost entirely content-free emails from a salesperson
there urging me to "book some time on [their] calendar" to discuss
giving them money.

I will also note that each of those emails comes with an unsubscribe
link at the bottom, which I have used multiple times now, and this
hasn't so far stopped the emails coming.

I did not sign up with Validity to become a sales lead, I did so because
they were providing a free service and I agreed that that it was
reasonable for them to have contact details of their users in order to
manage it properly. I realise I was extremely naive to believe this was
ever an operational relationship but it has certainly stopped being one
now, and I would like to get off that ride.

It is this which will forever leave me with bad memories of Validity,
not them deciding they can't actually justify providing free services
any more.

Thanks,
Andy

-- 
https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting
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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[postfix--- via mailop]

On 2025-04-09 19:47, L. Mark Stone via mailop wrote:


Thanks, but regrettably, no.  [AWS European zone] was our first suggestion (we 
are an AWS Partner...)

They do not want to host with a US-owned company.  We respect their decision.


concerned with jurisdictional overreach.

Would https://www.infomaniak.com/en satisfy your client's requirements?

--
Yuval Levy, Ontario-licensed lawyer


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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[Scott Q. via mailop]

So you are looking for infrastructure and the client brings his
own software ? Maybe something running OpenStack ?

https://cleura.com/
https://www.open-telekom-cloud.com/en/benefits/openstack

Scott​

On Wednesday, 09/04/2025 at 13:41 L. Mark Stone via mailop wrote:



To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are
looking for an AWS-like competitor to host an email system supporting
some 10K users.

AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is
preferred.

The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based
hosting providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.

Thanks, 
Mark 

-- 
_ 
L. Mark Stone, Founder 
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop]

Dnia  9.04.2025 o godz. 20:54:29 L. Mark Stone via mailop pisze:
> 
> We are not at all looking for an emailing service like AWS's SES, or to
> use a forwarder, SEG or similar.  We need like AWS m7i and r7i instances,
> with multiple block storage disks of different speeds and sizes, and,
> ideally some lower cost S3-like storage for older mail blobs.

You can have AWS instances that are hosted in European data centers. Would
it satisfy your customer?
-- 
Regards,
   Jaroslaw Rafa
   r...@rafa.eu.org
--
"In a million years, when kids go to school, they're gonna know: once there
was a Hushpuppy, and she lived with her daddy in the Bathtub."
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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[Scott Q. via mailop]

I'm actually curious about this - what makes AWS so special in
terms of running VMs ? They provide something akin to VMWare's Fault
Tolerance on all instances ?

Otherwise, if the host goes down, so does your vm.

Scott​

​
On Wednesday, 09/04/2025 at 16:54 L. Mark Stone via mailop wrote:



Sorry Michael and Scott that I wasn't clearer, and thanks for your
replies.

The Zimbra email software we use requires Linux instances, either
Ubuntu 22, RHEL9 or selected clones.  No docker containers,
microservices etc.

AWS has a lot of built-in infrastructure redundancy and resiliency
we'd ideally like to retain (S3 has eleven nines of durability for
example; EBS volumes are continuously replicated on at least two
storage frames at all times, etc.).

We are not at all looking for an emailing service like AWS's SES, or
to use a forwarder, SEG or similar.  We need like AWS m7i and r7i
instances, with multiple block storage disks of different speeds and
sizes, and, ideally some lower cost S3-like storage for older mail
blobs.

Some hosters do not allow outbound TCP port 25; that would be a
requirement in our case.

Thanks, 
Mark 

-- 
_ 
L. Mark Stone, Founder 
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award

- Original Message -
| From: "Scott" 
| To: "L. Mark Stone" , "mailop" 
| Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2025 3:16:49 PM
| Subject: Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

| So you are looking for infrastructure and the client brings his own
software ?
| Maybe something running OpenStack ?

| https://cleura.com/
| https://www.open-telekom-cloud.com/en/benefits/openstack

| Scott

| On Wednesday, 09/04/2025 at 13:41 L. Mark Stone via mailop wrote:

|| To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are
looking for an
|| AWS-like competitor to host an email system supporting some 10K
users.

|| AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is
preferred.

|| The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based
hosting
|| providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.

|| Thanks,
|| Mark

|| --
|| _
|| L. Mark Stone, Founder
|| North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner
|| For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs
|| Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
|| ___
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|| [ mailto:mailop@mailop.org | mailop@mailop.org ]
|| [ https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop |
|| https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop ]
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[mailop] Emails from my domain [redacted] apparently being dropped after successful delivery to ProofPoint.

[joemailop--- via mailop]

Hello All,

I was wondering if anyone from ProofPoint might be around to assist with 
deliverability issues for emails coming from my [redacted] domain going to more 
than a few ProofPoint hosted customers, both enterprise and essentials.

I've checked the IP reputation lookup, but our outbound email shoot out O365 
and while /maybe/ there's an IP or two that could be stinky, this has been 
going on for a few weeks now and every email we send basically comes out of a 
different O365 IP, so we're thinking this is some type of domain reputation 
issue? 

Replies off-list are preferable.

Best regards,
-joe

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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[L. Mark Stone via mailop]

- Original Message -
| From: "Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop" 
| To: "mailop" 
| Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2025 6:50:44 PM
| Subject: Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

| Dnia  9.04.2025 o godz. 20:54:29 L. Mark Stone via mailop pisze:
|> 
|> We are not at all looking for an emailing service like AWS's SES, or to
|> use a forwarder, SEG or similar.  We need like AWS m7i and r7i instances,
|> with multiple block storage disks of different speeds and sizes, and,
|> ideally some lower cost S3-like storage for older mail blobs.
| 
| You can have AWS instances that are hosted in European data centers. Would
| it satisfy your customer?

Thanks, but regrettably, no.  That was our first suggestion (we are an AWS 
Partner...) 

They do not want to host with a US-owned company.  We respect their decision.

Regards, 
Mark 

-- 
_ 
L. Mark Stone, Founder 
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
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Re: [mailop] gmail dkim oddity

[Mark E. Mallett via mailop]

On Tue, Apr 08, 2025 at 12:03:18PM -0700, Wei Chuang via mailop wrote:
> Hi Julian,
> I work in Gmail.  There's a bug in our implementation for "Show Original"
> for "Alignment" and it's being rolled back and fixed.  For now ignore that
> comment around "Alignment".

Oh that's kind of interesting. I was looking at "show original" the
other day on a message that gmail gave a DKIM pass to and wondering
something about it. Long story but: I noticed the real original has an
encoded (RFC2047-style) Subject field value but "show original" showed
it decoded. This confused me even more viz the DKIM issue. I kind of
assUme d that show original wouldn't be doing this decoding. Am I all
wet here (again)?

-mm-


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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[Michael Peddemors via mailop]

Ouch.. not sure if you want to recommend them ;)

However Mark..  that isn't a very good description of what you are 
looking for?


'aws-like'.. You mean SES, or just cloud ..

You can get redunduncy/resiliency in many ways. But for only 10k users, 
for mail that isn't a very big load..


Do they have a list of what their definition of redunduncy  is?

On 2025-04-09 11:19, Romain via mailop wrote:

Based in France, OVH and Scaleway.

Romain

Le mer. 9 avr. 2025 à 19:56, L. Mark Stone via mailop > a écrit :


To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are
looking for an AWS-like competitor to host an email system
supporting some 10K users.

AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is preferred.

The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based
hosting providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.

Thanks,
Mark

-- 
_

L. Mark Stone, Founder
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
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--
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Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
"LinuxMagic" a Reg. TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.

604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada

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[mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[L. Mark Stone via mailop]

To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are looking for an 
AWS-like competitor to host an email system supporting some 10K users.

AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is preferred.

The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based hosting 
providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.

Thanks, 
Mark 

-- 
_ 
L. Mark Stone, Founder 
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[Romain via mailop]

Based in France, OVH and Scaleway.

Romain

Le mer. 9 avr. 2025 à 19:56, L. Mark Stone via mailop  a
écrit :

> To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are looking
> for an AWS-like competitor to host an email system supporting some 10K
> users.
>
> AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is preferred.
>
> The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based
> hosting providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
>
> --
> _
> L. Mark Stone, Founder
> North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner
> For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs
> Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
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> https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
>
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Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

[L. Mark Stone via mailop]

Sorry Michael and Scott that I wasn't clearer, and thanks for your replies.

The Zimbra email software we use requires Linux instances, either Ubuntu 22, 
RHEL9 or selected clones.  No docker containers, microservices etc.

AWS has a lot of built-in infrastructure redundancy and resiliency we'd ideally 
like to retain (S3 has eleven nines of durability for example; EBS volumes are 
continuously replicated on at least two storage frames at all times, etc.).

We are not at all looking for an emailing service like AWS's SES, or to use a 
forwarder, SEG or similar.  We need like AWS m7i and r7i instances, with 
multiple block storage disks of different speeds and sizes, and, ideally some 
lower cost S3-like storage for older mail blobs.

Some hosters do not allow outbound TCP port 25; that would be a requirement in 
our case.

Thanks, 
Mark 

-- 
_ 
L. Mark Stone, Founder 
North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award

- Original Message -
| From: "Scott" 
| To: "L. Mark Stone" , "mailop" 

| Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2025 3:16:49 PM
| Subject: Re: [mailop] Email-Friendly B2B Infrastructure Hosting

| So you are looking for infrastructure and the client brings his own software ?
| Maybe something running OpenStack ?

| https://cleura.com/
| https://www.open-telekom-cloud.com/en/benefits/openstack

| Scott

| On Wednesday, 09/04/2025 at 13:41 L. Mark Stone via mailop wrote:

|| To provide hosting for a prospective Euro-based customer, we are looking for 
an
|| AWS-like competitor to host an email system supporting some 10K users.

|| AWS-like infrastructure redundancy/resiliency and security is preferred.

|| The prospective customer is endeavoring to avoid utilizing US-based hosting
|| providers, so AWS, Azure, OCI etc. are not viable options.

|| Thanks,
|| Mark

|| --
|| _
|| L. Mark Stone, Founder
|| North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner
|| For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs
|| Winner of the Zimbra Americas VAR Partner of the Year 2024 Award
|| ___
|| mailop mailing list
|| [ mailto:mailop@mailop.org | mailop@mailop.org ]
|| [ https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop |
|| https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop ]
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